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switching gears...frye should now start at the PF spot
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djsunyc
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7/14/2005  2:04 PM
with james in tow, frye will be getting alot of minutes at the backup C spot but i think he may excel even faster at the PF spot where he has a height and length advantage.

this should be our rotation:

PF - frye 15mins, sweets 30mins
C - james 20mins, frye 20mins

and let malik, mo, and butler fill in the rest here and there, especially when frye and james are in foul trouble.
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jaydh
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7/14/2005  2:05 PM
sounds good and all, but i dont know if he is ready for 35 minutes
TMS
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7/14/2005  2:06 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

with james in tow, frye will be getting alot of minutes at the backup C spot but i think he may excel even faster at the PF spot where he has a height and length advantage.

this should be our rotation:

PF - frye 15mins, sweets 30mins
C - james 20mins, frye 20mins

and let malik, mo, and butler fill in the rest here and there, especially when frye and james are in foul trouble.

i agree...having 2 fatbodies in the lane will clog up any chance Marbury & Craw will have of penetrating into the lane...at least Frye could play off the ball somewhat...Sweetney's a bench player anyway.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
crzymdups
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7/14/2005  2:07 PM
I agree about Frye. I was just going to make this thread. I hope he does start at PF, because SWeetney is a fine bench player, but not a starter in my mind.

I hope Zeke is really still exploring a trade for Stromile Swift, but I doubt we have anything Memphis wants...unless they like Jamal Crawford...
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VDesai
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7/14/2005  2:08 PM
I'd still start Sweetney and ease Frye in off the bench at both spots. Frye should get about 25 mpg next year.
bobs3304
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7/14/2005  2:10 PM
Frye isn't ready to start on a team whose goal is to reach the playoffs. If we were legitimitely rebuilding, I'd wholeheartedly agree. But watching him in the SL, I KNOW he's not ready. I expect Isiah to make another trade before next season's deadline to bring in a proven PF/C...

I'd love to get a guy like Gooden, b/c he is ready to start, can spot minutes at Center when needed, and wouldn't necessarily take minutes away from Frye. Gooden gets, on average, about 25 MPG.

Granted, there are other options out there...just thinking outloud.

[Edited by - bobs3304 on 07/14/2005 14:12:28]
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
BigAppleStar3
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7/14/2005  2:12 PM
I think the rotation looks like this ...

PF: Mike Sweetney 27 - Malik Rose 21
C: Jerome James 24 - Channing Frye 24

Of course Sweets, Big Snacks and Frye are three very foul prone players so we might see Mo' Taylor get some burn.

[Edited by - bigapplestar3 on 07/14/2005 14:14:18]

[Edited by - bigapplestar3 on 07/14/2005 14:14:41]
TMS
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7/14/2005  2:14 PM
Posted by bobs3304:

Frye isn't ready to start on a team whose goal is to reach the playoffs. If we were legitimitely rebuilding, I'd wholeheartedly agree. But watching him in the SL, I KNOW he's not ready. I expect Isiah to make another trade before next season's deadline to bring in a proven PF/C...

I'd love to get a guy like Gooden, b/c he is ready to start, can spot minutes at Center when needed, and wouldn't necessarily take minutes away from Frye. Gooden gets, on average, about 25 MPG.

Granted, there are other options out there...just thinking outloud.

[Edited by - bobs3304 on 07/14/2005 14:12:28]

maybe not, but we've all seen that Sweetney wasn't ready to start for a playoff contending team either, so unless Isiah unloads Mo T, Malik, Sweetney or JYD in the offseason, what other better options do we have other than to start the lottery pick & see what he can do?
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diderotn
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7/14/2005  2:15 PM
that would be a huge mistake. Look, when you draft a player to become a star with the 8th pick, it is imperative to use him as a starter immediately, especially when there is no one else on the squad who is better than him at that position. Frye has a lot more skills than Sweetney, and he is longer. With him on the court, teams will have to worry about his offensive game. Sweetney will be a good player in the league, but he doesn't fit our plan anymore. We need to move him while we can.

Posted by VDesai:

I'd still start Sweetney and ease Frye in off the bench at both spots. Frye should get about 25 mpg next year.

[Edited by - diderotn on 07/14/2005 14:16:10]
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BigAppleStar3
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7/14/2005  2:17 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by bobs3304:

Frye isn't ready to start on a team whose goal is to reach the playoffs. If we were legitimitely rebuilding, I'd wholeheartedly agree. But watching him in the SL, I KNOW he's not ready. I expect Isiah to make another trade before next season's deadline to bring in a proven PF/C...

I'd love to get a guy like Gooden, b/c he is ready to start, can spot minutes at Center when needed, and wouldn't necessarily take minutes away from Frye. Gooden gets, on average, about 25 MPG.

Granted, there are other options out there...just thinking outloud.

[Edited by - bobs3304 on 07/14/2005 14:12:28]

maybe not, but we've all seen that Sweetney wasn't ready to start for a playoff contending team either, so unless Isiah unloads Mo T, Malik, Sweetney or JYD in the offseason, what other better options do we have other than to start the lottery pick & see what he can do?

How do you know Mike Sweetney isn't ready? Herb Williams never gave him a legit fair chance.
VDesai
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7/14/2005  2:19 PM
Posted by diderotn:

that would be a huge mistake. Look, when you draft a player to become a star with the 8th pick, it is imperative to use him as a starter immediately, especially when there is no one else on the squad who is better than him at that position. Frye has a lot more skills than Sweetney, and he is longer. With him on the court, teams will have to worry about his offensive game. Sweetney will be a good player in the league, but he doesn't fit our plan anymore. We need to move him while we can.

Posted by VDesai:

I'd still start Sweetney and ease Frye in off the bench at both spots. Frye should get about 25 mpg next year.

[Edited by - diderotn on 07/14/2005 14:16:10]

What's the point in starting him at one position if you're not sure what position he's best suited for? Besides starting him doesn't necessarily mean anything...its the minutes he gets. As long as he gets a consistent 25 mpg early on he will develop the way he needs to. Give him a look at PF and C and see which one he is best suited for. And then if he proves himself worthy you increase his role to starter, boost his minutes etc.
TMS
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7/14/2005  2:22 PM
Posted by BigAppleStar3:

How do you know Mike Sweetney isn't ready? Herb Williams never gave him a legit fair chance.

right, it was Herb's fault that Sweetney got into early foul trouble & was 20 lbs overweight all last year...gotcha.
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VDesai
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7/14/2005  2:23 PM
I don't get this notion that Mike Sweetney wasn't ready to start for a playoff contending team. He only got a chance to start when this team was already in the tank. And besides, as a starter, his minutes didn't markedly go up. He played about 22.5 mpg as starter, around 4 mpg more per game than when he was coming off the bench. I don't think he's yet been given a chance to really prove anything about whether he's a starter or bench player down the line.

Let's give this guy a real stretch where he plays 30 mpg. I want to see him play with 4 fouls in the fourth quarter and see how he reacts, not just play the first and third (which is the way they seemed to be using him).
bobs3304
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7/14/2005  2:24 PM
Actually, it's a HORRIBLE idea to force a rookie into a situation just b/c you're options are limited. That could really stunt his growth as a player. Too many expectations put on a 1st year player is never good. You need to be realistic - Frye is good for 15 MPG next year.

Granted, I could be wrong. But I doubt it. Seeing how he's played in the SL games, I have a good picture of how long it'll take him to adjust to the pros. Just a hint - it's more than 0 years.

Isiah will find a way to unload JYD and Sweetney, b/c JYD is only signed to a MLE contract with 2 years left, and Sweetney is relatively cheap. Throw in a future draft pick or two, and we could easily land a proven Big. This is all speculation on my part, but I can't see us winning with Sweetney or Frye getting significant minutes - they're just not ready.

DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
diderotn
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7/14/2005  2:25 PM
what if the Magic did the same thing with Howard, would we know what this kid was capable off? N.Y needs to learn from the other teams around the league. When you draft a guy that played 4 years of collegiate basketball, you have to take your chances and let the guy play. With the guys that we have in the starting lineup, Frye would not be forced to do things that he is not accoustumed of doing. Marb, Q, TT, will be taking all of the shots in the beginning anyways, what we will ask of Frye is to do the little things like provide length, rebounding and some defense...


If you don't start him, you may endup with the same problem that we had with Sweetney. This kid is a quick learner, he needs to be the starter, because by midseason, he will be a hell of a player. I am all for letting the young boys play as early as possible. Sweetney will be traded anyway, so what is the use?

Our starting lineup should be:
Marb, Q, TT unfortunately, Frye and James

I would much rather have: Marb, Q, Ariza, Frye and James on the court as our starter, but that will not happen. Marb needs to have athletes that will bring it early in the game and sustain the effort. We would be much quicker on both ends with that lineup. As far as I am concerned, TT will be traded, so there is no reason to showcase him. Play the guys that we intend to keep around for a while.

[Edited by - diderotn on 07/14/2005 14:30:00]
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crzymdups
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7/14/2005  2:25 PM
Posted by VDesai:

I don't get this notion that Mike Sweetney wasn't ready to start for a playoff contending team. He only got a chance to start when this team was already in the tank. And besides, as a starter, his minutes didn't markedly go up. He played about 22.5 mpg as starter, around 4 mpg more per game than when he was coming off the bench. I don't think he's yet been given a chance to really prove anything about whether he's a starter or bench player down the line.

Let's give this guy a real stretch where he plays 30 mpg. I want to see him play with 4 fouls in the fourth quarter and see how he reacts, not just play the first and third (which is the way they seemed to be using him).

He's a short, fat man who gets tired and commits lazy fouls. He's a nice player - but he's no one's starter. I hope the Knicks trade him before the league realizes he's just another Weatherspoon.
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bobs3304
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7/14/2005  2:27 PM
Ariza's not ready to get significant minutes yet. He's a liability without a jumpshot and poor handle.

Frye is not ready, plain and simple. We're not rebuilding, we're contending. You don't test out 1st year players when your goal is to reach the playoffs.

Sweetney I'm willing to give a chance, but that would officially give us the worst defensive starting lineup in the league. James is not enough to anchor our defense. We need a few 1-on-1 stoppers as well.

[Edited by - bobs3304 on 07/14/2005 14:28:20]
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
crzymdups
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7/14/2005  2:28 PM
Posted by bobs3304:

Actually, it's a HORRIBLE idea to force a rookie into a situation just b/c you're options are limited. That could really stunt his growth as a player. Too many expectations put on a 1st year player is never good. You need to be realistic - Frye is good for 15 MPG next year.



Huh? Part of the reason Isiah drafted this guy was because he felt he had the makeup to make it in New York. He'll be fine starting. I hope the Knicks start Frye and James side by side. A tall frontline! Wouldn't that be something. Let the midget pigs roll in from the bench.
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BigAppleStar3
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7/14/2005  2:28 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by BigAppleStar3:

How do you know Mike Sweetney isn't ready? Herb Williams never gave him a legit fair chance.

right, it was Herb's fault that Sweetney got into early foul trouble & was 20 lbs overweight all last year...gotcha.

Even in games where Mike Sweetney didn't get into foul trouble, Herb Williams STILL didn't play him. And Sweets was not 20 lbs. over weight. Stop exagerating. What's your excuse for Herb not playing Sweets in 4th quarters when the season was clearly over?
crzymdups
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7/14/2005  2:29 PM
Posted by bobs3304:

Ariza's not ready to get significant minutes yet. He's a liability without a jumpshot and poor handle.

Frye is not ready, plain and simple. We're not rebuilding, we're contending. You don't test out 1st year players when your goal is to reach the playoffs.

Sweetney I'm willing to give a chance, but that would officially give us the worst defensive starting lineup in the league. James is not enough to anchor our defense. We need a few 1-on-1 stoppers as well.

[Edited by - bobs3304 on 07/14/2005 14:28:20]

Ariza got significant minutes LAST year. He was coasting in Summer League. He's going to be fine. And Frye is ready to start.
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switching gears...frye should now start at the PF spot
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