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Knicks finalizing trade for OG: It’s bad - badass for Knicks, bad for rest of league BOO YA
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HofstraBBall
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12/30/2023  2:25 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/30/2023  2:26 PM
Fuck it. Good luck IQ and RJ! Except against us.
Thanks for all the years!

Welcome OG, PA and Flynn!
Let's kick some ass!!

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
AUTOADVERT
nycericanguy
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12/30/2023  2:31 PM
Nalod wrote:
blkexec wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:put it like this, trading for KP would have made us better than this while still keeping RJ & IQ.

If Leon had this decision again , knowing what he knows now, he pulls that KP trade.

Keep in mind Leon was a rookie GM learning on the job. I think Isiah Thomas was the last GM I remember coming on a job and making a huge controversial trade for Marbury. Leon is more conservative and calculated. He waits for the right time and I’m sure he sees some past mistakes.

With that said I think this is a nice deal. Knicks did not want either player. IQ too expensive and no starting role. RJ played his way off the team. OG is 30mil and RJ/IQ is well north of that. And these are two guards out the rotation. Plus too many damn left handed slashers on one team.

IQ hurts but there’s a lot of opportunities now to improve short term and still set up for a superstar trade.

What and when was KP on the table for knicks to trade for him and when was it reported knicks were interested in him? I don't recall.

Fans be all over the place on IQ upside. Interesting stuff.
"Precious" being over looked in this deal? he is RFA and seems a solid back up. Being a RFA himself Massai had a lot on his plate to decide on between Siakim, OG, Precious and Trent Jr.

As for DM, he is ball dominant and avg's 20 shots a game. I like him a lot but fit?

My take: Thibs needs to get Grimes back on track and Chemistry matters. IQ was blocking Grimes a bit?
IQ as PG was not great.

well thats my whole point, that we SHOULD have been interested big time! KP openly talked about being open to a reunion.
joec32033
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12/30/2023  2:32 PM
martin wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
EwingPSD wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:i'll feel alot better about this if we extend OG today at the 4/117m figure

I need time to get my thoughts together on this trade, but just remember, Toronto offered him that 4 year max and he turned it down. He wanted more opportunity, and just got traded to the same situation.

He’s CAA. He will be extended

I am going to be honest, I am not sure what is worse. Signing him to a contract north of the 30 mil he turned down, or not signing him and letting him walk for nothing. This is not angood situation in my eyes.

You are right that OG can be an UFA. Do you really think that Leon and OG's agent really haven't worked out the details of the next contract yet?

OG's agent is Leon's son.

Point taken but my point still stands that I don't know which is worse, resigning him or letting him walk.

And this isn't about RJ glasses here. I like RJ alot and personally I think he blows up in Toronto. However I was always ok with trading him for a real upgrade (I named Jaylen Brown multiple times).

That being said this is a lose lose trade. You wither gave up a TON to clear cap space or you are about to invest in someone who is older, more injury prone and has shown the same skills/game/stats over a longer period of time than people screamed that RJ did and he never improved. And now the plan is to bank on that player making a leap at 26 when people couldn't help but cry that RJ didn't do it at 23 with less time in the league?

I respect you pointing out the fact that an extension is probably happening. I'm just pointing out both signing him to an extension and letting him walk both don't make sense. It's a lose lose situation here.

~You can't run from who you are.~
Philc1
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12/30/2023  2:35 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/30/2023  2:36 PM
martin wrote:
Philc1 wrote:
martin wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
EwingPSD wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:i'll feel alot better about this if we extend OG today at the 4/117m figure

I need time to get my thoughts together on this trade, but just remember, Toronto offered him that 4 year max and he turned it down. He wanted more opportunity, and just got traded to the same situation.

He’s CAA. He will be extended

I am going to be honest, I am not sure what is worse. Signing him to a contract north of the 30 mil he turned down, or not signing him and letting him walk for nothing. This is not angood situation in my eyes.

You are right that OG can be an UFA. Do you really think that Leon and OG's agent really haven't worked out the details of the next contract yet?

OG's agent is Leon's son.

So sign him after we get Mitchell or Giannis next offseason

You do not understand the Salary Cap.

Projected cap is $137 million next season. After OG opts out and EF is essentially cut we are about $30mil under. Use Bird exception for OG AFTER getting a superstar
Nalod
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12/30/2023  2:35 PM
love it when PhilC uses "sense" in his response.

Fans crave star trades.
"Only like it if we......"..

Man, I'd be surprised if DM was bought in but who knows!
Anyone thinking this cap space has any considerations to resigning or extending iHart?
What about clearing "trees" too give Grimes room to grow?

When we talk about "Starting" isn't this really about "finishing"? Thibs needs to decide on who he finishes with to close out games and develop that.

Nalod told y'all that pulling IQ vs. Thunder might be about life without him? Of course he puts in RJ.
But.......
OG from teh corner is golden and if teams are going to pay mind to Randle and Brunson, OG in the corner is better than Rj.
Grimes on the elbow. For now, DDV is great there. But.......DDV is not the future, he is the now.
If OG is here, I don't think we talk about Bridges as rooted in reality.
DM rumors will persist until he is moved to BKN.
Is there a world were Mitch is sent to Clev in a deal for DM with Allen? I doubt that. Not when Mitch is sidelined.
If knicks are not finished, what in gods name could they be looking at if not DM? Lavine don't want any of MSG anyway, but where he at now? He sent home and his team is THRIVING without him.
homeskillitprigioni
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12/30/2023  2:36 PM
Philc1 wrote:
martin wrote:
Philc1 wrote:
martin wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
EwingPSD wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:i'll feel alot better about this if we extend OG today at the 4/117m figure

I need time to get my thoughts together on this trade, but just remember, Toronto offered him that 4 year max and he turned it down. He wanted more opportunity, and just got traded to the same situation.

He’s CAA. He will be extended

I am going to be honest, I am not sure what is worse. Signing him to a contract north of the 30 mil he turned down, or not signing him and letting him walk for nothing. This is not angood situation in my eyes.

You are right that OG can be an UFA. Do you really think that Leon and OG's agent really haven't worked out the details of the next contract yet?

OG's agent is Leon's son.

So sign him after we get Mitchell or Giannis next offseason

You do not understand the Salary Cap.

Projected cap is $137 million next season. After OG opts out and EF is essentially cut we are about $30mil under.

To get who?
Philc1
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12/30/2023  2:37 PM
homeskillitprigioni wrote:
Philc1 wrote:
martin wrote:
Philc1 wrote:
martin wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
EwingPSD wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:i'll feel alot better about this if we extend OG today at the 4/117m figure

I need time to get my thoughts together on this trade, but just remember, Toronto offered him that 4 year max and he turned it down. He wanted more opportunity, and just got traded to the same situation.

He’s CAA. He will be extended

I am going to be honest, I am not sure what is worse. Signing him to a contract north of the 30 mil he turned down, or not signing him and letting him walk for nothing. This is not angood situation in my eyes.

You are right that OG can be an UFA. Do you really think that Leon and OG's agent really haven't worked out the details of the next contract yet?

OG's agent is Leon's son.

So sign him after we get Mitchell or Giannis next offseason

You do not understand the Salary Cap.

Projected cap is $137 million next season. After OG opts out and EF is essentially cut we are about $30mil under.

To get who?

Mitchell or Giannis
TheMTL
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12/30/2023  2:38 PM
joec32033 wrote:
martin wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
EwingPSD wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:i'll feel alot better about this if we extend OG today at the 4/117m figure

I need time to get my thoughts together on this trade, but just remember, Toronto offered him that 4 year max and he turned it down. He wanted more opportunity, and just got traded to the same situation.

He’s CAA. He will be extended

I am going to be honest, I am not sure what is worse. Signing him to a contract north of the 30 mil he turned down, or not signing him and letting him walk for nothing. This is not angood situation in my eyes.

You are right that OG can be an UFA. Do you really think that Leon and OG's agent really haven't worked out the details of the next contract yet?

OG's agent is Leon's son.

Point taken but my point still stands that I don't know which is worse, resigning him or letting him walk.

And this isn't about RJ glasses here. I like RJ alot and personally I think he blows up in Toronto. However I was always ok with trading him for a real upgrade (I named Jaylen Brown multiple times).

That being said this is a lose lose trade. You wither gave up a TON to clear cap space or you are about to invest in someone who is older, more injury prone and has shown the same skills/game/stats over a longer period of time than people screamed that RJ did and he never improved. And now the plan is to bank on that player making a leap at 26 when people couldn't help but cry that RJ didn't do it at 23 with less time in the league?

I respect you pointing out the fact that an extension is probably happening. I'm just pointing out both signing him to an extension and letting him walk both don't make sense. It's a lose lose situation here.

I'm against the trade because IQ was included. But Knicks don't need anymore from OG than what he already shown in Toronto which is lockdown defense and three point shooting. So we don't need him making a leap.

We need to make a leap and now trade for that star 2-guard. We have plenty of assets left to do just that
Philc1
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12/30/2023  2:39 PM
Nalod wrote:love it when PhilC uses "sense" in his response.

Fans crave star trades.
"Only like it if we......"..

Man, I'd be surprised if DM was bought in but who knows!
Anyone thinking this cap space has any considerations to resigning or extending iHart?
What about clearing "trees" too give Grimes room to grow?

When we talk about "Starting" isn't this really about "finishing"? Thibs needs to decide on who he finishes with to close out games and develop that.

Nalod told y'all that pulling IQ vs. Thunder might be about life without him? Of course he puts in RJ.
But.......
OG from teh corner is golden and if teams are going to pay mind to Randle and Brunson, OG in the corner is better than Rj.
Grimes on the elbow. For now, DDV is great there. But.......DDV is not the future, he is the now.
If OG is here, I don't think we talk about Bridges as rooted in reality.
DM rumors will persist until he is moved to BKN.
Is there a world were Mitch is sent to Clev in a deal for DM with Allen? I doubt that. Not when Mitch is sidelined.
If knicks are not finished, what in gods name could they be looking at if not DM? Lavine don't want any of MSG anyway, but where he at now? He sent home and his team is THRIVING without him.

I got banned from a crappy jet messageboard for criticizing a crappy bust quarterback. I’m close to getting banned from here for liking a good SF who helped turn this joke of a franchise into a competitive team. I don’t care about your 8 page diatribes against me because I think RJ Barrett was a good player
TheMTL
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12/30/2023  2:39 PM
Philc1 wrote:
martin wrote:
Philc1 wrote:
martin wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
EwingPSD wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:i'll feel alot better about this if we extend OG today at the 4/117m figure

I need time to get my thoughts together on this trade, but just remember, Toronto offered him that 4 year max and he turned it down. He wanted more opportunity, and just got traded to the same situation.

He’s CAA. He will be extended

I am going to be honest, I am not sure what is worse. Signing him to a contract north of the 30 mil he turned down, or not signing him and letting him walk for nothing. This is not angood situation in my eyes.

You are right that OG can be an UFA. Do you really think that Leon and OG's agent really haven't worked out the details of the next contract yet?

OG's agent is Leon's son.

So sign him after we get Mitchell or Giannis next offseason

You do not understand the Salary Cap.

Projected cap is $137 million next season. After OG opts out and EF is essentially cut we are about $30mil under. Use Bird exception for OG AFTER getting a superstar


You will have to renounce his bird rights or his contract counts 150% against the cap I believe
blkexec
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12/30/2023  2:40 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/30/2023  2:42 PM
Philc1 wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
EwingPSD wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:i'll feel alot better about this if we extend OG today at the 4/117m figure

I need time to get my thoughts together on this trade, but just remember, Toronto offered him that 4 year max and he turned it down. He wanted more opportunity, and just got traded to the same situation.

He’s CAA. He will be extended

I am going to be honest, I am not sure what is worse. Signing him to a contract north of the 30 mil he turned down, or not signing him and letting him walk for nothing. This is not angood situation in my eyes.

Only way this trade makes sense is we let OG walk in FA and use cap room to get a superstar like Giannis

What’s interesting is how you (Joe) look at this as a loss loss.

I see this as a win win.

If OG shines and the team goes on a winning streak and deep into the playoffs, that’s a win.
Or if he doesn’t sign a new contract and we use that cap space on a superstar, that’s a win.

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
Philc1
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12/30/2023  2:40 PM
TheMTL wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
martin wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
EwingPSD wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:i'll feel alot better about this if we extend OG today at the 4/117m figure

I need time to get my thoughts together on this trade, but just remember, Toronto offered him that 4 year max and he turned it down. He wanted more opportunity, and just got traded to the same situation.

He’s CAA. He will be extended

I am going to be honest, I am not sure what is worse. Signing him to a contract north of the 30 mil he turned down, or not signing him and letting him walk for nothing. This is not angood situation in my eyes.

You are right that OG can be an UFA. Do you really think that Leon and OG's agent really haven't worked out the details of the next contract yet?

OG's agent is Leon's son.

Point taken but my point still stands that I don't know which is worse, resigning him or letting him walk.

And this isn't about RJ glasses here. I like RJ alot and personally I think he blows up in Toronto. However I was always ok with trading him for a real upgrade (I named Jaylen Brown multiple times).

That being said this is a lose lose trade. You wither gave up a TON to clear cap space or you are about to invest in someone who is older, more injury prone and has shown the same skills/game/stats over a longer period of time than people screamed that RJ did and he never improved. And now the plan is to bank on that player making a leap at 26 when people couldn't help but cry that RJ didn't do it at 23 with less time in the league?

I respect you pointing out the fact that an extension is probably happening. I'm just pointing out both signing him to an extension and letting him walk both don't make sense. It's a lose lose situation here.

I'm against the trade because IQ was included. But Knicks don't need anymore from OG than what he already shown in Toronto which is lockdown defense and three point shooting. So we don't need him making a leap.

We need to make a leap and now trade for that star 2-guard. We have plenty of assets left to do just that

It’s looking like we are setting up to trade for Mitchell. The Christmas Day win over the bucks might have won us Giannis who knows.
Philc1
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12/30/2023  2:41 PM
blkexec wrote:
Philc1 wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
EwingPSD wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:i'll feel alot better about this if we extend OG today at the 4/117m figure

I need time to get my thoughts together on this trade, but just remember, Toronto offered him that 4 year max and he turned it down. He wanted more opportunity, and just got traded to the same situation.

He’s CAA. He will be extended

I am going to be honest, I am not sure what is worse. Signing him to a contract north of the 30 mil he turned down, or not signing him and letting him walk for nothing. This is not angood situation in my eyes.

Only way this trade makes sense is we let OG walk in FA and use cap room to get a superstar like Giannis

What’s interesting is how you look at this as a loss loss.

I see this as a win win.

If OG shines and the team goes on a winning streak and deep into the playoffs, that’s a win.
Of OF doesn’t sign a new contract and we use that cap space on a superstar, that’s a win.

I agree. All we have to do is not give OG an insane extension before the offseason
nycericanguy
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12/30/2023  2:42 PM
Philc1 wrote:
martin wrote:
Philc1 wrote:
martin wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
EwingPSD wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:i'll feel alot better about this if we extend OG today at the 4/117m figure

I need time to get my thoughts together on this trade, but just remember, Toronto offered him that 4 year max and he turned it down. He wanted more opportunity, and just got traded to the same situation.

He’s CAA. He will be extended

I am going to be honest, I am not sure what is worse. Signing him to a contract north of the 30 mil he turned down, or not signing him and letting him walk for nothing. This is not angood situation in my eyes.

You are right that OG can be an UFA. Do you really think that Leon and OG's agent really haven't worked out the details of the next contract yet?

OG's agent is Leon's son.

So sign him after we get Mitchell or Giannis next offseason

You do not understand the Salary Cap.

Projected cap is $137 million next season. After OG opts out and EF is essentially cut we are about $30mil under. Use Bird exception for OG AFTER getting a superstar

OG's cap hold is about $25m, we would have to renounce his bird rights to sign someone else.
nycericanguy
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12/30/2023  2:43 PM
martin wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:i'll feel alot better about this if we extend OG today at the 4/117m figure

Honest question: do you think the Knicks and OG have already worked out the outline of OG's contract?

Extension would mean opting INTO the $19M, and then maybe $25, $28, $32, $34? Or at least average of $30M for those 4 years?

absolutely but anything can happen and another team could come in with a crazy offer so if we can lock him up now it makes things easier.
blkexec
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12/30/2023  2:44 PM
Philc1 wrote:
blkexec wrote:
Philc1 wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
EwingPSD wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:i'll feel alot better about this if we extend OG today at the 4/117m figure

I need time to get my thoughts together on this trade, but just remember, Toronto offered him that 4 year max and he turned it down. He wanted more opportunity, and just got traded to the same situation.

He’s CAA. He will be extended

I am going to be honest, I am not sure what is worse. Signing him to a contract north of the 30 mil he turned down, or not signing him and letting him walk for nothing. This is not angood situation in my eyes.

Only way this trade makes sense is we let OG walk in FA and use cap room to get a superstar like Giannis

What’s interesting is how you (Joe) look at this as a loss loss.

I see this as a win win.

If OG shines and the team goes on a winning streak and deep into the playoffs, that’s a win.
Or if he doesn’t sign a new contract and we use that cap space on a superstar, that’s a win.

I agree. All we have to do is not give OG an insane extension before the offseason

Agree. I was also responding to Joe and agreeing with your take. Sorry if that wasn’t clear.

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
DLeethal
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12/30/2023  2:44 PM
EwingPSD wrote:
DLeethal wrote:Looks like the Knicks FO want to load up on defense and guys who don't need the ball to be effective around Brunson and Randle. And then I suppose the plan is to get one more star scorer to blend with those guys as the final piece.

That’s definitely the plan. As a fan I don’t like seeing IQ go and I don’t like that Flynn will probably immediately get mins over Deuce but this deal makes sense and I think they got 3 good players that make sense for them. OG is a bully and a great wing defender, PA is a good bench big, and I think Flynn can give you a little scoring punch off the bench and they lost that with IQ going out

yea I mean normally you would get the star first and then get someone like OG. But they are very clearly 1 move away now from a close to finished product.
nycericanguy
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12/30/2023  2:47 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
Clean wrote:I think people need to see how easily Quick was schemed out of the game in the playoffs. He been getting overrated big time. He is a really good player during the regular season but once Clev and MIA pressured him he disappeared the whole postseason until he got injured.

Wouldnt be so quick to dismiss his game. Young players having a rough playoff run early on is common. Kobe airballed 3 three pt attempts his first time.

IQ was a reliable 20pt plus starter at two positions, and a 6th man finalist. They got a very good young player, who could be an all star in a couple of years.

IQ is a very good two way player, but the path to all star would be extremely tough and likely wasnt gonna happen here.

OG is a very good two way player also.
BigDaddyG
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12/30/2023  2:51 PM
I'm feeling this move. This team went on a downward spiral defensively and this helps in the frontcourt. Pre-migraine RJ gave me hope, but it's becoming clearer and clearer that we will never see it on a consistent basis. While I think RJ has more potential as a creator than OG offensively, I'd still rather have OG's steadiness. When RJ is off, he just kills the offense. OG can't really handle more than straight line drives, but he's seemed to realize that more and more in recent years. The IQ loss will be huge, but I think we all saw the writing on the wall. He's going to get paid. Malachi has been really inconsistent from the little I've seen of him this season and I'm not sure he's better than Deuce. Precious will be interesting. Even if he never pulls it together, he gives us length and defensive versatility.
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
Clean
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12/30/2023  2:55 PM
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Knicks finalizing trade for OG: It’s bad - badass for Knicks, bad for rest of league BOO YA
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