NardDogNation wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:TS% values efficient offense, which means getting as many points per possession as possible. Guess what? So does winning. You know that the more points you score, the more likely you are to win, right? You're gonna get a little under 100 possessions in a game and you need to get as many points out of them as possible. FTs are the best way to do that (after uncontested layups).
Your interpretation that Harden is a flopper may or may not be right but is irrelevant.

All of that is an incomplete truth. Yes, Harden may have a higher TS% but that doesn't take into account a number of bias' in Harden's favor like pace of play and quality of teammates. These comparative disadvantages give Melo fewer and more difficult shots to take for his team to have any chance of winning. Offensively, Melo is the superior player.

in what universe?

Bonn1997 wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

holfresh wrote:Here is the think Bonn..You want to build your team around a guy like Harden who gives u this nonsense (pushes and flops but TS% is good) with zero defense to speak of then tell me Melo isn't a guy you build a team around...

I don't think you have to make a case for Melo by bashing Harden. I'm every bit as ardent a defender of Melo as you are but I would love to have Harden on this team. We wouldn't be having any of the problems we are having now with both those guys on our team; Melo as our 1A and Harden as our 1B.

Harden is carrying a 55 win team right now. He'd be 1B only if Lebron or Durant was on his team.

yea, I think it is clear that if Harden was on the knicks, the ball and offense would and should run through him...at which point we don't need to pay carmelo a max deal... which would mean the end of carmelo as he would not take less money.. that is already proven..

dk7th wrote:

holfresh wrote:

dk7th wrote:

holfresh wrote:

dk7th wrote:

holfresh wrote:

dk7th wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

holfresh wrote:It's time for this organization to start thinking about rebuilding around Melo..JVG said it last night...They have to entertain trade scenarios around Chandler, Shump, etc...We might have to take a second look at Lowry...

It would ahve been much easier if we didnt have to tarde so many assets for him. If he would ahve just waited to sign with us as a FA we would probably be in better shape IMO

Name those "assets"...Tell me the reason why we stink is Gallo...Stops saying assets and put names to them...

Cap space was the biggest one but picks and solid players count too

Please elaborate, Gallo had to get 10 mil which became Tyson essentially..So please elaborate...What pick..Tell me about the picks Donnie gave away to get under the cap..He could have let ZBO and the others expire..Does that count???? We traded David Lee for garbage and pointless salary back, so apparently Donnie wasn't thinking about the cap at that point..

Gallo doesn't even make half what Melo does but no one said we had to keep him anyway. If you don't know what picks we gave up in the Melo trade, you can look that up easily. I don't see what the other questions have to do with the topic.

What?????I have no clue what u are trying to say...What is the relevance of pointing out Gallo salary??...U said we would have cap space if Melo came here via free agency..I said we would have to pay Gallo 10 mil per plus Melo and Amare....The Mayor had to walk because we had no money for him...Where is the cap space???

I named the assets we gave up to get Melo. I was only replying to that part of the discussion. I wouldn't have signed Melo to a max contract salary in the off-season.

U would have signed Harden right??

Most likely. Houston got a great deal with him at $14 mil per

More closer to 16 mil per...No too different from a max deal, only space for one more max guy...Sprinkle in Lin and Asik at 15 per next year...They have to pay Parsons at least 10 mil next year...Their other max guy is Howard, who can play, we signed Amare who can't play...Surprised u still support Harden after calling Melo a volume scorer, who shoots it better than Harden...

this is an idiotic statement. harden has a 60TS% or about 5 percentage points higher than your favorite centerfold.

Melo is a career 46% shooter, Harden 44%...Harden is a flopper, TS% values floppers...

is that what TS% does? golly and here i thought it was a good thing to be able to draw fouls. nice to watch what a macho and stoical dude melo is. he just nobly presses on. poor melo. poor poor melo.

So u like Harden's game where he constantly jerks his head as he goes into the lane to draw fouls that really aren't fouls???

no i like that a player can draw fouls by using gamesmanship. it shows craftiness and guile, something that melo and his fans don't understand or appreciate. it doesn't help your case when you realize that melo gets to the line just as often as harden and lebron james.

there is no reason why he could not be a 60TS% player, taking 16-18 shots a game, getting to the line 10 times a game. his 3point shooting is actually pretty ok the last couple of years. but his game lacks craft and guile. look at durant and lbj and pierce in his prime: craft and guile. another thing they have in common that melo doesn't have is that, even though their usage rates are high, their assist rates are also high, meaning that they create cohesion.

i can't emphasize that last point enough.

Craft and guile huh...I call that flopping..Where does sportsmanship come into play? Bron lied to his organization and told them he didn't know what he will do at the end of the season and u applaud that..Melo told the truth so Denver can get pieces in return and he can secure a longer deal and u say he is a bad guy..He doesn't flop and fake actual fouls so he lacks craft and guile..Who is the twisted one here??

i said gamesmanship not sportsmanship.

lebron james honored his contract and played out the season. he owed the cavs nothing. there was nothing unethical in that.
lebron james colluded with two other guys to parlay a move to miami. collusion is unethical. it was a bitch move. and the tv show was insulting and embarrassing. but he took less money to go to where he wanted to go and he honored his contract. and he enriched the team he was going to by his actions. he wanted to win and he has won.

i call that gamesmanship or gaming the system.

carmelo did not honor his contract and was motivated by greed. he owed the nuggets the balance of his contract and nothing more. he met with dolan in vegas who knows nothing about basketball but loves to rub elbows with stars, leaving walsh out of the final decision. that backroom deal was borderline unethical but regardless the deal was motivated by greed. greed is not a matter of ethics it's a moral failing or a personal weakness of character. his actions enriched both the team he was leaving as well as himself and destroyed the germ of a decent team that he would have come to had he waited for free agency and taken less money. that's what lebron did.

melo's actions are the opposite of gamesmanship and you have the ultimate dupe in dolan to enable that.

amazing how the knicks had all that leverage in the beginning and managed to get the worst deal imaginable. but that is what a greedy player and an inept owner can do when they decide to work together.

funny how their games are a microcosm of this aspect of their lives, isn't it?

Your value system is all screwed up...No wonder u can't decipher who is doing right and who is doing wrong..U describe moral failings of the guy who was upfront and truthful then describe lying and being dishonest, colluding as gamesmanship..Good luck brother, glad I'm not your kid...No room for sportsmanship in your world..Floppers rein supreme..

holfresh wrote:

dk7th wrote:

holfresh wrote:

dk7th wrote:

holfresh wrote:

dk7th wrote:

holfresh wrote:

dk7th wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

holfresh wrote:It's time for this organization to start thinking about rebuilding around Melo..JVG said it last night...They have to entertain trade scenarios around Chandler, Shump, etc...We might have to take a second look at Lowry...

It would ahve been much easier if we didnt have to tarde so many assets for him. If he would ahve just waited to sign with us as a FA we would probably be in better shape IMO

Name those "assets"...Tell me the reason why we stink is Gallo...Stops saying assets and put names to them...

Cap space was the biggest one but picks and solid players count too

Please elaborate, Gallo had to get 10 mil which became Tyson essentially..So please elaborate...What pick..Tell me about the picks Donnie gave away to get under the cap..He could have let ZBO and the others expire..Does that count???? We traded David Lee for garbage and pointless salary back, so apparently Donnie wasn't thinking about the cap at that point..

Gallo doesn't even make half what Melo does but no one said we had to keep him anyway. If you don't know what picks we gave up in the Melo trade, you can look that up easily. I don't see what the other questions have to do with the topic.

What?????I have no clue what u are trying to say...What is the relevance of pointing out Gallo salary??...U said we would have cap space if Melo came here via free agency..I said we would have to pay Gallo 10 mil per plus Melo and Amare....The Mayor had to walk because we had no money for him...Where is the cap space???

I named the assets we gave up to get Melo. I was only replying to that part of the discussion. I wouldn't have signed Melo to a max contract salary in the off-season.

U would have signed Harden right??

Most likely. Houston got a great deal with him at $14 mil per

More closer to 16 mil per...No too different from a max deal, only space for one more max guy...Sprinkle in Lin and Asik at 15 per next year...They have to pay Parsons at least 10 mil next year...Their other max guy is Howard, who can play, we signed Amare who can't play...Surprised u still support Harden after calling Melo a volume scorer, who shoots it better than Harden...

this is an idiotic statement. harden has a 60TS% or about 5 percentage points higher than your favorite centerfold.

Melo is a career 46% shooter, Harden 44%...Harden is a flopper, TS% values floppers...

is that what TS% does? golly and here i thought it was a good thing to be able to draw fouls. nice to watch what a macho and stoical dude melo is. he just nobly presses on. poor melo. poor poor melo.

So u like Harden's game where he constantly jerks his head as he goes into the lane to draw fouls that really aren't fouls???

no i like that a player can draw fouls by using gamesmanship. it shows craftiness and guile, something that melo and his fans don't understand or appreciate. it doesn't help your case when you realize that melo gets to the line just as often as harden and lebron james.

there is no reason why he could not be a 60TS% player, taking 16-18 shots a game, getting to the line 10 times a game. his 3point shooting is actually pretty ok the last couple of years. but his game lacks craft and guile. look at durant and lbj and pierce in his prime: craft and guile. another thing they have in common that melo doesn't have is that, even though their usage rates are high, their assist rates are also high, meaning that they create cohesion.

i can't emphasize that last point enough.

Craft and guile huh...I call that flopping..Where does sportsmanship come into play? Bron lied to his organization and told them he didn't know what he will do at the end of the season and u applaud that..Melo told the truth so Denver can get pieces in return and he can secure a longer deal and u say he is a bad guy..He doesn't flop and fake actual fouls so he lacks craft and guile..Who is the twisted one here??

i said gamesmanship not sportsmanship.

lebron james honored his contract and played out the season. he owed the cavs nothing. there was nothing unethical in that.
lebron james colluded with two other guys to parlay a move to miami. collusion is unethical. it was a bitch move. and the tv show was insulting and embarrassing. but he took less money to go to where he wanted to go and he honored his contract. and he enriched the team he was going to by his actions. he wanted to win and he has won.

i call that gamesmanship or gaming the system.

carmelo did not honor his contract and was motivated by greed. he owed the nuggets the balance of his contract and nothing more. he met with dolan in vegas who knows nothing about basketball but loves to rub elbows with stars, leaving walsh out of the final decision. that backroom deal was borderline unethical but regardless the deal was motivated by greed. greed is not a matter of ethics it's a moral failing or a personal weakness of character. his actions enriched both the team he was leaving as well as himself and destroyed the germ of a decent team that he would have come to had he waited for free agency and taken less money. that's what lebron did.

melo's actions are the opposite of gamesmanship and you have the ultimate dupe in dolan to enable that.

amazing how the knicks had all that leverage in the beginning and managed to get the worst deal imaginable. but that is what a greedy player and an inept owner can do when they decide to work together.

funny how their games are a microcosm of this aspect of their lives, isn't it?

Your value system is all screwed up...No wonder u can't decipher who is doing right and who is doing wrong..U describe moral failings of the guy who was upfront and truthful then describe lying and being dishonest, colluding as gamesmanship..Good luck brother, glad I'm not your kid...No room for sportsmanship in your world..Floppers rein supreme..

your approach is naive.

i know the difference between winning and losing. i also know the difference between constructive behavior and destructive behavior. melo has been to the playoffs every year? BFD. he's made it past round 1 twice. think about that. melo was honest? BFD. he was greedy-- that part you left out. and how did he help his own cause or the knicks? dude is greedy and stupid, and that trumps honesty.

melo is a destructive loser-- a malignant narcissist-- and you think the knicks can build a winner around him.

dk7th wrote:i know the difference between winning and losing. i also know the difference between constructive behavior and destructive behavior. melo has been to the playoffs every year? BFD. he's made it past round 1 twice. think about that. melo was honest? BFD. he was greedy-- that part you left out. and how did he help his own cause or the knicks? dude is greedy and stupid, and that trumps honesty.

melo is a destructive loser-- a malignant narcissist-- and you think the knicks can build a winner around him.

Seems like the one year they set out to build a roster to compete they won 54 games and had JR and Tyson not completely sucked donkey dick against the Pacers we would have played the Heat in the conference finals.

So we replace veterans like Kidd and Sheed, guys who played at a very high level for stretches with Bargs and Beno and its the problem is Melo? Didnt we see what happens last year when Melo's supporting cast plays well?

Folks who claim to know basketball and claim to know what they are seeing have some funny opinions. For two months the entire backcourt on our roster shoots 35% but the problem is you cant build around Melo?

If we trade Melo we will still need exactly what we need now: more talented and consistent players. Only then we will be back to the David Lee, Gallo, Wilson Chandler days of winning 30 games and wondering if the #s these guys put up mean anything.

Melo wins games. You have to really phuck up a roster to play sub .500 ball when you have this guy on your team

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:i know the difference between winning and losing. i also know the difference between constructive behavior and destructive behavior. melo has been to the playoffs every year? BFD. he's made it past round 1 twice. think about that. melo was honest? BFD. he was greedy-- that part you left out. and how did he help his own cause or the knicks? dude is greedy and stupid, and that trumps honesty.

melo is a destructive loser-- a malignant narcissist-- and you think the knicks can build a winner around him.

clearly you dont... dude's been in the league 11 years and has never had a losing season. Garbage in garbage out.

Seems like the one year they set out to build a roster to compete they won 54 games and had JR and Tyson not completely sucked donkey dick against the Pacers we would have played the Heat in the conference finals.

So we replace veterans like Kidd and Sheed, guys who played at a very high level for stretches with Bargs and Beno and its the problem is Melo? Didnt we see what happens last year when Melo's supporting cast plays well?

Folks who claim to know basketball and claim to know what they are seeing have some funny opinions. For two months the entire backcourt on our roster shoots 35% but the problem is you cant build around Melo?

If we trade Melo we will still need exactly what we need now: more talented and consistent players. Only then we will be back to the David Lee, Gallo, Wilson Chandler days of winning 30 games and wondering if the #s these guys put up mean anything.

Melo wins games. You have to really phuck up a roster to play sub .500 ball when you have this guy on your team

TeamBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:i know the difference between winning and losing. i also know the difference between constructive behavior and destructive behavior. melo has been to the playoffs every year? BFD. he's made it past round 1 twice. think about that. melo was honest? BFD. he was greedy-- that part you left out. and how did he help his own cause or the knicks? dude is greedy and stupid, and that trumps honesty.

melo is a destructive loser-- a malignant narcissist-- and you think the knicks can build a winner around him.

clearly you dont... dude's been in the league 11 years and has never had a losing season. Garbage in garbage out.

Seems like the one year they set out to build a roster to compete they won 54 games and had JR and Tyson not completely sucked donkey dick against the Pacers we would have played the Heat in the conference finals.

So we replace veterans like Kidd and Sheed, guys who played at a very high level for stretches with Bargs and Beno and its the problem is Melo? Didnt we see what happens last year when Melo's supporting cast plays well?

Folks who claim to know basketball and claim to know what they are seeing have some funny opinions. For two months the entire backcourt on our roster shoots 35% but the problem is you cant build around Melo?

If we trade Melo we will still need exactly what we need now: more talented and consistent players. Only then we will be back to the David Lee, Gallo, Wilson Chandler days of winning 30 games and wondering if the #s these guys put up mean anything.

Melo wins games. You have to really phuck up a roster to play sub .500 ball when you have this guy on your team

It's just gonna keep going back to the Melo trade. "We would have those players if Melo didn't force his way here" or whatever. I get it. I agree with it to some extent. But it's done and it's over.

With that said, the Knicks do need to have some sort of plan in mind in the event that Melo walks. Dolans not trading him so we have to put our faith in Mills....

While the NBA occasionally has great 'teams' the league's good teams are still essentially the same. A couple high impact players with role players around them. We lose our one high impact guy and its back to many years of 30 win team seasons trying to figure out if the #s the guys on your roster like Lee and Gallo are putting are worth paying for.

Bonn1997 wrote:

TeamBall wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:i know the difference between winning and losing. i also know the difference between constructive behavior and destructive behavior. melo has been to the playoffs every year? BFD. he's made it past round 1 twice. think about that. melo was honest? BFD. he was greedy-- that part you left out. and how did he help his own cause or the knicks? dude is greedy and stupid, and that trumps honesty.

melo is a destructive loser-- a malignant narcissist-- and you think the knicks can build a winner around him.

clearly you dont... dude's been in the league 11 years and has never had a losing season. Garbage in garbage out.

Seems like the one year they set out to build a roster to compete they won 54 games and had JR and Tyson not completely sucked donkey dick against the Pacers we would have played the Heat in the conference finals.

So we replace veterans like Kidd and Sheed, guys who played at a very high level for stretches with Bargs and Beno and its the problem is Melo? Didnt we see what happens last year when Melo's supporting cast plays well?

Folks who claim to know basketball and claim to know what they are seeing have some funny opinions. For two months the entire backcourt on our roster shoots 35% but the problem is you cant build around Melo?

If we trade Melo we will still need exactly what we need now: more talented and consistent players. Only then we will be back to the David Lee, Gallo, Wilson Chandler days of winning 30 games and wondering if the #s these guys put up mean anything.

Melo wins games. You have to really phuck up a roster to play sub .500 ball when you have this guy on your team

Yet people using the eyeball test didn't realize how ****ed up the roster was until the results were obvious. Isn't that interesting?!

No, not really.

Well, it's interesting to people who want to learn about and better understand the game. New information is never interesting to those who don't want to learn though.

TeamBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

TeamBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:i know the difference between winning and losing. i also know the difference between constructive behavior and destructive behavior. melo has been to the playoffs every year? BFD. he's made it past round 1 twice. think about that. melo was honest? BFD. he was greedy-- that part you left out. and how did he help his own cause or the knicks? dude is greedy and stupid, and that trumps honesty.

melo is a destructive loser-- a malignant narcissist-- and you think the knicks can build a winner around him.

clearly you dont... dude's been in the league 11 years and has never had a losing season. Garbage in garbage out.

Seems like the one year they set out to build a roster to compete they won 54 games and had JR and Tyson not completely sucked donkey dick against the Pacers we would have played the Heat in the conference finals.

So we replace veterans like Kidd and Sheed, guys who played at a very high level for stretches with Bargs and Beno and its the problem is Melo? Didnt we see what happens last year when Melo's supporting cast plays well?

Folks who claim to know basketball and claim to know what they are seeing have some funny opinions. For two months the entire backcourt on our roster shoots 35% but the problem is you cant build around Melo?

If we trade Melo we will still need exactly what we need now: more talented and consistent players. Only then we will be back to the David Lee, Gallo, Wilson Chandler days of winning 30 games and wondering if the #s these guys put up mean anything.

Melo wins games. You have to really phuck up a roster to play sub .500 ball when you have this guy on your team

It's just gonna keep going back to the Melo trade. "We would have those players if Melo didn't force his way here" or whatever. I get it. I agree with it to some extent. But it's done and it's over.

With that said, the Knicks do need to have some sort of plan in mind in the event that Melo walks. Dolans not trading him so we have to put our faith in Mills....

what sunk this ship isnt the Melo trade. Its what happened after. Chandler and Gallo are alway hurt. Are they building blocks? Mosgov is a very good backup, and may eventually become a decent starter but he's still backup. Felton is terrible and NOT a building block. Jordon Hill is playing OK and even starting but is a low impact player. Who are the stars we are lamenting losing in that trade? I hated the trade also, mostly because it meant the end of Walsh, a guy who I thought could execute a plan and continue to fix the Knicks.

While the NBA occasionally has great 'teams' the league's good teams are still essentially the same. A couple high impact players with role players around them. We lose our one high impact guy and its back to many years of 30 win team seasons trying to figure out if the #s the guys on your roster like Lee and Gallo are putting are worth paying for.

The only thing I disliked about the trade is what Melo did from his side which was keeping the Nets in it. Other than that, I would have gone for him.

The thing with Melo though is do you give him the money he wants to stay here?

Do I think we win a title with Melo? Not likely. Do I think we are in the playoffs every year with MElo? Yes I do.

I just refuse to kid myself into believing that we are better off without him. He has flaws but he's a high impact guy and one of a dozen or so around the league, and if your lucky enough to have one then market him and build around him. Winning is better then losing. Winning creates options. Losing takes them away. Winning builds player value. Losing strips it. Winning build culture and esteem. Losing washes it away.

If we had picks I could stomach a spell like Boston is going to undertake... but they have what? 10 first rounders in the next years? Very different set of circumstances.

And to address Bonn's commenct I could not have predicted out entire backcourt playing so poorly, but when you look at the #s are you suprised by the record? Our three big contributors there are Felton/Shumpert/JR. Please describe their level of play from last year to this. But everything KNicks is about MElo... I get it

fishmike wrote:

TeamBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

TeamBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:i know the difference between winning and losing. i also know the difference between constructive behavior and destructive behavior. melo has been to the playoffs every year? BFD. he's made it past round 1 twice. think about that. melo was honest? BFD. he was greedy-- that part you left out. and how did he help his own cause or the knicks? dude is greedy and stupid, and that trumps honesty.

melo is a destructive loser-- a malignant narcissist-- and you think the knicks can build a winner around him.

clearly you dont... dude's been in the league 11 years and has never had a losing season. Garbage in garbage out.

Seems like the one year they set out to build a roster to compete they won 54 games and had JR and Tyson not completely sucked donkey dick against the Pacers we would have played the Heat in the conference finals.

So we replace veterans like Kidd and Sheed, guys who played at a very high level for stretches with Bargs and Beno and its the problem is Melo? Didnt we see what happens last year when Melo's supporting cast plays well?

Folks who claim to know basketball and claim to know what they are seeing have some funny opinions. For two months the entire backcourt on our roster shoots 35% but the problem is you cant build around Melo?

If we trade Melo we will still need exactly what we need now: more talented and consistent players. Only then we will be back to the David Lee, Gallo, Wilson Chandler days of winning 30 games and wondering if the #s these guys put up mean anything.

Melo wins games. You have to really phuck up a roster to play sub .500 ball when you have this guy on your team

It's just gonna keep going back to the Melo trade. "We would have those players if Melo didn't force his way here" or whatever. I get it. I agree with it to some extent. But it's done and it's over.

With that said, the Knicks do need to have some sort of plan in mind in the event that Melo walks. Dolans not trading him so we have to put our faith in Mills....

what sunk this ship isnt the Melo trade. Its what happened after. Chandler and Gallo are alway hurt. Are they building blocks? Mosgov is a very good backup, and may eventually become a decent starter but he's still backup. Felton is terrible and NOT a building block. Jordon Hill is playing OK and even starting but is a low impact player. Who are the stars we are lamenting losing in that trade? I hated the trade also, mostly because it meant the end of Walsh, a guy who I thought could execute a plan and continue to fix the Knicks.

While the NBA occasionally has great 'teams' the league's good teams are still essentially the same. A couple high impact players with role players around them. We lose our one high impact guy and its back to many years of 30 win team seasons trying to figure out if the #s the guys on your roster like Lee and Gallo are putting are worth paying for.

The only thing I disliked about the trade is what Melo did from his side which was keeping the Nets in it. Other than that, I would have gone for him.

The thing with Melo though is do you give him the money he wants to stay here?

I would. Folks who dont think he's not a max player know nothing about the NBA. Melo is a high impact guy and has shown when he's surrounded with any level of quality that his teams win.

Do I think we win a title with Melo? Not likely. Do I think we are in the playoffs every year with MElo? Yes I do.

I just refuse to kid myself into believing that we are better off without him. He has flaws but he's a high impact guy and one of a dozen or so around the league, and if your lucky enough to have one then market him and build around him. Winning is better then losing. Winning creates options. Losing takes them away. Winning builds player value. Losing strips it. Winning build culture and esteem. Losing washes it away.

If we had picks I could stomach a spell like Boston is going to undertake... but they have what? 10 first rounders in the next years? Very different set of circumstances.

And to address Bonn's commenct I could not have predicted out entire backcourt playing so poorly, but when you look at the #s are you suprised by the record? Our three big contributors there are Felton/Shumpert/JR. Please describe their level of play from last year to this. But everything KNicks is about MElo... I get it

fishmike wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

I just refuse to kid myself into believing that we are better off without him.

That depends entirely on how his $21 mil salary is replaced. You make it sound like people want to waive him and replace him with an NBDL player.

look around the league. Use your brain. What happens if Melo walks? What is your plan to rebuild the roster? We are then a team with no impact players. So how are you replacing that? Tell me names. It sure seems to me your picking from a cheap FA pool (NBDL caliber guys) or your going to overpay for a guy who has more holes in his game and is lower impact than Melo anyway... guys like Jennings, Josh Smith, Al Jefferson... your looking at another extended period of 30 win seasons while you pine for an impact player to build around.

Bonn you make it sounds as simple as our impact player isnt good enough to win a title, so lets get a new one. It took this organization 10 years to accomplish that.

And what happens if he stays at max salary?

The question is not is Melo good or bad. He's good, very very good even, not Lebron great but still.

The main question si will Melo be good enough for the salary he's about to get?
And what about in 3 years?
He has played a **** ton of minutes already, how long before he breaks down?
How will his monster contract look then?

Don't think about the Melo trade, who's right or wrong, I told you so or whatever...
Aren't you all fed up of paying diamonds for over the hill stars?
Cause Melo will be our next Amare/Dice/Houston times ten because of the new salary cap.
This is something we won't overcome, even with Dolan's big pockets, the new CBA is a brand new paradigm on how you have to build teams.
It is time the Knicks adapted.

It's a ugly long road we have in front of us if we don't take hard decisions now.
I've been a Knick fan for 25 years, Dolan is about to get me, I'm fed up with this crap.