[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

the job of a power forward
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum
Page 1 of 2  1  2 Next ›
« Reply To Topic
Author Thread
BRIGGS
Posts: 53275
Alba Posts: 7
Joined: 7/30/2002
Member: #303
7/16/2005  11:01 AM
well, it can be the flashy position, there are a few clubs with high caliber PF like Dirk KG Webber[the one before the knee]

but I se PF as a position for a tough effecient player who can rebound and score points

ONE of the main reason I wanted to take Bynum over Frye is because Bynum is a real 5 and I dont think Frye is, I really think he is a 4, that being said if he is a 4, was he clearly a better pick than Ike Diogu, or was it that he is two inches taller? If anyone watched the players in college it was CLEAR and cut Diogu was the better player, better in EVERY aspect except 20 foot jump shooting. In fact if I can get 1 person to tell me how Frye is a better player than Frye at the 4 let me know.

If the trouble here as is purported the 4 a position we have spent MILLIONS upon MILLIONS on, even if we had guys who were all in the 6-8 range why didnt we take a better player for the position.

Im sorry, anyone who thinks Frye is better is wrong

and now they are going to trade away Sweetney picks and Tim Thomas just to get Mark Blount and overpay Walker. If this was the case, why didnt we just move Sweetney for a pick or perhaps include him in the KT trade and take Diogu 8?

When fishmike brought it up I thought it was ludicrous, not about the talent, but becase we had like 9 PFs at the time! But as the world turns in NY, as they makke moves bringing in multi million dollar vets and get sick of them 2 months later, with the plan of getting James in FA--why didnt they either take the back up C in Bynum or the BEST PF in Diogu? Is it because they believe channing can play 4-5? that must be it, because Diogu is a better player than frye as a PF--better scorer, better rebounder, tougher, strong strong legs great refined post game. Im a confused fan--like one of the guys said, Isiah is a contradiction machine. Im buying that Frye Robinson and lee meant we would play up tempo and now we are in the process of bringing in james and fatoine.

really i dont get it and i believe that NEITHER do the fellas making the calls. you dont spend 17mm% on players at the deadline to throw them to the bench 2 months later. its just a consistent rotissere gig for the new regime--thats all its been
RIP Crushalot😞
AUTOADVERT
bobs3304
Posts: 24827
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 7/5/2005
Member: #948
7/16/2005  11:18 AM
Dude relax. Jesus. Bynum won't have an impact for a long time. Atleast Frye has a chance to do SOMETHING next year.

If Sweetney shows up come training camp, then we should probably keep him. Will Isiah wait that long to decide Sweets' fate? None of us know. But Isiah realizes that the PF slot isn't ready just yet, and is without a doubt working hard to make something happen. I'd rather not have Walker, but it's his decision, not ours.

We'll just have to see how it plays out. He might be looking into attaining Walker b/c he sees a leadership dilemma with Herb coaching and not Larry Brown. Who knows.

I'm confident in what Isiah is doing. He's finally set on the direction he wanted to go since he first arrived. He stockpiled draft picks and young talent in case he had to go the way of rebuilding. But with James on board, that just isn't an option anymore.

I hope he gives Sweetney a chance, but I can't say whether or not he will...

[Edited by - bobs3304 on 07/16/2005 11:19:43]
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
tkf
Posts: 36487
Alba Posts: 6
Joined: 8/13/2001
Member: #87
7/16/2005  11:26 AM
Briggs here is the thing: the league does not have a lot of trye 6:11 PF's there are a lot of undersized ones, but not many with true size and skill, that is why there are premiums on guys like sheed, dirk, kg and webber as well as duncan, and guess what, with their length at times they can play the center position depending on the matchup. This is where I see frye, he is 6'11, long, athletic and can block shots as well as score.. Diagu is short for a PF, we DON'T NEED THAT!!! What is he 6'8 at best? don't we have enough of that? The other key is that frye can run the floor, that is key for a guy that big, and he can protect the paint from the PF position, that is another key.. I don't know why you continue to work the frye pick into the ground. I mean who is next? who will be the player that you talk about next week that we should of taken over frye?
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
Knicksfan
Posts: 32907
Alba Posts: 27
Joined: 7/5/2004
Member: #691
USA
7/16/2005  11:36 AM
Posted by BRIGGS:

Im a confused fan

really i dont get it

I agree with that

You don't get it as I don't get what's your fascination with this theme, going over it time after time after time after time... Why don't you just forget about Frye at all untill he establishes himself in the league? It will do you good..
Knicks_Fan
Killa4luv
Posts: 27768
Alba Posts: 51
Joined: 6/23/2002
Member: #261
USA
7/16/2005  12:11 PM
I am not sold on the idea that Ike Diogu will be a force in the league. He is tough, but he is little. If we drafted an undersized PF, I would have died.

BTW just because we have players that can run doesn't mean every piece has to fit that mold. We are not going to be the Suns. Every player doesn't have to run down the court. Is Duncan ever the first guy down the court?
Im sorry, anyone who thinks Frye is better is wrong

That remains to be seen.

[Edited by - Killa4luv on 07/16/2005 12:11:50]
crzymdups
Posts: 52018
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/1/2004
Member: #671
USA
7/16/2005  12:19 PM
Briggs, Frye is a 5 in an up tempo game, but I think we would all agree that SOME teams are going to have centers that can abuse Frye - big guys like Ben Wallace and Shaq who abuse everyone in some way. That's what JJames is for. He played extremely well against the Pistons last season.

I'm actually warming to the James signing. It was a necessary evil, but he can really help the defense and put a big body on the bigs who warrant it. I think some games James will get 30 minutes and some games he'll only get 15 or so. I still think Frye will get the majority of the minutes at center when James is not playing. I think they'll probably play together some as well.

Why are you convinced Antoine is coming? I don't see it. I agree it would be an awful trade, but I don't think Zeke would do that. Maybe I'm being naive and he just wants to sell seats, but to think that we could possibly be STARTING three guys who shoot 38% is mind-boggling. Please don't be that stupid, Zeke.
¿ △ ?
gunsnewing
Posts: 55076
Alba Posts: 5
Joined: 2/24/2002
Member: #215
USA
7/16/2005  12:23 PM
Posted by Killa4luv:

I am not sold on the idea that Ike Diogu will be a force in the league. He is tough, but he is little. If we drafted an undersized PF, I would have died.

BTW just because we have players that can run doesn't mean every piece has to fit that mold. We are not going to be the Suns. Every player doesn't have to run down the court. Is Duncan ever the first guy down the court?
Im sorry, anyone who thinks Frye is better is wrong

That remains to be seen.

[Edited by - Killa4luv on 07/16/2005 12:11:50]

yeah I agree plus everyone had Frye going ahead of Ike. The fact that Frye should be able to play the 4 & 5 was the reason he was picked whether there were better players on the board or not. I personally would've drafted Bynum who will be a top flight CENTER in 2-3yrs and who will no go on a championship run with Phil, Kobe & Kwame in LA and sign JJ as a stopgap with Sweetney, Lee & Butler at PF but oh well it's too late.
crzymdups
Posts: 52018
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/1/2004
Member: #671
USA
7/16/2005  12:24 PM
I don't think LA should start planning that parade just yet.
¿ △ ?
Rich
Posts: 27410
Alba Posts: 6
Joined: 12/30/2003
Member: #511
USA
7/16/2005  12:28 PM
If Isiah trades Sweetney and picks for Walker and Blount, I will start wishing that Layden was the GM.
bobs3304
Posts: 24827
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 7/5/2005
Member: #948
7/16/2005  12:30 PM
Since when does the 8th Pick in ANY draft in recent years get immediate playing time, especially on a team like the Knicks?

Some of you are overestimating Frye. Others are underestimating him. Here's what to look forward to - a guy that has size and quickness, but isn't strong enough to bang down low with the big boys yet. He'll see around 10-15 MPG, possibly 20 depending on how our PF/C situation pans out in the coming months.

DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
Rich
Posts: 27410
Alba Posts: 6
Joined: 12/30/2003
Member: #511
USA
7/16/2005  12:31 PM
Posted by bobs3304:

Since when does the 8th Pick in ANY draft in recent years get immediate playing time, especially on a team like the Knicks?

Some of you are overestimating Frye. Others are underestimating him. Here's what to look forward to - a guy that has size and quickness, but isn't strong enough to bang down low with the big boys yet. He'll see around 10-15 MPG, possibly 20 depending on how our PF/C situation pans out in the coming months.

When the GM publicly states that he would pick Frye over Bogut, fans have a right to have high expectations.

[Edited by - Rich on 07/16/2005 12:32:14]
bobs3304
Posts: 24827
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 7/5/2005
Member: #948
7/16/2005  12:36 PM
Posted by Rich:


When the GM publicly states that he would pick Frye over Bogut, fans have a right to have high expectations.

[Edited by - Rich on 07/16/2005 12:32:14]


Perception is one thing. Reality is another...
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
crzymdups
Posts: 52018
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/1/2004
Member: #671
USA
7/16/2005  12:36 PM
Posted by bobs3304:

Since when does the 8th Pick in ANY draft in recent years get immediate playing time, especially on a team like the Knicks?

Some of you are overestimating Frye. Others are underestimating him. Here's what to look forward to - a guy that has size and quickness, but isn't strong enough to bang down low with the big boys yet. He'll see around 10-15 MPG, possibly 20 depending on how our PF/C situation pans out in the coming months.

He's getting a lot more than 10-15 minutes, man. What are you smoking? As for 8th picks specifically who have come in and contributed in their first season and played a lot of time - how about Vin Baker, Kerry Kittles and Andre Miller? First round picks come in and get playing time A LOT around the league. it can turn around a team, and with the way the league is now with the new zone and perimeter rules, with a premium on speed and athleticism, it's an even bigger benefit to play young guys.
¿ △ ?
gunsnewing
Posts: 55076
Alba Posts: 5
Joined: 2/24/2002
Member: #215
USA
7/16/2005  12:39 PM
I think if Jerome James starts at Center Frye should start at PF because he will compliment James who stays inside for the most part. Then bring in Sweetney for Frye or shift Frye to C
bobs3304
Posts: 24827
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 7/5/2005
Member: #948
7/16/2005  12:40 PM
Posted by crzymdups:


He's getting a lot more than 10-15 minutes, man. What are you smoking? As for 8th picks specifically who have come in and contributed in their first season and played a lot of time - how about Vin Baker, Kerry Kittles and Andre Miller? First round picks come in and get playing time A LOT around the league. it can turn around a team, and with the way the league is now with the new zone and perimeter rules, with a premium on speed and athleticism, it's an even bigger benefit to play young guys.

Frye will not get more than 15 MPG. You're overhyping a rookie that has played mediocre - good at best in the SL. He still needs alotta work, as did Sweetney. Sweetney was the 10th pick in 02, and he was far more dominant at Georgetown than Frye was at Arizona. It's taken Sweets 2 years and counting to get where he needs to be. Frye will take the same amount of time, if not longer. 15 MPG or less.
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
nyshakespeare
Posts: 20527
Alba Posts: 13
Joined: 6/23/2003
Member: #420
USA
7/16/2005  12:44 PM
Posted by Rich:

If Isiah trades Sweetney and picks for Walker and Blount, I will start wishing that Layden was the GM.

I try to look at the positives whenever IT makes a move, but there is no bright side to Walker IMHO. He's softer than Charmin & that freaking shimmy...don't get me started on that. Plus you just know he is going to get a ridiculous contract in a sign & trade. I'd rather give Fat Albert another shot at PF.

Guess I'm just spoiled by the old Knick squads that would take it to ya every night. Where have you gone Oak & X-man?
It Is Solved By Walking
gunsnewing
Posts: 55076
Alba Posts: 5
Joined: 2/24/2002
Member: #215
USA
7/16/2005  12:46 PM
Posted by nyshakespeare:
Posted by Rich:

If Isiah trades Sweetney and picks for Walker and Blount, I will start wishing that Layden was the GM.

I try to look at the positives whenever IT makes a move, but there is no bright side to Walker IMHO. He's softer than Charmin & that freaking shimmy...don't get me started on that. Plus you just know he is going to get a ridiculous contract in a sign & trade. I'd rather give Fat Albert another shot at PF.

Guess I'm just spoiled by the old Knick squads that would take it to ya every night. Where have you gone Oak & X-man?

agreed. that is the one guy i want nothing to do with!
crzymdups
Posts: 52018
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/1/2004
Member: #671
USA
7/16/2005  12:46 PM
Posted by bobs3304:
Posted by crzymdups:


He's getting a lot more than 10-15 minutes, man. What are you smoking? As for 8th picks specifically who have come in and contributed in their first season and played a lot of time - how about Vin Baker, Kerry Kittles and Andre Miller? First round picks come in and get playing time A LOT around the league. it can turn around a team, and with the way the league is now with the new zone and perimeter rules, with a premium on speed and athleticism, it's an even bigger benefit to play young guys.

Frye will not get more than 15 MPG. You're overhyping a rookie that has played mediocre - good at best in the SL. He still needs alotta work, as did Sweetney. Sweetney was the 10th pick in 02, and he was far more dominant at Georgetown than Frye was at Arizona. It's taken Sweets 2 years and counting to get where he needs to be. Frye will take the same amount of time, if not longer. 15 MPG or less.

Sweetney was the 9th pick in 2003 for starters. He didn't get PT at first because Layden is an idiot and Sweet's father died during training camp. When Isiah got here, Sweetney immediately started getting 20 minutes. He started the second half of his second season, but couldn't stay on the court because of conditioning/foul issues.

Frye will have no Ladyen issues, no conditioning issues and hopefully no family tragedies. Frye is a big 6'11", he's no toothpick and despite Brigg's wishes and desires, Frye doesn't seem to be losing his muscle mass. Frye will play a MINIMUM of 25 minutes per game this year. Trust me. He's so much more ready for the NBA than Sweetney was, it's not even close. Different bodies, different players.
¿ △ ?
bobs3304
Posts: 24827
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 7/5/2005
Member: #948
7/16/2005  12:53 PM
Posted by crzymdups:


Sweetney was the 9th pick in 2003 for starters. He didn't get PT at first because Layden is an idiot and Sweet's father died during training camp. When Isiah got here, Sweetney immediately started getting 20 minutes. He started the second half of his second season, but couldn't stay on the court because of conditioning/foul issues.

Frye will have no Ladyen issues, no conditioning issues and hopefully no family tragedies. Frye is a big 6'11", he's no toothpick and despite Brigg's wishes and desires, Frye doesn't seem to be losing his muscle mass. Frye will play a MINIMUM of 25 minutes per game this year. Trust me. He's so much more ready for the NBA than Sweetney was, it's not even close. Different bodies, different players.


That's your opinion. I've watched both in the NCAA tournament, (during their respective years), and Sweetney was a far more dominant force. Granted, a player doesn't always carry over to the NBA gracefully, but I'm basing this on the ability they've shown in college. Sweetney has the potential to be a poor man's Elton Brand if he can just get in shape and improve his hops.

I hope you're right. I really do. I hope Channing Frye surprises US ALL and just plays Big every game. I'd love to see him get 30+ MPG and dominate. I'd love to see him muster up 12 Points, 8 Boards, and 2 Blocks......but that's not realistic. When you're as stacked as we are at PF, and with Frye not being able to play Center on a consistent basis, I don't see him getting more than 20 MPG.

Don't forget -- this guy isn't even a rookie yet. Don't expect big things from him just b/c he was OUR pick...
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
bobs3304
Posts: 24827
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 7/5/2005
Member: #948
7/16/2005  1:14 PM
http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1046


" Channing Frye – Frye played a smart game, staying involved around the basket and making his presence felt on the defensive end. However, he should have been able to dominate the likes of Pape Sow, Marcus Haislip, and Uros Slokar, and that just didn’t happen. Frye doesn’t seem comfortable with his back to the basket, and that’s not something I like to see out of a guy that’s supposed to be polished and ready to play. "


^ My point...

[Edited by - bobs3304 on 07/16/2005 13:15:15]
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
Page 1 of 2  1  2 Next ›
« Reply To Topic
the job of a power forward
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum

©2001-2012 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy