arkrud wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

holfresh wrote:

arkrud wrote:

martin wrote:

arkrud wrote:

martin wrote:

arkrud wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Does anyone know people who work in a hospital? If you work in a hospital in an inner city--you darn well know why we need HUGE HUGE immigration reform. Minorities with the MAIN offender being ILLEGAL Hispanics use OUR medical system for their own benefit. They come here pregnant Illegally at 7 -8 months--have a baby and
they get free healthcare section 8 housing food stamps and they do the process over and over again. The more babies--the more free stuff--and its all on everyone elses shoulders to pay for. Hi\s panics have blown away AA in population over the last twenty years and now make up the highest minority in the uS.

This system of entitlement and the process of being able to step on US soil from ANY country ILLEGAL and have a child born as a LEGAL US citizen has to stop. This is just one facet of whats wrong with our immigration system and it costs in the hundreds of billions of taxpayers money and or insurance premiums to pay for. It isnt fair. If you are here illegally and NOT paying fair taxes and using our medical system loopholes that were intended for true hardship against true US citizens--you need to GTFO.

And we can babycake the truth--but this is fact and it needs to stop. We need to stop all avenues that continue to pound on the deficit or at some point what ever you have done for you your family what you have as a home or in the bank may not matter anymore. The free ride has to be over

I think trump knows this but I dont think Hillary gives one crackadoodle iota.

Any time you want to start with facts and actual policy proposals by the candidate, others will start to treat you like an informed citizen who has something to offer to the debate, conversation, etc.

Otherwise it's the same old fluff and bluster that you keep on repeating.

You have added nothing with this post on immigration, health care or what either party/candidate is offering. Zero.

In fact, it's less than zero, it's hyperbole (last sentence) and probably factually wrong (whole post).

It's kind of funny how people have such a strong opinions about this 2 candidates who both do not deserve much of the interest and will most likely viewed by history as a joke unless they will be a reason for some serious global problems to make their future presidency a horror rather than a joke.
It's a shame not on them but on us all that we cannot fine people who really deserve to be a leaders. What a sad time for America...

Mostly I do not understand what you are saying.

Both candidates should garner incredibly high, honest, analytical interest as they are running for the highest office and most important individual person in the world status, so I disagree with the bolded statement above. As far as I can gather, one candidate is a complete and utter joke and a fool of a man and the other is not an ideal candidate but is worth consideration.

No disrespect to your opinion.
I do agree that Hilary is safer bet.
But I do not think we should vote for best of the worst.
We should vote for the best of the best. But I guess we do not deserve it....

That's nice and all but we have 2 candidates: Hilary and Trump. Best of the best, best of the worst... those are just empty words right now. It's between Hilary and Trump.

I am voting for libertarian mandate. And a lot of millennials will do to.
Both Reps and Dems are not the future.
They discredited themselves by disregarding the future of this country in favor of their personal and partisan needs.

Here is a Libertarian with a plan for the future..

Come on, why you picking on Gary?!? He's got the long view, baby!

We need to get this United Federation of Planets thing going or else it's Battlestar Galatica time, running away from sentient SkynetSolarCityTeslabots!

I saw that live, it definitely brought a smile! He has such a goofy way about him that I didn't notice 4 years ago.

Humor is a problem in US...
As Disney teaches us the humor is when somebody kicked in the a..sss..
And yes I am seriously for exploration of other planets , self-driving cars, fusion energy and such.
It is much more important that adding $10 more to somebody welfare check, busting some corrupt CEO, or deciding who will be allowed in the public toilet or can big Kardasian a..ss be shown on TV.
I mean this little things are also of some importance but rather will be forgotten in couple of short years.

Nah... ass kicking is more Warner Brothers! I thought it was funny, but you can't say he's wrong about the science behind our Sun's death spiral.

But as a filthy Trotsky-reading socialist looking at voting for Comrade Dr. Jill, I'll just note it was humor while deflecting humanity's role in climate change. Hottest summer on earth on record, tropical diseases on the march... etc.

Talked to a bank rep on the phone today who was up in Maine, friendly chit-chatting, pitching me credit products to "buy your heating oil" or whatever emergency. I mentioned my AC bill, and she said this was the first summer she can remember using her AC so much up there. So something like that has both a short-term financial impact and a long-term multi-generational impact.

Hard to convince humans to look beyond their own life span, let alone the next paycheck.

And technically, we don't have just two parties. I'm a registered Democrat because otherwise in NY I'm basically disenfranchising myself. But I am too tired of Coke vs. Pepsi. Can a brother get some wheatgrass?

martin wrote:

arkrud wrote:

martin wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:I asked this a few pages back, but genuinely interested in hearing from folks who are voting for Trump...

What do you make of Pence?

I've read most of this thread but have undoubtedly missed some things here and there. I've yet to hear some very concrete reason why folks are voting FOR Trump/Pence. I've heard why people are not voting for Hilary, but not FOR Trump outside of that tingly feeling guns and BRIGGS keep referring to.

I am not voting for Trump but spoke with a lot of people who will.
They just fed up with current political establishment and want CHANGE.
They just want to shake the tree.
Was it the same for some folks when they were voting for Obama?
The change may not come (and most likely will not same as with Obama) but people want it badly and want to feel as they can make an impact. They are tired to be called bigots, racist, and such just for talking their mind.
Who planting the wind will harvest the storm.

Change is good. Change for the sake of change can be very good. Change at the highest level of civil office and for the most influential person in the word needs to done very deliberately, honestly, with as much scrutiny and transparency as possible. That is not the case with Trump. You don't just throw your hat into the pile because you are fed up, that's called recklessness.

I totally agree with this and every educated balanced person will agree.
But there are many people who never train their mind to digest all complexities of the society and not aware about large historical context. Discarding this people opinions is also dangerous and irresponsible.
Hilary is wrong person to be the one who will bring the common ground for reconciliation we desperately needed.
We need this common ground to unite us even if it is around expedition to Mars.
We need someone who will reinforce many things all Americans believe in and will rally around.
For now I can see just opposite from both candidates.

martin wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:I asked this a few pages back, but genuinely interested in hearing from folks who are voting for Trump...

What do you make of Pence?

I've read most of this thread but have undoubtedly missed some things here and there. I've yet to hear some very concrete reason why folks are voting FOR Trump/Pence. I've heard why people are not voting for Hilary, but not FOR Trump outside of that tingly feeling guns and BRIGGS keep referring to.

One thing seems clear: Trump's "muscular" stance on illegal immigrants and limiting legal Muslim immigrants wins them over.

I wonder if Trump is to his supporters what Obama's critics (from both the right and left) accused Barry of being: a cipher, a symbol where it's more a projection of the hopes of the supporter, versus clear mindedness on what Trump is actually capable of in today's politics.

Yea I'm really interested in what Trump voters think about Pence. Particularly because of his recent statement about Dick Cheney as a role model.

So... Mike Pence. Whatcha Trump fans think?

arkrud wrote:

martin wrote:

arkrud wrote:I totally agree with this and every educated balanced person will agree.
But there are many people who never train their mind to digest all complexities of the society and not aware about large historical context. Discarding this people opinions is also dangerous and irresponsible.
Hilary is wrong person to be the one who will bring the common ground for reconciliation we desperately needed.
We need this common ground to unite us even if it is around expedition to Mars.
We need someone who will reinforce many things all Americans believe in and will rally around.
For now I can see just opposite from both candidates.

Right now the choice is between Hilary and Trump. If Hilary is the wrong person, who is the right person?

Looks like both Reps and Dems cannot find one any more...
Same as Putin party win in Russia with 44% voters turnaround (16% in Saint Petersburg and $40 in Moscow) was a loss not a win the election of Hilary or Trump will be a loss for America regardless of the result.
My hope is it will be something we will be able to learn on moving forward.
But I want to have no part of it in supporting ether side.

That's quite the blanket statement. Sounds like the statements that were made regarding Obama (and how bad he would be) before he started. Or how Obamacare would ruin everything.

arkrud wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

martin wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:I asked this a few pages back, but genuinely interested in hearing from folks who are voting for Trump...

What do you make of Pence?

I've read most of this thread but have undoubtedly missed some things here and there. I've yet to hear some very concrete reason why folks are voting FOR Trump/Pence. I've heard why people are not voting for Hilary, but not FOR Trump outside of that tingly feeling guns and BRIGGS keep referring to.

One thing seems clear: Trump's "muscular" stance on illegal immigrants and limiting legal Muslim immigrants wins them over.

I wonder if Trump is to his supporters what Obama's critics (from both the right and left) accused Barry of being: a cipher, a symbol where it's more a projection of the hopes of the supporter, versus clear mindedness on what Trump is actually capable of in today's politics.

Yea I'm really interested in what Trump voters think about Pence. Particularly because of his recent statement about Dick Cheney as a role model.

So... Mike Pence. Whatcha Trump fans think?

With the latest shootings and stabbing the Trump positioning is getting reinforced...
It is getting scarier per hour... Not the terrorist but the reaction which can be quite disproportional considering the powers assembled in Middle East.
Russia and US already exchanged punches at the expense of Rebels and UN...
Its just a matter of time until US or Russian personal will be killed... then who knows what will happen.

But in the grand cosmic scheme of things, they are only imperial blips in the Milky Way of history... so why worry?

You ain't voting for Trump! Leave my post alone for my bros BRIGGS and guns so they can tell me what they think of who will ACTUALLY be president in a Trump Pence administration!

arkrud wrote:

martin wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:I asked this a few pages back, but genuinely interested in hearing from folks who are voting for Trump...

What do you make of Pence?

I've read most of this thread but have undoubtedly missed some things here and there. I've yet to hear some very concrete reason why folks are voting FOR Trump/Pence. I've heard why people are not voting for Hilary, but not FOR Trump outside of that tingly feeling guns and BRIGGS keep referring to.

I am not voting for Trump but spoke with a lot of people who will.
They just fed up with current political establishment and want CHANGE.
They just want to shake the tree.
Was it the same for some folks when they were voting for Obama?
The change may not come (and most likely will not same as with Obama) but people want it badly and want to feel as they can make an impact. They are tired to be called bigots, racist, and such just for talking their mind.
Who planting the wind will harvest the storm.

The want change but won't vote out their congressmen...The informed would know the real problem in Washington is Congress..It's easy to get a presidential candidate to implement a mandate...

holfresh wrote:

arkrud wrote:

martin wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:I asked this a few pages back, but genuinely interested in hearing from folks who are voting for Trump...

What do you make of Pence?

I've read most of this thread but have undoubtedly missed some things here and there. I've yet to hear some very concrete reason why folks are voting FOR Trump/Pence. I've heard why people are not voting for Hilary, but not FOR Trump outside of that tingly feeling guns and BRIGGS keep referring to.

I am not voting for Trump but spoke with a lot of people who will.
They just fed up with current political establishment and want CHANGE.
They just want to shake the tree.
Was it the same for some folks when they were voting for Obama?
The change may not come (and most likely will not same as with Obama) but people want it badly and want to feel as they can make an impact. They are tired to be called bigots, racist, and such just for talking their mind.
Who planting the wind will harvest the storm.

The want change but won't vote out their congressmen...The informed would know the real problem in Washington is Congress..It's easy to get a presidential candidate to implement a mandate...

This true... but what President can really do?
Constitution and Law are the real power of the Republic...
But shhhh... this is not what common folks should hear...

arkrud wrote:

holfresh wrote:

arkrud wrote:

martin wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:I asked this a few pages back, but genuinely interested in hearing from folks who are voting for Trump...

What do you make of Pence?

I've read most of this thread but have undoubtedly missed some things here and there. I've yet to hear some very concrete reason why folks are voting FOR Trump/Pence. I've heard why people are not voting for Hilary, but not FOR Trump outside of that tingly feeling guns and BRIGGS keep referring to.

I am not voting for Trump but spoke with a lot of people who will.
They just fed up with current political establishment and want CHANGE.
They just want to shake the tree.
Was it the same for some folks when they were voting for Obama?
The change may not come (and most likely will not same as with Obama) but people want it badly and want to feel as they can make an impact. They are tired to be called bigots, racist, and such just for talking their mind.
Who planting the wind will harvest the storm.

The want change but won't vote out their congressmen...The informed would know the real problem in Washington is Congress..It's easy to get a presidential candidate to implement a mandate...

This true... but what President can really do?
Constitution and Law are the real power of the Republic...
But shhhh... this is not what common folks should hear...

And shhhh... there are other governments like the state, county, city, the water board, school board... that may have as much if not more effect on your everyday... and certainly is more responsive to your vote and input than the federal government.

We pay attention to the Knicks, when we probably would have a richer life supporting the local rec league!

holfresh wrote:

arkrud wrote:

holfresh wrote:

arkrud wrote:

martin wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:I asked this a few pages back, but genuinely interested in hearing from folks who are voting for Trump...

What do you make of Pence?

I've read most of this thread but have undoubtedly missed some things here and there. I've yet to hear some very concrete reason why folks are voting FOR Trump/Pence. I've heard why people are not voting for Hilary, but not FOR Trump outside of that tingly feeling guns and BRIGGS keep referring to.

I am not voting for Trump but spoke with a lot of people who will.
They just fed up with current political establishment and want CHANGE.
They just want to shake the tree.
Was it the same for some folks when they were voting for Obama?
The change may not come (and most likely will not same as with Obama) but people want it badly and want to feel as they can make an impact. They are tired to be called bigots, racist, and such just for talking their mind.
Who planting the wind will harvest the storm.

The want change but won't vote out their congressmen...The informed would know the real problem in Washington is Congress..It's easy to get a presidential candidate to implement a mandate...

This true... but what President can really do?
Constitution and Law are the real power of the Republic...
But shhhh... this is not what common folks should hear...

A president more or less directs foreign policy..Congress has the most say in domestic policy..It's curious that congress approval rating is in single digits or close to it while the president is @ 50+..

The current congress is totally useless..Corporste America owns them..Yet people think changing the President is real change...I hope by next election someone push the idea that nationally we should vote out our congressmen..

Re: foreign policy — Congress has the sole constitutional power to declare war, yet they haven't declared a war since World War II... yet we still talk about the Korean "War", the Vietnam "War", Iraq "War" 1 & 2...

They have abdicated their responsibility and given more power to the executive for political expediency... or maybe they got used to the buck stopping at the White House instead of their desks. More time to beg for money.

holfresh wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

holfresh wrote:

arkrud wrote:

holfresh wrote:

arkrud wrote:

martin wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:I asked this a few pages back, but genuinely interested in hearing from folks who are voting for Trump...

What do you make of Pence?

I've read most of this thread but have undoubtedly missed some things here and there. I've yet to hear some very concrete reason why folks are voting FOR Trump/Pence. I've heard why people are not voting for Hilary, but not FOR Trump outside of that tingly feeling guns and BRIGGS keep referring to.

I am not voting for Trump but spoke with a lot of people who will.
They just fed up with current political establishment and want CHANGE.
They just want to shake the tree.
Was it the same for some folks when they were voting for Obama?
The change may not come (and most likely will not same as with Obama) but people want it badly and want to feel as they can make an impact. They are tired to be called bigots, racist, and such just for talking their mind.
Who planting the wind will harvest the storm.

The want change but won't vote out their congressmen...The informed would know the real problem in Washington is Congress..It's easy to get a presidential candidate to implement a mandate...

This true... but what President can really do?
Constitution and Law are the real power of the Republic...
But shhhh... this is not what common folks should hear...

A president more or less directs foreign policy..Congress has the most say in domestic policy..It's curious that congress approval rating is in single digits or close to it while the president is @ 50+..

The current congress is totally useless..Corporste America owns them..Yet people think changing the President is real change...I hope by next election someone push the idea that nationally we should vote out our congressmen..

Re: foreign policy — Congress has the sole constitutional power to declare war, yet they haven't declared a war since World War II... yet we still talk about the Korean "War", the Vietnam "War", Iraq "War" 1 & 2...

They have abdicated their responsibility and given more power to the executive for political expediency... or maybe they got used to the buck stopping at the White House instead of their desks. More time to beg for money.

Yeah but the President can launch a nuclear weapon without the approval of Congress..Think about that for a moment as you ponder Dr. Jill..

...yes, as I ponder Dr. Jill from the cheap seats in the solidly blue Empire State.

holfresh wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

holfresh wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

holfresh wrote:

arkrud wrote:

holfresh wrote:

arkrud wrote:

martin wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:I asked this a few pages back, but genuinely interested in hearing from folks who are voting for Trump...

What do you make of Pence?

I've read most of this thread but have undoubtedly missed some things here and there. I've yet to hear some very concrete reason why folks are voting FOR Trump/Pence. I've heard why people are not voting for Hilary, but not FOR Trump outside of that tingly feeling guns and BRIGGS keep referring to.

I am not voting for Trump but spoke with a lot of people who will.
They just fed up with current political establishment and want CHANGE.
They just want to shake the tree.
Was it the same for some folks when they were voting for Obama?
The change may not come (and most likely will not same as with Obama) but people want it badly and want to feel as they can make an impact. They are tired to be called bigots, racist, and such just for talking their mind.
Who planting the wind will harvest the storm.

The want change but won't vote out their congressmen...The informed would know the real problem in Washington is Congress..It's easy to get a presidential candidate to implement a mandate...

This true... but what President can really do?
Constitution and Law are the real power of the Republic...
But shhhh... this is not what common folks should hear...

A president more or less directs foreign policy..Congress has the most say in domestic policy..It's curious that congress approval rating is in single digits or close to it while the president is @ 50+..

The current congress is totally useless..Corporste America owns them..Yet people think changing the President is real change...I hope by next election someone push the idea that nationally we should vote out our congressmen..

Re: foreign policy — Congress has the sole constitutional power to declare war, yet they haven't declared a war since World War II... yet we still talk about the Korean "War", the Vietnam "War", Iraq "War" 1 & 2...

They have abdicated their responsibility and given more power to the executive for political expediency... or maybe they got used to the buck stopping at the White House instead of their desks. More time to beg for money.

Yeah but the President can launch a nuclear weapon without the approval of Congress..Think about that for a moment as you ponder Dr. Jill..

...yes, as I ponder Dr. Jill from the cheap seats in the solidly blue Empire State.

And Dr. Jill ain't even about droppin' nukes, baby! Total nuclear disarmament is the prescription!