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Can Marbury do for James what he did for Nazy?
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Bonn1997
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7/14/2005  1:35 PM
Turn a bench scrub into a 12 PPG scorer on 55% shooting because of his playmaking skills. (Only James will get tripple the blocked shots.) If not, why? What's the difference between Nazy pre-Marbury and James?
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jaydh
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7/14/2005  1:37 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:

What's the difference between Nazy pre-Marbury and James?

james is a better defender
TMS
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7/14/2005  1:40 PM
Nazy & James are pretty much the same player...i wouldn't want to sign Nazr to a 5 year $30 million dollar deal either...what's your point?
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
EnySpree
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7/14/2005  1:40 PM
Good question!

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diderotn
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7/14/2005  1:40 PM
James will be greatly used by Marburry, because James has better hands under the basket, and most of all is measured 4" more than Nazr which makes him a much better finisher.
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djsunyc
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7/14/2005  1:43 PM
the question we should've been asking is how good would kwame be here if marbury gave nazr all those easy baskets?

but alas spilt milk.

james will give us a solid 15-20 mins a night and that's it.
Killa4luv
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7/14/2005  1:45 PM
Posted by diderotn:

James will be greatly used by Marburry, because James has better hands under the basket, and most of all is measured 4" more than Nazr which makes him a much better finisher.
I think so as well. Its funny too because the same people who are upset about JJ, were upset about Nazzy and we would have had to pay him 8-9 mil per for 5. I'd rather JJ at less money plus Lee, plus whoever the hell else we get for next years pick!

And yes I believe Marbs will make elevate his point production like he did Nazr.

[Edited by - killa4luv on 07/14/2005 13:46:20]
TheloniusMonk
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7/14/2005  1:45 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

the question we should've been asking is how good would kwame be here if marbury gave nazr all those easy baskets?

but alas spilt milk.

james will give us a solid 15-20 mins a night and that's it.

gilbert arenas couldn't do anything with him
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Bonn1997
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7/14/2005  1:46 PM
Posted by TMS:

Nazy & James are pretty much the same player...i wouldn't want to sign Nazr to a 5 year $30 million dollar deal either...what's your point?
Well, if he turns into Nazy with tripple the shot-blocking (he already has the shot-blocking), then at $5 mil per season, I'm sure some team would give up 2 1st rd picks for him like they did for Nazy. However, I WOULD give a 5 yr $29 mil contract to a Nazy with tripple the shot-blocking if what you guys are saying is true that Marbury can elevate his offense to Nazy's level.
Bonn1997
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7/14/2005  1:48 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

the question we should've been asking is how good would kwame be here if marbury gave nazr all those easy baskets?

but alas spilt milk.

james will give us a solid 15-20 mins a night and that's it.
The Lakers gave up Butler and their 1st rd pick (which could easily be a lottery pick). To beat that, we probably would have given up Q and 2 non-lottery 1st rd picks or maybe Q, SA's #1, and Ariza and/or Sweetney. Would you really want to give up that much? I really wanted Kwame, but I think deciding not to beat LA's offer for Kwame was the right decision.
diderotn
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7/14/2005  1:48 PM
All the guys who are crying about the deal don't have a clue about what the Knicks really need. A lot of them want Kwame who can not provide what James is able to give us. First of all, he is much more affordable, second, he has the size and weight necessary to complement the guys that we have. yes kwame may be a better dunker, but can he block or guard bigger guys than him??? no. We need a defensive minded type of center who knows his limitation. Kwame doesn't know his limitations just yet.

Posted by Killa4luv:
Posted by diderotn:

James will be greatly used by Marburry, because James has better hands under the basket, and most of all is measured 4" more than Nazr which makes him a much better finisher.
I think so as well. Its funny too because the same people who are upset about JJ, were upset about Nazzy and we would have had to pay him 8-9 mil per for 5. I'd rather JJ at less money plus Lee, plus whoever the hell else we get for next years pick.
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diderotn
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7/14/2005  1:50 PM
to those of you who don't understand the idea behind the James signing, let me try to explain it to you all.

Look, close your eyes and imagine James, Frye, and either JYD or Rose on the court together, with James at Center, Frye PF, AND JYD or Rose as SF. In a good defensive scheme, once the ball is thrown to the big a big man like Shaq or Duncan, you can have James behind guarding the Center with both JYD and Frye swooming to crowd the shooting and passing lanes which will cause a lot of TOs. With the speed of our guards and JYD and Fryes as the runners that they are, they can run the lanes and produce a lot of points in the fast brake. Defensively it is a hell of a good move....Both James and Frye are known to be shot blockers, so look for teams to be very timid when it comes to penetrate and get in the paint. All three guys (JYD, Frye, and James) are long enough to cover their sector and provide help defense.

If TT was a better defender as our starting SF, we could have fully used the help defense strategy, but he is not. That is why it will be best to use Ariza or JYD in that role. TT doesn't think defense,,,,he is an offensive player....

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simrud
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7/14/2005  1:51 PM
Dido the only person on this forum that NEVER has a clue is you. Your posts don't even make any sense half the time. I don't know how you have the nerve to tell anybody they don't have a clue.

JJ is total reversal of direction from rebuilding. If you get him, why in the world are you tradin Mohammed for picks and Rose.

IT has no plan, and its clear.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
jaydh
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7/14/2005  1:53 PM
Posted by simrud:

IT has no plan, and its clear.

just because you dont understand what isiah is doing, doesnt mean he doesnt have a plan. even if its bad, and you dont agree with it, ALL F'ING GMS HAVE A PLAN
VDesai
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7/14/2005  1:56 PM
2 things:

1) It's not Nazy...its NazR. Its no biggie, but I mean, we had this guy on our team for a year, lets spell his name right.

2) Marbury really didn't turn this guy into that much better of a player. If you look at Nazr's stats, the only other chances he got to play real minutes (I'm talking like over 29) was with the Hawks, and his numbers were about the same. Here are his stats

2000: 28 games, 25.6 mins, 12.3 pts, 9 rebs
2001: 82 games, 26.4 mins, 9.7 pts, 7.9 rebs

Now with Marbury and the Knicks...

2003: 27 games, 24.9 mins, 9.2 pts, 7.7 rebs
2004: 54 games, 28.6 mins 10.9 pts, 8.1 rebs

So really, Nazr was virtually the same player. He performed virtually the same give the same amount of minutes. So I'm not sure if the "Marbury made him better" argument holds that much water. At best Steph helped his FG% (which improved on the Knicks), but that was also a product of Nazr playing on a better team and getting better looks without having to force anything (he was playing on last place Atlanta teams).


Similarly what's going to make James better is his ability to stay out there and play more minutes. He's got some major issues with fouls that will limit that, but when he is out there he's reasonably produtive.


[Edited by - VDesai on 07/14/2005 13:59:35]

[Edited by - VDesai on 07/14/2005 14:01:56]
diderotn
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7/14/2005  1:59 PM
I don't have a clue??? Nazr is not a better player than James, Nazr is shorter, smaller in weight, and most of all doesn't have the athleticism necessary. Until he got to N.Y, no one really cared about him...what makes you think that James can't do much more than what Nazr did with the Knicks..??? The pick that we got from the Spurs may be combined to help us draft a star next season...

Posted by simrud:

Dido the only person on this forum that NEVER has a clue is you. Your posts don't even make any sense half the time. I don't know how you have the nerve to tell anybody they don't have a clue.

JJ is total reversal of direction from rebuilding. If you get him, why in the world are you tradin Mohammed for picks and Rose.

IT has no plan, and its clear.
The true Knickabocker..........
TMS
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7/14/2005  2:00 PM
Posted by jaydh:
Posted by simrud:

IT has no plan, and its clear.

just because you dont understand what isiah is doing, doesnt mean he doesnt have a plan. even if its bad, and you dont agree with it, ALL F'ING GMS HAVE A PLAN
my plan is to grab a sandwich before the freakin' cafeteria closes.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
jaydh
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7/14/2005  2:01 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by jaydh:
Posted by simrud:

IT has no plan, and its clear.

just because you dont understand what isiah is doing, doesnt mean he doesnt have a plan. even if its bad, and you dont agree with it, ALL F'ING GMS HAVE A PLAN
my plan is to grab a sandwich before the freakin' cafeteria closes.

go! quick! hurry! before you have to change your plans.
bobs3304
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7/14/2005  2:03 PM
Posted by simrud:


JJ is total reversal of direction from rebuilding. If you get him, why in the world are you tradin Mohammed for picks and Rose.

IT has no plan, and its clear.

We're not rebuilding, and we never were. You don't really rebuild and have the highest payroll in the league. You can build onto what you have, and that would illustrate better what Isiah's doing, but I think it goes farther than that. Zeke is doing exactly what he was trying to in 2003 -- build a playoff contender. He's smart enough to realize you need a combination of youth and veteran leadership to get it done...

He was also smart enough to realize that there was the slight chance he would be forced to legitimitely rebuild, and that's why he's been stockpiling picks as of late. And even on a playoff caliber team, it never hurts to have a future set in place...

[Edited by - bobs3304 on 07/14/2005 14:04:46]
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
crzymdups
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7/14/2005  2:13 PM
Posted by TheloniusMonk:
Posted by djsunyc:

the question we should've been asking is how good would kwame be here if marbury gave nazr all those easy baskets?

but alas spilt milk.

james will give us a solid 15-20 mins a night and that's it.

gilbert arenas couldn't do anything with him

When did Gilbert play with Jerome? Gilbert isn't really a play-maker. The stuff people say about Marbury is more true about Gilbert.

James will look better on the Knicks than he did on the Sonics, Marbury needs a half court big man to be effective. He needs a three point shooter on the wing and he needs a high post pick and roll guy. Isiah got him those things (james, Q, Frye), not to mention a truly capable backup (nate), so I have to believe Zeke's plan still is to build around Marbury.

Look, it's not a terrible move, but there were moves seemingly out there that could have made this team a powerhouse. If those moves weren't realistic (and they rarely are), I don't HATE this move...5 years is a LOOOONG time though.
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