JamesKPolk wrote:

martin wrote:

JamesKPolk wrote:

martin wrote:

JamesKPolk wrote:

martin wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:I am one of the bigger Frank fans in here but I understand why they played DSJr right now. Trade deadline is coming and he needs to be showcased. Since I am a big Frank fan, my only question why not just bench Payton instead and start Frank and let DSJr back him up. Need to keep developing the youngins and its not like Payton is head and shoulders better than Frank.

Because you keep some continuity.

Couple of games playing DSJr over Frank ain't gonna kill any type of development for Frank over the long haul.

DSJ, when healthy, has been playing all season and usually getting more time over Frank.

No he hasn't, and this is an easy thing to look up and verify.

This is low level stuff man

Yeah, and like I said, early on when DSJ was 'healthy' he played more than Frank. He received regular minutes.

You're a very defensive guy over this front office. You have been for quite some time.

I'm not entirely sure what you have invested in Steve Mills and Scott Perry but the bottom line is this:

I've said similar stuff about awful teams in the past. About Phil, Isiah, Grunwald, etc. You know what happened? People like you coming at me like I'm the devil and making it about how I'm miserable and hate the franchise. And every single damn time the Knicks have proved the collective sports world right. And they're doing it again now. I wonder if you'll go back and address all the time you lambasted someone for having an opinion that was different than yours which ended up being the correct opinion? Probably not, but it would be nice to see.

I am here to point out facts to you, nothing more nothing less.

Point to the games where DJ played more than Frank

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/smithde03/gamelog/2020
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/n/ntilila01/gamelog/2020

In the broad swath of games that DJ has played, Frank has pretty much started, averaging about, what's a good guess, 30 minutes? DJ came off bench and maybe got 20.

The games are numbered and dated, so provide those games you are talking about and make it a trend to support "DSJ, when healthy, has been playing all season and usually getting more time over Frank."

Guys, I'm really done with this level of ineptness, I'm not having it on this site.

Go for it, back up your statements

Hey look at that, Frank played more when he was healthy. Pretty sure DSJ was been considered ‘injured’ 75% of the season between the death of his stepmother, his back and then his oblique. So there hasn’t been much of an opportunity to put my statement to the test. But looks like he got less minutes than Frank when he played. Great. He got an opportunity to play minutes that he was undeserving of getting due to a front office that’s invested in him.

Arguing semantics about one guy getting 25 minutes and the other guy getting 30 minutes proves what exactly? What’s the argument? I don’t care about Frank. This isn’t a Frank discussion. This is a front office wants guys playing at all costs discussion. Explain to me our current starting lineup and rotation and how it makes any sense for a ‘rebuilding my team. At this point Elfrid Payton, another bust draft pick Perry is obsessed with, gets more minutes than both the other point guards combined. Why? Explain to me what the front office is doing instead of a long winded argument about 20 minutes vs. 30 minutes because the entire argument you’re trying to make is irrelevant in the entire grand scheme.

I want to know why a ‘rebuilding’ team wants all veterans playing, why a ‘rebuilding’ team
Spent $70 million on role playing veterans who don’t compliment each other at all and why Mills and Perry believes that Knox, DSJ and others were good young players worth pursuing. These are much more important questions that needs answers than DSJ.

FACTS, you don't know what they are.

We all make mistakes and it's all banter anyway, but if you can't own up, there is no place for that here. It's life man, be better than this.

Like I said, if you can't man up, find a new home. Contact me offline if you would like.

martin wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:
Btw, hope that "putting Smith in just to showcase his talents" is not what is taking place. If it is than the Knicks are making a mistake and as dumb as everyone suspects. What exactly is the point of trading a kid that is 22 had two good years and is now at his lowest trade value? Hmmm. If that's the case lets get a second for Frank and second for Knox and release Dot. I mean... same thought pattern. As mentioned above, I know its tough to fathom, for Frank fans, but do you think that maybe the reason they brought/showcased Smith in last night was due to Franks usual inconsistent season, 6 for 25 shooting and Smith's production and athletic ability shown first two years? How bout guys just say the truth, they want Smith gone so their boy can get yet another year of chances. Chip here we come. Frank's 5 and 5 and solid defense will to get us the crown. lmao

It’s exactly what happened this last game, for better or worse.

Seems to me DSJr doesn’t want to be on the Knicks. Can’t be 100% on this but similar things happened in Dallas right?

Similar things in what sense? Being frustrated due to lack of production due to playing time/injuries? He produced in Dallas despite injuries. Not given the chance here thus far since back. And feel its ok to be frustrated with the way year is going. Cant think of manynplayers that wpuld not be. If your talking about his team feeling it was best to move on after being replaced as the main ball handler by a franchise player and the new face of the Franchise? Definitely not happening here. Still having trouble understanding how a fair take that does not take into account any favoritism for Frank would result in a decision to get rid of a 22 year old that has shown nore production than ANY of our youngins?

Keep in mind. Have asked the same of those that thought it was agood idea to trade Frank or Knox. And I think we both know those two have had my h more inconsistency and production.

JamesKPolk wrote:

martin wrote:

JamesKPolk wrote:

martin wrote:

JamesKPolk wrote:

martin wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:I am one of the bigger Frank fans in here but I understand why they played DSJr right now. Trade deadline is coming and he needs to be showcased. Since I am a big Frank fan, my only question why not just bench Payton instead and start Frank and let DSJr back him up. Need to keep developing the youngins and its not like Payton is head and shoulders better than Frank.

Because you keep some continuity.

Couple of games playing DSJr over Frank ain't gonna kill any type of development for Frank over the long haul.

DSJ, when healthy, has been playing all season and usually getting more time over Frank.

No he hasn't, and this is an easy thing to look up and verify.

This is low level stuff man

Yeah, and like I said, early on when DSJ was 'healthy' he played more than Frank. He received regular minutes.

You're a very defensive guy over this front office. You have been for quite some time.

I'm not entirely sure what you have invested in Steve Mills and Scott Perry but the bottom line is this:

I've said similar stuff about awful teams in the past. About Phil, Isiah, Grunwald, etc. You know what happened? People like you coming at me like I'm the devil and making it about how I'm miserable and hate the franchise. And every single damn time the Knicks have proved the collective sports world right. And they're doing it again now. I wonder if you'll go back and address all the time you lambasted someone for having an opinion that was different than yours which ended up being the correct opinion? Probably not, but it would be nice to see.

I am here to point out facts to you, nothing more nothing less.

Point to the games where DJ played more than Frank

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/smithde03/gamelog/2020
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/n/ntilila01/gamelog/2020

In the broad swath of games that DJ has played, Frank has pretty much started, averaging about, what's a good guess, 30 minutes? DJ came off bench and maybe got 20.

The games are numbered and dated, so provide those games you are talking about and make it a trend to support "DSJ, when healthy, has been playing all season and usually getting more time over Frank."

Guys, I'm really done with this level of ineptness, I'm not having it on this site.

Go for it, back up your statements

Hey look at that, Frank played more when he was healthy. Pretty sure DSJ was been considered ‘injured’ 75% of the season between the death of his stepmother, his back and then his oblique. So there hasn’t been much of an opportunity to put my statement to the test. But looks like he got less minutes than Frank when he played. Great. He got an opportunity to play minutes that he was undeserving of getting due to a front office that’s invested in him.

Arguing semantics about one guy getting 25 minutes and the other guy getting 30 minutes proves what exactly? What’s the argument? I don’t care about Frank. This isn’t a Frank discussion. This is a front office wants guys playing at all costs discussion. Explain to me our current starting lineup and rotation and how it makes any sense for a ‘rebuilding my team. At this point Elfrid Payton, another bust draft pick Perry is obsessed with, gets more minutes than both the other point guards combined. Why? Explain to me what the front office is doing instead of a long winded argument about 20 minutes vs. 30 minutes because the entire argument you’re trying to make is irrelevant in the entire grand scheme.

I want to know why a ‘rebuilding’ team wants all veterans playing, why a ‘rebuilding’ team
Spent $70 million on role playing veterans who don’t compliment each other at all and why Mills and Perry believes that Knox, DSJ and others were good young players worth pursuing. These are much more important questions that needs answers than DSJ.

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

martin wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

JamesKPolk wrote:Smith Jr is Mills' guy and he will get as many opportunities as he can as long as Mills is employed here.

This coming from a guy that thinks the whole team is a dumpster fire yet thinks a guy that had 14/5.4 for us last year, 15/5 his first year, has played minimal minutes since 12/11 and is at a career low in value should stay on the bench in favor of what exactly? Because the other point guards have been lighting it up? Question, What did Frank shoot in 5 games before the Brooklyn game? Hint 6 for 32. Yet Knicks should give him all the minutes? Keep a Smith on the bench? Stop.

This whole **** about making a game thread about Frank is getting old. Guys losing their **** because Frank did not get his chance and blaming Smith for any little ****. Including his 7 points and 14 minutes of play. It really killed us last night. Yet no mention of Dotson, Portis, Bullock, Knox going 7 for 25??? No mention of Mitch scoring 4 points in 25 minutes? No mention of Frank's 2 fouls in 3 minutes? Yep. All makes sense.

Actually, no one is doing that. Feel like pretty much everyone thought it was reasonable for DSJr to be getting minutes in lieu of showcasing him before trade deadline. Further, I think it was a good tactical thing to bring in Frank even for 3 minutes at the end of the game and it happened to work out for the best for Frank, not so much for the outcome though.

You might be getting it backwards?

Doing what? Ok, Should have specified. Guys saying "DSJ, when healthy, has been playing all season and usually getting more time over Frank" or "DSJ just played maliciously. He can't get out of here soon enough." or "Talent without a brain is no talent at all. We spend more time pandering to showcasing this mofo than is ever worth it. He belongs in China" or "Sorry, it’s not silly. It’s the truth. That’s who Mills wanted to draft but Phil went with Frank. Facts" = Losing your ****. Love how everyone tries to make this about Smiths ability and not about some other bull**** that makes them root against the kid and root solely for Frank. Great Seems fair.

Btw, hope that "putting Smith in just to showcase his talents" is not what is taking place. If it is than the Knicks are making a mistake and as dumb as everyone suspects. What exactly is the point of trading a kid that is 22 had two good years and is now at his lowest trade value? Hmmm. If that's the case lets get a second for Frank and second for Knox and release Dot. I mean... same thought pattern. As mentioned above, I know its tough to fathom, for Frank fans, but do you think that maybe the reason they brought/showcased Smith in last night was due to Franks usual inconsistent season, 6 for 25 shooting and Smith's production and athletic ability shown first two years? How bout guys just say the truth, they want Smith gone so their boy can get yet another year of chances. Chip here we come. Frank's 5 and 5 and solid defense will to get us the crown. lmao

the bold... first you blame everyone's agenda, then declare your own and plant your flag. Literally in the same post. Doesnt leave much for discussion.

Its all speculation because we dont know anything that goes on behind doors, only what we see. We see Frank has shown an uptick this year in aggression and over all play but still projects to an uninspiring defensive specialist and fringe rotation player. Not quite the same endorsement as "chip here we come" but OK

Meanwhile our other young PG has had a terrible season, not been healthy and when he has played has not shown anything of the things that got him to the NBA. Its been a really bad year for DSjr. Is that part of the agenda also?

Things are tough in Knick land

Hopefully the boys play well tonight. Ill be there with my son. We got a 5 game package. The basketball sucks but nothing is more important than hanging with your teenagers

Have been to many games this year. In town two weeks out of every month and look forward to it. Every game I have been to has been quite entertaining. Team has competed. Definitely not as bad as last year.

Fish knows my "agenda" quite well, when it comes to Frank. Have not tried to hide it. But okay let me state it once again. Besides the whole he was not the type of player I would have picked at the 8, which we have beat to the ground. The posts above seem direct. Why the double standard with giving one kid a chance over another? Specially when the kid everyone seems to think deserves it has shown much less in the same span? Why the push to trade a 22 year old that has put up 15/5 in his first two years of NBA ball for a second rounder that may never sniff the top side of 5/3? Do not see the issue with "my agenda"

Have fun tonight.