Who are we gonna draft? Who are we gonna sign? Who might we trade for? What should the structure of the team look like? What type of players should we target? These are the things worth talking about.

nixluva wrote:Melo has a no trade, so he's gonna be here as long as he wants to be. We need to focus on the other 14 players on this team. Arguing about Melo and his contract is futile and a waste of bandwidth.

Who are we gonna draft? Who are we gonna sign? Who might we trade for? What should the structure of the team look like? What type of players should we target? These are the things worth talking about.

interesting situations for melo if they come calling:

houston - pelicans pick this year and some nice young players.. not sure how much they like him but i'm sure morey would be interested for the right price...
toronto - unlikely but i can see a trade formulating around him... they have a window to contend and have the knicks 2016 pick... might get nixed by melo and usarji probably doesn't like him...
cavs - they will probably go a different direction but i'm not seeing love coming back... melo would be the next biggest name... hard to conceive a trade that works tho...
bulls - if they wanted him they would have got him in the offseason...
memphis - another out of the blue candidate but fits basketball wise...

these are all unlikely scenarios but just food for thought...

nixluva wrote:Melo has a no trade, so he's gonna be here as long as he wants to be. We need to focus on the other 14 players on this team. Arguing about Melo and his contract is futile and a waste of bandwidth.

Who are we gonna draft? Who are we gonna sign? Who might we trade for? What should the structure of the team look like? What type of players should we target? These are the things worth talking about.

taking the "fait accompli" approach isn't cutting it for me, nixluva. no more rah-rah speechifying please. answer the questions i posed, and if you don't wish to, lets just say that no answer tells me all i need to know anyway. here they are, cut and pasted just for you:

1)did the knickerbockers overpay for carmelo anthony's services?

2)what is carmelo ACTUALLY WORTH to the knicks if the goal is to win a title?

3)what would YOU have paid carmelo if you could have?

mreinman wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:Melo has a no trade, so he's gonna be here as long as he wants to be. We need to focus on the other 14 players on this team. Arguing about Melo and his contract is futile and a waste of bandwidth.

Who are we gonna draft? Who are we gonna sign? Who might we trade for? What should the structure of the team look like? What type of players should we target? These are the things worth talking about.

taking the "fait accompli" approach isn't cutting it for me, nixluva. no more rah-rah speechifying please. answer the questions i posed, and if you don't wish to, lets just say that no answer tells me all i need to know anyway. here they are, cut and pasted just for you:

1)did the knickerbockers overpay for carmelo anthony's services?

2)what is carmelo ACTUALLY WORTH to the knicks if the goal is to win a title?

3)what would YOU have paid carmelo if you could have?

lets say he was not worth what we paid him.

Phil is a smart guy, why do you think that he did it?

Are you 100% positive that put in his situation, you don't cave and resign him as well?

you know my philosophy and my values. you know what my answer is.

so far as phil, is he smart or was he willingly compromised for a cool 60 mil?

mreinman wrote:

dk7th wrote:

mreinman wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:Melo has a no trade, so he's gonna be here as long as he wants to be. We need to focus on the other 14 players on this team. Arguing about Melo and his contract is futile and a waste of bandwidth.

Who are we gonna draft? Who are we gonna sign? Who might we trade for? What should the structure of the team look like? What type of players should we target? These are the things worth talking about.

taking the "fait accompli" approach isn't cutting it for me, nixluva. no more rah-rah speechifying please. answer the questions i posed, and if you don't wish to, lets just say that no answer tells me all i need to know anyway. here they are, cut and pasted just for you:

1)did the knickerbockers overpay for carmelo anthony's services?

2)what is carmelo ACTUALLY WORTH to the knicks if the goal is to win a title?

3)what would YOU have paid carmelo if you could have?

lets say he was not worth what we paid him.

Phil is a smart guy, why do you think that he did it?

Are you 100% positive that put in his situation, you don't cave and resign him as well?

you know my philosophy and my values. you know what my answer is.

so far as phil, is he smart or was he willingly compromised for a cool 60 mil?

so your values are different or better than his?

hard to judge until your presented with the dilemma.

I don't like the move at all but it would be silly of me to "know" what I would do if I was in his situation.

Its like saying "if I was a billionaire, I would give 90 percent of it to charity because as a guy making 50g, that is just my values."

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:Melo has a no trade, so he's gonna be here as long as he wants to be. We need to focus on the other 14 players on this team. Arguing about Melo and his contract is futile and a waste of bandwidth.

Who are we gonna draft? Who are we gonna sign? Who might we trade for? What should the structure of the team look like? What type of players should we target? These are the things worth talking about.

taking the "fait accompli" approach isn't cutting it for me, nixluva. no more rah-rah speechifying please. answer the questions i posed, and if you don't wish to, lets just say that no answer tells me all i need to know anyway. here they are, cut and pasted just for you:

1)did the knickerbockers overpay for carmelo anthony's services?

2)what is carmelo ACTUALLY WORTH to the knicks if the goal is to win a title?

3)what would YOU have paid carmelo if you could have?

There was no Rah Rah anything in my post. Just stating the facts. I find your questions to be a totally useless exercise but since you ask.

1. Phil paid Melo and gave him a No Trade, so he obviously felt it was worth it. I think other teams would've upped their offers if they could.

2. Melo is worth what he's able to be paid by a team. The goal is to win a title, but very few players actually win a title so you can't solely tie it to that prospect.

3. What I would want to pay Melo is irrelevant. Obviously I would love to be able to low ball Melo and hope he signed, but that isn't realistic and what would that say to future FA's about how we treat our players? Melo wasn't going to just sign any old contract and Phil wasn't about to low ball him.

Melo's contract isn't going to stop Phil from being able to put together a winning team. Phil knew how much money he was paying Melo when he gave him that contract. Worrying about how much Melo is making is pointless as we can't easily do anything about it. Not without Melo's OK to any trade. As long as he's here we need to operate a smart game plan to rebuild the roster. Phil has all the options he needs to be able to get that done this summer and over the next 2 years.

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:The more legit players we put around Melo the more his assists should improve. Often he passes to no effect because guys either miss the open shot or turn down the open shot. This is a team problem and not so much just a Melo problem. Should he get better at being more of a team player, YES, but he's made to look worse due to the players he's been surrounded by most of his time here.

Melo has his flaws and i've had my issues with him over the years, but it's FAR more important to fix the rest of the roster than to be worrying about Melo. We literally have to establish a new core to this team. We need a starting quality PG, SG, PF and Center!!! This is what Phil needs to be most concerned with fixing.

Following an Atlanta Model ie "Money Ball" is within Phil's ability to accomplish with his current options. Draft pick, 3 Solid Free Agents and maybe a trade using his trade exceptions. It's going to really be important to make smart decisions and we'll have to see just what they do. Gotta make every decision count.

it is the responsibility of the best player to do whatever it takes to make others around him better. if he is incapable or incompetent in this regard then... why does he ask for max money in new york with a meaningless discount?

and if it isn't his responsibility to make others around him better and he needs to get better players around him then, again... what is he doing asking for max money in new york with a meaningless discount?

Where are the SF/PF in the league currently, that are making there teammates better.If you say kd, Labron, aldridge, gasol, ect.. stop for a minute and think about who those guys have as teammates, talent wise, especially the guards. Then take a look at the coaches they play for. In fact all of melo's coaches are currently not head coaches.

The knicks are worth 2.5 billion dollars, and you want players to take a pay cut.. this isn't a charity case, it's damn business. wake up

nixluva wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:Melo has a no trade, so he's gonna be here as long as he wants to be. We need to focus on the other 14 players on this team. Arguing about Melo and his contract is futile and a waste of bandwidth.

Who are we gonna draft? Who are we gonna sign? Who might we trade for? What should the structure of the team look like? What type of players should we target? These are the things worth talking about.

taking the "fait accompli" approach isn't cutting it for me, nixluva. no more rah-rah speechifying please. answer the questions i posed, and if you don't wish to, lets just say that no answer tells me all i need to know anyway. here they are, cut and pasted just for you:

1)did the knickerbockers overpay for carmelo anthony's services?

2)what is carmelo ACTUALLY WORTH to the knicks if the goal is to win a title?

3)what would YOU have paid carmelo if you could have?

There was no Rah Rah anything in my post. Just stating the facts. I find your questions to be a totally useless exercise but since you ask.

1. Phil paid Melo and gave him a No Trade, so he obviously felt it was worth it. I think other teams would've upped their offers if they could.

2. Melo is worth what he's able to be paid by a team. The goal is to win a title, but very few players actually win a title so you can't solely tie it to that prospect.

3. What I would want to pay Melo is irrelevant. Obviously I would love to be able to low ball Melo and hope he signed, but that isn't realistic and what would that say to future FA's about how we treat our players? Melo wasn't going to just sign any old contract and Phil wasn't about to low ball him.

Melo's contract isn't going to stop Phil from being able to put together a winning team. Phil knew how much money he was paying Melo when he gave him that contract. Worrying about how much Melo is making is pointless as we can't easily do anything about it. Not without Melo's OK to any trade. As long as he's here we need to operate a smart game plan to rebuild the roster. Phil has all the options he needs to be able to get that done this summer and over the next 2 years.

classic evasion nixluva. ok now i know where you stand.

same shyte different poster.

I'm not the one with the problem. You need to ask better questions. Your entire campaign is vapid and pointless. Nothing can be gained from your constant refrain of Melo sucks and he costs too much. If that's all you have to offer perhaps you should consider a different forum where people can't face the reality that Melo was in fact signed to a 5 year deal with the New York Knicks. Melo is going to be here until he decides that he doesn't want to be here. Why should he leave when he knows Phil is about to improve the team?

The team will have a huge amount of money a draft pick and trade exceptions to use in order to put a new team together. That's what we need to focus on. Why don't you tell us what is to be gained from constantly talking about Melo's contract? I can answer that... NOTHING!!! Now leave us to talk about actual achievable goals rather than more hater screeds about Melo. GET OVER IT!!!

If all those things were exclusive to our squad you might be on to something

Alas it's not, you might as well stop mentioning the trade exceptions

At some point common sense has to kick in with you

What I appreciate about the Hawks they are getting it done

Without a Fake Digital Superstar and maybe amongst one of the most unstable fraught

Front Offices, Fan Bases, in all of sports

And appears they truly did put together a team that was better than

The Woody coached 53win team they had a few yrs ago

Nothing like putting a team together a few yrs removed

From previous seasons and latching on to those 50WIN totals

Thinking you have the same team and the results prove

The team is actually better than the 50WIN team

Their CULTURE CHANGE happened close to the gym floor and locker room

And not closer to the Box Suites

So I tip Melo's Broke-Struggle Jazz Soloist Hat to

Kent Bazemore being the 13gm Win difference for the Atlanta Hawks

It's a question of signing or trading for the right 13gm winning difference player

H1AND1 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

dk7th wrote:

mreinman wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:Melo has a no trade, so he's gonna be here as long as he wants to be. We need to focus on the other 14 players on this team. Arguing about Melo and his contract is futile and a waste of bandwidth.

Who are we gonna draft? Who are we gonna sign? Who might we trade for? What should the structure of the team look like? What type of players should we target? These are the things worth talking about.

taking the "fait accompli" approach isn't cutting it for me, nixluva. no more rah-rah speechifying please. answer the questions i posed, and if you don't wish to, lets just say that no answer tells me all i need to know anyway. here they are, cut and pasted just for you:

1)did the knickerbockers overpay for carmelo anthony's services?

2)what is carmelo ACTUALLY WORTH to the knicks if the goal is to win a title?

3)what would YOU have paid carmelo if you could have?

lets say he was not worth what we paid him.

Phil is a smart guy, why do you think that he did it?

Are you 100% positive that put in his situation, you don't cave and resign him as well?

you know my philosophy and my values. you know what my answer is.

so far as phil, is he smart or was he willingly compromised for a cool 60 mil?

so your values are different or better than his?

hard to judge until your presented with the dilemma.

I don't like the move at all but it would be silly of me to "know" what I would do if I was in his situation.

Its like saying "if I was a billionaire, I would give 90 percent of it to charity because as a guy making 50g, that is just my values."

This must have come up when Phil was interviewed for the position. So either he chose on his own to re-sign Melo or he freely chose to take the job knowing the team would be built around a player he didn't want to build around.

I wholly believe Phil would've never been given the job had he not sold Dolan on a vision of the team built around Carmelo and the triangle. Dolan would've never hired him. Phil envisioned building a team around Melo, "healing" him as mreinman said.

Think about it like this: Phil has never lost in his NBA career at each step he's taken. And as a coach he took some teams with some talented yet hardware lacking players and turned them into champions with the triangle. In his mind he probably thinks/thought he could do it again with Carmelo. Whether this is pure ****iness or hubris (as Splat called it) or whatever, Phil thinks/thought he could build a team around Carmelo but at the same time he isn't the kind of guy who would want Dolan sniffing around. So really the only logical conclusion is he sold Dolan on a plan that he was comfortable enough with to not want to sniff around, ie: Building a winner around Dolan's signature acquisition. Dolan mostly left Isiah alone too, remember.

you may well be right. but for a guy who called the roster "clumsy" before agreeing to take the gig, he seems to be doing his job pretty clumsily himself. and when you, as the president, state that the star player "did exactly what we sort of asked him to to do," that does not sound like complete ownership of the negotiations. something very fishy and sketchy about that statement.

CrushAlot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:Melo has a no trade, so he's gonna be here as long as he wants to be. We need to focus on the other 14 players on this team. Arguing about Melo and his contract is futile and a waste of bandwidth.

Who are we gonna draft? Who are we gonna sign? Who might we trade for? What should the structure of the team look like? What type of players should we target? These are the things worth talking about.

taking the "fait accompli" approach isn't cutting it for me, nixluva. no more rah-rah speechifying please. answer the questions i posed, and if you don't wish to, lets just say that no answer tells me all i need to know anyway. here they are, cut and pasted just for you:

1)did the knickerbockers overpay for carmelo anthony's services?

2)what is carmelo ACTUALLY WORTH to the knicks if the goal is to win a title?

3)what would YOU have paid carmelo if you could have?

There was no Rah Rah anything in my post. Just stating the facts. I find your questions to be a totally useless exercise but since you ask.

1. Phil paid Melo and gave him a No Trade, so he obviously felt it was worth it. I think other teams would've upped their offers if they could.

2. Melo is worth what he's able to be paid by a team. The goal is to win a title, but very few players actually win a title so you can't solely tie it to that prospect.

3. What I would want to pay Melo is irrelevant. Obviously I would love to be able to low ball Melo and hope he signed, but that isn't realistic and what would that say to future FA's about how we treat our players? Melo wasn't going to just sign any old contract and Phil wasn't about to low ball him.

Melo's contract isn't going to stop Phil from being able to put together a winning team. Phil knew how much money he was paying Melo when he gave him that contract. Worrying about how much Melo is making is pointless as we can't easily do anything about it. Not without Melo's OK to any trade. As long as he's here we need to operate a smart game plan to rebuild the roster. Phil has all the options he needs to be able to get that done this summer and over the next 2 years.

classic evasion nixluva. ok now i know where you stand.

same shyte different poster.

That is pretty funny coming from a poster that just keeps reposting the same stuff over and over. Nothing wrong with Nix's post. He gave you an answer.

1)when i asked HIM if he felt the knicks overpaid he hid behind phil jackson's skirts.
2)when i asked him what HE thought melo was worth if the goal was to win a title he responded with the sickeningly stupid and evasive "what the market will bear"
3)when i asked him what HE would have paid melo he dismissed, apparently with brazen cop-out circularity, the question as irrelevant

yes indeed-y his answer revealed exactly what his true colors are underneath all the rah-rah and "i believe in phil" tripe... no wonder you're satisfied with the answers. they're right in your wheelhouse...

then again perhaps you want to have a crack at some personal, honest, and sincere responses to those 3 questions. no evasions, no hiding, no misdirection...