Posted by crzymdups:

The Lakers had Kobe Bryant, top five player at worst, Lamar Odom, top 25 player at worst, Caron Butler and the inside track on Phil Jackson. They were in a much better position than us.

I meant the Lakers were in the same situation as we were in terms of what they had to get franchise talent or young talent at the very least. We both had lottery picks and it looks like we both had an asset that could have gotten us Kwame. Obviously them having Kobe is an a big advantage over what we have but they were a mess just like we were. My point is we had the same opportunity they had to give our franchise a shot at winning a title.

Posted by fishmike:

Posted by Marv:

What is with you guys and "Kwame Brown is special" nonsense?

Are you going to be hyping his potential forever?

the thing is rather than trade for a guy that could be great we sign a guy for 5 years we know never will be. Typical Knicks.

Fish, I just have a very different view on these 2.

I look at Kwame and I see a guy who's been in the league for 4 years. He had one great stretch, in 2003-2004.

He entred a crucial playoff series for his franchise, and despite E Thomas's spin, I believe the reports that he totally fell apart, couldn't handle the pressure and forced his team to kick him off the roster. That's unbelievably pathetic for anyone, especially a #1 overall center who's looked at as "a guy that could be great."

James has been in the league for 5 years. IMO he's been pretty much of a bum the whole time. But he did show up for his team in the playoffs this year. I think you could say he showed everything in the Sacramento series that Kwame showed in his hot spurt of '03-04. And James did it under playoff pressure, when his team needed him. As opposed to totally blowing up and falling apart like Kwame.

SO when i look at these 2 guys, I rate them evenly overall. I don't buy into Kwame's great "potential" any longer.

Posted by bobs3304:

Posted by crzymdups:

The Lakers had two top 25 players. He have one (Marbury). That is a HUGE difference. Add in the coaching difference and they were in a far superior situation to the Knicks as of May 1 (everyone knew Jax was going back to Jeannie and the Lake).

I'm confident that Isiah will add a top 15 Big Man by the trading Deadline next season. I don't think he has any other choice...

[Edited by - bobs3304 on 07/14/2005 14:45:27]

good luck with that.

all the trades for kwame, who's better, kwame is worth the gamble and if the trade dont work out, knicks has little to lose, he's young with plently of years to grow(you mean waste), he's oh so athletic.....blah, blah, blah.....please cut the hype

kwame has now ran out of excuses and there is no other coach he can dispute...... is kwame uncoachable

briggs all those threads, first bynum now brown........are you scouting for LA?.....c'mon

Posted by bobs3304:

Posted by crzymdups:




good luck with that.

If Walker is considered by RealGM's player rankings, and by popular opinion, to be a top 15 PF, then I'd be right, wouldn't I.

Gooden's also a possibility. I'd consider him top 20.

Pau Gasol might be available. I hate his game, but he's easily among the top 10 PF's.

It's not as hard as it seems.

I thought you meant a top 15 player in the league who is a big man. I didn't realize you were talking about just PFs. If you're the fifteenth best PF in the league, you're an *average* starter (b/c there are 30 teams and 30 starting PFs). Yeah, I definitely think Isiah will be able to get an average starting PF at some point over the next year. Frye might even become one.

Posted by bobs3304:

Average? No. To be a Top 15 PF in the league is pretty damn good. Walker is def. Top 15 caliber, but he doesn't fit in here. We already have a chucker that can post up - his name is Q, and he's here to stay.

Half the teams in the league have an average starting PF. We are one of those teams. That said, I hope Sweetney surprises us all and comes into camp in shape, and ready to contribute big time...

Who's our average starting PF? If you can list 20 PFs better than ours (which I could easily for any of our PFs), then your PF is a below average starting PF. It's simple mathematics. If there are 30 starting PFs, the fifteenth best one is an average starting PF. That's not an insult. You have to be a very good player to be an average *starter* at any position in the NBA (except center).

Posted by bobs3304:

Sweetney is our average PF.

Average PF and Average *starting* PF are entirely different. Average starting PF means you're approximately the 15th best PF in the league (maybe in the 12 to 18 range). If you count all bench PFs, vets playing for the min, etc., then there are many low-tier players. Sweetney probably is an average PF, but he's probably a bottom 20% *starting* PF (based on last season at least).