3G4G wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

3G4G wrote:

tkf wrote:

dk7th wrote:

tkf wrote:

Papabear wrote:

tkf wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

sebstar wrote:

franco12 wrote:its not just the Melo trade - its every deal made over the last 5-10 years.

This franchise is essentially over-leveraged like a bank - and they borrow against tomorrow for a mediocre today.

Letting Lin go for nothing is just one more example of mismanagement.

Signing Amar'e when we missed out on Lebron - another move that might have been better played by keeping Lee (possibly at a home team discount?) rather than signing a star just for the sake of making a move.

Great post...to flesh this out, we essentially traded Zach, crawford, lee, and two lottery pics just to have the OPTION of signing lebron james and another big free agent. That strategy failed, and all we had to show for it was Amare, who is broken down.

Thats the reason why we had to rely on older talent...not the melo trade. We gave up mediocre talent for a top 5 player in his prime. Get real. The cupboard was bare when melo was traded her, because of the mismanagement of the previous regime.

We got Amar'e, who got Felton and Melo, who got JR and Tyson, who got Kidd, Camby and Sheed. Fair or not, Zach Randolph and Crawford were not draws to other players.

And I get so sick of this blazing hypocrisy and revisionist history. People HATED Zach for his lack of defense. They spent Jamal Crawford's entire stint here blasting him for shot selection and poor defense. People wined none stop about 'Avid Lee' and his complete lack of D. Now they are gods, while people blast the players we do have. Its the same c*** over and over! AAAAARRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!

a boatload of money got us amare, money got felton, money and stupidity got us carmelo, money got JR and money sure as hell got us tyson chandler.. a 3 year deal and money got us kidd, a ridiculous trade got us camby....

Papabear Says

TKF why in the hell are you a Knicks Fan??? Or are you? You hate the team players you mentioned you hate the owner. Why don't you just go be a Denver fan? Jump the ship. I read some of your posts and its a hate thing with you. You really don't like the Knicks so just admit it. You are not a New York Knicks Fan. You hate the Knicks. ADMIT IT !!

why are you a knicks fan? or are you? start with the owner on down.. you defend this team at all cost.... you like herb williams, dolan? all the trades? salary position.... future outlook? break it down for me...

lots of battered-wife syndromers is how you break it down. ironic that dolan runs things and yet he is so obviously a milquetoast, but when you have money it can insulate you from personal defects. dolan is not interested in winning he is interested in putting asses in seats regardless of the actual quality of the team. he also loves stars. and he surrounds himself with yes-men. dolan always finds a way to alienate or force away good people.

the fish rots from the head down.

exactly..., it does... i dislike dolan as much as I do the maloofs.. the NBA just found a way to get those clowns out of town. now time to work on this fool here at msg...

Ironically ticket sales are down 9% at the Garden in a year which the team is supposedly built to win now? Go Figure

fewer seats this year until the renovations are finished

Dude you're reaching here bro.....

Here's Wiki's info for Basketball

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madison_Square_Garden 19,033

Knicks vs Bulls second game of season(No Derrick Rose)
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278103 19,033

Knicks vs Bulls yesterday(No Derrick Rose Melo coming off suspension
http://scores.espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278254 19,033

Knicks vs Bulls Feb 2 last year(Derrick Rose played)
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=320202018 19,763

Now we know attendance during games is fudged a little but ticket sales down 9% has very little to do with renovation, it has more to do with average ticket price which the Knicks recently hiked up the average price of admission to alarming levels.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7529476/nba-average-ticket-price-increases-first-time-three-years

To a somewhat smaller degree but it will affect overall percentages factor Brooklyn Nets moving to town. 9% of an arena at near 20,000 capacity would be about 1800 seats missing at an average of $117.50/seat.... do the math, do you think in your right Dolan would take those losses. Uhhhh No!

Fact:

The real MSG capacity is 19,763, though most of us round up because it sounds cooler.

With the second stage of the Garden transformation nearly complete, the Garden capacity will fall about 1,000 lower than the usual 19,763 sell-out crowd, according to team officials.

Link for your reading: http://www.postingandtoasting.com/2012/10/18/3521094/madison-square-gardens-capacity-will-shrink-a-bit-this-season

cooch2584 wrote:Id like to see dk7th and tkf make a post within 1 min of each other.AINT HAPPENING AGAIN CALLING OUT

wouldn't that in effect disprove your assertion... cooch? anybody home? and is carlos boozer your favorite player?

dk7th wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:Id like to see dk7th and tkf make a post within 1 min of each other.AINT HAPPENING AGAIN CALLING OUT

wouldn't that in effect disprove your assertion... cooch? anybody home? and is carlos boozer your favorite player?

DANCING,DANCING,DANCING HES A DANCING MACHINE.

cooch2584 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

TeamBall wrote:

dk7th wrote:lots of battered-wife syndromers is how you break it down. ironic that dolan runs things and yet he is so obviously a milquetoast, but when you have money it can insulate you from personal defects. dolan is not interested in winning he is interested in putting asses in seats regardless of the actual quality of the team. he also loves stars. and he surrounds himself with yes-men. dolan always finds a way to alienate or force away good people.

the fish rots from the head down.

Going by your logic, I dont see how anyone can have "battered-wife syndrome" worse than those who dislike/hate this team yet still continue to frequent message boards dedicated to it

for me it has been a swing between rubbernecking and being a coroner. i am not in denial like a battered wife is. i am a realist but there are many so-called knick fans who seem to be inhabiting a bizarro world where everything is upside-down and backwards.

when the knicks show the potential for reaching the finals-- hell even a potential strong showing in the conference finals-- there will be justification for genuine excitement. i was moving in that direction the first 15-20 games but started seeing the cracks around the first houston game. since then i have receded back to skepticism and now it's going to take some real re-grouping and leadership to right this listing ship.

look at my signature. ask yourself if the knicks look like a finals-caliber team or even a conference finals team. that's where my point of view radiates from. i am thinking ahead not living in the moment like so many here are willing to do, echoing the battered-wife syndrome of hopes and prayers.

If you have "receded back into skepticism" then you aint a real fan. REAL fans take a loss , and move on and not dwell on it,the same with a win,take it and look to the next game. Some of yall will pick apart a loss like a crow on road kill but they STFU when our team wins. THOSE are not real fans.

this is nonsense. who died and left you boss? since when do you get to define what a real fan is? tkf is right-- you are the sort of fan that is satisfied enabling incompetent people and losers. you remind me of tammy wynette song-- stand by your man.

Nope, its called standing by your TEAM,something you know nothing about. Oh and I thought I was on ignore with you.LOL

no cooch i urged YOU to put ME on ignore. remember?

I would NEVER put you on ignore,YOUR A CLOWN PURELY FOR ENTERTAINMENT PURPOSES

well at least one of us is benefitting from this, cooch. and if you don't mind, cooch, unless you're willing to bet the 2000 tkf suggested, i am not going to respond any longer to your posts.

gunsnewing wrote:I don't think it was Dolan's idea to get Lebron. Walsh said the media and fans started talking about Lebron's upcoming free agency and he figured why not go in on it

He might "go in on it" bit its an organizational decision. No way I can ever imagine a GM of any team in any league make such moves in any way without ownership being on board.

If your right, then our leadership is beyond comprehension.

dk7th wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

TeamBall wrote:

dk7th wrote:lots of battered-wife syndromers is how you break it down. ironic that dolan runs things and yet he is so obviously a milquetoast, but when you have money it can insulate you from personal defects. dolan is not interested in winning he is interested in putting asses in seats regardless of the actual quality of the team. he also loves stars. and he surrounds himself with yes-men. dolan always finds a way to alienate or force away good people.

the fish rots from the head down.

Going by your logic, I dont see how anyone can have "battered-wife syndrome" worse than those who dislike/hate this team yet still continue to frequent message boards dedicated to it

for me it has been a swing between rubbernecking and being a coroner. i am not in denial like a battered wife is. i am a realist but there are many so-called knick fans who seem to be inhabiting a bizarro world where everything is upside-down and backwards.

when the knicks show the potential for reaching the finals-- hell even a potential strong showing in the conference finals-- there will be justification for genuine excitement. i was moving in that direction the first 15-20 games but started seeing the cracks around the first houston game. since then i have receded back to skepticism and now it's going to take some real re-grouping and leadership to right this listing ship.

look at my signature. ask yourself if the knicks look like a finals-caliber team or even a conference finals team. that's where my point of view radiates from. i am thinking ahead not living in the moment like so many here are willing to do, echoing the battered-wife syndrome of hopes and prayers.

If you have "receded back into skepticism" then you aint a real fan. REAL fans take a loss , and move on and not dwell on it,the same with a win,take it and look to the next game. Some of yall will pick apart a loss like a crow on road kill but they STFU when our team wins. THOSE are not real fans.

this is nonsense. who died and left you boss? since when do you get to define what a real fan is? tkf is right-- you are the sort of fan that is satisfied enabling incompetent people and losers. you remind me of tammy wynette song-- stand by your man.

Nope, its called standing by your TEAM,something you know nothing about. Oh and I thought I was on ignore with you.LOL

no cooch i urged YOU to put ME on ignore. remember?

I would NEVER put you on ignore,YOUR A CLOWN PURELY FOR ENTERTAINMENT PURPOSES

well at least one of us is benefitting from this, cooch. and if you don't mind, cooch, unless you're willing to bet the 2000 tkf suggested, i am not going to respond any longer to your posts.

RUN,dk7th/tkf RUN REAL FAST so your running away?? Take your ball and run away because you and your alter ego are CLOWNS LOOKING FOR ATTENTION.SNFH AT THE CLOWNS

knickscity wrote:

Nalod wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:I don't think it was Dolan's idea to get Lebron. Walsh said the media and fans started talking about Lebron's upcoming free agency and he figured why not go in on it

Its always the owners directive a GM will follow. Owner has to sign off on the financials.

He might "go in on it" bit its an organizational decision. No way I can ever imagine a GM of any team in any league make such moves in any way without ownership being on board.

If your right, then our leadership is beyond comprehension.

I'm sure Walsh sold him on the idea.

We all know what dolan is about so we make the best of it and move on.

3G4G wrote:

Hersports85 wrote:

3G4G wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

3G4G wrote:

tkf wrote:

dk7th wrote:

tkf wrote:

Papabear wrote:

tkf wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

sebstar wrote:

franco12 wrote:its not just the Melo trade - its every deal made over the last 5-10 years.

This franchise is essentially over-leveraged like a bank - and they borrow against tomorrow for a mediocre today.

Letting Lin go for nothing is just one more example of mismanagement.

Signing Amar'e when we missed out on Lebron - another move that might have been better played by keeping Lee (possibly at a home team discount?) rather than signing a star just for the sake of making a move.

Great post...to flesh this out, we essentially traded Zach, crawford, lee, and two lottery pics just to have the OPTION of signing lebron james and another big free agent. That strategy failed, and all we had to show for it was Amare, who is broken down.

Thats the reason why we had to rely on older talent...not the melo trade. We gave up mediocre talent for a top 5 player in his prime. Get real. The cupboard was bare when melo was traded her, because of the mismanagement of the previous regime.

We got Amar'e, who got Felton and Melo, who got JR and Tyson, who got Kidd, Camby and Sheed. Fair or not, Zach Randolph and Crawford were not draws to other players.

And I get so sick of this blazing hypocrisy and revisionist history. People HATED Zach for his lack of defense. They spent Jamal Crawford's entire stint here blasting him for shot selection and poor defense. People wined none stop about 'Avid Lee' and his complete lack of D. Now they are gods, while people blast the players we do have. Its the same c*** over and over! AAAAARRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!

a boatload of money got us amare, money got felton, money and stupidity got us carmelo, money got JR and money sure as hell got us tyson chandler.. a 3 year deal and money got us kidd, a ridiculous trade got us camby....

Papabear Says

TKF why in the hell are you a Knicks Fan??? Or are you? You hate the team players you mentioned you hate the owner. Why don't you just go be a Denver fan? Jump the ship. I read some of your posts and its a hate thing with you. You really don't like the Knicks so just admit it. You are not a New York Knicks Fan. You hate the Knicks. ADMIT IT !!

why are you a knicks fan? or are you? start with the owner on down.. you defend this team at all cost.... you like herb williams, dolan? all the trades? salary position.... future outlook? break it down for me...

lots of battered-wife syndromers is how you break it down. ironic that dolan runs things and yet he is so obviously a milquetoast, but when you have money it can insulate you from personal defects. dolan is not interested in winning he is interested in putting asses in seats regardless of the actual quality of the team. he also loves stars. and he surrounds himself with yes-men. dolan always finds a way to alienate or force away good people.

the fish rots from the head down.

exactly..., it does... i dislike dolan as much as I do the maloofs.. the NBA just found a way to get those clowns out of town. now time to work on this fool here at msg...

Ironically ticket sales are down 9% at the Garden in a year which the team is supposedly built to win now? Go Figure

fewer seats this year until the renovations are finished

Dude you're reaching here bro.....

Here's Wiki's info for Basketball

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madison_Square_Garden 19,033

Knicks vs Bulls second game of season(No Derrick Rose)
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278103 19,033

Knicks vs Bulls yesterday(No Derrick Rose Melo coming off suspension
http://scores.espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400278254 19,033

Knicks vs Bulls Feb 2 last year(Derrick Rose played)
http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=320202018 19,763

Now we know attendance during games is fudged a little but ticket sales down 9% has very little to do with renovation, it has more to do with average ticket price which the Knicks recently hiked up the average price of admission to alarming levels.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7529476/nba-average-ticket-price-increases-first-time-three-years

To a somewhat smaller degree but it will affect overall percentages factor Brooklyn Nets moving to town. 9% of an arena at near 20,000 capacity would be about 1800 seats missing at an average of $117.50/seat.... do the math, do you think in your right Dolan would take those losses. Uhhhh No!

Fact:

The real MSG capacity is 19,763, though most of us round up because it sounds cooler.

With the second stage of the Garden transformation nearly complete, the Garden capacity will fall about 1,000 lower than the usual 19,763 sell-out crowd, according to team officials.

Link for your reading: http://www.postingandtoasting.com/2012/10/18/3521094/madison-square-gardens-capacity-will-shrink-a-bit-this-season

Having 730 less seats creates a 3.5% drop in potential ticket sales but sales are down 9%. Your link provided was more proof it's not totally related to renovation is has a factor but there are others.

Where are you getting 9%