This time even tho Fish is young, he's got the full support of the man on top. Phil has way more clout and is more convincing than anyone Melo has dealt with. What can Melo say to Phil really? Dude has 2 hands full of rings. I mean there's not another man alive who could talk to Melo and basically say, "STFU KID. You don't know jack about winning". This is why Melo will be more amenable to what is being asked of him this time. PLUS the fact that it's more about what the REST of the team does more so than Melo. Melo is not the problem. It's having a system for the rest of the players to excel in. Hopefully the vets will do as well as the Kid Knicks have done so far.

toad wrote:You can't build around Melo and his ego. This is not going to turn out well. We can only hope there's a trade down the line.

Or we can hope that you start rooting for another team.

Bonn1997 wrote:

nixluva wrote:You guys are nuts if you think Phil and Fish aren't PERFECTLY equipped to handle a player like Melo after dealing with Kobe or MJ. Melo is not going to be a problem for them. One thing that also gives hope is how Melo played during the Olympics. After fighting MDA all season, he goes and does EXACTLY what MDA was asking him to do, in being more of a catch and shoot player and staying within the flow of the offense. There's no reason why we can't expect Melo to play in this system given the way it's setup for players with his skills already.

Melo will only have to buy in to the idea that he will have to do less in order for his team to do more. I think once he sees the team winning playing that way, he won't be a problem. We saw that for a while when the team was winning 2 years ago. He won't be a problem.

Is our rookie coach better equipped to deal with him than MDA was?

well if you listen to the way most are talking you would think Phil is coaching..

Papabear wrote:

tkf wrote:

dk7th wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nyk4ever wrote:

fishmike wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

dk7th wrote:7 million over a five year period. melo is a saint.

Yeah we should make a statue. Even though im a diehard Knick fan but i really respect a guy like Tim Duncan. He is probably one of the best players i have ever seen besides jordan/lebron and the guy continues to take less. No wonder San Antonio wins for 20 years

Go look up his salary history. Taking less didn't happen until he was 35

dont bother fish, you and i have said this multiple times each and people just ignore it. yeah, duncan took less, only after he made 200million..

you're misrepresenting reality, aka lying.

duncan had won three titles and when he was 26 he earned 12 million dollars the year he won his first of three finals mvps.

again, by the time he earned 22 million in a season he had already won 3 titles and had earned 3 finals mvps. he led his teams to those titles.

meantime your defense of this greedy, me-first never was is truly moronic and pathetic.

what has carmelo done to actually earn the right to receive almost the entire maximum?

NOTHING

Ask Phil Jackson. He wouldn't entertain a sign and trade with the bulls and gave Melo the contract that he signed.

sorry but this is all on melo, unconscionable melo.

all of it.

every last unconscionable cent.

you can try to deflect all you want-- it was dolan, it was walsh, it was jackson-- but melo is the common denominator and has once again taken more than he has ever deserved and hurts the team he plays for in doing so.

it's unconscionable.

just an awful awful situation for the knicks.

I agree, a sad day in NY sports....

Papabear Says

What do you mean? It is a great day for NY Sports. Man stop complaining the season hasen't even started yet. If Phil thought he could win without Melo he would have. Melo is the best player on the team and deserves the Max. He did give a little back. Look there is nothing that Melo could do on this team to make you happy except leaving and he ain't doing that just relax and put your faith in Phil Jackson.

I don't place faith blindly.. I like phil the coach.. Phil the GM has a lot to prove.. so far this signing was a mistake....

tkf wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

nixluva wrote:You guys are nuts if you think Phil and Fish aren't PERFECTLY equipped to handle a player like Melo after dealing with Kobe or MJ. Melo is not going to be a problem for them. One thing that also gives hope is how Melo played during the Olympics. After fighting MDA all season, he goes and does EXACTLY what MDA was asking him to do, in being more of a catch and shoot player and staying within the flow of the offense. There's no reason why we can't expect Melo to play in this system given the way it's setup for players with his skills already.

Melo will only have to buy in to the idea that he will have to do less in order for his team to do more. I think once he sees the team winning playing that way, he won't be a problem. We saw that for a while when the team was winning 2 years ago. He won't be a problem.

Is our rookie coach better equipped to deal with him than MDA was?

well if you listen to the way most are talking you would think Phil is coaching..

mreinman wrote:

dk7th wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

tkf wrote:

dk7th wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nyk4ever wrote:

fishmike wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

dk7th wrote:7 million over a five year period. melo is a saint.

Yeah we should make a statue. Even though im a diehard Knick fan but i really respect a guy like Tim Duncan. He is probably one of the best players i have ever seen besides jordan/lebron and the guy continues to take less. No wonder San Antonio wins for 20 years

Go look up his salary history. Taking less didn't happen until he was 35

dont bother fish, you and i have said this multiple times each and people just ignore it. yeah, duncan took less, only after he made 200million..

you're misrepresenting reality, aka lying.

duncan had won three titles and when he was 26 he earned 12 million dollars the year he won his first of three finals mvps.

again, by the time he earned 22 million in a season he had already won 3 titles and had earned 3 finals mvps. he led his teams to those titles.

meantime your defense of this greedy, me-first never was is truly moronic and pathetic.

what has carmelo done to actually earn the right to receive almost the entire maximum?

NOTHING

Ask Phil Jackson. He wouldn't entertain a sign and trade with the bulls and gave Melo the contract that he signed.

sorry but this is all on melo, unconscionable melo.

all of it.

every last unconscionable cent.

you can try to deflect all you want-- it was dolan, it was walsh, it was jackson-- but melo is the common denominator and has once again taken more than he has ever deserved and hurts the team he plays for in doing so.

it's unconscionable.

just an awful awful situation for the knicks.

I agree, a sad day in NY sports....

Interesting. I don't recall you guys ranting about Amare "unconscionable" when he opted in this past month. How come Amare's move was not unconscionable? Amare has to know that he is not worth $25 mil per season.....why did he not opt out and and restructure his contract to do the honorable thing like Tim Duncan would have....in order to free up space THIS YEAR.

We all see how it works. You guys are obsessed with Melo....when basically 90% of the NBA is negotiating as high of a contract as they can get......and there are other guys playing for the Knicks, taking up significant cap space and NOT contributing on any consistent type of level....who for some reason do not draw any reason/blame from you.

Makes you really look silly.

i am not happy about stoudemire but he knew he was dead man walking-- and in fact i feel for the guy, since he came here as a free agent, had greater success than melo before coming here, and then was summarily shoved aside by the arrival of melo, who was dolan's signature move. his attitude must have been that, knowing he would be marginalized if not outright unwanted, that he was not going to be the good soldier and take a financial hit for a team that pretty much doesn't want him around. isn't that what you and 99% of the fan base thinking? this is the price of doing business as a franchise in disarray and chaos.

you might as well have asked all the dead men walking players during walsh's first two years to have done the same, including stephon dinglebury.

well did you? and did you begrudge them getting paid in full?

hypocrites will have a hard time contending with what i just laid out in plain english and logically. you're more than welcome to give it a try.

Yeah - I feel for Amare too and his 100 million dollar heist.

Certainly a fair and balanced post and non hypocritical.

I seem to remember Amare going down hill before Melo got here.

Don't bother the man with facts; he won't respond to it.

jrodmc wrote:+11 factorial

Ouch.

You will find foosballknick, that facts do not matter in this Melohate debate.

FACT: Despite 4-5 years out of the playoffs, we were a +.500 team on the way to a chip, playing ball the right way. The future was brighter than a Nate Robinson Sprite commerical, or Gallo's next stint on the IR, or the Mayor's blank stare, or Moz's next posterization.
FACT: Amare's breakdown can be tied directly to Melo's lack of a real gameface, that stupid headband, and that insulting WB tat. Amare was on his way to being the next Bill Russell/Shaq combo before the entrance of the Melo-ignancy. Those knees were platinum before HE STUPIDLY MANAGED TO MAKE DOLAN ALLOW HIM TO FORCE HIS WAY HERE.
FACT: Our subsequent making of the playoffs and then only winning a meaningless division title, and getting into the second round for the first time in a decade are obviously offset by the past mistreatment of Mardy Collins. Melo Bad Karma in spades. It took four years, but see? We finally didn't make the playoffs.

people are wondering why i am LOL'ing in the office!

jrodmc wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

tkf wrote:I don't place faith blindly.. I like phil the coach.. Phil the GM has a lot to prove.. so far this signing was a mistake....

based on what was this signing a mistake?

Based on the fact that Melo is being paid now, in real US dollars, instead of WWII ration stamps, because as we saw unfold, the entire league has realized the current NBA game passed Melobullyball by before he was born.

you are a kindred spirit.

dk7th wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

dk7th wrote:
i am not happy about stoudemire but he knew he was dead man walking-- and in fact i feel for the guy, since he came here as a free agent, had greater success than melo before coming here, and then was summarily shoved aside by the arrival of melo, who was dolan's signature move. his attitude must have been that, knowing he would be marginalized if not outright unwanted, that he was not going to be the good soldier and take a financial hit for a team that pretty much doesn't want him around. isn't that what you and 99% of the fan base thinking? this is the price of doing business as a franchise in disarray and chaos.

you might as well have asked all the dead men walking players during walsh's first two years to have done the same, including stephon dinglebury.

well did you? and did you begrudge them getting paid in full?

hypocrites will have a hard time contending with what i just laid out in plain english and logically. you're more than welcome to give it a try.

Again - you make it pretty difficult to take anything you post seriously.

Fact - Amare was damaged goods even before he signed here as a Free Agent. Amare was breaking down even before Melo was acquired.

Fact - Amare was brought in as a Free Agent at a great cost to the Knicks who traded multiple first round picks and gave away players in order to sign Amare

Fact - Amare would have been "shoved aside" had the Knicks original plan played out.......to sign Amare in order to lure LBJ.

Fact - I've never begrudged anyone getting paid in full.....ever.

Fact - you seem to have a problem with athletes getting paid as evidenced by your constant posting on the topic even calculating how much Melo makes per minute.

Fact - the "Dead Men Walking" as you indicate in your post have nothing to do with anything being discussed (Amare restructuring & Melo taking less)......you are only bringing those variable into your post as a misdirecting statement because you really have nothing valid to offer in this conversation except for your subjective (and seemingly tainted) opinion.

Fact - by making the statement "hypocrites will have a hard time contending ......" you are name calling using a passive aggressive/indirect technique - you do this often and it is why so few people on this board can stand your posts.

It would be nice if Melo took much less for the team. But it is no different than any other player also taking much less for the team - so let's not make it out to be that one guy is an ogre and everyone else is a saint.

hmmm... let's see....

your first assertion was fact, but i prefer that some facts be put in context, like for instance that the owner had placed a mandate that his team bring in two big names, the priority being lebron james.

with this priority in mind your second assertion is false, laughably so.

as is your third assertion.

your fourth assertion is not a fact it is an accusation masked as an opinion. that said, i begrudge people getting paid in full when they only do half the job required of them when the goal is winning titles.

and yes i do have a problem with athletes getting paid so much that they hurt their own chances at winning. melo is dumb that way, very dumb.

my dead man walking is the heart of the matter vis a vis complaining about stoudemire taking less for the sake of the knicks. that you want to dismiss it makes me question your reading comprehension.

the last fact regarding hypocrisy stands-- as evidenced by your weak sauce response to my post. nothing passive about it.

melo was in a position to do what was best for the knicks, a golden opportunity to redeem himslef and buy some goodwill capital from the fanbase.

he blew it.

tkf wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

nixluva wrote:You guys are nuts if you think Phil and Fish aren't PERFECTLY equipped to handle a player like Melo after dealing with Kobe or MJ. Melo is not going to be a problem for them. One thing that also gives hope is how Melo played during the Olympics. After fighting MDA all season, he goes and does EXACTLY what MDA was asking him to do, in being more of a catch and shoot player and staying within the flow of the offense. There's no reason why we can't expect Melo to play in this system given the way it's setup for players with his skills already.

Melo will only have to buy in to the idea that he will have to do less in order for his team to do more. I think once he sees the team winning playing that way, he won't be a problem. We saw that for a while when the team was winning 2 years ago. He won't be a problem.

Is our rookie coach better equipped to deal with him than MDA was?

Of course he does because he was hand picked by Phil Jackson.

Ah, hand-picked by our rookie GM!

Yes ... who was handpicked by our veteran owner.

who has been a failure so far with this team..

Phil has been a failure based on what? Your extreme minority opinion? He made the most acclaimed trade amongst fans and media for this team in a very long time. He got assets while unloading dead weight, just what everyone has asked for. He also challenged Melo and resigned him at less than max, and we are the only team that pushed for him to sign for less than we could have signed him for. Any other GM of this team would have just offered the max and figured the rest out later. Kerr was the only misfire, but he landed a candidate of equal potential. Phil has been as good as we could have asked for. But again, thats the majority, not you and the other 1% who think Melo isn't worth the MLE in this league lol.

Knixkik wrote:

tkf wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

nixluva wrote:You guys are nuts if you think Phil and Fish aren't PERFECTLY equipped to handle a player like Melo after dealing with Kobe or MJ. Melo is not going to be a problem for them. One thing that also gives hope is how Melo played during the Olympics. After fighting MDA all season, he goes and does EXACTLY what MDA was asking him to do, in being more of a catch and shoot player and staying within the flow of the offense. There's no reason why we can't expect Melo to play in this system given the way it's setup for players with his skills already.

Melo will only have to buy in to the idea that he will have to do less in order for his team to do more. I think once he sees the team winning playing that way, he won't be a problem. We saw that for a while when the team was winning 2 years ago. He won't be a problem.

Is our rookie coach better equipped to deal with him than MDA was?

Of course he does because he was hand picked by Phil Jackson.

Ah, hand-picked by our rookie GM!

Yes ... who was handpicked by our veteran owner.

who has been a failure so far with this team..

Phil has been a failure based on what? Your extreme minority opinion? He made the most acclaimed trade amongst fans and media for this team in a very long time. He got assets while unloading dead weight, just what everyone has asked for. He also challenged Melo and resigned him at less than max, and we are the only team that pushed for him to sign for less than we could have signed him for. Any other GM of this team would have just offered the max and figured the rest out later. Kerr was the only misfire, but he landed a candidate of equal potential. Phil has been as good as we could have asked for. But again, thats the majority, not you and the other 1% who think Melo isn't worth the MLE in this league lol.

I was refering to dolan... and please phil caved he could have gone ahead and given him all the money and it would not have made any difference... caremlo taking a discount here is akin to your mom asking you as a kid to clean your room and you take all the junk and shove it under your bed and say..." Rooms clean".... This was a sham of a discount, and it is just breathtakingly ridiculous that you guys are actually giving props and buying into him Giving a discount... LOL.. I mean really man? really?

Kerr was the only misfire, but he landed a candidate of equal potential. Phil has been as good as we could have asked for. But again, thats the majority, not you and the other 1% who think Melo isn't worth the MLE in this league lol.

do you really think fisher is of equal potential? then I ask why did phil go so hard after kerr, remember kerr was already an exec in this league..

Phil has been averaged and has done what any GM in the league could have.. for 60 mil I expected more, a good GM IMO would have have been pushing for a sign and trade with the bulls... if we just brought phil in to chase and overpay carmelo, I say we wasted 60 mil on phil.. any GM, any could have offered a max to a greedy player who only wants money... and would have easily succeeded...

Listen, I like phil... AS a coach.. if he were coaching the knicks I would feel a bit different.. to me he has a lot to prove as a GM.. and Prez..