Posted by Solace:
Posted by Killa4luv:
OMFG, OJ?!?! Of course they count, where the hell does OJ come into this? 2 white people were killed, ostensibly by OJ (I did not follow the case and didn't celebrate when he got off) and it is 13 years later and this is still coming up. This was bad thing, no doubt, but why is it that these 2 lives are worth so much more in the collective American psyche than many others who died of more tragic circumstances before or since? Why do you think that is Isles?
Incredible how you discount whatever you feel like, then spawn mass confusion when you claim others do the same. I'm sure it's not your intention, but you usually come off sounding with the effect of this: "bad stuff only happens to my race. Another race is soley to blame for this." Although you don't expressly say that, that's how you come off. Unfortunately, when the tone comes off like that, the people you really want to listen are the same audience you just lost because your phrasing was insensitive towards others that are not in your group; others who you've made perfectly clear aren't in your group. That's very unfortunate, I think.
Solace, try just reading the words that I write. I write clearly, and express exactly what I want to say with the words I us. If you are reading something more into it, thats you and not me. You cant hold me accountable for things I did not say.
What have a discounted that is so incredible?
Bad stuff happens to everyone, and I never say another race is to solely to blame for this. I talk about a system of injustice. If that sounds to you like another race, I dont know what to tell you bro. I talk about Institutionalized disrimination/injustice, etc. These are sociological concepts and are far more complex than the simple race-baiting you are reading into them. If I felt like you (Solace) or others were personally to blame for the things that are going on, I woudlnt talk to you and wouldnt be on the site.
And although I thinkk you are projecting other meanings on to what I am saying, I do value you relating how you are reading it, that means others are probably reading similar things into it as well. We talked about this before, but I dont know how to say some of this stuff without you or others feeling some type of way.
The reality is this:
White people are not being systematically discriminated against, period.
In a host of different ways other groups, people of color, women, gays, poor people are.
It is mainly white people in positions of power who are keeping these systems in play, but it is not all white people, obviously, and even many of the people doing this, do so unwittingly. But if I mention this, white people feel guilty or something and deny that this is even happening and then we arent getting any closer to understanding.
But I will keep what you are saying in mind, I do find it useful as a barometer.
I thought this was a great analogy for whats going on in terms of racism in this country:
Levels of Racism: A Gardener's Tale
The following allegory is used by Camara Jones in her class "Race and Racism."
A gardener has two kinds of seed, red and pink, and two flower boxes. One contains rich soil and one has poor, rocky soil. The gardener favors red flowers over pink, so she plants the red seed in the rich soil and the pink seed in the poor soil. Year after year, the rains water, the sun shines, and the gardener harvests the flowers. But she never changes the soil.
The red flowers flourish in the rich soil. But the pink flowers languish--the strongest make it to middling height, the weakest die. The gardener notices the difference, but soon forgets her original decision to put poor soil in one flower box and rich soil in the other. "It's really good that I liked red flowers because they're much prettier," she thinks.
The analogy to institutionalized racism arises from the flowers being contained in separate boxes, and it is perpetuated by the gardener failing to fertilize or mix the soil. An example of personally mediated racism would be if she purposefully removed a stray pink seed that found its way into the red flower box.
Internalized racism results when the pink flowers, realizing they are all scraggly, say to the bee, "Don't bring me any of that substandard pink pollen, bring me the high-quality red pollen," believing that there is something inherently bad about their own kind.
"It all goes back to institutionalized racism," says Jones, suggesting that if society addressed the institutionalized form--mix up the soil, mix up the seed, fertilize--then the personally mediated and the internalized forms would also disappear.
9/18/2007 11:46 AM