http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5401230

I'd hate to trade Randolph with whoever and watch him blow up, but it is awfully tempting. When (if, really) Paul is healthy he is the best point guard in the game. Say if we get a 1st round pick from NO with a deal like, Curry Chandler Randolph for Paul, Okafor, would you do it?

AnubisADL wrote:

BigSm00th wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:I understand wanting to compete as soon as possible but Chris Paul is coming off a serious knee injury. I prefer to see what kind of guys we have in Gallo and Randolph this year.

Also guys rise and fall in the NBA quickly. You got young PGs like Deron Williams, Russel Westbrook, Derrick Rose, Rondo, Stephen Curry, and Brandon Jennings who arent coming off of major knee surgery. How long will Chris Paul be considered a top 3 PG in the league?

I understand where you're coming from. This is why Walsh gets paid millions of bucks and the Knicks have a team of doctors. You see if Paul is OK. If he is, you make the deal. Done. If CP3 comes back and is killing it, then you have to give up more to get him.

In response to your question, if CP3 is healthy he's the best in the game. Dude 08-09 (2 seasons ago his last fully healthy one) he put up 23 points/11 assists/6 rebounds/3 steals on 50% FG and 85% FT. those are video game #s! let me see d-rose or westbrook put up 23/11/6/3 w/ efficient shooting for an entire season!

The Knicks would sign off on a trade regardless of his health. We maxed out Amare's uninsured knees.

Now you are correct. IF he is healthy then he is worth it. However when you hear about guys taking longer than expected to heal that isnt a good sign. Plus we need to also factor in the system he will be playing in. I believe Deron Williams is the best PG in the league and has been so for awhile. I see Chris Paul getting bumped down sooner rather than later.

I also think we could potentially sign cheaper alternative who are up for rookie extensions. As I keep saying, Randolph and Gallo will need to be extended in 2 yrs. I prefer to see what we have. I also have my eye on Mayo because we know Memphis isn't going to carry alot of salary.

At the end of the day we need to remain flexible. I dont see the point of rushing to be capped out.

Amar'es knees have been fine for a few years now. They have not been much of a concern. If they were, do you really think the Knicks would have been so quick to give him a max contract? I don't think so.

Chris Paul goes McDyess/Grant Hill on us.

2010/11 (this season) $15M
2011/2012 $16 M
2012/13 $17.7 PLAYER OPTION

We can't sign Deron Williams if he goes unrestricted after 2011/12 season. Melo ain't coming to a team with $15M tied up to Chris Paul with one good knee.

Best case scenario: Deron Williams excercises HIS player option for 2012/13 (which I think he only does if the new CBA sucks and 17M is the most he'll make and he chooses that over a longer term deal like Richard Jefferson pulled off)

Scenario 2:

Chris Paul is spectacular. Melo signs for a discount. Whoever we keep out of Gallo, Randolph, Chandler, etc is great. Parade down Broadway.

Scenario 3:

Chris Paul goes Grant Hill for Orlando (wouldn't that be ironic?)

Scenario 4:

Chris Paul does GREAT for Orlando and they get a 'chip with him and Dwight Howard.

No easy choices here.

Even if we decide not to make a move for Paul, Melo and Deron Williams could easily escape us.

Do we maintain flexibility (I vote for that) or say hey...the entire point of flexibility is so that when Chris Paul is available we have the pieces to go get him.

Steve Nash + Amare + some great pieces couldn't get it done in Phoenix so I don't think Chris Paul and Amare guarantees anything.

I'd love to SIGN chris paul as a healthy FA or to trade Curry + Chandler for him but have doubts about this move.

BigSm00th wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Uptown wrote:Starphuckin? What does that mean, exactly? If you define starphucking by what the Celts did to win a "Ship" then we need to proceed with no vaseline.

I'd consider it to be going after high-paid big name players with huge concerns (be it personality baggage or physical health issues). Marbury, McDyess, and Paul meet that description. The Celtics' acquisitions (KG & Ray Allen) did not.

amare is a huge health concern as well, is that starphucking?

who cares what you want to call it, CP3 is one of the 5 best players in the game.

eViL wrote:

jazz74 wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

SupremeCommander wrote:I can't believe people are saying to wait on Chris Paul. Eff that. You get him to entice Melo--as he may sign an extension given the CBA uncertainty. Now, he might be willing to let it ride if you have Amar'e and Paul.

Yeah- just one question, how do you sign Melo with no cap space? We do this trade and thats our roster- we can't upgrade at all

they are discussing scenarios where we will still have curry's contract so we will still have our flexibility.

[sarc]because new orleans will demand assets for paul, but denver will dump melo for curry's expiring.[/sarc] how does that make any sense?

no, we use the cap space from the contract nxt year to sign him outright.

BigSm00th wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

BigSm00th wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

BigSm00th wrote:

TMS wrote:i'll tell you guys what's stupid... that's trading away young assets for a player you don't even know if you'll be able to sign in a year's time... giving up young assets to attain a superstar in a trade is not stupid... that's what teams like the Celtics did to get KG & the Heat did to get Shaq, both on their way to winning a championship because of it... i love how the notion of giving up young assets for a player like CP3 now is so out of the question for the same people that were so adamant in their defense of the all-in for Lebron plan over the past 2 years.

not wanting to give up the entire farm for CP3 is understandable, i don't think anyone advocates giving up AR, Gallo & Chandler all in the same deal for a player who had a major surgery... you can draw to flashbacks of the ill-fated McDyess deal in some respects... but in other respects CP3 is a much more valuable player, especially when you already have a player like Amare in the fold who would be at the receiving end of his 10 assists a night over Ray Felton's 5... & you would also likely be adding a player like OK4 to the fold as well which shores up your frontcourt even more... but no, people would rather wait out another season & get strung along once again by Melo hoping he'll decide to sign here next summer... the time for waiting is over... if a superstar player is available in a trade, you go for it... that's what amassing young assets is supposed to net us afterall... giving up AR is not going to make or break this franchise... attaining a player like CP3 very well could... of course there's a risk, just like there was a risk giving away assets before we even knew what Lebron was going to do this summer... i'd rather give up assets knowing who you're getting personally... this is CP3 we're talking about... you won't find a better PG in the NBA anywhere & people are hedging on giving up AR... wow.

agreed. i think there is a fine line b/w what constitutes a "good deal" in trading for CP3. That being said, Briggs, ray felton for his career is a 14 pt 6 assist guy. i agree his #'s will get inflated, but saying he'll lead the league in assists is a bit much.

chris paul is a year younger than felton is. for his career he's legit put up 19/10/5reb!/2.5 stl. those are superstar #'s. look at isiah thomas' career #'s, very very similar. this guy, in d'antoni's offense, could legitimately put up 20 points/15 assists/6 rebounds/2.5 steals. just eye popping stuff. if nash won 2 back to back MVPs i can't imagine what CP3 would do in the prime of his career playing with a big like amare. (CP3's best year in 08-09 he put up 23/11/6/3 those are real numbers not inflated briggs #s thats what this guy did with byron scott as a head coach)

felton was signed to a very very realistic contract. if the knicks made this move i don't see why they couldn't turn around and get some assets for felton.

obviously the knicks have the leverage here. they have had a succesful offseason so far, have accumulated a few nice picks, and CP3 is the one that demanded a trade. the hornets are the one with the disgruntled superstar, not the knicks.

walsh has made his name as a GM pulling off good trades. his pacer teams post reggie were forged with a few wily trades (getting JO for dale davis, getting artest and brad miller for jalen rose), i think everyone agrees lee was gonna go for nothing and he managed to get AR, turaif, and azabuike out of it --- a great deal when the flip side of the coin is nothing.

we'll see what happens, but how can you NOT want a guy like CP3? i know he has an injury issue -- guess what, so does amare. you can be in the conversation as a championship contender with a duo of CP3 and amare.

Explain to me what leverage the Knicks have when Chris Paul is signed for 2 more years? None--it would be expensive and stupid at this point. We just paid 100mm $ for a guy who is a legit health rish--now what we want to start giving up 21 year old 7 footers. Sometimes I think that people need to think more about it-- we are in 0 need. We wait and deal from position of strength--see what WE have and not rush into very expensive players who haev been hurt for lengthy periods without proof of health. Im very excited to see what we have---I think its a winning team--a few tweaks--OK but let it go.

Briggs, giving up a 21 yr old 7 footer to get a 25 yr old who's career averages are 19/10/5/2 seems like why you acquire the 21 YO 7', so you can get the all-world point guard. obviously if CP3's knees are a huge ? mark its a gamble but i don't think they are. i agree, we need to deal from a position of strength. a position of strength, to me, is when another team's star player comes out and says "i dont want to play here anymore, trade me to the knicks" which is essentially what just happened.

dealing gallinari and randolph would be excessive. dealing one of them would not be. turn felton and his very serviceable contract around in december and get another few assets. this is the best PG in the league we are talking about.

Let me ask you a question--what is wrong with the strategy of waiting to see what we have before we give the whoel farnm away for a player who has not proven he is healthy? what is the rush or need?

Briggs, don't get me wrong, I completely agree with you. the first line of my initial response to your post was "i think there is a fine line b/w what constitutes a "good deal" in trading for CP3." if that is giving them cap space and taking on okafor and giving up gallinari and randolph, obviously its NOT a good deal. losing one of gallinari/randolph and one of chandler/douglas in addition to giving up expiring deals to make it work to get CP3 is, in my opinion, a very good deal. i don't think the knicks should just rush in and shoot their load, i don't think they will. walsh has been a pretty good trade broker over the years and i expect it to continue.

the flip side of your coin is waiting until the season, CP3 comes back healthy and is averaging 25/11/6/3 over the first month, and now his price goes up. knicks need to do "due diligence" on this, see if he's healthy, and if he is, make a power move and get the guy. he's a top 5 player in the league AND a point guard (he would absolutely thrive in this offense).

don't get taken but also don't NOT make the deal b/c you have to give up a talented young player. the heat gave up odom and butler to get shaq. butler never became the star ppl thought and the heat won a title. the celtics gave up al jefferson and gerald green and telfair to get KG, they won a title. you acquire the young assets to make a move like this, a power move that puts you in the championship contender category.

If there's a trade like Curry, Randolph, Chandler, Azubuike, Turiaf, 2014 1st for Paul, Okafor...

I take that deal and don't look back. Just imagine it as if we traded David Lee + Curry + Chandler for Paul/Okafor, and that's a trade all of us should've wanted just two months ago. People can't get too tied to young players that have yet to really prove themselves in the league, especially ones that have yet to even play a game in a Knick uniform. When it comes to the superstar players in the league, you cross your fingers and hope for the best, the way Miami did when they let a young Caron Butler go for Shaq, or when Boston traded up-and-coming Al Jefferson for KG.

Paul/Gallo/Amare is a great starting core to build a championship around. And we'd have our center in Okafor, and perhaps we can ship Felton for a shooter like Rip Hamilton.

Vmart wrote:

BasketballJones wrote:Pat will get him down to Miami and play with Lebron, Wade and Bosh.

Don't forget Melo too.

Of course. It's the best way for them all to collect their rings.