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Some recent observations on Chandler
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djsunyc
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12/31/2008  12:39 PM
it's basically 40 games into chandler's nba career. so far, i think he's exceeded expectations...
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BlueSeats
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12/31/2008  12:43 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

it's basically 40 games into chandler's nba career. so far, i think he's exceeded expectations...

I agree. He's every bit the kid that Gallinari is. Expecting NBA smarts and savvy out of such pups is futile and counter productive.
Pharzeone
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12/31/2008  1:00 PM
I am not sure if what MisterEarl is saying is race baiting when you have posters on here telling you that the Italian kid has a high BB IQ when they only witness 40 minutes in a SL game where he tried to drive over a guy who weighs 300+ pounds (some would suggest that is low BB IQ). I laughed when NYBocker said maybe Gallinari is the superstar. It still remains to be seen if this guy's body can even survive in the NBA. Let's see if he can take hard fouls first. Depsite what many people believe on this forum it is not normal for a 18 year young man to have this much trouble with his back from a rough fall.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
TMS
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12/31/2008  1:02 PM
Posted by Cosmic:

Earl, you asked me what I saw, I said what I saw.

If you want to discount everything he does wrong, and tell me I'm making things up, then that's your choice.

I'm not the only one in the thread who was concerned with his play the last six odd games, hence why this thread was born, you took my observations to task, I clarified them, you dismiss them anyway. That's just what you do though so no big deal.

TMS: Honestly, get over the Crawful thing already, it's tiresome, he's a bum, was always a bum, and sure as hell is nobodies savior. Jeez, you call me obsessed? Your last three posts to me just the past day bring the guy up. Keep it up if that pleases you this is my last reply on that trash you call a good player and lament trading.

i disagree.

& i also think u need to pipe down with your constant digs at Donnie Walsh... it's getting tiresome as well... while we're at it, i think u need to quiet down on the Bring Back Marbury posts as well... no one wants that bum around here... & i can't believe u actually think the Knicks will win a championship this year... get over it already, jeez.

[Edited by - TMS on 12-31-2008 10:12 AM]
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
misterearl
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12/31/2008  1:09 PM
"... like, yo, be aggressive..."

Thank you dj and blueseats

another valid perspective, this time from a veteran player:

“I think the biggest thing is Will doesn’t really understand how good he is or how good he could be," Quentin said. "When I’m out there I can see it, everybody can see it. Will’s an interesting kid...

... He always listens well, he tries to do everything the coaches tell him, even when I’m talking to him he’ll try to do what I’m talking about. I try to encourage him at different times, like, yo, be aggressive. Go do what you do, get to the rim. When he does his thing, it helps us.”

and from a writer:

"When he does his thing...it's nasty."

- Alan Hahn

once a knick always a knick
BlueSeats
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12/31/2008  1:20 PM
Posted by Pharzeone:

I am not sure if what MisterEarl is saying is race baiting when you have posters on here telling you that the Italian kid has a high BB IQ when they only witness 40 minutes in a SL game where he tried to drive over a guy who weighs 300+ pounds (some would suggest that is low BB IQ). I laughed when NYBocker said maybe Gallinari is the superstar. It still remains to be seen if this guy's body can even survive in the NBA. Let's see if he can take hard fouls first. Despite what many people believe on this forum it is not normal for a 18 year young man to have this much trouble with his back from a rough fall.

I haven't noticed the race card played for some time on this board, and found it curious that it reappeared on the day of papabear's return, even beginning with a nod to the bear himself.

I think the card is best played where encountered. If NYBocker's posts bother someone then one's issues with them should be addressed to him, not someone else. And isn't bocker Filipino? I don't know, do the standby black/white racial preference assumptions still apply?
kam77
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12/31/2008  2:12 PM
I hate all people equally.
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
misterearl
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12/31/2008  2:16 PM
Pharzeone - as you have accurately described, arbitrary negative labels, or assignment of a low BB IQ to a functional rookie like Chandler, is (in the words of blueseats) both futile and counter productive.

I am hopeful that Gallinari and Chandler can be the reincarnation of DeBusshere and Bradley by 2011.

Focusing on the (normal) growing pains of the youngest players describes a unique form of impatience. It's not unlike chastising a baby while taking his or her first steps.

"Dammit, get to that pacifier quicker... and don't drop it!"



once a knick always a knick
BasketballJones
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12/31/2008  2:17 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

I loved the play of Chandler last night. He was erratic and made mistakes


I loved the mistakes and erratic play too.
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misterearl
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12/31/2008  2:27 PM
“Mistakes are the portals of discovery.”

- James Joyce
once a knick always a knick
djsunyc
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12/31/2008  2:27 PM
it is VERY difficult for rookies to acclimate to the nba, including high lottery picks. a player's first few years in the league is crucial in their development as a pro down the line. it's quite possible a player put in an ideal situation blossoms into a star player while the same player put in another, would become a career nba journeyman. a player can work his tail off, but if he doesn't get the opportunity, isn't surrounded by the right people and teammates, nor is nurtured along mentally as well as physically, he may never get to fulfill his potential.

chandler came into an absolute DRECK of a situation last season with isiah, marbury and all the other buffoons. we see how it's taking nate a while to mature and i'm not mad at him for that since this environment the past 3 years has been anything but a breeding ground for maturity. we are seeing david lee starting to realize the business aspect of the league and understand that he needs to continue working on his craft to take the next step. now, let's say both of them joined a team like the dallas mavericks 3 years ago...an organization that does an admiral job of being professional while developing and integrating their younger players...there's a good chance nate is talked about in the same light as barbosa or how bobby jackson used to be, and david lee would be looked upon as a big time reserve that every team wants (i.e brian grant when he left portland).

that's why chandler's performance this season has to be looked upon as nothing but a positive. he basically had no coaching last season and was exposed to worst in basketball. now, in his new found role with a team starting to change it's culture, he has put up some very nice performances and has shown flashes of being a high impact guy on the court. some lotto picks haven't done that yet.
BlueSeats
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12/31/2008  2:34 PM
Posted by misterearl:

Pharzeone - as you have accurately described, arbitrary negative labels, or assignment of a low BB IQ to a functional rookie like Chandler, is (in the words of blueseats) both futile and counter productive.

I am hopeful that Gallinari and Chandler can be the reincarnation of DeBusshere and Bradley by 2011.

Focusing on the (normal) growing pains of the youngest players describes a unique form of impatience. It's not unlike chastising a baby while taking his or her first steps.

"Dammit, get to that pacifier quicker... and don't drop it!"


I don't disagree with feelings about the pups, I just wonder if it's productive to play to the peanut gallery and make it about race. Are there no impatient black fans? Are all white fans fair to "Il Busto"?
misterearl
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12/31/2008  2:39 PM
blueseats - where was race mentioned?

The only card that was played was the rookie card.

[Edited by - misterearl on 12-31-2008 2:40 PM]
once a knick always a knick
BlueSeats
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12/31/2008  2:41 PM

A lot of our young guys still don't know their roles. Most of them are tweeners and are being used at different positions on the floor. Sometimes they're asked to operate within the offense, sometimes they're applauded for taking it upon themselves to make something happen. The coach isn't even sure yet how to utilize these guys to best advantage. They have to be allowed to try things to see what they're capable of.
BlueSeats
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12/31/2008  2:43 PM
Posted by misterearl:

blueseats - where was race mentioned?

The only card that was played was the rookie card.

[Edited by - misterearl on 12-31-2008 2:40 PM]


Telling someone they'd sing a different tune if a white guy put up the same numbers.
Cosmic
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12/31/2008  2:52 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Cosmic:

Earl, you asked me what I saw, I said what I saw.

If you want to discount everything he does wrong, and tell me I'm making things up, then that's your choice.

I'm not the only one in the thread who was concerned with his play the last six odd games, hence why this thread was born, you took my observations to task, I clarified them, you dismiss them anyway. That's just what you do though so no big deal.

TMS: Honestly, get over the Crawful thing already, it's tiresome, he's a bum, was always a bum, and sure as hell is nobodies savior. Jeez, you call me obsessed? Your last three posts to me just the past day bring the guy up. Keep it up if that pleases you this is my last reply on that trash you call a good player and lament trading.

i disagree.

& i also think u need to pipe down with your constant digs at Donnie Walsh... it's getting tiresome as well... while we're at it, i think u need to quiet down on the Bring Back Marbury posts as well... no one wants that bum around here... & i can't believe u actually think the Knicks will win a championship this year... get over it already, jeez.

[Edited by - TMS on 12-31-2008 10:12 AM]

Huh? You're acting flat out deranged.
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Cosmic
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12/31/2008  2:54 PM
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by misterearl:

blueseats - where was race mentioned?

The only card that was played was the rookie card.

[Edited by - misterearl on 12-31-2008 2:40 PM]


Telling someone they'd sing a different tune if a white guy put up the same numbers.

Which I don't. It's an asinine accusation with no merit.

When people in a debate, one that should be friendly at that, resort to that kind of nonsense and the nonsense TMS is replying to me with, it just shows they have nothing of value to say in return to someone's else's observations. I guess this means what I have to say has validity for if not they'd have something constructive to say in return instead of random unfounded gibberish.
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Bippity10
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12/31/2008  3:50 PM
Anyone notice that David Lee is developing a drop step into a baby hook shot?
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Cosmic
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12/31/2008  4:07 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

Anyone notice that David Lee is developing a drop step into a baby hook shot?

I hadn't actually. I know he's tried some more conventional post ups but they seem sloppy so I didn't seek to label them as anything more than that: Sloppy.

What I had noticed about Lee is he is just HORRENDOUS on defense. I always knew he was bad but this has grown to ridiculous proportions: He just stands there when guards cut into the lane. If he had any reaction time at all he could leap and swat at their shot. Yet, he doesn't. He sits there in cement and watches the play unfold.

I even noticed that on a number of his rebounds he simply leaves his man early putting him in a better position - earlier than the opponent - to snatch the board. In that I noticed there are times when he misses the opportunity and the player he left is the one that snags the O-Board and gives the opposition a new 24. Also, when he's not about to be the primary rebounder, he leaves his man anyway instead of boxing out, and that too leads to an extra possession for the opponent.

Also, even though he is an above average passer for certain, he makes some VERY lazy passes that get picked off. No need for that. Just...pass the ball with velocity and you take away 1 or 2 turnovers a game.

Lastly, Lee, for the love of god, HIT THE GYM. This guy is reminding me more and more of Brad Miller - someone who refuses to hit the weights - and has the upper body development..of..well... ME for crying out loud. Hit the damn weights.

Lee does have the right attitude and a desire to improve and he has improved on something each and every year but as I outlined above there are several things that just perplex you as to why he hasn't strived to improve those as they seem to be little things but they lead to big mistakes.

I've said it before and I'll say it again as I do with Nate and Chandler. While I like them they have yet to show me they are TRUE keepers. They'd make a nice bench trio but they are not starters and we need starters. To get enough quality starters both Curry and Jeffries must pack their bags. To do that - we might need to include Lee or Chandler or Nate to make it happen. If the right deal comes along you strongly consider it.

*waits for earl and papabear to tell me I'm now racist against whites for these observation on Lee*

bleh......
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kam77
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12/31/2008  4:14 PM
Posted by Cosmic:
Posted by Bippity10:

Anyone notice that David Lee is developing a drop step into a baby hook shot?

I hadn't actually. I know he's tried some more conventional post ups but they seem sloppy so I didn't seek to label them as anything more than that: Sloppy.

What I had noticed about Lee is he is just HORRENDOUS on defense. I always knew he was bad but this has grown to ridiculous proportions: He just stands there when guards cut into the lane. If he had any reaction time at all he could leap and swat at their shot. Yet, he doesn't. He sits there in cement and watches the play unfold.


Maybe he is too intent on boxing out his man... too geeked up for the rebound.

lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
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Some recent observations on Chandler
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