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IT butchers Greg Anthony
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gunsnewing
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10/19/2006  2:52 PM

All I gotta say is opentour eyes and watch the game and develop your own opinion. A lot of guys here are knowledgable but most of you are just media whores. Posting links can't explain what is going on.

Stop watching espn and stop reading the papers. Watch games. That's all the answers you need.


amen to that!
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gunsnewing
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10/19/2006  3:01 PM
Posted by arkrud:

This Balkman-Williams talk make no sense
IT has Marbs and takin Williams was a contradictions to everything IT did.
So he sad A by building around Marbs, tnah he sad B by not drafting Williams.
Now we will see how it will work out.
IT will be exposed no metter what.
His Agurre comments its another indication how tentative he is inside.
He knows bball and he can see what this group af players can do. He see the writings on the wall and freeking out.


so not drafting Artest and drafting Weis is okay because we already had LJ/Spree?
gunsnewing
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10/19/2006  3:09 PM
Posted by SugarRayRichardson:

Isiah is just being Isiah. Taking his shot where he can. Patrick wasnt complimentary to the current Knicsk. Isiah didnt go after Patrick. Isiah used to do the same thing on the court and then leave the "bad boys" to clean up his mess. Then one night he tried taking a cheap shot at John Stockton. Karl Malone sent Isiah to the hopital.

haha thats frickin great! is that why Isiah has that scar over his eye?

[Edited by - gunsnewing on 10-19-2006 3:24 PM]
Silverfuel
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10/19/2006  3:14 PM
Posted by gunsnewing:

so not drafting Artest and drafting Weis is okay because we already had LJ/Spree?
Are you saying Marcus Williams will be as good as Artest? Cause everyone knows hindsigth is 20/20. For every Artest and Ben Wallace, I am give you Adrian Griffin and Olowakandi. The one thing Isiah can do correctly is draft. I know is hard but have some faith.
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
islesfan
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10/19/2006  3:18 PM
Posted by gunsnewing:
Posted by SugarRayRichardson:

Isiah is just being Isiah. Taking his shot where he can. Patrick wasnt complimentary to the current Knicsk. Isiah didnt go after Patrick. Isiah used to do the same thing on the court and then leave the "bad boys" to clean up his mess. Then one night he tried taking a cheap shot at John Stockton. Karl Malone sent Isiah to the hopital.

haha thats frickin great! is that why Isiah has that scare over his eye?

Yup. Mailman gave Isiah a vicious elbow to the head. Blood was gushing profusely from Isiah's temple. I have a shot of it on my laptop wallpaper.
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
Silverfuel
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10/19/2006  3:19 PM
Posted by islesfan:

Yup. Mailman gave Isiah a vicious elbow to the head. Blood was gushing profusely from Isiah's temple. I have a shot of it on my laptop wallpaper.
I cant tell if you are kidding but i really hope you are.
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
Pharzeone
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10/19/2006  3:20 PM
Posted by gunsnewing:
Posted by SugarRayRichardson:

Isiah is just being Isiah. Taking his shot where he can. Patrick wasnt complimentary to the current Knicsk. Isiah didnt go after Patrick. Isiah used to do the same thing on the court and then leave the "bad boys" to clean up his mess. Then one night he tried taking a cheap shot at John Stockton. Karl Malone sent Isiah to the hopital.

haha thats frickin great! is that why Isiah has that scare over his eye?

Too bad, out of all those guys that were just mentioned, only Thomas has 2 NBA Championship rings. As far as this goes, I think alot of that seems from not just the draft situation but complaints that Fraizer and Albert had with the Ewing's Knicks. Anthony's Knick career is just one huge joke. If Balkman takes a whiz on the court, he would have done more for the Knick organization than Anthony. Whose biggest impact as a Knick was coughing up the ball to Reggie Miller in that ridculous 1995 playoff game and getting his butt kicked by Kevin Johnson while wearing that awful shirt on National TV.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
fishmike
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10/19/2006  3:34 PM
Posted by EnySpree:

This debate is just as dumb as the Larry brown track record debate.

Right now the knicks got balkman. After seeing the guy play cuz most of you haven't before the draft, what do you think of him now?

Now I saw him play at the nit and on national TV before that, I thought isiah did reach a bit. Still like spike lee I was not flipping out cuz I knew the guy could play.

Balkman showed more than he did in college in summer league and pre-season. Dude has an above average handle. His head is up at all times and he is a great finisher not only on dunks but he can take his man off the dribble and lay it up.

All I gotta say is opentour eyes and watch the game and develop your own opinion. A lot of guys here are knowledgable but most of you are just media whores. Posting links can't explain what is going on.

Stop watching espn and stop reading the papers. Watch games. That's all the answers you need.
Eny, what have we seen in the last 3 years? 5 coaches, players coming and going, salaries inflating, guys quitting... should we just wipe the slate clean and blind faith? I STILL dont know what Isiah's plan is. Do you?



[Edited by - fishmike on 10-19-2006 3:36 PM]
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
MS
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10/19/2006  4:36 PM
Rory (NYC): What do you think of Isiah Thomas going nuts on Greg Anthony yesterday? Boy, Isiah is really self-conscious! Do you see Balkman and the Knicks proving people wrong?

Chad Ford: Isiah's a little sensitive. Greg works for ESPN, not the Knicks. I think he has the right to say whatever he wants, even if it hurts Isiah's feelings. Besides, I think Greg was right. No one in the league that I've spoken with thought Balkman was a first round pick. They all loved his hustle, but that was about it. When you look and see he passed on guys like Rajon Rondo and Marcus Williams to get him ... I think it will call into serious question Isiah's one proven strength -- his ability to judge talent in the draft.
joec32033
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10/19/2006  4:40 PM
This is what I dont understand. Its ok for Greg Anthony to make us look like fools about picking Balkman when he hasn't played a single minute in uniform, but Isiah should wait? You would say that after 10 regular season games! Or you would say, he has only played as a rookie and wasn't even in the rookie game! You are being biased. You are giving Greg Anthony a chance to call out Zeke but Zeke can't respond after the guy has played a few preseason games? Its better than PURE speculation that Anthony was doing.
Other than the fact that Anthony wasn't the only one to crap on this pick, I am not also not criticizing Isiah for firing back. I am criticzing Isiah for taking a personal cut at Greg Anthony and for assuming that in order to be a "former Knick" you can't be realistic about the team.
Isiah said this-
Then Thomas went after Anthony, calling him "a so-called former Knick who on draft night, with millions of people watching, had the audacity to take me to task on a player that I'm pretty sure he had never seen before in his life.

"Greg Anthony should never, ever be in a position to question myself on anything about basketball, because I do remember the kind of player he was," Thomas said. "I'll leave it at that."

But he didn't.

"I know a Piston never would do that," Thomas said. "A Celtic never would do that. A Laker never would do that ... That just goes to show you what we're dealing with."

A simple "I thought Balkman was best for the team I am going to mold, Anthony is entitled to his opinion" at least doesn't make him sound like a dictator. Isiah, Oak, Ewing, Mase are all ex-knicks who had something bad to say about this organization on the way out-especially Oak who has called out alot more of Isiah's moves AND Isiah's players being ****ies than Anthony.
You were talking about right and wrong when you brought up Marcus Williams. You were saying Anthony was right cause Balkman would've dropped. Not in those words but thats what you meant.
Once again, Anthony is not the only one who suggested this. Someone said there is something more to this than just Balkman, and I have to agree with that.

Also, I would have happily taken Rondo instead of Marcus.

Of course he had to make sure Balkman played a few minutes in uniform! Unlike Anthony, he waited to have atleast some evidence not just pure promise. He let Balkman play 3 preseason games and look pretty good in them before he said anything to the doubters. But I am sure he defended his pick 5 months ago too. Just not as brashly. I guarantee you he said Balkman will be a good player. So its not like he abandoned his player then. Its just that Balkman getting an ovation gives him a good feeling and when someone asks him about it, he calls out the people that made him look stupid.
Come on, Silver. What evidence? Preseason? Balkman looks good. He don't look great, he isn't doing anything astonishing (unless you count playing defense on this team astonishing-which it may be).

Fish stated my opinion best when he stated his. It isn't about the player, it never was. Balkman is the type of player this team needed. So were Rondo, and Marcus, and Bobby Jones, and PJ Tucker.

It is about the fact that he was taken at 20 when he could have been there at 29 and we could have gotten something this team sorely lacks a good, young PG(not SG in a PG's body, not shoot first PG, not a shooting PG)that is a distributer and may actually make his teammates better.

~You can't run from who you are.~
TrueBlue
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10/19/2006  4:45 PM
I can agree with the fact of Zeke's approach drafting for need but he got too personal and the dude is Certified Sissified. I mean how dumb is it to fire back in defense of a pick after the 3rd pre-season game?
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TheGame
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10/19/2006  6:29 PM
Can someone explain to me why IT seems to be the only person taking heat in this draft. Do you seriously think that the 19 players picked before Balkman are going to pan out? At least, 1/4 of that group are going to be busts like ever other year in the draft. No one mentions that or suggests that GM's like Larry Bird screwed up in not taking Williams or Rondo or that Phoenix screwed up in giving up their pick only to pay Marcus Banks free agent money to do the exact same thing Rondo could have done at a rookie pay rate. To me, this whole argument seems like just a veiled attempt to bash IT. IT did what a GM is supposed to do in the draft, he got a solid player that is going to contribute to the team. This monday morning QBing of the pick seems to me to be pointless. I could see if it was clear that Balkman could not play or contribute, but the people making this argument concede that Balkman can play and was exactly the type of player this team needed. It does not really make much sense to me unless people are harping on this just b/c they dislike IT.
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Silverfuel
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10/19/2006  6:34 PM
joec: The whole discussion is too stale for me to continue but I'm going to try. Point is, Isiah waited for Balkman to have played. Then someone asked him about how he felt and then he unloaded. Greg Anthony became the face of all those that said bad things about the pick. Isiah responded to all but remembered Greg's name as the leader of the group. And so what if he got personal? Like you said Greg wasn't the only one to hate the pick, Isiah isn't the first or the last person in the NBA to get personal. I remember Starks, Ewing and Oakley getting personal with the opposite teams players all the time. These guys are intense.

I disagree with you but I'm glad you have an opinion. Its better than being one of those that sits on the fence not having made up his mind.

[Edited by - Silverfuel on 10-19-2006 11:36 AM]
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
Pharzeone
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10/19/2006  7:05 PM
Posted by TheGame:

Can someone explain to me why IT seems to be the only person taking heat in this draft. Do you seriously think that the 19 players picked before Balkman are going to pan out? At least, 1/4 of that group are going to be busts like ever other year in the draft. No one mentions that or suggests that GM's like Larry Bird screwed up in not taking Williams or Rondo or that Phoenix screwed up in giving up their pick only to pay Marcus Banks free agent money to do the exact same thing Rondo could have done at a rookie pay rate. To me, this whole argument seems like just a veiled attempt to bash IT. IT did what a GM is supposed to do in the draft, he got a solid player that is going to contribute to the team. This monday morning QBing of the pick seems to me to be pointless. I could see if it was clear that Balkman could not play or contribute, but the people making this argument concede that Balkman can play and was exactly the type of player this team needed. It does not really make much sense to me unless people are harping on this just b/c they dislike IT.

Because he is Thomas. Mike and Mike said it on their show after the draft. 19 teams passed him up but only Isiah takes the shot. Mike Breen calls the pick controversial. I guess Balkman killed someone and I don't know about it. I guess they know what they talking about because those are the same people who were screaming when he drafted a David Lee while Chris Taft and Andray Blatche were on the board. Oh I forgot everyone wanted David Lee too.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
nixluva
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10/19/2006  7:28 PM
By the way G. Anthony took a shot at Isiah the next day saying that he might have drafted Balkman and Collins cuz they were also client's of LeBron's agent. Now that's getting nasty. So Isiah had a legit beef with him.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/story/463043p-389613c.html

What Thomas remembers most about that June night were comments made by Anthony, who called the pick "befuddling" and later surmised that Thomas selected Balkman and Mardy Collins in the first round because they are clients of Leon Rose, the agent who represents LeBron James. One month later, James re-signed with Cleveland.

http://www.newsday.com/sports/basketball/knicks/ny-spknix194939204oct19,0,5968524.story?coll=ny-knicks-print

Anthony, an NBA analyst for ESPN, was one of many pundits who questioned the Knicks' decision to select Balkman 20th overall. Among other things, Anthony said the Knicks could've signed Balkman as an undrafted free agent. He later suggested that the Knicks reached for both Balkman and Mardy Collins to curry favor with LeBron James' agent in an effort to one day persuade James to sign with the Knicks.
joec32033
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10/19/2006  7:32 PM
Posted by Silverfuel:

joec: The whole discussion is too stale for me to continue but I'm going to try. Point is, Isiah waited for Balkman to have played. Then someone asked him about how he felt and then he unloaded. Greg Anthony became the face of all those that said bad things about the pick. Isiah responded to all but remembered Greg's name as the leader of the group. And so what if he got personal? Like you said Greg wasn't the only one to hate the pick, Isiah isn't the first or the last person in the NBA to get personal. I remember Starks, Ewing and Oakley getting personal with the opposite teams players all the time. These guys are intense.

I disagree with you but I'm glad you have an opinion. Its better than being one of those that sits on the fence not having made up his mind.

[Edited by - Silverfuel on 10-19-2006 11:36 AM]

I agree, the discussion is very stale about Balkman.

My main point before this whole draft thing erupted had to do with not what Isiah was saying(he felt Balkman was the best pick for the team) but how he said it(nailing Anthony's career, that so-called ex-Knick line was totally hypocritical- then acting like some type of great GM-"Who is Greg Anthony to question me?"), or whatever he said.
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joec32033
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10/19/2006  7:34 PM
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by TheGame:

Can someone explain to me why IT seems to be the only person taking heat in this draft. Do you seriously think that the 19 players picked before Balkman are going to pan out? At least, 1/4 of that group are going to be busts like ever other year in the draft. No one mentions that or suggests that GM's like Larry Bird screwed up in not taking Williams or Rondo or that Phoenix screwed up in giving up their pick only to pay Marcus Banks free agent money to do the exact same thing Rondo could have done at a rookie pay rate. To me, this whole argument seems like just a veiled attempt to bash IT. IT did what a GM is supposed to do in the draft, he got a solid player that is going to contribute to the team. This monday morning QBing of the pick seems to me to be pointless. I could see if it was clear that Balkman could not play or contribute, but the people making this argument concede that Balkman can play and was exactly the type of player this team needed. It does not really make much sense to me unless people are harping on this just b/c they dislike IT.

Because he is Thomas. Mike and Mike said it on their show after the draft. 19 teams passed him up but only Isiah takes the shot. Mike Breen calls the pick controversial. I guess Balkman killed someone and I don't know about it. I guess they know what they talking about because those are the same people who were screaming when he drafted a David Lee while Chris Taft and Andray Blatche were on the board. Oh I forgot everyone wanted David Lee too.

It was not because they passed up Marcus-I and they- had no problem with that-it was because they reached so much for Balkman, that was the point they were trying to make. I remember the show, I have listened religiously for about 2 years.
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Silverfuel
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10/19/2006  7:36 PM
Posted by joec32033:

My main point before this whole draft thing erupted had to do with not what Isiah was saying(he felt Balkman was the best pick for the team) but how he said it(nailing Anthony's career, that so-called ex-Knick line was totally hypocritical- then acting like some type of great GM-"Who is Greg Anthony to question me?"), or whatever he said.
Anthony got personal too. nixluva had a good post about that. Zeke responded.
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joec32033
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10/19/2006  7:40 PM
Posted by Silverfuel:
Posted by joec32033:

My main point before this whole draft thing erupted had to do with not what Isiah was saying(he felt Balkman was the best pick for the team) but how he said it(nailing Anthony's career, that so-called ex-Knick line was totally hypocritical- then acting like some type of great GM-"Who is Greg Anthony to question me?"), or whatever he said.
Anthony got personal too. nixluva had a good post about that. Zeke responded.

Silver, did we not ALL suggest that Isiah Thomas signed Vin Baker because he had the same agent as Jamal Crawford when the trade was made? That is not personal to me. That is saying Isiah may be skirting the rules a little maybe and making an accusation the equivilant of tampering.
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Silverfuel
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10/19/2006  7:46 PM
Posted by joec32033:

Silver, did we not ALL suggest that Isiah Thomas signed Vin Baker because he had the same agent as Jamal Crawford when the trade was made? That is not personal to me. That is saying Isiah may be skirting the rules a little maybe and making an accusation the equivilant of tampering.
We all also say Greg Anthony sucked. Does that make anything right? Just because we all said it isn't an excuse. This is my basic argument. Why is Zeke the only guy being held to a higher standard? I was sure Anthony had said something to set Isiah off but nixluva confirmed it. Maybe it was something worse that we didn't hear. Did Isiah have to get personal? Did Greg Anthony have to suggest Isiah drafted Balkman cause of the agent?

EDIT: Everyone is wired differently. I remember you were extremely sensitive to comments I made about Allan Houston. We dont know what set Isiah off. Just because you and I dont think something is personal doesnt mean anything to him.

[Edited by - Silverfuel on 10-19-2006 12:47 PM]
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
IT butchers Greg Anthony

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