yellowboy90 wrote:

martin wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

martin wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

martin wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

crzymdups wrote:I still like Courtney Lee as a potential SG.

I think Evan Fournier might want out of Orlando post-Skiles and I wonder if they're less inclined to match him. Though last summer they didn't want Tobias and signed him anyway.

Lee is a much ****ttier version of what we have in Affalo and hes 31--were not getting fournier --not happening unless we are stone cold out of our minds. I like Crabbe if we can do it---Portland probably will match anyway--but 14mm per year will make them think about it.

I honestly think Portland is more likely to match on Crabbe than Orlando on Fournier.

The sad/scary thing is that one or both players could be had but instead Phil goes after Evan Turner.

you just made up something out of thin air and then accused Phil of doing wrong. Out of nothing. The pessimism is truly awful

Different situation but Cory Joseph did become available last year and the knicks went with AA. So yes I am concerned about Phil and his FA picks. Yes he got Lopez but his first choice was Monroe. It worked out in the end though.

I just presented a scenario that may or may not happen but is plausible with the way people think Evan Turner is a Phil type guard.

NY did not lose out on Cory Joseph, he wanted his home town. Knicks just drafted Grant and already had Jose, they didn't need another PG, AA was better short term.

And NY's first choices were Aldridge and DeAndre, not Monroe.

They did not even get in the race. You offer him slightly more money than Toronto and the starting job and see what happens. Just being a starter might have done it. Already having Calderon should never be a deciding factor. Also, Toronto drafted a pg in the 1st rd too. Joseph would have helped short term and gave them another young player on a great contract. Phil dropped the ball.

With Joseph defense you could have played a 2 pg system sliding Calderon to the 2 if you did not cut him. If you did cut Calderon you could have still could have got AA if you sacrificed using the exception on KS. You use the exception on Lou/Thomas since they wanted to give them an atta boy raise. Now you save the 3.1m of cap space to use with the $4m+ you got from stretching Jose.

You know how badly Joseph wanted to go to Toronto? They already had a start all-star PG, just drafted a PG and he still felt like that was his spot.

28 teams lost out on Joseph. 28 GMs failed. Or, 1 got lucky cause he wanted to go there and they also wanted to supplement their team with Canadian born. It actually makes sense.

Of those 28 teams who could have offered him a starting job? Also, I would not mind if they lost out on him like they did Jordan or Aldridge because at least they got in the race. I might not agree with Jordan in the triangle or Aldridge next to Melo but they at least reached out to both players.

Hey, a career backup just signed to be a backup player. If you think we missed out, OK. I think the Knicks missed out on a very good backup that they don't and didn't need who also really really really wanted to be in Toronto.

So far he's had a nice career as a backup and will be that for a while.

crzymdups wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

crzymdups wrote:I still like Courtney Lee as a potential SG.

I think Evan Fournier might want out of Orlando post-Skiles and I wonder if they're less inclined to match him. Though last summer they didn't want Tobias and signed him anyway.

Lee is a much ****ttier version of what we have in Affalo and hes 31--were not getting fournier --not happening unless we are stone cold out of our minds. I like Crabbe if we can do it---Portland probably will match anyway--but 14mm per year will make them think about it.

I honestly think Portland is more likely to match on Crabbe than Orlando on Fournier.

The sad/scary thing is that one or both players could be had but instead Phil goes after Evan Turner.

I think it is extremely tought to get an RFA from another team, especially when they likely have cap room. Orlando and Portland both have plenty of cap space. And Crabbe is a major rotational piece to their playoffs team that just played the Warriors very very well. I'd be shocked if Crabbe weren't matched by Portland.

list all the RFA's that had signed elsewhere and its a very small list. In fact Lin is one of the only I can think of. If the player is worth a fart in the wind they match and trade later (see Tobias)

You are forgetting O'Quinn.

That was actually a sign and trade with Orlando.

yes but he was a restricted FA. S&Ts is one option teams have to resort to in order to get an RFA away from their current team.

The other way is what Dallas did with Chandler Parsons and "dirty up" the contract.

crzymdups wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

crzymdups wrote:I still like Courtney Lee as a potential SG.

I think Evan Fournier might want out of Orlando post-Skiles and I wonder if they're less inclined to match him. Though last summer they didn't want Tobias and signed him anyway.

Lee is a much ****ttier version of what we have in Affalo and hes 31--were not getting fournier --not happening unless we are stone cold out of our minds. I like Crabbe if we can do it---Portland probably will match anyway--but 14mm per year will make them think about it.

I honestly think Portland is more likely to match on Crabbe than Orlando on Fournier.

The sad/scary thing is that one or both players could be had but instead Phil goes after Evan Turner.

I think it is extremely tought to get an RFA from another team, especially when they likely have cap room. Orlando and Portland both have plenty of cap space. And Crabbe is a major rotational piece to their playoffs team that just played the Warriors very very well. I'd be shocked if Crabbe weren't matched by Portland.

list all the RFA's that had signed elsewhere and its a very small list. In fact Lin is one of the only I can think of. If the player is worth a fart in the wind they match and trade later (see Tobias)

You are forgetting O'Quinn.

That was actually a sign and trade with Orlando.

yes but he was a restricted FA. S&Ts is one option teams have to resort to in order to get an RFA away from their current team.

The other way is what Dallas did with Chandler Parsons and "dirty up" the contract.

Yeah, Parsons, and then Houston did it with Lin and Asik in the same off-season (and regretted the balloon year later)

Parsons can actually opt out this summer, which could be interesting. Chandler Parsons to Portland could be verrrrrry interesting.

i wonder if teams worry about his health. I believe he had micro fracture surgery last off-season.

yellowboy90 wrote:

martin wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

martin wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

martin wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

martin wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

crzymdups wrote:I still like Courtney Lee as a potential SG.

I think Evan Fournier might want out of Orlando post-Skiles and I wonder if they're less inclined to match him. Though last summer they didn't want Tobias and signed him anyway.

Lee is a much ****ttier version of what we have in Affalo and hes 31--were not getting fournier --not happening unless we are stone cold out of our minds. I like Crabbe if we can do it---Portland probably will match anyway--but 14mm per year will make them think about it.

I honestly think Portland is more likely to match on Crabbe than Orlando on Fournier.

The sad/scary thing is that one or both players could be had but instead Phil goes after Evan Turner.

you just made up something out of thin air and then accused Phil of doing wrong. Out of nothing. The pessimism is truly awful

Different situation but Cory Joseph did become available last year and the knicks went with AA. So yes I am concerned about Phil and his FA picks. Yes he got Lopez but his first choice was Monroe. It worked out in the end though.

I just presented a scenario that may or may not happen but is plausible with the way people think Evan Turner is a Phil type guard.

NY did not lose out on Cory Joseph, he wanted his home town. Knicks just drafted Grant and already had Jose, they didn't need another PG, AA was better short term.

And NY's first choices were Aldridge and DeAndre, not Monroe.

They did not even get in the race. You offer him slightly more money than Toronto and the starting job and see what happens. Just being a starter might have done it. Already having Calderon should never be a deciding factor. Also, Toronto drafted a pg in the 1st rd too. Joseph would have helped short term and gave them another young player on a great contract. Phil dropped the ball.

With Joseph defense you could have played a 2 pg system sliding Calderon to the 2 if you did not cut him. If you did cut Calderon you could have still could have got AA if you sacrificed using the exception on KS. You use the exception on Lou/Thomas since they wanted to give them an atta boy raise. Now you save the 3.1m of cap space to use with the $4m+ you got from stretching Jose.

You know how badly Joseph wanted to go to Toronto? They already had a start all-star PG, just drafted a PG and he still felt like that was his spot.

28 teams lost out on Joseph. 28 GMs failed. Or, 1 got lucky cause he wanted to go there and they also wanted to supplement their team with Canadian born. It actually makes sense.

Of those 28 teams who could have offered him a starting job? Also, I would not mind if they lost out on him like they did Jordan or Aldridge because at least they got in the race. I might not agree with Jordan in the triangle or Aldridge next to Melo but they at least reached out to both players.

Hey, a career backup just signed to be a backup player. If you think we missed out, OK. I think the Knicks missed out on a very good backup that they don't and didn't need who also really really really wanted to be in Toronto.

So far he's had a nice career as a backup and will be that for a while.

So you think he is a backup I can understand that but that's why to me trying to get someone like him on a good deal would've been so smart. If he didn't work out you know have a cheap backup growing forward. A backup that can defend the 1/2.

signing Joseph when you have Jose for 2 more years and then just drafted a PG doesn't make sense. 3 PGs and no starting shooting guards? That's not a good use of cap space. Plus Corey wanted Toronto.

If you want to hold that against Phil, that's OK to me, it just doesn't make sense to me.

Good interview. He said he's interested in fitting in a system and that's what they knicks can offer. They just got to steal him from the blazers first......

martin wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

martin wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

martin wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

martin wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

martin wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

crzymdups wrote:I still like Courtney Lee as a potential SG.

I think Evan Fournier might want out of Orlando post-Skiles and I wonder if they're less inclined to match him. Though last summer they didn't want Tobias and signed him anyway.

Lee is a much ****ttier version of what we have in Affalo and hes 31--were not getting fournier --not happening unless we are stone cold out of our minds. I like Crabbe if we can do it---Portland probably will match anyway--but 14mm per year will make them think about it.

I honestly think Portland is more likely to match on Crabbe than Orlando on Fournier.

The sad/scary thing is that one or both players could be had but instead Phil goes after Evan Turner.

you just made up something out of thin air and then accused Phil of doing wrong. Out of nothing. The pessimism is truly awful

Different situation but Cory Joseph did become available last year and the knicks went with AA. So yes I am concerned about Phil and his FA picks. Yes he got Lopez but his first choice was Monroe. It worked out in the end though.

I just presented a scenario that may or may not happen but is plausible with the way people think Evan Turner is a Phil type guard.

NY did not lose out on Cory Joseph, he wanted his home town. Knicks just drafted Grant and already had Jose, they didn't need another PG, AA was better short term.

And NY's first choices were Aldridge and DeAndre, not Monroe.

They did not even get in the race. You offer him slightly more money than Toronto and the starting job and see what happens. Just being a starter might have done it. Already having Calderon should never be a deciding factor. Also, Toronto drafted a pg in the 1st rd too. Joseph would have helped short term and gave them another young player on a great contract. Phil dropped the ball.

With Joseph defense you could have played a 2 pg system sliding Calderon to the 2 if you did not cut him. If you did cut Calderon you could have still could have got AA if you sacrificed using the exception on KS. You use the exception on Lou/Thomas since they wanted to give them an atta boy raise. Now you save the 3.1m of cap space to use with the $4m+ you got from stretching Jose.

You know how badly Joseph wanted to go to Toronto? They already had a start all-star PG, just drafted a PG and he still felt like that was his spot.

28 teams lost out on Joseph. 28 GMs failed. Or, 1 got lucky cause he wanted to go there and they also wanted to supplement their team with Canadian born. It actually makes sense.

Of those 28 teams who could have offered him a starting job? Also, I would not mind if they lost out on him like they did Jordan or Aldridge because at least they got in the race. I might not agree with Jordan in the triangle or Aldridge next to Melo but they at least reached out to both players.

Hey, a career backup just signed to be a backup player. If you think we missed out, OK. I think the Knicks missed out on a very good backup that they don't and didn't need who also really really really wanted to be in Toronto.

So far he's had a nice career as a backup and will be that for a while.

So you think he is a backup I can understand that but that's why to me trying to get someone like him on a good deal would've been so smart. If he didn't work out you know have a cheap backup growing forward. A backup that can defend the 1/2.

signing Joseph when you have Jose for 2 more years and then just drafted a PG doesn't make sense. 3 PGs and no starting shooting guards? That's not a good use of cap space. Plus Corey wanted Toronto.

If you want to hold that against Phil, that's OK to me, it just doesn't make sense to me.

like yellow said, we desperately need to find guys like joseph who are little used high efficiency gems. Going after career losers like AA because your eye test told you that he is ok is silly.

Why not offer him a contract? Toronto would be in big trouble without him.

Was he even on their radar? Could the knicks not use a guy like him?

why does it need to be defend anything phil related?

BRIGGS wrote:Jus think about this---Allen Crabbe just turned 24 and he lead all of the NBA players in efg in the playoffs for a team that was very close to beating GS.
He's just going to get better. I think hes like a young Allan Houston. Hes the same size as Allan hes got a very similar touch. If you start to really think about it if we are going to spend money--first we have to OUTSPEND the rest of the NBA and Portland and it might have to have shock value. I look at our team and the nBA and we lack great outside shooting--and I think for pennies on the dollar(in terms of total cap)--we can go out and put big offers out there for Curry and Crabbe.

I agree. We have to take some chances somewhere. If we are going to take chances, we should do it on young players with good outside shots. We need to gamble on upside and fit, and these players hit on both criteria.

fishmike wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Jus think about this---Allen Crabbe just turned 24 and he lead all of the NBA players in efg in the playoffs for a team that was very close to beating GS.
He's just going to get better. I think hes like a young Allan Houston. Hes the same size as Allan hes got a very similar touch. If you start to really think about it if we are going to spend money--first we have to OUTSPEND the rest of the NBA and Portland and it might have to have shock value. I look at our team and the nBA and we lack great outside shooting--and I think for pennies on the dollar(in terms of total cap)--we can go out and put big offers out there for Curry and Crabbe.

I agree. We have to take some chances somewhere. If we are going to take chances, we should do it on young players with good outside shots. We need to gamble on upside and fit, and these players hit on both criteria.

with another cap jump and an even better FA crop is this the offseason to overpay and take that chance? Is overpaying to get a guy like Crab worth the risk of not participating in next years FA?

The list is DEEP

http://hoopshype.com/2015/12/30/nba-free-agency-2017-the-top-players/

Don't forget the CBA is up at the end of next season. I expect there will be a long lockout and the cap will come back down under $100M.

I don't know if you can plan to preserve cap when you really have no idea what the cap and rules will look like.

Knixkik wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Jus think about this---Allen Crabbe just turned 24 and he lead all of the NBA players in efg in the playoffs for a team that was very close to beating GS.
He's just going to get better. I think hes like a young Allan Houston. Hes the same size as Allan hes got a very similar touch. If you start to really think about it if we are going to spend money--first we have to OUTSPEND the rest of the NBA and Portland and it might have to have shock value. I look at our team and the nBA and we lack great outside shooting--and I think for pennies on the dollar(in terms of total cap)--we can go out and put big offers out there for Curry and Crabbe.

I agree. We have to take some chances somewhere. If we are going to take chances, we should do it on young players with good outside shots. We need to gamble on upside and fit, and these players hit on both criteria.

Knik--thats my absolute same thought process. Its pretty simple--I know Curry and Crabbe are good players who will help the team by extending the floor aT a MINIMUM---upside of both--well I really willing to bet on it. Im willing to take risk that I have better players here--but its going to take financial aggression.