GustavBahler wrote:fishmike wrote:GustavBahler wrote:fishmike wrote:Rookie wrote:GustavBahler wrote:fishmike wrote:this thread and these narratives suck. Randle destroyed NBA all defensive guy Mobley and Mitch practically won the Cle series himself. Those two have been terrible in the Heat series. Celtics core have been together 6 years. Phili has never made it past the 2nd round in the Embiid era. Most people here thought the Knicks were a play in team this year. Now its "move on from Randle and Mitch cause they arent winning us a title"
We have a flawed roster with flawed players. When its not going well it's gonna look bad. Pretty wild change in attitude since the Cle series from the fan base. I get it. As far as the players and who stays/goes I trust the FO to make the right moves. Everyone gets on Randle for what he doesnt do. I get it... but it's what he does do that puts him in that position. 25/10 guys who also pass the ball and never miss games are hard to replace. Its not "enabling" its working with what we have.
Nothing to do with owning a Randle jersey. 
Its not so much Randle, but the role he has on the team. I dont believe its hyperbole to state that Randle historically has not been a clutch player. Does not play well in the 4th. Has not been a good playoff performer. Bad would be an accurate decription.
If Jules was 22-23, sure give him time to figure things out. But Randle has been playing for almost a decade now. Almost 30.
I believe the crux of the problem is Randle's role in the offense. You cant have a second option who is as unreliable as Randle has been. Not if the Knicks want to contend.
As its been said. When Jules was talking about the team not wanting it enough. He was really talking about just himself. Randle is strong but not mentally tough. You have as much riding as the Knicks do, on Randle not folding when it matters. I think you're setting yourself up for disappointment.
The Knicks cant contend on his gaudy stats alone. Its also about when he fills up a stat sheet.
If Randle stays it better be with another star ahead of him as a scoring option. Enough of a sample size to believe its necessary.
As for Mitch, if he stays, Brunson needs to spend part of the offseason working on a two man game. Might be the worst chemistry between a starting PG and Center. They need to put in the time to make it work.
And practice those fing free throws.
Are you sure that he is self aware enough to be talking about himself here? He could just as well be deflecting blame to the rest of the team. He could also hold the opinion that other than himself, there isn't enough talent on the team and he wouldn't be completely wrong. The Knicks need to keep making the playoffs and Randle gets us there. He might be a head case, but he is our head case. I don't see any drastic changes on the horizon. I just hope exit interviews aren't - 'sorry Julius, we will surround you with better talent next year.'
100% that comment was a knock on the centers. I am not committed to Randle any more than any other players.Basically I just keep hearing Randle isnt a good first or second option and we have kinda known that for years and have been trying improve that. Brunson has helped. We still have more needs. 5th seed team.
Lets not rewrite history. I was saying it early in the season. Half the board completely lost it. Some were so triggered that they are unable to carry on a rational conversation. So no, we didnt all kind of knew.
As for Randle's self awareness. I agree that he doesnt realize that he is speaking about himself. Which makes it all the sadder.
people wanted to give up picks to get rid of him which was bat**** crazy. The people (like me) were never arguing to keep him as our #1, just to keep him. People think Thibs plays him and enables him because of some weird **** and its so silly. Randle does things nobody else does for us. I get fans dont like his energy and his playoff scoring has been trash but it doesnt change the obvious. The FO isnt stupid either. They arent going to have an emotional reaction to a guy having a mediocre or poor post season to what they do the other 80 games (and this is a guy who plays 80 games). They will upgrade Randle when they can.
Another thing people need to grasp is 3 years is relatively early if you are actually building something. We have seen a lot of internal improvement/development. Randle himself has made adjustments. Sucks if the season ends on a note like this but that shouldnt rewrite history either. This year Randle passed more, deferred to Brunson, changed his shot profile. When his problems overshadow that stuff he will be gone. Until then he's an important cog. Knicks were the 5th seed. Where do you think we finish with Randle's 25/10 and physical play in the paint?
You're right there were some crazy trade ideas. My early season trade idea was moving him when he was closer to his 2020 game. Not a fire sale.
But thats not what I was talking about. I got a lot of pushback just for suggesting that Randle wasnt a reliable first or second option.
Randle stays, Randle is traded. We still need a player who lives for the postseason. Like Brunson.
First or second option on what type of a team?
He was just a first/second option on a team that got 5th seed and win a round in playoffs.
So facts say you were wrong.
Is he a first or second option on a chip team? Who on here has said that?
And who, that is available is?
Probably only 15-20 players you can say that of.
Randle argument has ALWAYS been about fans ignoring his production and cost.
A cost which allows us to bring in better players and pieces.
Fans are quick to say get rid of him and focus on the slow mo breakdowns of him taking 10 seconds off during one of his 40 minute games. Recently after second ankle sprain.
They ignore the difficulty of posting 25/10, physicality he provides, becoming an All Star and being named all NBA.
Randle does not make good decisions when double teamed or dribbling with his back to the basket.
Randle takes too many three.
Randle has bad body language when struggling.
Randle often has a resting bitch face.
Randle needs lots more playoff experience and seems to feel pressure in tough situations.
Randle is far from being my favorite player.
But will defend his cost and worth until someone gives me a viable trade option that will not strap the cap or steal our assets.
But my side has also been that he has been our best player since he has been here and we have made it to the playoffs two years because of him.
He has shown, with JB, that he is able to bow down to a better player.
He draws double teams and is a willing passer.
Bring in a true elite player, some more shooting and Randle can definitely be part of a chip team.
'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
5/12/2023 10:15 PM