Knixkik wrote:

SergioNYK wrote:I give this offseason a B.

I wanted to address the PG position and increase the overall talent on the team and I think we did to a certain degree.

I don't view Kemba as the long term answer at PG. He's more of a stop gap. I really wanted once and for all to have that position locked up for years to come but Kemba is a lot better than Elfrid Payton (who isn't? ). To be fair, there really wasn't a legit chance to address this position. I'm not a fan of Lonzo and I much rather have Rose at the half the price of Lowry. I was hoping for that Sexton trade but maybe Cleveland wanted too much in return. But for $18M/2 years, Kemba is a good gamble. Let's hope that knee holds up!

Not super excited about Fournier but I understand what he brings and how he's expected to help. He's just not someone who excites you, which I would expect for $78M. Guess $78M isn't worth what it used to!

I'm fine bringing back Rose, Noel and Burks. No problems at all with their contracts either. All were fair and are tradeable. Maybe I would have preferred to bring back Bullock over Burks for the perimeter defense but it's not that big of a deal.

I'm fine with the Draft picks for now. Sorry for Knox ruined Summer League for me and I can never trust what I see at those games. Hopefully Grimes, McBride and Sims develop and can help this season and beyond.

Kemba could have it locked up for the next 3-4 years and with IQ and McBride you have 2 long term possibilities on the roster to develop. There’s a chance the position is set for the next 10 years.

No roster in the NBA stays the same for more than 3 yrs, unless they're are a dynasty.

This is going to be a 2 yr run at best, and that's if we win 50 games this season and a trip into the 2nd round. Even at that point your always going to look to get better

EwingsGlass wrote:

martin wrote:

EwingsGlass wrote:

martin wrote:Don't know if this was updated with the Boston 2nd round picks coming our way via Fournier Sign and Trade

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/TommyBeer/status/1427661915166228483

It includes the new picks. Not a fan of this move.

The Charlotte 2nd in 2022 is worthless.

So, we are getting one 2nd round pick but giving our division rival a 17.1MM TPE rather than letting that salary cap loss expire on them. Strategically, this would have hurt the Celtics. The ability to exceed the salary cap is a strategic benefit.

Much of the benefit of taking Fournier from the Celtics was that it is a net loss to them -- they lose both the player and the salary cap that came with the player -- we have now subsidized that loss to the Celtics by giving them the right to acquire players with that exception -- exceeding the salary cap.

https://hoopshype.com/salaries/players/

So, when a player in the 17mm range becomes available before the trade deadline, Celts could potentially add that player without giving much else up. Maybe further draft consideration. I could see Steven Adams ending up on the Celtics in the short term. In my imaginary scenario, would the Knicks pass on a 2023 2nd rounder (and fifth pick in that draft) to keep Adams (or something like him) off the Celtics?

Doesn't make a lot of sense unless there is some other politics involved.

If it ends up being Adams, my guess is that there was a give/take to the Walker buyout.

Thanks. So it's the CHA 2022 2nd round protected 31-55 and which is the other pick?

I think you are right about this being strange. I don't get it either

The Taj restructure doesn’t make a lot of sense either. Can’t see Taj getting 5mm anywhere else. It’s a relatively harmless overpay, but in the off chance they needed help at the trade deadline, they just gave up a key bargaining chip for a guy who was unsigned to start the year last year.

I like Taj but I think giving him a $2.6mm contract was reasonable. Don’t really understand the regrade against our interest.

It’s like someone in the FO woke up and decided to screw up previously made decisions that were already done correctly.

If we get burned on these, it will be near the trade deadline where Boston makes a trade for a player to compete with us at the deadline and where another team that didn’t burn their cap exceptions signs a waiver player that could help us.

Alternatively, we bought a second round pick for $110k of our actual cost and we rewarded a player that played well for us.

SergioNYK wrote:I give this offseason a B.

I wanted to address the PG position and increase the overall talent on the team and I think we did to a certain degree.

I don't view Kemba as the long term answer at PG. He's more of a stop gap. I really wanted once and for all to have that position locked up for years to come but Kemba is a lot better than Elfrid Payton (who isn't? ). To be fair, there really wasn't a legit chance to address this position. I'm not a fan of Lonzo and I much rather have Rose at the half the price of Lowry. I was hoping for that Sexton trade but maybe Cleveland wanted too much in return. But for $18M/2 years, Kemba is a good gamble. Let's hope that knee holds up!

Not super excited about Fournier but I understand what he brings and how he's expected to help. He's just not someone who excites you, which I would expect for $78M. Guess $78M isn't worth what it used to!

I'm fine bringing back Rose, Noel and Burks. No problems at all with their contracts either. All were fair and are tradeable. Maybe I would have preferred to bring back Bullock over Burks for the perimeter defense but it's not that big of a deal.

I'm fine with the Draft picks for now. Sorry for Knox ruined Summer League for me and I can never trust what I see at those games. Hopefully Grimes, McBride and Sims develop and can help this season and beyond.

I agree with your assessment. The moves that the Knicks made were good, but not great. But then there were no better alternatives, short of signing Kawhi, and I suppose teams realized right away that he was staying with the Clips. The other option was to stand pat and keep open cap space for next summer or a blockbuster trade for a superstar during the season, and then who knows what that would have brought: maybe a lot, maybe nothing.

BigDaddyG wrote:

EwingsGlass wrote:

martin wrote:

EwingsGlass wrote:

martin wrote:Don't know if this was updated with the Boston 2nd round picks coming our way via Fournier Sign and Trade

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/TommyBeer/status/1427661915166228483

It includes the new picks. Not a fan of this move.

The Charlotte 2nd in 2022 is worthless.

So, we are getting one 2nd round pick but giving our division rival a 17.1MM TPE rather than letting that salary cap loss expire on them. Strategically, this would have hurt the Celtics. The ability to exceed the salary cap is a strategic benefit.

Much of the benefit of taking Fournier from the Celtics was that it is a net loss to them -- they lose both the player and the salary cap that came with the player -- we have now subsidized that loss to the Celtics by giving them the right to acquire players with that exception -- exceeding the salary cap.

https://hoopshype.com/salaries/players/

So, when a player in the 17mm range becomes available before the trade deadline, Celts could potentially add that player without giving much else up. Maybe further draft consideration. I could see Steven Adams ending up on the Celtics in the short term. In my imaginary scenario, would the Knicks pass on a 2023 2nd rounder (and fifth pick in that draft) to keep Adams (or something like him) off the Celtics?

Doesn't make a lot of sense unless there is some other politics involved.

If it ends up being Adams, my guess is that there was a give/take to the Walker buyout.

Thanks. So it's the CHA 2022 2nd round protected 31-55 and which is the other pick?

I think you are right about this being strange. I don't get it either

The Taj restructure doesn’t make a lot of sense either. Can’t see Taj getting 5mm anywhere else. It’s a relatively harmless overpay, but in the off chance they needed help at the trade deadline, they just gave up a key bargaining chip for a guy who was unsigned to start the year last year.

I like Taj but I think giving him a $2.6mm contract was reasonable. Don’t really understand the regrade against our interest.

It’s like someone in the FO woke up and decided to screw up previously made decisions that were already done correctly.

If we get burned on these, it will be near the trade deadline where Boston makes a trade for a player to compete with us at the deadline and where another team that didn’t burn their cap exceptions signs a waiver player that could help us.

Alternatively, we bought a second round pick for $110k of our actual cost and we rewarded a player that played well for us.

Do we know if there's a team option? Also, sometimes you need salaries of differing sizes to make trades work. The Knicks are at a point with the cap that any new additions this season will be through trade, medical exemption, or waiver wire. Brock knows what he's doing.

This is a key point - Taj salary amount = another contract available to make a bigger trade work.

Knicks (Allergies) are not dumb —- they must have known they had no other available use for these $ and decide 1) to reward Ram and 2) to create another contract value as potential pice to make $ work in trade

Jmpasq wrote:Knicks say they acquired Evan Fournier from Boston in sign and trade that included NYK getting two future second round picks. NYK says they sent BOS cash considerations. Wow thats cool. Get another pick for nothing

2 picks actually. But this appears to be this FO goal for every player transaction or trade. Gotta love this strategy. It takes balls to see a player you want, but willing to trade down and banking on that player to still be there. Reminds me of my current preparation for Fantasy Football draft strategies.

SergioNYK wrote:I give this offseason a B.

I wanted to address the PG position and increase the overall talent on the team and I think we did to a certain degree.

I don't view Kemba as the long term answer at PG. He's more of a stop gap. I really wanted once and for all to have that position locked up for years to come but Kemba is a lot better than Elfrid Payton (who isn't? ). To be fair, there really wasn't a legit chance to address this position. I'm not a fan of Lonzo and I much rather have Rose at the half the price of Lowry. I was hoping for that Sexton trade but maybe Cleveland wanted too much in return. But for $18M/2 years, Kemba is a good gamble. Let's hope that knee holds up!

Not super excited about Fournier but I understand what he brings and how he's expected to help. He's just not someone who excites you, which I would expect for $78M. Guess $78M isn't worth what it used to!

I'm fine bringing back Rose, Noel and Burks. No problems at all with their contracts either. All were fair and are tradeable. Maybe I would have preferred to bring back Bullock over Burks for the perimeter defense but it's not that big of a deal.

I'm fine with the Draft picks for now. Sorry for Knox ruined Summer League for me and I can never trust what I see at those games. Hopefully Grimes, McBride and Sims develop and can help this season and beyond.

Agree. Solid B overall

blkexec wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:Knicks say they acquired Evan Fournier from Boston in sign and trade that included NYK getting two future second round picks. NYK says they sent BOS cash considerations. Wow thats cool. Get another pick for nothing

2 picks actually. But this appears to be this FO goal for every player transaction or trade. Gotta love this strategy. It takes balls to see a player you want, but willing to trade down and banking on that player to still be there. Reminds me of my current preparation for Fantasy Football draft strategies.

It’s a low risk, medium reward strategy. Just keep accumulating picks even if they aren’t sexy high draft picks. We can develop mid-late firsts and even second rd picks into good or at least effective players

gradyandrew wrote:

SergioNYK wrote:1. I give this offseason a B.

I wanted to address the PG position and increase the overall talent on the team and I think we did 2. to a certain degree.

I don't view Kemba as the long term answer at PG. He's more of a stop gap. I really wanted once and for all to have that position locked up for years to come but Kemba is a lot better than Elfrid Payton (who isn't? ). To be fair, there really wasn't a legit chance to address this position. 3. I'm not a fan of Lonzo and I much rather have Rose at the half the price of Lowry. I was hoping for that Sexton trade but maybe Cleveland wanted too much in return. But for $18M/2 years, Kemba is a good gamble. Let's hope that knee holds up!

4.Not super excited about Fournier but I understand what he brings and how he's expected to help. He's just not someone who excites you, which I would expect for $78M. Guess $78M isn't worth what it used to!

I'm fine bringing back Rose, Noel and Burks. No problems at all with their contracts either. All were fair and are tradeable. Maybe I would have preferred to bring back Bullock over Burks for the 5. perimeter defense but it's not that big of a deal.

6. I'm fine with the Draft picks for now. Sorry for Knox ruined Summer League for me and I can never trust what I see at those games. Hopefully Grimes, McBride and Sims develop and can help this season and beyond.

1. It seems like you have Knicks fan PTSD. This was a great offseason， I don't really see how it could have gone better. If not an A+,then definitely an A

2. To what degree? Kemba is much closer to Kyrie and Lillard than to Lonzo， Graham， and Dinwiddie. Even if the Knicks just used their cap space to absorb his deal， I think the upgrade would have been worth it. It would have cost the Knicks being able to resign Burks and Noel. The financials of the deal make it a home run. Fit，history， and weakening the Celtics makes it a grand slam.
With Rose Knicks have the best bench PG in the league as well. I don't really see a better PG tandem in the league.

3. I feel like the injury concerns are overblown. Everyone gets injured. Kemba came back last season and by May was back in All Star form. Boston's trade was about culture，fit， and money. OKC knew the buyout deal was the best on the table. They are happy to get him off the roster so Giddy and SGA can get more minutes.

4. Yoda voice， "You will be. You will be." EF was not the best shooting (Robinson)， passing (DeRozan) or defensive (Caruso/ PJ) wing available this offseason. You can find plenty of stats where he's merely above average. But if you look at the sum of his game，he's a smidgen below Middleton and PG， two other guys whose competency across the board elevates them to All Star status. Defensively weaker than those 2 but like Kemba in CHA， Fournier has been a key component of some very good defensive teams. The fact that Kemba and Fournier already have half a season together is what gives this offseason that +.

For a better breakdown on the two，thestrick.land has some great articles.

5. I don't think Reggie Bullock's defense has ever been rated higher than now. Somehow he was the key to a top 5 defense and now that he's gone it's about to fall apart? It seems like a stretch to get worried about it， more PTSD.

6. Why just fine? Trading out opened up the money for Kemba and we still get a future pick. We got 2 marksman 3 and D guys and a high upside young big. This team is stacked.

We've had our heads bitten a lot of times in the past，so I get it. But seriously， Knicks are shooting for the one seed， don't be surprised if they get it.

This was a good offseason overall. The draft picks are fine, the FA signings are fine and we resigned players we needed.

A great offseason would be the Knicks getting Lillard for a couple draft picks or 2-3 superstar players deciding to come here to make a superteam. For once, it would be nice to see the Knicks have one of those summers instead of the bowlsh t California or the Heat or the Nets, teams nobody cares about outside of the west coast enjoying that

gradyandrew wrote:
5. I don't think Reggie Bullock's defense has ever been rated higher than now. Somehow he was the key to a top 5 defense and now that he's gone it's about to fall apart? It seems like a stretch to get worried about it， more PTSD.