TMS wrote:i have no problem w/MDA holding Nate accountable, i've been calling for him to do that for the longest... but there is a bigger issue that we need to keep in mind here, which is to make use of our assets to try & unload Fishlips or Curry's contracts if at all possible... there were rumors that the Kings were interested in taking Nate as part of a Fishlips trade for KT last year... i think we should have done all we could to pump up Nate's value to try & get something like that done this year... MDA biting the bullet on some discipline for the better good of the franchise to me would have been a more suitable outcome to this entire situation... if after the trade deadline, no team is interested in Nate, wouldn't that have been just as good a time to doll out the punishments on Nate & make him an example?

again, this is not about me defending Nate Robinson's idiotic behavior... for me it's all about the way this situation was handled, which i believe didn't serve our best possible interests in the big picture... we can't afford to just let talent like Nate go for nothing... he's a dynamic player & IMO could have been a useful piece in a possible trade, but now the chances of that happening aren't looking good.

A lot of folks have some rather strong hate directed toward Jeffries (I don't), but he worked on his shot a bit- is doing the things he does best well, so MDA is giving him big minutes on the court and he is producing. I see him as a somewhat like Rodman in his game, and don't expect much on offense from him. I get annoyed with him getting stripped all the time when he is going up for a basket, but I know that he puts in some hard minutes on the defensive end, and I think he has done a good job for the Knicks this year.

A lot of folks had a dislike for Hughes, but he is another guy who bought into what MDA wanted from his guys, and he has come from basketball purgatory to find a new lease on life on MDA's Knicks.

Nate has not made the changes asked of him- has not seen the light, and is therefore not playing.

No reason to tank this year- we don't have a pick- so why not go all out to make the playoffs? Nate's value was also minimal based on the lack of interest in him earlier in the year. He was given some significant minutes earlier in the season, but MDA obviously felt that he wasn't doing the job he wanted him to do, and Douglas emerged as a capable player, able to do many of the things Nate can do, and more.

In a year with a lot of mediocrity in the EC, we stand a chance to make the playoffs, as crazy as that might seem to some folks. Why not go for it? Why not play the guys who will give us the best chance to gain a slot in the playoffs.

Paladin55 wrote:
A lot of folks have some rather strong hate directed toward Jeffries (I don't), but he worked on his shot a bit- is doing the things he does best well, so MDA is giving him big minutes on the court and he is producing. I see him as a somewhat like Rodman in his game, and don't expect much on offense from him. I get annoyed with him getting stripped all the time when he is going up for a basket, but I know that he puts in some hard minutes on the defensive end, and I think he has done a good job for the Knicks this year.

A lot of folks had a dislike for Hughes, but he is another guy who bought into what MDA wanted from his guys, and he has come from basketball purgatory to find a new lease on life on MDA's Knicks.

Nate has not made the changes asked of him- has not seen the light, and is therefore not playing.

No reason to tank this year- we don't have a pick- so why not go all out to make the playoffs? Nate's value was also minimal based on the lack of interest in him earlier in the year. He was given some significant minutes earlier in the season, but MDA obviously felt that he wasn't doing the job he wanted him to do, and Douglas emerged as a capable player, able to do many of the things Nate can do, and more.

In a year with a lot of mediocrity in the EC, we stand a chance to make the playoffs, as crazy as that might seem to some folks. Why not go for it? Why not play the guys who will give us the best chance to gain a slot in the playoffs.

I think Paladin should be banned for posting such an all-round sensible post.

Paladin55 wrote:

TMS wrote:i have no problem w/MDA holding Nate accountable, i've been calling for him to do that for the longest... but there is a bigger issue that we need to keep in mind here, which is to make use of our assets to try & unload Fishlips or Curry's contracts if at all possible... there were rumors that the Kings were interested in taking Nate as part of a Fishlips trade for KT last year... i think we should have done all we could to pump up Nate's value to try & get something like that done this year... MDA biting the bullet on some discipline for the better good of the franchise to me would have been a more suitable outcome to this entire situation... if after the trade deadline, no team is interested in Nate, wouldn't that have been just as good a time to doll out the punishments on Nate & make him an example?

again, this is not about me defending Nate Robinson's idiotic behavior... for me it's all about the way this situation was handled, which i believe didn't serve our best possible interests in the big picture... we can't afford to just let talent like Nate go for nothing... he's a dynamic player & IMO could have been a useful piece in a possible trade, but now the chances of that happening aren't looking good.

Would you do this if you knew that it would be at the expense of a playoff slot?

A lot of folks have some rather strong hate directed toward Jeffries (I don't), but he worked on his shot a bit- is doing the things he does best well, so MDA is giving him big minutes on the court and he is producing. I see him as a somewhat like Rodman in his game, and don't expect much on offense from him. I get annoyed with him getting stripped all the time when he is going up for a basket, but I know that he puts in some hard minutes on the defensive end, and I think he has done a good job for the Knicks this year.

A lot of folks had a dislike for Hughes, but he is another guy who bought into what MDA wanted from his guys, and he has come from basketball purgatory to find a new lease on life on MDA's Knicks.

Nate has not made the changes asked of him- has not seen the light, and is therefore not playing.

No reason to tank this year- we don't have a pick- so why not go all out to make the playoffs? Nate's value was also minimal based on the lack of interest in him earlier in the year. He was given some significant minutes earlier in the season, but MDA obviously felt that he wasn't doing the job he wanted him to do, and Douglas emerged as a capable player, able to do many of the things Nate can do, and more.

In a year with a lot of mediocrity in the EC, we stand a chance to make the playoffs, as crazy as that might seem to some folks. Why not go for it? Why not play the guys who will give us the best chance to gain a slot in the playoffs.

i would give up a chance at the playoffs to try & dump Fishlips or Curry's contracts, absolutely dude... to me that should be the primary focus to this season without question... the fact that we don't own our draft pick shouldn't guide our path this season... our focus needs to be on 2010 & freeing up as much cap space as possible & i've said that from the very beginning.

on Fishlips, i have a dislike of the fact that his contract is preventing us from signing 2 max FA's this offseason, it really doesn't have much to do with his game... if he was making less i wouldn't mind him on this team at all, but for the player he is & the money it's costing us to keep him on the roster, he's an albatross in my view... would love to dump him at the nearest opportunity & hate the thought of letting assets like Nate walk for nothing because i happen to think he could have been a useful asset in trying to unload a contract like that.

on Hughes, i never really had much feelings on him coming in, to me he was an expiring contract nothing more, but i knew the guy had game & defended him against some harsh critics early on when he was looking like garbage... now i wouldn't mind re-signing him to a midlevel type contract at all but not at the expense of signing 2 max FA's this offseason... i like the way he's handled himself this year & he does some nice things on both ends of the floor that we can use going forward.

as for Nate, i came to the conclusion that he would never change his ways a long time ago... the only objection i have is watching him go w/o getting anything back in return... i've been calling for him to be traded for the past 2 years, not because i don't like Nate (i actually have an affinity for the guy when he's not acting like a goof), but because i don't think he'll ever change & become the player that MDA needs him to be in order to be successful in this system, & i said that a long time ago while guys like misterearl & plenty of others were telling me i was being overly critical & nitpicky.

markvmc wrote:Hhhmmmnnnn.... a coach who doesn't like players he can't control? Naaahhhhh.

i think there's a little bit more to it tho...

TMS wrote:all i know is some of y'all that are doing the lecturing now are doing a complete 180 degree turn on the Nate issue from last season after he was playing lights out.

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=29641&page=1

back then he was a must keep guy that we could absolutely not allow to walk for nothing to you guys... now all of a sudden he's no big loss... how does that happen over the span of one season?

nothing i'm saying about Nate now is anything different than what i said about him then... he's a talented player that we need to make sure we get something back for in a trade... he won't work out here under the system that MDA wants to play cuz he doesn't have the mentality to conform & conduct himself the way MDA wants him to... to just waste a young player like that who has demonstrated in the past he can be an electrifying player w/o getting back anything in return is bad management of our assets IMO.

So no one can ever change their minds?

Al Harrington is next on D'Antoni's "changing roles" radar, gradually being weaned off minutes as David Lee has been doing his thing, Wilson Chandler gets stronger and Gallo grows into his first full season. The Harrington three point shot happy night in Chicago did not help his cause.

He did not play down the stretch against the Clippers and he is sitting out the third quarter tonight.

His agent will not demand a trade.

TMS wrote:all i know is some of y'all that are doing the lecturing now are doing a complete 180 degree turn on the Nate issue from last season after he was playing lights out.

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=29641&page=1

back then he was a must keep guy that we could absolutely not allow to walk for nothing to you guys... now all of a sudden he's no big loss... how does that happen over the span of one season?

nothing i'm saying about Nate now is anything different than what i said about him then... he's a talented player that we need to make sure we get something back for in a trade... he won't work out here under the system that MDA wants to play cuz he doesn't have the mentality to conform & conduct himself the way MDA wants him to... to just waste a young player like that who has demonstrated in the past he can be an electrifying player w/o getting back anything in return is bad management of our assets IMO.

That thread makes me nostalgic for Islesfan's posts.

BasketballJones wrote:

TMS wrote:all i know is some of y'all that are doing the lecturing now are doing a complete 180 degree turn on the Nate issue from last season after he was playing lights out.

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=29641&page=1

back then he was a must keep guy that we could absolutely not allow to walk for nothing to you guys... now all of a sudden he's no big loss... how does that happen over the span of one season?

nothing i'm saying about Nate now is anything different than what i said about him then... he's a talented player that we need to make sure we get something back for in a trade... he won't work out here under the system that MDA wants to play cuz he doesn't have the mentality to conform & conduct himself the way MDA wants him to... to just waste a young player like that who has demonstrated in the past he can be an electrifying player w/o getting back anything in return is bad management of our assets IMO.

So no one can ever change their minds?

only if it's followed with an apology for ever doubting me to begin with... otherwise, no.