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Bonn1997
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10/12/2008  5:30 PM
And late in games, Gardiner could be a very frequent pinch runner.
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10/12/2008  6:59 PM
A-Rods sort of the Marbury, Zach, Jerome contract wise of the Yankees. Kind of great as a individual stat maker, but useless as a teammate and clutch hitter. With two thirds of his money, the Yankees could acquire some really good arms for the mound. I still say develop, but you have to mix it up when building a successor to what we recently had.

And pitching is the number one sore eye for us right now. Replacing the middle men and maybe a good quality starter would do the trick.
I'll never trust this' team again.
Bonn1997
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10/12/2008  7:05 PM
Man, you're going way overboard mentioning those Knicks and A-Rod in the same sentence. A-Rod last year (in his MVP season) hit several game winning hits, and we wouldn't have made the playoffs without them. Yeah, I know he hit only .270, which is a disgrace. Now if you want to argue that we should have spent the money on starting pitching, I won't disagree. I'd have prefered spending it on Johan and having $150 mil leftover.
Finestrg
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10/12/2008  10:04 PM
Just reading some stuff over at yesnetwork.com and I came across this Cano for Beltran deal that apparently has been all over the 'net even though this is the first I've heard about it. You guys hear anything about this??

Specifically it's Cano, Kennedy, Bruney (or Veras) for Carlos Beltran. Gotta tell ya, I don't do this if I'm the Yankees. First off, that's a lot to give up and not get any pitching back in return. Second, Cano's gonna have a bounce-back year, and we'd be making a panic deal here while his value's low. I still maintain that any deal for Cano+ has got to net us a frontline starting pitcher. I like Bruney (lost all that weight and looked great especially toward the end of the season). And I love Jose Veras. I've always been a big Veras guy. Kid throws smoke and has a great slider. God forbid Mo has any setbacks, we might need Veras to close if they decide to make Joba a starter and leave him there.

Plus, we already have a good option in Gardner who, provided he works on his hitting, could be the next Jacoby Ellsbury. And we got A-Jax waiting in the wings - plan was for him to play well and possibly hit the bigs as early as next year. What would you do with that kid now? Beltran's a nice player but I pass here. We have more important areas of need to fill.

www.yesnetwork.com/news/article.jspymd=20080925&content_id=1455898&oid=36019&vkey=6

What do you guys think of this?


[Edited by - finestrg on 10-12-2008 10:39 PM]
TMS
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10/12/2008  10:15 PM
NO WAY do i make that deal... for Beltran? he's way overpaid & he's had his share of struggles in NY as well... no way do i trade Cano, Kennedy AND Bruney for him.

Damon, Kennedy & Melky is all i'd offer, sorry to say.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
nyk4ever
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10/12/2008  10:55 PM
Posted by TMS:

NO WAY do i make that deal... for Beltran? he's way overpaid & he's had his share of struggles in NY as well... no way do i trade Cano, Kennedy AND Bruney for him.

Damon, Kennedy & Melky is all i'd offer, sorry to say.

I'd make that trade in a second man. Beltran is a clutch player and he would fill the #3 spot in our order perfectly. He also plays a gold-glove level centerfield.

Fine, I read something about this trade a few days ago. All I know is that I'd make that trade in an instant.



[Edited by - nyk4ever on 10-12-2008 10:57 PM]
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
nyk4ever
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10/12/2008  10:58 PM
Brett Gardner is another melky cabrera. Good enough in short spurs, but never good enough to be your everyday OFer.. alot like Endy Chavez with the Mets. Gardner is a 4th OFer.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
TMS
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10/12/2008  11:37 PM
u can still win w/guys like Gardner if u have pop elsewhere in the lineup... u don't have to have a full roster of Allstars.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
TMS
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10/12/2008  11:38 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by TMS:

NO WAY do i make that deal... for Beltran? he's way overpaid & he's had his share of struggles in NY as well... no way do i trade Cano, Kennedy AND Bruney for him.

Damon, Kennedy & Melky is all i'd offer, sorry to say.

I'd make that trade in a second man. Beltran is a clutch player and he would fill the #3 spot in our order perfectly. He also plays a gold-glove level centerfield.

Fine, I read something about this trade a few days ago. All I know is that I'd make that trade in an instant.



[Edited by - nyk4ever on 10-12-2008 10:57 PM]

he built his entire reputation on that 1 mind blowing series he had in HOU before he signed that huge contract... anyone remember who was left w/the bat on his shoulder when the Mets lost game 7 of the NLCS?
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
nyk4ever
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10/12/2008  11:40 PM
Posted by TMS:

u can still win w/guys like Gardner if u have pop elsewhere in the lineup... u don't have to have a full roster of Allstars.

I totally agree. Right now we don't have pop elsewhere. We got nothing at 1st, Catcher, CF, RF. I'm exhibit A of not wanting a bunch of all-stars, I've basically disagreed with every guy you guys have proposed we target (Teixiera, CC, etc etc)

Acquiring Beltran isn't just getting a name and an all-star, he is a winning player (despite the Mets lack of recent success) and a proven playoff performer, he's also a ball-hawk in CF.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
nyk4ever
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10/12/2008  11:42 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by TMS:

NO WAY do i make that deal... for Beltran? he's way overpaid & he's had his share of struggles in NY as well... no way do i trade Cano, Kennedy AND Bruney for him.

Damon, Kennedy & Melky is all i'd offer, sorry to say.

I'd make that trade in a second man. Beltran is a clutch player and he would fill the #3 spot in our order perfectly. He also plays a gold-glove level centerfield.

Fine, I read something about this trade a few days ago. All I know is that I'd make that trade in an instant.



[Edited by - nyk4ever on 10-12-2008 10:57 PM]

he built his entire reputation on that 1 mind blowing series he had in HOU before he signed that huge contract... anyone remember who was left w/the bat on his shoulder when the Mets lost game 7 of the NLCS?

So because he had one bad AB he's not a good playoff performer? He was still 8 for 27 3HR, 4RBI in that series...
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
TMS
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10/12/2008  11:43 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by TMS:
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by TMS:

NO WAY do i make that deal... for Beltran? he's way overpaid & he's had his share of struggles in NY as well... no way do i trade Cano, Kennedy AND Bruney for him.

Damon, Kennedy & Melky is all i'd offer, sorry to say.

I'd make that trade in a second man. Beltran is a clutch player and he would fill the #3 spot in our order perfectly. He also plays a gold-glove level centerfield.

Fine, I read something about this trade a few days ago. All I know is that I'd make that trade in an instant.



[Edited by - nyk4ever on 10-12-2008 10:57 PM]

he built his entire reputation on that 1 mind blowing series he had in HOU before he signed that huge contract... anyone remember who was left w/the bat on his shoulder when the Mets lost game 7 of the NLCS?

So because he had one bad AB he's not a good playoff performer? He was still 8 for 27 3HR, 4RBI in that series...

he batted .278 in the '06 postseason, a far cry from the ridiculous postseason he had in HOU... i didn't say he was a bad postseason performer, only that he's a bit overrated based on 1 crazy hot streak.

& no, i wouldn't give up Cano, 1 of the top 2B in the game before his 1 bad year last season AND 1 of our best bullpen arms for another huge money player in Beltran who hasn't lived up to his contract.

[Edited by - TMS on 10-12-2008 8:50 PM]
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
nyk4ever
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10/12/2008  11:44 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by TMS:
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by TMS:

NO WAY do i make that deal... for Beltran? he's way overpaid & he's had his share of struggles in NY as well... no way do i trade Cano, Kennedy AND Bruney for him.

Damon, Kennedy & Melky is all i'd offer, sorry to say.

I'd make that trade in a second man. Beltran is a clutch player and he would fill the #3 spot in our order perfectly. He also plays a gold-glove level centerfield.

Fine, I read something about this trade a few days ago. All I know is that I'd make that trade in an instant.



[Edited by - nyk4ever on 10-12-2008 10:57 PM]

he built his entire reputation on that 1 mind blowing series he had in HOU before he signed that huge contract... anyone remember who was left w/the bat on his shoulder when the Mets lost game 7 of the NLCS?

So because he had one bad AB he's not a good playoff performer? He was still 8 for 27 3HR, 4RBI in that series...

he batted .278 in the '06 postseason, a far cry from the ridiculous postseason he had in HOU

Cano has a .245 postseason BA. If we're going to generalize, let's start there.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
TMS
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10/12/2008  11:56 PM
Cano's an awesome hitter & defensive player in his own right... i dunno if a straight up swap would be justified let alone giving up 2 other assets in the process.

[Edited by - TMS on 10-12-2008 8:56 PM]
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Bonn1997
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10/13/2008  12:01 AM
An .800 OPS 2nd baseman is FAR more valuable than an .850 OPS CFer. It's pretty hard to get offense from 2nd base. The only issue to me is whether Cano will return to his performance prior to this year or not. I honestly have no clue what the answer is to that question.
nyk4ever
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10/13/2008  12:04 AM
Posted by TMS:

Cano's an awesome hitter & defensive player in his own right... i dunno if a straight up swap would be justified let alone giving up 2 other assets in the process.

[Edited by - TMS on 10-12-2008 8:56 PM]

Cano is NOT an awesome defensive player, the past 2 years he has been in the Top5 of 2B errors.

You are seriously telling me you wouldn't trade Cano for Carlos Beltran?

Cmon man.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
TMS
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10/13/2008  12:05 AM
i'm willing to bet anyone here that Cano will be back to being a .840+ OPS player next season.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
nyk4ever
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10/13/2008  12:07 AM
Posted by Bonn1997:

An .800 OPS 2nd baseman is FAR more valuable than an .850 OPS CFer. It's pretty hard to get offense from 2nd base. The only issue to me is whether Cano will return to his performance prior to this year or not. I honestly have no clue what the answer is to that question.

I will take what I get out of Carlos Beltran every day of the week over Robinson Cano. To me, the only two things that Cano has proven to me is that he's not serious about playing the game of baseball the right way and that he is dreadful the first few months of the season.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
TMS
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10/13/2008  12:09 AM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by TMS:

Cano's an awesome hitter & defensive player in his own right... i dunno if a straight up swap would be justified let alone giving up 2 other assets in the process.

[Edited by - TMS on 10-12-2008 8:56 PM]

Cano is NOT an awesome defensive player, the past 2 years he has been in the Top5 of 2B errors.

You are seriously telling me you wouldn't trade Cano for Carlos Beltran?

Cmon man.

oh come on, u seriously been watching Cano play all these years & think he's a bad defensive player... he makes errors cuz he gets to balls other 2B can only dream about getting to sometimes... there isn't another 2B in baseball that turns the DP better than he does & he's got a SS's arm at his position... please don't try to sell me that Mets BS that Cano's a horrible defender... he's awesome.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
nyk4ever
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10/13/2008  12:09 AM
Posted by TMS:

i'm willing to bet anyone here that Cano will be back to being a .840+ OPS player next season.

He might, he's a very talented player. Personally, I'm tired of watching him squander away his talent.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
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