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Knick trying to get Udirih

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DurzoBlint
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8/1/2013 8:38 AM

gunsnewing wrote:I am going to admit I don't know much about udrih. It's possible he went unnoticed by me because he played behind Jennings and Ellis. If he really is a ball mover like prigs but better offensively he will help. The kinda guy who you look past the stats and has a positive effect on the team like Prigs. So I would start him with Prigs as his backup for 20mins and then move Felton for a draft pick. Felton might net us a late 1st since PGs are scarse. If Felton continues to start and udrih and prigs get inconsistent minutes than the offense will continue to struggle as it did last yr before Woodson finally played prigioni. Unfortunately I agree there is no way he takes vet min at 31 at the pg position

so now we want to give Felton away and replace him with an (as you admit) unknown or, am I misinterpreting you? I think it would be better to see if we can get him and then evaluate the squad afterwards.

the fact that you can't even have an unrelated thread without some tool here bringing him up make me think that rational minds are few and far between. Bunch of emotionally weak, angst riddled people. I mean, how many times can you argue the same shyt

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Finestrg
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8/1/2013 8:59 AM

callmened wrote:Im sorry...while i admit that priga was a nice surprise i often felt he was limited. His reluctance to shoot made the game 5 vs 4. Plus at his age i dont getvwhy we signed him using over half of our 3mill MLE. I think hes a nice 3rd stringer while udrih is a by far superior player.

Completely agree with that assessment. And no question Beno Udirih is a better player than Prigioni. This guy would be some coup for the vet min. if we can get him.

gunsnewing
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8/1/2013 9:10 AM

There are many reasons in not happy with this team. As I've said in the past the main one is the offense. I don't know whether to blame Felton or Woodson or both. When Felton is in at pg the offense is so predictable because he can only run certain plays and misses open guys and often calls his own number which usually leads to a brick. He has tunnel vision and does not see the floor. These things lead to Melo isos. Woodson rips into prigioni when he tries to create offense instead if dumping the ball to Melo. Same thing happened with Lin. Knicks need a pg to take charge but not at the expense of Shumpert. Maybe adding Bargnani will help. But with Felton at pg we will see the same offensive struggles as last yr IMO. I think Tyson will be stronger and motivated after all the heat he's taken. We should be better on the boards if the bigs are healthier. No more dinosaurs like Rasheed and Camby breaking down.

gunsnewing
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8/1/2013 9:20 AM LAST EDITED: 8/1/2013 9:22 AM

Trade felton for a pick and a hard nose rebounder. Felton is only valuable when his shot is falling. Most of the time it's not

CrushAlot
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8/1/2013 9:30 AM

gunsnewing wrote:There are many reasons in not happy with this team. As I've said in the past the main one is the offense. I don't know whether to blame Felton or Woodson or both. When Felton is in at pg the offense is so predictable because he can only run certain plays and misses open guys and often calls his own number which usually leads to a brick. He has tunnel vision and does not see the floor. These things lead to Melo isos. Woodson rips into prigioni when he tries to create offense instead if dumping the ball to Melo. Same thing happened with Lin. Knicks need a pg to take charge but not at the expense of Shumpert. Maybe adding Bargnani will help. But with Felton at pg we will see the same offensive struggles as last yr IMO. I think Tyson will be stronger and motivated after all the heat he's taken. We should be better on the boards if the bigs are healthier. No more dinosaurs like Rasheed and Camby breaking down.

I honestly don't remember Woodson ripping into Prigs. Are there examples or particular games where this happened?

I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18

gunsnewing
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8/1/2013 9:38 AM

I can't pinpoint what game vs what team but maybe someone else can. I remember Woodson yanking him from the game after making 1 mistake whereas Felton would have 3 consecutive to's or bricks and would remain in the game. The Nyets game comes to mind

yellowboy90
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8/1/2013 9:45 AM

gunsnewing wrote:I can't pinpoint what game vs what team but maybe someone else can. I remember Woodson yanking him from the game after making 1 mistake whereas Felton would have 3 consecutive to's or bricks and would remain in the game. The Nyets game comes to mind

I remember him ripping into Prigs and yanking him but it was more than 1 mistake. Also, Prigs needed it drilled into his head he needs to shoot when open. I think it will make him a better player this year.

CrushAlot
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8/1/2013 9:47 AM

yellowboy90 wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:I can't pinpoint what game vs what team but maybe someone else can. I remember Woodson yanking him from the game after making 1 mistake whereas Felton would have 3 consecutive to's or bricks and would remain in the game. The Nyets game comes to mind
I remember him ripping into Prigs and yanking him but it was more than 1 mistake. Also, Prigs needed it drilled into his head he needs to shoot when open. I think it will make him a better player this year.

Thanks guys.

I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18

CrushAlot
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8/1/2013 9:49 AM

Berman saying Knicks first choice is Udrih, second is Brown. Also said Knicks aren't interested in D.West anymore.

I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18

DurzoBlint
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8/1/2013 9:55 AM LAST EDITED: 8/1/2013 10:04 AM

gunsnewing wrote:I can't pinpoint what game vs what team but maybe someone else can. I remember Woodson yanking him from the game after making 1 mistake whereas Felton would have 3 consecutive to's or bricks and would remain in the game. The Nyets game comes to mind

not going to doubt it happened but, if so, it was a RARE event.

and we have no idea how it would run under Udirih. Felton played well for the most part this season past and, even though the offense did run better with him playing off guard, there is no reason to throw him under the bus.

gunsnewing
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8/1/2013 9:57 AM LAST EDITED: 8/1/2013 10:08 AM

We can argue semantics. The bottom line is the offense doesn't gel with Felton. Felton excelled in Dantonis system. Pushing the ball up the floor with a healthy Amare and the young guys. Same way Lin excelled for Dantoni and was just another guy out there for Woodson. Another guy catering to Melo ISO

gunsnewing
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8/1/2013 10:05 AM

I'd love Rondo but not at the expense of Shumpert. Good PGs are hard to come by. I would take Udrih for now and then bring in a stud as we get closer to 2015

Bonn1997
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8/1/2013 10:08 AM

gunsnewing wrote:We can argue semantics. The bottom line is the offense doesn't gel with Felton. Felton excelled in Dantonis system. Pushing the ball up the floor with a healthy Amare and the young guys. Same way Lin excelled for Dantoni and was just another guy out there for Woodson. Another guy catering to Melo ISO

It gelled better than it did with Bibby or B Davis. The point is you can't just lose Felton without having a replacement PG.

DurzoBlint
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8/1/2013 10:11 AM

Bonn1997 wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:We can argue semantics. The bottom line is the offense doesn't gel with Felton. Felton excelled in Dantonis system. Pushing the ball up the floor with a healthy Amare and the young guys. Same way Lin excelled for Dantoni and was just another guy out there for Woodson. Another guy catering to Melo ISO

It gelled better than it did with Bibby or B Davis. The point is you can't just lose Felton without having a replacement PG.

Which was my entire point. Plus Felton didn't have a terrible season for us. He played well from the off guard spot and showed the benefits of having two capable ball handlers in the back court.

callmened
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8/1/2013 10:30 AM

I think ray is more than adequate. I just worry abt his health. Hes an avg pg who can win u 54 games. Hes just not an elie diff maker

Think QB brad johnson on tb vack in the day

Knicks should be improved: win about 40 games and maybe sneak into the playoffs. Melo, Rose and even Noah will have some nice moments however this team should be about PORZINGUS. the sooner they make him the primary player, the better

martin
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8/1/2013 10:57 AM

gunsnewing wrote:We can argue semantics. The bottom line is the offense doesn't gel with Felton. Felton excelled in Dantonis system. Pushing the ball up the floor with a healthy Amare and the young guys. Same way Lin excelled for Dantoni and was just another guy out there for Woodson. Another guy catering to Melo ISO

you are going to need to dive a little deeper into your arguments. start here:

http://espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/teamstats

http://www.82games.com/1213/12NYK1.HTM

Knicks had the 3rd most efficient offense with Felton playing lots of minutes in the backcourt.

For me, I think Felton is the perfect backup PG on a championship level team. His decision making and shot-making just isn't there. Felton certainly excels in PnR situations but to say he didn't provide enough for the Knicks is barely scratching the surface or completely wrong.

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DurzoBlint
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8/1/2013 11:13 AM

martin wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:We can argue semantics. The bottom line is the offense doesn't gel with Felton. Felton excelled in Dantonis system. Pushing the ball up the floor with a healthy Amare and the young guys. Same way Lin excelled for Dantoni and was just another guy out there for Woodson. Another guy catering to Melo ISO
you are going to need to dive a little deeper into your arguments. start here:
http://espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/teamstats
http://www.82games.com/1213/12NYK1.HTM
Knicks had the 3rd most efficient offense with Felton playing lots of minutes in the backcourt.
For me, I think Felton is the perfect backup PG on a championship level team. His decision making and shot-making just isn't there. Felton certainly excels in PnR situations but to say he didn't provide enough for the Knicks is barely scratching the surface or completely wrong.

He (Guns) said he just wants to go further in the playoffs but, he's focusing on one of last years positives instead of the big albatross negative called Amare. If he was able to live up to his contract (which I concede was always doubtful), then we might have had a better post season the past 3years.

gunsnewing
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8/1/2013 11:20 AM

Bonn1997 wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:We can argue semantics. The bottom line is the offense doesn't gel with Felton. Felton excelled in Dantonis system. Pushing the ball up the floor with a healthy Amare and the young guys. Same way Lin excelled for Dantoni and was just another guy out there for Woodson. Another guy catering to Melo ISO

It gelled better than it did with Bibby or B Davis. The point is you can't just lose Felton without having a replacement PG.

I'm operating under the assumption that we get Udrih

tkf
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8/1/2013 11:34 AM

CrushAlot wrote:
tkf wrote:
Papabear wrote:
tkf wrote:
Papabear wrote:
tkf wrote:
martin wrote:
tkf wrote:why is it taking a lot of convincing to get him here? i thought all free agents would flock here to come play with carmelo? or so I was told...
dude, if you got nothing to add, please move on.
come on martin.. loosen up a bit, jeez.... no time for a little poking? I mean how many times have people regurgitated this myth that players will flock here to play with carmelo.. just some fun poking and jabbing.. no harm intended... but I will move on.....
no problem....

Papabear Says
TKF that's all you do and you are starting to rub people the wrong way because we know what you are about.
I will tell you what I'm about.. I am consistent and I don't flip flop.... I make my point and I stick by it and will defend it..
unlike you and your woe is me rant about the knicks... what will it be tomorrow papabear? will it be the good bear? or bad bear? or unhappy bear?
This coming from a guy who refers to himself in 3rd person...

Papabear Says
TKF Let's be real!I believe you are a Troll. A big time Troll What will it be tomorrow for me?? I really don't know but I surely won't be having a hate day every day like you. I can separate being upset from the raging hate you bring to this forum everyday with nothing positive to say. Now let me get back to the topic! Udirih will be a great pickup if we can get him. I'm not a happy camper but after hearing about some comments Melo is starting to make is in the honest a positive direction. We really won't know what we have until training camp and most of all what will Amare bring.With Udirih on the team that brings us another experienced point guard who can score and make smart decisions.
Troll? lol.. so this is you waving the white flag.. you have nothing to say really, so throw out the "TKF=Troll" how nice... truth is man.. you are confused.. "homer bear" is having a conflict with "reality bear".. The problem is, "papabear" doesn't know how to deal with conflicting sides.. so you get threads like the one you made, and anyone who doesn't believe what "Homerbear" believes in, they are haters and trolls... while papabear can sit back and flip flop all day long while sitting inside his glass house with his box full of stones...
as far as udrih goes, he is a serviceable player, certainly would take him over prigs.... yet this is the knicks, we don't even have enough money to entice this guy to come here to NY, without having to beg.. now we come to this... NY has to beg marginal vets to come play for us... jeeeeezus...
Knicks went into free agency with 3.1 mil and vet minis to offer. Not sure where the 'this is the Knicks we don't even have enough money to entice this guy to here without begging comes from'. You follow this stuff enough to understand the situation the Knicks were in at the start of the offseason. Fussing about it sounds like you were ignorant of the situation.

if we needed to upgrade PG why are we out giving artest money? bringing back prigs for more money? how many PG's do we need? it seems as if NY has no clue of what they are doing, so when the time comes to take aim at a player that may be an upgrade at needed position, they never seem to have the money.... I am not ignorant of the situation at all, this just seems to be the knicks way of doing business..

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF

tkf
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8/1/2013 11:40 AM

DurzoBlint wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Finestrg wrote:Back to hoops -
So now in retrospect, was signing Prigioni at the time for a portion of the mini-ML instead of going after Udirih weeks ago when we had more money to spend a little bit of a mistake? I think so. Udirih > Prigioni.. Just sayin'.

Prigioni played very well. We couldn't let him go. Definitely getting Prigioni is better than a chance at getting Udirih. It sucks we've got so much money tied up on overpaid players and have such limited FA options though.
if we had let Prigs go, guys here guys would be up in arms. Prigs deserved to be a priority and we know he fits the roster while we have no idea how Udirih would mesh.

if he is a priority, then why are we chasing beno? why are we chasing bobby "don't mean to be cruel but I am going to china" Brown? why? what are we doing? if prigs was a priority, lets move on to the next need... honestly, not sure spending money on artest was a good move.. A nice feel good story, for a former NY star, but artest is not the same player.... and although we can also use his defense, i think our need was for a Dejuan blair, reggie evans type..

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF

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