TeamBall - the senior faculty eagerly awaits your suggestions and modifications to Leadership 101.

Fall course descriptions are due at the printer next week.

TripleThreat wrote:

misterearl wrote:No one is asking Melo to mentor any kids

Why not simply introduce yourself to four newly acquired peers as a show of support?

Just one day. Is that really asking too much?

The bitter irony of all of it, is even if Melo didn't mean one bit of it, making what are seen as the type of gestures you are talking about would infinitely improve his ability to "brand" himself if that was the end goal.

Peyton Manning has the personality of a dead goat, however even when he wasn't a Super Bowl winner, he was still very marketable because he did and said what were perceived as the 'right things' a team leader should say or do.

Which sadly, the end result makes Melo even dumber than at first glance. If he could give two hoots about being a basketball player and wants to be a supercharged wannabe Jay Z Willy Wonka CEO with a stable full of stupid hats, then doing all the little things that real team leaders do nominally would be the best "branding" opportunity ever.

Warren Sapp and Shaquille O'Neal were both guys clearly campaigning for TV analyst/color commentator jobs long before they retired, but they amped it up their last few years, but they weren't so transparent about it. They knew how to play the "game" You could argue that Mike Strahan might be even more diabolical than Tiki Barber, but he clearly knew how to maneuver outside of the NFL and into the field of PR, marketing and self promotion in a more effective way.

Which is again, the sad part of having Phil Jackson in charge, because Zen Master is known for using the media to push players buttons. Melo does care what the public perception is about him and all Phil has to do is rip Melo a new one about his lack of defense and leadership and Melo has no choice but to tow the line. Even Kobe's ego had to occasionally collapse under the weight of Phil's media mojo.

Do it because it's the right thing to do.

Or do it because it's just good business otherwise.

That Melo won't do it for the former is just pathetic. That Melo can't do it for the latter is simply tragic.

Two thumbs up TripleThreat

The haters are now concerned about Melo's brand maintenance..Too funny..

holfresh - is labelling an opinion that of a "hater" the best you have as a rebuttal?

TripleThreat built a compelling, sophisticated, and cogent set of observations. Your response reminds us of the tone deaf Ed Gwynn put down of the passionate Vinny Gambino in court, "request denied."

Cool. Here is a true story.

During the glory years, the Red Holzman Knicks had their down moments. During unproductive or complacent shifts. a frustrated Red would call a timeout and the Garden crowd would respond with derision. Marv Albert would chime in, "...and the Knicks are hearing it from the crowd." It was not always pretty. Coming back from the time out, the crowd would shift to positive and cheer the team out of the huddle. What was that all about?

Were Knicks fans being "haters"? Of course not.

Were Yankees fans "haters" when they booed Mantle or Reggie after a strikeout?

Athletes in New York are pushed to greatness. Sometimes, that same demanding roar of the crowd lifts them like no other city. Or it can make them run for cover in the shower, while the reporters chase them for post game quotes.

Wanting someone to be better is not hate. It is tough love.

Exhibit A:

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=41725&page=1

But count me as one of the disillusioned fans put off by his whole persona as a "Celebrity first, Athlete second".

After signing to $124m, he doesn't get to bitch and moan about the roster. He should've bounced to Chitown or Houston if he truly wanted to contend.

Seeing Durantula, Old ass KG, and Brokedown Flash show up in Summer League without publicity or fanfare is what real ballers that lead by example is all about.

Sick and tired of all the excuse makers and apologists for Melo amongst my friends and family, the media and social media, and Knick forums. Put up or shut up time for the $23 million man.

Phil Jax hasn't had the best year and half start as Knicks president, that said, there is now clear signs of what his "vision" for Knicks basketball is to become. Sure the Derrick Williams is a gamble, but when you can sign 3 under 30 plus role players that will play 2 way bball, you have that luxury. NO more gimmicks, no more D'Antoni spread, no more ISO Melo. Forget all that smokescreen shyt called "The Triangle"....Fisher will probably run a hybrid one, as it's been a heavy dose of Pick and Roll ball so far in Summer League.

Good thing about Phil, he don't give 2 phucks about what Melo thinks, didn't even confer with his LaLa sniffin' azz on what free agents to pick. If the season teeters, I'm sure Melo will stink up the lockerroom with his negativity, and that's where Phil will Zen Melo into waiving that no trade clause.

I'm willing to give Melo a pass if he proves us all wrong, but 171-195 record as a Knick speaks otherwise. Won't even touch his playoff performances...

On that note...GO KNICKS!

ChuckBuck wrote:I used to love this guy. Probably was one of his biggest supporters in the UK forum.

Exhibit A:

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=41725&page=1

But count me as one of the disillusioned fans put off by his whole persona as a "Celebrity first, Athlete second".

After signing to $124m, he doesn't get to bitch and moan about the roster. He should've bounced to Chitown or Houston if he truly wanted to contend.

Seeing Durantula, Old ass KG, and Brokedown Flash show up in Summer League without publicity or fanfare is what real ballers that lead by example is all about.

Sick and tired of all the excuse makers and apologists for Melo amongst my friends and family, the media and social media, and Knick forums. Put up or shut up time for the $23 million man.

Phil Jax hasn't had the best year and half start as Knicks president, that said, there is now clear signs of what his "vision" for Knicks basketball is to become. Sure the Derrick Williams is a gamble, but when you can sign 3 under 30 plus role players that will play 2 way bball, you have that luxury. NO more gimmicks, no more D'Antoni spread, no more ISO Melo. Forget all that smokescreen shyt called "The Triangle"....Fisher will probably run a hybrid one, as it's been a heavy dose of Pick and Roll ball so far in Summer League.

Good thing about Phil, he don't give 2 phucks about what Melo thinks, didn't even confer with his LaLa sniffin' azz on what free agents to pick. If the season teeters, I'm sure Melo will stink up the lockerroom with his negativity, and that's where Phil will Zen Melo into waiving that no trade clause.

I'm willing to give Melo a pass if he proves us all wrong, but 171-195 record as a Knick speaks otherwise. Won't even touch his playoff performances...

On that note...GO KNICKS!

Well, lets make sure it stinks then. So we can kick this bum out like an old bad habit.

RedmenBaller wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

Uptown wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Just wondering if Harden, Curry, Rose, LeBron, Dirk, Kobe, Brow, Lilliard, Duncan, Lowry/Derozan, Wall, etc. are all passing their leadership 101 class in Vegas?

Who cares what they are doing? They are not costing us more than a third of our cap space -they have ZERO relevance to the Knicks. And some of them have delivered actual results not fancy popularity contest bull**** and individual stats obtained at the cost of team success.

What is with people getting bent out of shape when Melo gets called out? He gets called out because He is NOT a leader, he IS selfish and he can't share limelight with others. And he will NEVER win a NBA championship as the primary focal point of this or any other team. Is the truth so hard to swallow that this needs to be wrapped in politically correct BS? People are free to like him all they want, but to act like others are making stuff up about him and being negative when they are calling it the way they see is ridiculously immature IMO.

very fair points

To be honest...the points are totally unfair and irrelevant to the topic. WTF does this rant have to do with summer league? Looking at dudes username, its near impossible to imagine he can post anything unbiased about Melo. Im pretty sure its a cut and paste post.

Wait what? Why on earth would I want to post something "unbiased" about Melo? This is a message board people post their opinions. You do the exact same thing (post opinions-which by definition are biased) and so does everyone else. IMO opinion Melo is not adding value to the Knicks, never has and never will. The OP asked why hasn't Melo gone to Vegas and all anyone has to say is, he is not required to go to Vegas or anywhere else. That's it.

Once you start throwing in names like LeBron and Duncan then people will ask why on earth is Melo being compared to those people? They are multiple time champions who do not have the "selfishness" and "lack of leadership" virtues associated with their reputation around the NBA. Attempting to calibrate Melo's leadership by comparing to these guys is bogus. And if a Damien Lillard type proves to be as selfish as Melo is, exactly what does that do to make Melo a better leader?

Would say Lebron is considered as one of the best current day leaders in the NBA and I think he was umm....sitting right next to him. Why would you show up to try to establish a leadership role with guys , most on SL squad, that are not going to be part of the team?

You shot yourself in the foot by mentioning that Lebron was sitting right next to him. I don't have the time to make a list of what Lebron has done for the Cavs during the season and this off-season, but all he did was made sure his owner signed his guys, they got paid, and he even held off on signing with the team until he knew exactly what was going on with everybody on his roster.

If you have the time, grab a coffee and read this, it's enlightening. http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2517134-a-team-transformed-inside-lebron-james-first-season-back-with-the-cavaliers

I've already mentioned what the other guy (CP3) did for his team...he got off that banana boat real quick when he heard his center was leaving for another team. Wade is good...he has Riley at the helm of his squad, but even he reached out to his new top draft pick and offerred words of encouragement, advice, CONVERSATION. WTF has Melo done, that he's so content, chilling in the Bahamas? And this isn't just this summer, it's every summer, that's the problem that Knicks fans have with the supposed cornerstone of the franchise.

And to answer your question as to why he should show up to show leadership to guys on a summer league squad that are not gonna be a part of the team....ummmm....they just drafted the FOURTH OVERALL PICK. I have a feeling he's gonna be on the team, and they also signed four free agents, one of them who is supposedly his boy, who still hasn't heard from him, and introduced them at the same place. You would think this jerk would be at the press conference. He's tweeting ass and tits pics of his wife but can't shoot a text to Afflalo, his new starting two guard.

This malcontent is obviously not happy that Phil didn't get another max cat, which is why it's not a big deal for him that four dudes just signed on to play some major minutes along side him. If this was LMA, maybe, MAYBE, he would be there to give a handshake.

RedmenBaller wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

RedmenBaller wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

Uptown wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Just wondering if Harden, Curry, Rose, LeBron, Dirk, Kobe, Brow, Lilliard, Duncan, Lowry/Derozan, Wall, etc. are all passing their leadership 101 class in Vegas?

Who cares what they are doing? They are not costing us more than a third of our cap space -they have ZERO relevance to the Knicks. And some of them have delivered actual results not fancy popularity contest bull**** and individual stats obtained at the cost of team success.

What is with people getting bent out of shape when Melo gets called out? He gets called out because He is NOT a leader, he IS selfish and he can't share limelight with others. And he will NEVER win a NBA championship as the primary focal point of this or any other team. Is the truth so hard to swallow that this needs to be wrapped in politically correct BS? People are free to like him all they want, but to act like others are making stuff up about him and being negative when they are calling it the way they see is ridiculously immature IMO.

very fair points

To be honest...the points are totally unfair and irrelevant to the topic. WTF does this rant have to do with summer league? Looking at dudes username, its near impossible to imagine he can post anything unbiased about Melo. Im pretty sure its a cut and paste post.

Wait what? Why on earth would I want to post something "unbiased" about Melo? This is a message board people post their opinions. You do the exact same thing (post opinions-which by definition are biased) and so does everyone else. IMO opinion Melo is not adding value to the Knicks, never has and never will. The OP asked why hasn't Melo gone to Vegas and all anyone has to say is, he is not required to go to Vegas or anywhere else. That's it.

Once you start throwing in names like LeBron and Duncan then people will ask why on earth is Melo being compared to those people? They are multiple time champions who do not have the "selfishness" and "lack of leadership" virtues associated with their reputation around the NBA. Attempting to calibrate Melo's leadership by comparing to these guys is bogus. And if a Damien Lillard type proves to be as selfish as Melo is, exactly what does that do to make Melo a better leader?

Would say Lebron is considered as one of the best current day leaders in the NBA and I think he was umm....sitting right next to him. Why would you show up to try to establish a leadership role with guys , most on SL squad, that are not going to be part of the team?

Again I have already responded to this - underlined above. I have no idea what the comment about sitting right next to him is about? Who was sitting next to what?

They are on vacation together. Therefore the reference. Not a leader based on what? Your biased views? Your experience as a team mate? A guy sitting at home in his one bedroom apt. In Queens is calling out an athlete who has climbed to the height of his sport. Ahh the beauty of being a fan. Gotta love it. However, All your jealous rants still don't take away from the fact the premise of calling any player out for not attending SL is pure stupidity fuled by hate. I am sure your putting in extra time on your days off from Subway just to prove your leadership skills.

Classic dick riding response. Bash the poor guy for doing what he can in life and put him down to defend a millionaire selfish ball hogging athlete who wouldn't even waste his spit on you much less give you the time of day. He is a fan of the team this loser plays on. He gives his time, spends his money on the team, therefore he has a right to be critical, regardless of how poor or rich he is. Melo holds a position that brings that, good or bad. It has nothing to do with how much anybody makes or how big the house is that they live in.

I'm sure you've watched movies that sucked, so you weren't critical of them? Just because they are a big movie director/actor/producer, who are more successful in life monetary wise, who put out a **** movie and took your $24.95, you couldn't say they sucked while watching their movie on your 20" CRT monitor? Failed logic.

And you're asking him if he puts in extra time on his day off from Subway to show his leadership skills...guess what? Yeah, some people do. They work late, they come in on their day off, they take on extra responsibility, and they are the ones who earn a raise, a promotion, maybe their own store. So if some kid making 8 bucks an hour can do that, I would expect a guy making 124 million and not sniff any kind of success during his tenure to do the same.

But see, that's the thing. Melo isn't the Subway worker you could rely on to cover a shift. He's the lazy part time worker who calls out on a busy Saturday night to go out with his buddies.

Uptown wrote:

anrst wrote:there is no comparison between melo and alpha dogs on winning team

melo and chris paul? gtfo.

Thanks for missing the point. take a look at what mr earl said and you will see the point if my post. Paul like Melo is MIA from summer league....why is that okay for Paul but not Melo? Its understood that Paul is better player and leader than Melo, but yet he has the same number of rings as Melo. If dk is paying attention, i just gave him a clue to my equation....

He just finished stealing back his starting center from another team who had all but gotten his signature on the dotted line. He deserves his vacation.

Talking about it, and BEING about it are two different things.