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4949
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12/30/2007  3:02 PM
Posted by GKFv2:

Damn that fool Crawford for getting injured and giving Isiah another excuse. Dolan will probably be seen laughing again with Isiah. No accountability in this organization. None!

it's all staged.
I'll never trust this' team again.
AUTOADVERT
holfresh
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12/30/2007  3:03 PM
Posted by tkf:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by tkf:

you know I find it funny how every analyst, ever other teams announcers when they call a game vs the knicks, just praise lee, and really respects how he plays the game.. they also notice how guys like zach seem to bring very little to the table, and how curry is not really in NBA shape..

but on these sites, all i hear is how we defend lee and how he never gets blame.. I mean are you guys serious? what got damn game are you watching?

Dont pay any attention to Holfresh, he loathes the fact that Lee is liked by the fans and it eats at him every minute of every day while Lee is a Knick.

I hate the fact that Lee comes up smelling like roses every time when the entire team sucks..



so because lee plays hard, and plays the right way, he should called out because his team sucks? tell me, how in the hell does that make sense?

It's a myth that he plays the right way...he doesn't play on the defensive end of the ball...It is also a myth that good things happens when he is in the game....DLee is a good player not a great player...He makes the same mistakes others on the team make...He doesn't always play hard which is another myth that is always heard...Another myth is the Knicks competes when he is in the game...Please bro...He didn't suck as bad as the rest of our crappy players today but clearly he is not playing the way he did last year...Does that make sense...
4949
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12/30/2007  3:09 PM
Posted by tkf:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by tkf:

you know I find it funny how every analyst, ever other teams announcers when they call a game vs the knicks, just praise lee, and really respects how he plays the game.. they also notice how guys like zach seem to bring very little to the table, and how curry is not really in NBA shape..

but on these sites, all i hear is how we defend lee and how he never gets blame.. I mean are you guys serious? what got damn game are you watching?

Dont pay any attention to Holfresh, he loathes the fact that Lee is liked by the fans and it eats at him every minute of every day while Lee is a Knick.

I hate the fact that Lee comes up smelling like roses every time when the entire team sucks..



so because lee plays hard, and plays the right way, he should called out because his team sucks? tell me, how in the hell does that make sense?

why is it that Lee seems to be the only one that is not controversial. He plays hard and goes about what he's supposed to do on this team. I would put Crawford in the same position also. Maybe even Balkman. They stay out of trouble off court and on and just try to do what their suppose to do. Be there and try hard. They may not be the most talented, but it's a start.
I'll never trust this' team again.
bitty41
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12/30/2007  3:10 PM
one thing i will say about david lee - he has league wide respect...it's not just from a bunch of idiots on this board. he was invited to workout with team usa. that shows he's thought highly of by nba execs as a potential player for the team down the road.

secondly, many factors play into it:

1. he plays hard pretty much all the time
2. he was the #30 pick
3. he's white
4. and he makes less than balkman

zach is 20/10, has a bad rep, and makes basically max dollars. there's a different level of expectation for each player. lee has exceeded fans expectations while zach has dissapointed.

I agree this is all fair and pretty much encompasses the whole Lee vs Randolph debate. However I still think Lee is a bit overhyped. You look at guys like Haslem, Varejao, Bogut, McDyess and they bring the same attributes to the table but they get just a job well done. And I think the one factor that you don't mention is that for many fans Lee is the epitome of the Anti-Isiah movement.

[Edited by - bitty41 on 12-30-2007 3:12 PM]
bigbeast
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12/30/2007  3:10 PM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by bitty41:
How sad we have 2 fans arguing in defense of Zach to slight Lee as we produces another blowout effort performance. Why would you want to post on a forum to **** on Lee while trying to cut Zach some slack? This gets back to the fans who would lash out in fits of rage defending Curry....WHY?

True my only problem is that people make Lee out to be this sort of "everything is okay player" that makes the sun shine everytime he steps out onto the floor. Whereas Randolph is criticsed roundly every game regardless of whether he performed well or poorly.

one thing i will say about david lee - he has league wide respect...it's not just from a bunch of idiots on this board. he was invited to workout with team usa. that shows he's thought highly of by nba execs as a potential player for the team down the road.

secondly, many factors play into it:

1. he plays hard pretty much all the time
2. he was the #30 pick
3. he's white
4. and he makes less than balkman

zach is 20/10, has a bad rep, and makes basically max dollars. there's a different level of expectation for each player. lee has exceeded fans expectations while zach has dissapointed.

Pretty much sums it up...

"Man, who knows with this team." Aguirre.
4949
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12/30/2007  3:12 PM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by bitty41:
How sad we have 2 fans arguing in defense of Zach to slight Lee as we produces another blowout effort performance. Why would you want to post on a forum to **** on Lee while trying to cut Zach some slack? This gets back to the fans who would lash out in fits of rage defending Curry....WHY?

True my only problem is that people make Lee out to be this sort of "everything is okay player" that makes the sun shine everytime he steps out onto the floor. Whereas Randolph is criticsed roundly every game regardless of whether he performed well or poorly.

one thing i will say about david lee - he has league wide respect...it's not just from a bunch of idiots on this board. he was invited to workout with team usa. that shows he's thought highly of by nba execs as a potential player for the team down the road.

secondly, many factors play into it:

1. he plays hard pretty much all the time
2. he was the #30 pick
3. he's white
4. and he makes less than balkman

zach is 20/10, has a bad rep, and makes basically max dollars. there's a different level of expectation for each player. lee has exceeded fans expectations while zach has dissapointed.

Wait a minute. Are you calling the people on this board who respect Lee, idiots? And why do you have to make the point that he's white. Did anyone here make a point that the rest of the team is black? That's not the point we're making.
I'll never trust this' team again.
tkf
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12/30/2007  3:13 PM
Posted by bitty41:
that is not a point, that is just foolishness. lee sucks? why? because you say so? listen, every basketball mind in the NBA dissagrees with you.. so I guess I will side with guys who actually understand the game, and not some fan, who has seemingly let his emotions get the best of him..

This is pretty lame "oh every great basketball mind think so" this isn't exactly concrete evidence. Most of the great NBA minds as you term it aren't even thinking about the Knicks other then a good laugh because they have absolutely no relevance to real basketball right now.

[Edited by - bitty41 on 12-30-2007 3:11 PM]


did I say "great" or did you just add that in there to make your weak point have some sort of merit? listen to every announcer that does the knicks game, I mean opposing teams announcers, these guys are basketball minds, former coaches and players. The bulls announcers, the kings, the list goes on and on, these guys love lee, they love the way he plays the game.. this is not rocket science bro!!!!!

But I guess we should just listen to you, because you say so.. right?
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
TrueBlue
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12/30/2007  3:14 PM
Posted by tkf:
Posted by TrueBlue:
Posted by tkf:
Posted by bitty41:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by BlueSeats:

In the 1st quarter lee went 4-4 and was probably the best player on the floor for either team. We played with spirit and unity. Then Isiah sat him most of the second quarter. Curry put up points but the knicks lost ground and spirit.

Please stop...


Noah shut Lee down.

.. noah didn't do a damn thing. the first quarter the guys were playing well. then he sat lee until a little under two minutes in the second quarter, jeffries who was playing well, sat most of that quarter also....

[Edited by - tkf on 30-12-2007 2:39 PM]



How sad we have 2 fans arguing in defense of Zach to slight Lee as we produces another blowout effort performance. Why would you want to post on a forum to **** on Lee while trying to cut Zach some slack? This gets back to the fans who would lash out in fits of rage defending Curry....WHY?

[Edited by - TrueBlue on 12-30-2007 1:47 PM]

I agree, that is just moronic behavior. over at realgm, they are defending zach, and using crawford as reason to do so.. I said, crawford is not the knicks problem, he is not their solution, but he is not the problem. zach is a huge problem IMO.... But yea , listen to every announcer around the league, they heap praises on lee, while they take pot shots at zach.. I guess they are all missing something too.. right? what a joke..


Spot on! I even asked Holfresh earlier if he was able to listen to the Bulls announcers, they were having a field day torching Zach. But for some odd reason our fans always have to detract from the big picture and start this little escapade of scapegoating the least glaring problem.

[Edited by - TrueBlue on 12-30-2007 2:30 PM]
LMFAO @ the Bio [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephon_Marbury[/url]
tkf
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12/30/2007  3:15 PM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by tkf:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by tkf:

you know I find it funny how every analyst, ever other teams announcers when they call a game vs the knicks, just praise lee, and really respects how he plays the game.. they also notice how guys like zach seem to bring very little to the table, and how curry is not really in NBA shape..

but on these sites, all i hear is how we defend lee and how he never gets blame.. I mean are you guys serious? what got damn game are you watching?

Dont pay any attention to Holfresh, he loathes the fact that Lee is liked by the fans and it eats at him every minute of every day while Lee is a Knick.

I hate the fact that Lee comes up smelling like roses every time when the entire team sucks..



so because lee plays hard, and plays the right way, he should called out because his team sucks? tell me, how in the hell does that make sense?

It's a myth that he plays the right way...he doesn't play on the defensive end of the ball...It is also a myth that good things happens when he is in the game....DLee is a good player not a great player...He makes the same mistakes others on the team make...He doesn't always play hard which is another myth that is always heard...Another myth is the Knicks competes when he is in the game...Please bro...He didn't suck as bad as the rest of our crappy players today but clearly he is not playing the way he did last year...Does that make sense...



who said lee was GREAT? we all acknowlege he is good, but that is the point, if we had 4 other good players to put on the floor consistently we would not be 8-21!!!
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
PresIke
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12/30/2007  3:15 PM
Posted by GKFv2:

Who cares if he's depressed? He's been depressed before. Means nothing. This moron is going to be here for a long time. Damn that fool Crawford for getting injured and giving Isiah another excuse. Dolan will probably be seen laughing again with Isiah. No accountability in this organization. None!

Didn't mean to imply anyone should care (I actually kind of expected someone to state this) but to point out how lost even he appears, when he usually stands up to critics. He was not really making excuses today. He has to say something, and to suddenly expect him go all Peter Finch in 'Network' or Damon Waynes in 'Bamboozled' is unlikely:



especially when I suspect Dolan is like this character:

Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
BlueSeats
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12/30/2007  3:17 PM
Who's hyping Lee? I think Nocioni is three times the player Lee is, and he comes off the bench.

By look at the game log and follow Lee's name on the right hand side. In the first half everything he did was a positive. No missed shots, no turnovers, and holfresh wants him bashed.

http://scores.espn.go.com/nba/playbyplay?gameId=271230018
PresIke
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12/30/2007  3:17 PM
Posted by FireIsiah:

Isiah has the audacity to say we are close. Close to what? you f'in ahole.

Man, he didn't say that. That is not a real quote.
Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
4949
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12/30/2007  3:17 PM
Posted by bitty41:

And I think the one factor that you don't mention is that for many fans Lee is the epitome of the Anti-Isiah movement.

So is that a representation in a good way or a bad one? And why would he' be the rep?
I'll never trust this' team again.
tkf
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12/30/2007  3:18 PM
Posted by TrueBlue:
Posted by tkf:
Posted by TrueBlue:
Posted by tkf:
Posted by bitty41:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by BlueSeats:

In the 1st quarter lee went 4-4 and was probably the best player on the floor for either team. We played with spirit and unity. Then Isiah sat him most of the second quarter. Curry put up points but the knicks lost ground and spirit.

Please stop...


Noah shut Lee down.

.. noah didn't do a damn thing. the first quarter the guys were playing well. then he sat lee until a little under two minutes in the second quarter, jeffries who was playing well, sat most of that quarter also....

[Edited by - tkf on 30-12-2007 2:39 PM]



How sad we have 2 fans arguing in defense of Zach to slight Lee as we produces another blowout effort performance. Why would you want to post on a forum to **** on Lee while trying to cut Zach some slack? This gets back to the fans who would lash out in fits of rage defending Curry....WHY?

[Edited by - TrueBlue on 12-30-2007 1:47 PM]

I agree, that is just moronic behavior. over at realgm, they are defending zach, and using crawford as reason to do so.. I said, crawford is not the knicks problem, he is not their solution, but he is not the problem. zach is a huge problem IMO.... But yea , listen to every announcer around the league, they heap praises on lee, while they take pot shots at zach.. I guess they are all missing something too.. right? what a joke..


Spot on! I even asked Holfresh earlier if he was able to listen to the Bulls announcers, they were having a field Zach torching Zach. But for some odd reason our fans always have to detract from the big picture and start this little escapade of scapegoating the least glaring problem.

when lee was destroying the kings front line a few weeks ago. the kings announcers were like, this david lee is good, and young. Then they mentioned the artest rumors with the knicks, and they went on to say" no wonder why the knicks are reluctant to include this kid in any deal, he is a player". Now these are guys who have no reason to pump lee up, they are just commenting on what they and every sane person in this league sees...
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
PresIke
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12/30/2007  3:20 PM
Posted by FireIsiah:
Posted by 4949:
Posted by islesfan:

Isiah's press conference:

"We played 30 really good minutes. We just need to learn how to do that for the full 48. We're really close. There's still a lot of time left in this season. We're all glad to see this year end and we expect good things in 2008."

I just want to go down and kick his ass.

Im sure if someone knocks him out this whole message board will bail you out and many lawyers will represent you for free.

Guys, he's messing around. Isiah's press conference hadn't started yet, nor did he say this.

I'm not defending Isiah and in some ways this isn't a huge deal, but we should know better than to falsely quote folks. It's borderline libel/defamation, even if you don't like the person and has said similar things before.

[Edited by - PresIke on 12-30-2007 3:21 PM]

[Edited by - PresIke on 12-30-2007 3:22 PM]
Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
bitty41
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12/30/2007  3:20 PM
did I say "great" or did you just add that in there to make your weak point have some sort of merit? listen to every announcer that does the knicks game, I mean opposing teams announcers, these guys are basketball minds, former coaches and players. The bulls announcers, the kings, the list goes on and on, these guys love lee, they love the way he plays the game.. this is not rocket science bro!!!!!

But I guess we should just listen to you, because you say so.. right?

Look I will repeat saying that you heard that announcer say sing Lee's praises is not a viable proof that Lee is a respected player around the league. If the coaches vote him on the all-star team okay, he makes an all-NBA team again thats concrete proof.
holfresh
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12/30/2007  3:22 PM
Posted by BlueSeats:

Who's hyping Lee? I think Nocioni is three times the player Lee is, and he comes off the bench.

By look at the game log and follow Lee's name on the right hand side. In the first half everything he did was a positive. No missed shots, no turnovers, and holfresh wants him bashed.

http://scores.espn.go.com/nba/playbyplay?gameId=271230018

No Blue I don't want to bash him at all, just don't say things were going well when he is in the game because it wasn't going well...

He played 36 minutes with 11 pts, 7 boards...but somehow is was the only one doing well and playing the right way..





[Edited by - holfresh on 12-30-2007 3:24 PM]

[Edited by - holfresh on 12-30-2007 3:24 PM]
bitty41
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12/30/2007  3:23 PM
when lee was destroying the kings front line a few weeks ago. the kings
announcers were like, this david lee is good, and young. Then they mentioned the artest rumors with the knicks, and they went on to say" no wonder why the knicks are reluctant to include this kid in any deal, he is a player". Now these are guys who have no reason to pump lee up, they are just commenting on what they and every sane person in this league sees...

Lee had a great game against the Kings what exactly did you expect the announcers to be saying?
GKFv2
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12/30/2007  3:31 PM
Posted by PresIke:
Posted by GKFv2:

Who cares if he's depressed? He's been depressed before. Means nothing. This moron is going to be here for a long time. Damn that fool Crawford for getting injured and giving Isiah another excuse. Dolan will probably be seen laughing again with Isiah. No accountability in this organization. None!

Didn't mean to imply anyone should care (I actually kind of expected someone to state this) but to point out how lost even he appears, when he usually stands up to critics. He was not really making excuses today. He has to say something, and to suddenly expect him go all Peter Finch in 'Network' or Damon Waynes in 'Bamboozled' is unlikely:



especially when I suspect Dolan is like this character:


He specifically mentioned that since they were missing their "top 2 scorers" that they couldn't score as easily.
Thank you, Rick Brunson.
BlueSeats
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12/30/2007  3:33 PM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by BlueSeats:

Who's hyping Lee? I think Nocioni is three times the player Lee is, and he comes off the bench.

By look at the game log and follow Lee's name on the right hand side. In the first half everything he did was a positive. No missed shots, no turnovers, and holfresh wants him bashed.

http://scores.espn.go.com/nba/playbyplay?gameId=271230018

No Blue I don't want to bash him at all, just don't say things were going well when he is in the game because it wasn't going well...

He played 36 minutes with 11 pts, 7 boards...but somehow is was the only one doing well and playing the right way..





[Edited by - holfresh on 12-30-2007 3:24 PM]

[Edited by - holfresh on 12-30-2007 3:24 PM]

I was speaking of the first quarter, where the score was tied and he was 4 for 4 with some rebounds and no turnovers.

You were adamant that we didn't lose ground with curry when we clearly did: from even to down 8.

For some reason you feel the need to skew this much farther than it's worth.

Let me ask you guys this. If you make a list of Knicks you'd like to dump and those you'd like to keep, which side does Lee go on?
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