[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

Allan Houston Question
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum
Page 1 of 2  1  2 Next ›
« Reply To Topic
Author Thread
SkyWalker
Posts: 20468
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 12/1/2004
Member: #814
8/3/2005  8:56 AM
Can the Knicks use this new rule and dump Houston and then resign him to the league minimum???. Essentially, then we would turn Houston into the bad guy if he refused to resign with us. If he is close to Dolan maybe that would be a potential resolution. It makes sense for both Houston and the Knicks. Unless, Houston really wants to play on a contender team. But then he would be a jerk for leaving us.
Kenny SkyWalker
AUTOADVERT
firefly
Posts: 23229
Alba Posts: 17
Joined: 7/26/2004
Member: #721
United Kingdom
8/3/2005  8:57 AM
No. You cannot resign a player you cut using the amnesty clause. I assume that stands for whole year.
Some men see things as they are and ask why. I dream things that never were and ask why not?
subzero0
Posts: 21244
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/24/2003
Member: #410
8/3/2005  9:04 AM
Ugh, whats the point anyway? If your going to cut him, cut him. It seems to me that the Allan Houston rule should be used on Penny Hardaway anyways. Even if we use this rule to cut Houston, it still counts against the cap for ALL the years left on his contract. So it really doesnt help the team any, since Dolans got money to burn. Hardaway on the other hand has a bad attitude and i dont need him showcasing that kinda work ethic around our young team! Cut Penny
Pharzeone
Posts: 32183
Alba Posts: 14
Joined: 2/11/2005
Member: #871
8/3/2005  9:04 AM
Posted by firefly:

No. You cannot resign a player you cut using the amnesty clause. I assume that stands for whole year.
The rule is sort of fair. I think I saw on ESPN like if the KNicks cut him, it will be great for both sides unless Houston resigns with another for like the minimum than it will suck for him because the NBA will not a player to get paid twice. He will only get his minimum for as long as he has the minimum contract while his original team's contract is prorated after the minimum contract is over. If that is the case that is extremely fair.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
CTKnicksfan
Posts: 20312
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/24/2004
Member: #572
8/3/2005  9:12 AM
Another interesting thing wich came out recently (I think in the Chad Ford column a couple of days ago) is that if Houston is cut under the amnesty clause, there is a spread provision in his deal, that if he's cut the $40mm still owed to him would be paid in something like 8 $5mm annual payments rather than $20mm each year for the next 2. Combine that with the luxury tax, and I don't see how Dolan can do anything other than cut him.

look at it this way, keeping Houston will still cost $20mm next year, cutting him would cost only $5mm, and if he signs for a $1mm vet min deal, they get that back from him too.
firefly
Posts: 23229
Alba Posts: 17
Joined: 7/26/2004
Member: #721
United Kingdom
8/3/2005  9:15 AM
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by firefly:

No. You cannot resign a player you cut using the amnesty clause. I assume that stands for whole year.
The rule is sort of fair. I think I saw on ESPN like if the KNicks cut him, it will be great for both sides unless Houston resigns with another for like the minimum than it will suck for him because the NBA will not a player to get paid twice. He will only get his minimum for as long as he has the minimum contract while his original team's contract is prorated after the minimum contract is over. If that is the case that is extremely fair.

Im not so sure if that is the case. I heard that Finley and Houston's contract actually state that if they are in a situation where they are playing for a different contract while the original is still running, the value of the contract gets spread over many years at a average of about 6-7 mill a year.

So, as far as I understand it, A. someone who DOESNT have that in their contract will get their money on time at the same time as their new contract(just like Shandon Anderson, Vin Baker and Zo), and B. even Houston and Finley will still be getting something albeit less then they should.
Some men see things as they are and ask why. I dream things that never were and ask why not?
islesfan
Posts: 9999
Alba Posts: 37
Joined: 7/19/2004
Member: #712
8/3/2005  10:16 AM
Here's a better question. If expiring contracts are as valuable as Isiah would have you believe, then why would they be giving up the mother of all expiring contracts for nothing? In a year and a half they would have a $20M contract to offer in trade. They've waited all this time to dump TT and Penny so why can't they do the same for Houston? Hell, between LB and Lenny they're paying their head coaches close to what they're paying Houston. It's not like Dolan can't afford it. He'll just raise ticket prices or as he always does, he'll raise cable rates with some hidden charge.

Using the amnesty on Houston does absolutely nothing to help the team's salary cap situation and takes a huge trade asset away from them. Who knows whose unwanted player we can get for that expiring contract.
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
Andrew
Posts: 26600
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #1
USA
8/3/2005  10:20 AM
Posted by islesfan:

Here's a better question. If expiring contracts are as valuable as Isiah would have you believe, then why would they be giving up the mother of all expiring contracts for nothing?

Very true....if Houston is cut I think it would be a Dolan ($) decision opposed to a basketball decision.
PURE KNICKS LOVE
martin
Posts: 76563
Alba Posts: 108
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #2
USA
8/3/2005  10:24 AM
Posted by islesfan:

Here's a better question. If expiring contracts are as valuable as Isiah would have you believe, then why would they be giving up the mother of all expiring contracts for nothing?

Saving $40M helps. Plus, Mo Taylor and JYD also come off the books that same year.
Official sponsor of the PURE KNICKS LOVE Program
fishmike
Posts: 53867
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
8/3/2005  10:25 AM
We already have expiring deals, if thats what they want. Mo T ($9mm) JYD ($6mm) and Sweetney ($3mm) all expire the same year, so its a non issue. This will save the $40mm in luxury taxes, and if we want to take on more cash at the deadline if there is some firesale then we have $18mm in above deals to use. Shandon's lovely deal also comes off, but I'm sure we cant trade that.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
CTKnicksfan
Posts: 20312
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/24/2004
Member: #572
8/3/2005  10:26 AM
I think even Dolan has his limits. He's a businessman first and foremost. Also, The Knicks still have over something on the order of $15 mil expiring with MoT + JYD which im sure will be used in trades as well.
CTKnicksfan
Posts: 20312
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/24/2004
Member: #572
8/3/2005  10:27 AM
Wow we all posted the same thing at the same time
crzymdups
Posts: 52018
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/1/2004
Member: #671
USA
8/3/2005  10:29 AM
Posted by Andrew:
Posted by islesfan:

Here's a better question. If expiring contracts are as valuable as Isiah would have you believe, then why would they be giving up the mother of all expiring contracts for nothing?

Very true....if Houston is cut I think it would be a Dolan ($) decision opposed to a basketball decision.

I disagree. Everything we've heard indicates that Dolan wants to keep Houston. It's a good basketball move. Even if he Houston can play, what, like 30 games this season... he's a waste and we already have a minutes crunch with Jamal and Q. Also, who in the world would we trade for that even comes close to Houston's salary? I don't buy this. Cutting Houston is a perfectly reasonable and fiscally sane basketball move.
¿ △ ?
islesfan
Posts: 9999
Alba Posts: 37
Joined: 7/19/2004
Member: #712
8/3/2005  10:41 AM
Oh, is that why Isiah got Mo T? For his expiring contract?

So who does it help to save $40M? Just Dolan and his bottomless wallet. There's no denying that it hurts the Knicks and us fans since it takes away a trade asset, at least based on what Isiah has said about expiring deals. If having the $15M in expiring deals, representing Mo T and JYD, is good then wouldn't $35M be better?
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
fishmike
Posts: 53867
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
8/3/2005  10:45 AM
Posted by islesfan:

Oh, is that why Isiah got Mo T? For his expiring contract?

So who does it help to save $40M? Just Dolan and his bottomless wallet. There's no denying that it hurts the Knicks and us fans since it takes away a trade asset, at least based on what Isiah has said about expiring deals. If having the $15M in expiring deals, representing Mo T and JYD, is good then wouldn't $35M be better?
quit fishing...
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
bobs3304
Posts: 24827
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 7/5/2005
Member: #948
8/3/2005  10:45 AM
I'd rather have Penny cut, knowing that they can't use that expiring contract to land more maxed out players.

Or can they?
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
nyballer
Posts: 21019
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 9/4/2001
Member: #108
USA
8/3/2005  11:09 AM
i've been saying this all along but if they really want to keep expiring contracts and use the clause with the least amount of damage, cut shandon anderson...his salary still counts against us and itll save us 16 million...cutting penny saves us about that much, but we don't lose anything by using the amnesty clause on shandon

[Edited by - nyballer on 08/03/2005 11:25:20]
"easy like sunday morning..." - walt clyde
Bonn1997
Posts: 58654
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 2/2/2004
Member: #581
USA
8/3/2005  11:19 AM
Posted by nyballer:

i've been saying this all along but if they really want to keep expiring contracts and use the clause with the least amount of damage, cut shandon anderson...his salary still counts against us and itll save us 16 million...cutting penny saves us about that much, but we don't lose anything but using the amnesty clause on shandon
That's a good point actually because we won't even lose a player whose expiring contract could be traded.
bernard
Posts: 20730
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 10/17/2003
Member: #475
8/3/2005  12:48 PM
Yes, from fan's perspective, the best move for us is Shandon.

Then, if by some miracle Houston comes back strong, we get the benefit. And even if he doesn't come back, we have the oppty to trade his expiring deal in a couple of years. I'm dubious we'd find takers, but who knows? In any event, we keep open these possibilities at a cost to Dolan (who cares).

Operating on the OPM principal, I'm all for keeping Houston and Penny because the team could benefit, even if in ways totally disproportionate to the size of their contracts. We've got nothing to gain by keeping on paying luxury tax on Shandone's deal, so I have no problem w/ Dolan saving some $$ on it.

All that said, it's likely going to be Houston, and I can't really blame Dolan for saving the bigger $$, even though I'd be happier if it were Shandone.
Pharzeone
Posts: 32183
Alba Posts: 14
Joined: 2/11/2005
Member: #871
8/3/2005  12:56 PM
There has to be another reason behind this HOuston release thing because I could see the Knicks seeing what they could get for Houston via trade next season after seeing what they could get out of him this season. I think it is question of whether Houston was not totally honest last season. IF he is talking about signing as a free agent to another team that means he is healthy enough to pass a physical. If I was his boss, my first question would be why didn't you play for me if you are now willing to play for someone else. I think that's what Bill Davidson asked LB.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
Page 1 of 2  1  2 Next ›
« Reply To Topic
Allan Houston Question
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy