ChuckBuck wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

martin wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

martin wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody!

Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.

I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?

Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.

Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.

Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.

Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.

Popovich does it all the time.

Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.

When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.

Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?

What is the point of having the best 3 point shooter in the league, if you're not going to use him. We all know Novak sucks on D, but why have a 3 pt specialist in the game then, if you won't run screens for him. What good is a decoy or floor spacer, if you won't run plays for him?

Obviously, the Houston Rockets thought Camby recovered from plantar fasciitis. 'Nuff said on that.

Look, I like Woodson as a coach. I like him alot.

Don't like his doghouse tendencies though.

Not sure if your point on Camby makes sense, ie... how Houston picking him up for the 13/14 season has anything to do with his plantar fasciitis limiting his play during 12/13.

You brought Lin up earlier. How was Lin in Woodson's doghouse?

Novak proved two years in a row that as a specialist 3 point shooter on offense.....he is nullified in the playoffs by more agressive perimeter D.

Lin didn't put up the same numbers or have the free rein that he had under D'Antoni before getting injured.

Without a D'Antoni style offense centered around drive and kick guard play, Novak needed plays designed for him. Instead he was relegated to a $4million decoy/floor spacer.

Defense wasn't the issue so much, as it was predictable, stagnant ISO after ISO sets. No motion, no backcuts, backdoors, curls....nothing.

It's either High Pick and Roll or ISO...that's the whole playbook.

I like Woody, but he needs an Offensive Coordinator, as much as, D'Antoni needs a Defensive Coordinator.

Fair enough points.....and I believe part of the reason for fan malaise is that the Knicks offense is just not as fun to watch now as it was under MDA. However the bigger picture was that the D'Antoni system was not producing enough wins and he had lost the team by mid-season two years ago. Some will argue that it was the MDA lack of focus on D, others will place the blame on Melo. Almost anyone can understand that Woody is not the offensive guru that MDA is.....so I'm not sure why anyone would expect a D'Antoni style offense under Woody. I agree that he needs offensive assistant support.

I do not agree with the Woodson "Doghouse" theory. Seems to me that Coaches go with who they trust the most. Lin might have been reigned in a bit....but having lesser numbers does not mean Lin was in the Doghouse. Camby was injured much of the season......KMart came in later in the year and played effectively enough to take his minutes.

ChuckBuck wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

martin wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

martin wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody!

Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.

I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?

Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.

Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.

Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.

Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.

Popovich does it all the time.

Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.

When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.

Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?

What is the point of having the best 3 point shooter in the league, if you're not going to use him. We all know Novak sucks on D, but why have a 3 pt specialist in the game then, if you won't run screens for him. What good is a decoy or floor spacer, if you won't run plays for him?

Obviously, the Houston Rockets thought Camby recovered from plantar fasciitis. 'Nuff said on that.

Look, I like Woodson as a coach. I like him alot.

Don't like his doghouse tendencies though.

Not sure if your point on Camby makes sense, ie... how Houston picking him up for the 13/14 season has anything to do with his plantar fasciitis limiting his play during 12/13.

You brought Lin up earlier. How was Lin in Woodson's doghouse?

Novak proved two years in a row that as a specialist 3 point shooter on offense.....he is nullified in the playoffs by more agressive perimeter D.

Lin didn't put up the same numbers or have the free rein that he had under D'Antoni before getting injured.

Without a D'Antoni style offense centered around drive and kick guard play, Novak needed plays designed for him. Instead he was relegated to a $4million decoy/floor spacer.

Defense wasn't the issue so much, as it was predictable, stagnant ISO after ISO sets. No motion, no backcuts, backdoors, curls....nothing.

It's either High Pick and Roll or ISO...that's the whole playbook.

I like Woody, but he needs an Offensive Coordinator, as much as, D'Antoni needs a Defensive Coordinator.

Fair enough points.....and I believe part of the reason for fan malaise is that the Knicks offense is just not as fun to watch now as it was under MDA. However the bigger picture was that the D'Antoni system was not producing enough wins and he had lost the team by mid-season two years ago. Some will argue that it was the MDA lack of focus on D, others will place the blame on Melo. Almost anyone can understand that Woody is not the offensive guru that MDA is.....so I'm not sure why anyone would expect a D'Antoni style offense under Woody. I agree that he needs offensive assistant support.

I do not agree with the Woodson "Doghouse" theory. Seems to me that Coaches go with who they trust the most. Lin might have been reigned in a bit....but having lesser numbers does not mean Lin was in the Doghouse. Camby was injured much of the season......KMart came in later in the year and played effectively enough to take his minutes.

I just wish Woody put more trust in other players like he did with Melo and JR. And I love Melo. JR...I like, when he's good JR.

If he had unleashed Copeland earlier...oh well.

I think for the Knicks to be successful this upcoming season, Woodson cannot give Bargnani the Novak treatment.

He must run him off screens, run pick and pop, run pick and roll, post him up against smaller opponents, ISO him on the perimeter against bigger ones, etc...

If Melo's going for the scoring title again, and JR has free rein to shoot 16 times a game, then we'll probably be 1 and done or 2 rounds and done.

Woodson has to "share the wealth" with the players. Can't be predictable like last year. Melo has to average like 24 or 25, Bargnani 15 or 16, JR 14 or 15, and then distributed with the rest.

If we can balance out the offense, while playing solid D, we have as good a chance as any to advance to the ECF.

If not, you know the drill.

Woody won't be able to take his frustrations out on Bargnani the way he did Novak, because Novak was Woody's whipping boy because he's not confrontational. Bargnani will not take things so lightly.

It would not surprise me if the Knicks crash and burn next year, starting with Bargs as the first domino, and this will be because Woody's inability to truly lead a group of men will be exposed.

Woody is not a good coach nor a good leader, he rides the coat tails of his Star Player and he basically kisses their ass in exchange for cooperation. Then Woody throws quieter and less established players under the bus.

Woody is a weak man and a weak leader, and this team is going nowhere fast.

You heard it here first.

IronWillGiroud wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

martin wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

martin wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody!

Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.

I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?

Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.

Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.

Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.

Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.

Popovich does it all the time.

Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.

When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.

Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?

What is the point of having the best 3 point shooter in the league, if you're not going to use him. We all know Novak sucks on D, but why have a 3 pt specialist in the game then, if you won't run screens for him. What good is a decoy or floor spacer, if you won't run plays for him?

Obviously, the Houston Rockets thought Camby recovered from plantar fasciitis. 'Nuff said on that.

Look, I like Woodson as a coach. I like him alot.

Don't like his doghouse tendencies though.

Not sure if your point on Camby makes sense, ie... how Houston picking him up for the 13/14 season has anything to do with his plantar fasciitis limiting his play during 12/13.

You brought Lin up earlier. How was Lin in Woodson's doghouse?

Novak proved two years in a row that as a specialist 3 point shooter on offense.....he is nullified in the playoffs by more agressive perimeter D.

Lin didn't put up the same numbers or have the free rein that he had under D'Antoni before getting injured.

Without a D'Antoni style offense centered around drive and kick guard play, Novak needed plays designed for him. Instead he was relegated to a $4million decoy/floor spacer.

Defense wasn't the issue so much, as it was predictable, stagnant ISO after ISO sets. No motion, no backcuts, backdoors, curls....nothing.

It's either High Pick and Roll or ISO...that's the whole playbook.

I like Woody, but he needs an Offensive Coordinator, as much as, D'Antoni needs a Defensive Coordinator.

Fair enough points.....and I believe part of the reason for fan malaise is that the Knicks offense is just not as fun to watch now as it was under MDA. However the bigger picture was that the D'Antoni system was not producing enough wins and he had lost the team by mid-season two years ago. Some will argue that it was the MDA lack of focus on D, others will place the blame on Melo. Almost anyone can understand that Woody is not the offensive guru that MDA is.....so I'm not sure why anyone would expect a D'Antoni style offense under Woody. I agree that he needs offensive assistant support.

I do not agree with the Woodson "Doghouse" theory. Seems to me that Coaches go with who they trust the most. Lin might have been reigned in a bit....but having lesser numbers does not mean Lin was in the Doghouse. Camby was injured much of the season......KMart came in later in the year and played effectively enough to take his minutes.

I just wish Woody put more trust in other players like he did with Melo and JR. And I love Melo. JR...I like, when he's good JR.

If he had unleashed Copeland earlier...oh well.

I think for the Knicks to be successful this upcoming season, Woodson cannot give Bargnani the Novak treatment.

He must run him off screens, run pick and pop, run pick and roll, post him up against smaller opponents, ISO him on the perimeter against bigger ones, etc...

If Melo's going for the scoring title again, and JR has free rein to shoot 16 times a game, then we'll probably be 1 and done or 2 rounds and done.

Woodson has to "share the wealth" with the players. Can't be predictable like last year. Melo has to average like 24 or 25, Bargnani 15 or 16, JR 14 or 15, and then distributed with the rest.

If we can balance out the offense, while playing solid D, we have as good a chance as any to advance to the ECF.

If not, you know the drill.

Woody won't be able to take his frustrations out on Bargnani the way he did Novak, because Novak was Woody's whipping boy because he's not confrontational. Bargnani will not take things so lightly.

It would not surprise me if the Knicks crash and burn next year, starting with Bargs as the first domino, and this will be because Woody's inability to truly lead a group of men will be exposed.

Woody is not a good coach nor a good leader, he rides the coat tails of his Star Player and he basically kisses their ass in exchange for cooperation. Then Woody throws quieter and less established players under the bus.

Woody is a weak man and a weak leader, and this team is going nowhere fast.

You heard it here first.

I don't really like this personal type of trash talk and think it drags fan forums down. You are performing a character assassination on Mike Woodson with only your subjective opinion and no real facts.

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

martin wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

martin wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody!

Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.

I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?

Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.

Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.

Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.

Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.

Popovich does it all the time.

Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.

When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.

Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?

What is the point of having the best 3 point shooter in the league, if you're not going to use him. We all know Novak sucks on D, but why have a 3 pt specialist in the game then, if you won't run screens for him. What good is a decoy or floor spacer, if you won't run plays for him?

Obviously, the Houston Rockets thought Camby recovered from plantar fasciitis. 'Nuff said on that.

Look, I like Woodson as a coach. I like him alot.

Don't like his doghouse tendencies though.

Not sure if your point on Camby makes sense, ie... how Houston picking him up for the 13/14 season has anything to do with his plantar fasciitis limiting his play during 12/13.

You brought Lin up earlier. How was Lin in Woodson's doghouse?

Novak proved two years in a row that as a specialist 3 point shooter on offense.....he is nullified in the playoffs by more agressive perimeter D.

Lin didn't put up the same numbers or have the free rein that he had under D'Antoni before getting injured.

Without a D'Antoni style offense centered around drive and kick guard play, Novak needed plays designed for him. Instead he was relegated to a $4million decoy/floor spacer.

Defense wasn't the issue so much, as it was predictable, stagnant ISO after ISO sets. No motion, no backcuts, backdoors, curls....nothing.

It's either High Pick and Roll or ISO...that's the whole playbook.

I like Woody, but he needs an Offensive Coordinator, as much as, D'Antoni needs a Defensive Coordinator.

Fair enough points.....and I believe part of the reason for fan malaise is that the Knicks offense is just not as fun to watch now as it was under MDA. However the bigger picture was that the D'Antoni system was not producing enough wins and he had lost the team by mid-season two years ago. Some will argue that it was the MDA lack of focus on D, others will place the blame on Melo. Almost anyone can understand that Woody is not the offensive guru that MDA is.....so I'm not sure why anyone would expect a D'Antoni style offense under Woody. I agree that he needs offensive assistant support.

I do not agree with the Woodson "Doghouse" theory. Seems to me that Coaches go with who they trust the most. Lin might have been reigned in a bit....but having lesser numbers does not mean Lin was in the Doghouse. Camby was injured much of the season......KMart came in later in the year and played effectively enough to take his minutes.

I just wish Woody put more trust in other players like he did with Melo and JR. And I love Melo. JR...I like, when he's good JR.

If he had unleashed Copeland earlier...oh well.

I think for the Knicks to be successful this upcoming season, Woodson cannot give Bargnani the Novak treatment.

He must run him off screens, run pick and pop, run pick and roll, post him up against smaller opponents, ISO him on the perimeter against bigger ones, etc...

If Melo's going for the scoring title again, and JR has free rein to shoot 16 times a game, then we'll probably be 1 and done or 2 rounds and done.

Woodson has to "share the wealth" with the players. Can't be predictable like last year. Melo has to average like 24 or 25, Bargnani 15 or 16, JR 14 or 15, and then distributed with the rest.

If we can balance out the offense, while playing solid D, we have as good a chance as any to advance to the ECF.

If not, you know the drill.

Just one add to this. Bargs has the ability to create his own shot........Novak really has not shown that ability.

He does, but it's up to Woodson to not park Bargnani in the corner like he did Novak.

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

martin wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

martin wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody!

Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.

I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?

Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.

Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.

Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.

Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.

Popovich does it all the time.

Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.

When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.

Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?

What is the point of having the best 3 point shooter in the league, if you're not going to use him. We all know Novak sucks on D, but why have a 3 pt specialist in the game then, if you won't run screens for him. What good is a decoy or floor spacer, if you won't run plays for him?

Obviously, the Houston Rockets thought Camby recovered from plantar fasciitis. 'Nuff said on that.

Look, I like Woodson as a coach. I like him alot.

Don't like his doghouse tendencies though.

Not sure if your point on Camby makes sense, ie... how Houston picking him up for the 13/14 season has anything to do with his plantar fasciitis limiting his play during 12/13.

You brought Lin up earlier. How was Lin in Woodson's doghouse?

Novak proved two years in a row that as a specialist 3 point shooter on offense.....he is nullified in the playoffs by more agressive perimeter D.

Lin didn't put up the same numbers or have the free rein that he had under D'Antoni before getting injured.

Without a D'Antoni style offense centered around drive and kick guard play, Novak needed plays designed for him. Instead he was relegated to a $4million decoy/floor spacer.

Defense wasn't the issue so much, as it was predictable, stagnant ISO after ISO sets. No motion, no backcuts, backdoors, curls....nothing.

It's either High Pick and Roll or ISO...that's the whole playbook.

I like Woody, but he needs an Offensive Coordinator, as much as, D'Antoni needs a Defensive Coordinator.

Fair enough points.....and I believe part of the reason for fan malaise is that the Knicks offense is just not as fun to watch now as it was under MDA. However the bigger picture was that the D'Antoni system was not producing enough wins and he had lost the team by mid-season two years ago. Some will argue that it was the MDA lack of focus on D, others will place the blame on Melo. Almost anyone can understand that Woody is not the offensive guru that MDA is.....so I'm not sure why anyone would expect a D'Antoni style offense under Woody. I agree that he needs offensive assistant support.

I do not agree with the Woodson "Doghouse" theory. Seems to me that Coaches go with who they trust the most. Lin might have been reigned in a bit....but having lesser numbers does not mean Lin was in the Doghouse. Camby was injured much of the season......KMart came in later in the year and played effectively enough to take his minutes.

I just wish Woody put more trust in other players like he did with Melo and JR. And I love Melo. JR...I like, when he's good JR.

If he had unleashed Copeland earlier...oh well.

I think for the Knicks to be successful this upcoming season, Woodson cannot give Bargnani the Novak treatment.

He must run him off screens, run pick and pop, run pick and roll, post him up against smaller opponents, ISO him on the perimeter against bigger ones, etc...

If Melo's going for the scoring title again, and JR has free rein to shoot 16 times a game, then we'll probably be 1 and done or 2 rounds and done.

Woodson has to "share the wealth" with the players. Can't be predictable like last year. Melo has to average like 24 or 25, Bargnani 15 or 16, JR 14 or 15, and then distributed with the rest.

If we can balance out the offense, while playing solid D, we have as good a chance as any to advance to the ECF.

If not, you know the drill.

Just one add to this. Bargs has the ability to create his own shot........Novak really has not shown that ability.

yellowboy90 wrote:I wish there were numbers that showed how many screens were set for Novak last year versus the previous year.

i wish this too

foosballnick wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

martin wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

martin wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody!

Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.

I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?

Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.

Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.

Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.

Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.

Popovich does it all the time.

Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.

When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.

Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?

What is the point of having the best 3 point shooter in the league, if you're not going to use him. We all know Novak sucks on D, but why have a 3 pt specialist in the game then, if you won't run screens for him. What good is a decoy or floor spacer, if you won't run plays for him?

Obviously, the Houston Rockets thought Camby recovered from plantar fasciitis. 'Nuff said on that.

Look, I like Woodson as a coach. I like him alot.

Don't like his doghouse tendencies though.

Not sure if your point on Camby makes sense, ie... how Houston picking him up for the 13/14 season has anything to do with his plantar fasciitis limiting his play during 12/13.

You brought Lin up earlier. How was Lin in Woodson's doghouse?

Novak proved two years in a row that as a specialist 3 point shooter on offense.....he is nullified in the playoffs by more agressive perimeter D.

Lin didn't put up the same numbers or have the free rein that he had under D'Antoni before getting injured.

Without a D'Antoni style offense centered around drive and kick guard play, Novak needed plays designed for him. Instead he was relegated to a $4million decoy/floor spacer.

Defense wasn't the issue so much, as it was predictable, stagnant ISO after ISO sets. No motion, no backcuts, backdoors, curls....nothing.

It's either High Pick and Roll or ISO...that's the whole playbook.

I like Woody, but he needs an Offensive Coordinator, as much as, D'Antoni needs a Defensive Coordinator.

Fair enough points.....and I believe part of the reason for fan malaise is that the Knicks offense is just not as fun to watch now as it was under MDA. However the bigger picture was that the D'Antoni system was not producing enough wins and he had lost the team by mid-season two years ago. Some will argue that it was the MDA lack of focus on D, others will place the blame on Melo. Almost anyone can understand that Woody is not the offensive guru that MDA is.....so I'm not sure why anyone would expect a D'Antoni style offense under Woody. I agree that he needs offensive assistant support.

I do not agree with the Woodson "Doghouse" theory. Seems to me that Coaches go with who they trust the most. Lin might have been reigned in a bit....but having lesser numbers does not mean Lin was in the Doghouse. Camby was injured much of the season......KMart came in later in the year and played effectively enough to take his minutes.

I just wish Woody put more trust in other players like he did with Melo and JR. And I love Melo. JR...I like, when he's good JR.

If he had unleashed Copeland earlier...oh well.

I think for the Knicks to be successful this upcoming season, Woodson cannot give Bargnani the Novak treatment.

He must run him off screens, run pick and pop, run pick and roll, post him up against smaller opponents, ISO him on the perimeter against bigger ones, etc...

If Melo's going for the scoring title again, and JR has free rein to shoot 16 times a game, then we'll probably be 1 and done or 2 rounds and done.

Woodson has to "share the wealth" with the players. Can't be predictable like last year. Melo has to average like 24 or 25, Bargnani 15 or 16, JR 14 or 15, and then distributed with the rest.

If we can balance out the offense, while playing solid D, we have as good a chance as any to advance to the ECF.

If not, you know the drill.

Just one add to this. Bargs has the ability to create his own shot........Novak really has not shown that ability.

How valuable is shot creation from a PF/C shooting .437 (or .399 last year)? All he's creating are his own misses.

I thought you don't put a lot of stock in Shooting Pct? We will see how a change in scenery and difference in role and teammates as well as a come back from injury will effect his %. My theory is that his percentage will be significantly better than .399.

You seem to establish a theory first and then go and find stats to back up the theory. Citing wanton facts means little unless you dig deeper to understand why the stats are what they are.

Bargs shooting pct will be lower than many C/PF because he shoots more from the outside and three pt range. His stats will be lower due to elbow injury. His stats will be lower due to being the main guy and therefore focus of more defensive intensity. As I have said before, basketball statistics are not static in a vacuum, there are actually other players and teams on the floor. The Knicks are banking that a change in teammates, coaches, fans and role will create more offensive efficiency. You seem to be of the mindset that everything always stays the same based on the way you are evaluating Bargs here.

OK, 53% TS% (48% last year).. Like I said, sometimes I list FG% for simplicity although you're right that I should have at least included the TS% with it.

Bonn1997 wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

martin wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

martin wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody!

Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.

I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?

Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.

Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.

Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.

Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.

Popovich does it all the time.

Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.

When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.

Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?

What is the point of having the best 3 point shooter in the league, if you're not going to use him. We all know Novak sucks on D, but why have a 3 pt specialist in the game then, if you won't run screens for him. What good is a decoy or floor spacer, if you won't run plays for him?

Obviously, the Houston Rockets thought Camby recovered from plantar fasciitis. 'Nuff said on that.

Look, I like Woodson as a coach. I like him alot.

Don't like his doghouse tendencies though.

Not sure if your point on Camby makes sense, ie... how Houston picking him up for the 13/14 season has anything to do with his plantar fasciitis limiting his play during 12/13.

You brought Lin up earlier. How was Lin in Woodson's doghouse?

Novak proved two years in a row that as a specialist 3 point shooter on offense.....he is nullified in the playoffs by more agressive perimeter D.

Lin didn't put up the same numbers or have the free rein that he had under D'Antoni before getting injured.

Without a D'Antoni style offense centered around drive and kick guard play, Novak needed plays designed for him. Instead he was relegated to a $4million decoy/floor spacer.

Defense wasn't the issue so much, as it was predictable, stagnant ISO after ISO sets. No motion, no backcuts, backdoors, curls....nothing.

It's either High Pick and Roll or ISO...that's the whole playbook.

I like Woody, but he needs an Offensive Coordinator, as much as, D'Antoni needs a Defensive Coordinator.

Fair enough points.....and I believe part of the reason for fan malaise is that the Knicks offense is just not as fun to watch now as it was under MDA. However the bigger picture was that the D'Antoni system was not producing enough wins and he had lost the team by mid-season two years ago. Some will argue that it was the MDA lack of focus on D, others will place the blame on Melo. Almost anyone can understand that Woody is not the offensive guru that MDA is.....so I'm not sure why anyone would expect a D'Antoni style offense under Woody. I agree that he needs offensive assistant support.

I do not agree with the Woodson "Doghouse" theory. Seems to me that Coaches go with who they trust the most. Lin might have been reigned in a bit....but having lesser numbers does not mean Lin was in the Doghouse. Camby was injured much of the season......KMart came in later in the year and played effectively enough to take his minutes.

I just wish Woody put more trust in other players like he did with Melo and JR. And I love Melo. JR...I like, when he's good JR.

If he had unleashed Copeland earlier...oh well.

I think for the Knicks to be successful this upcoming season, Woodson cannot give Bargnani the Novak treatment.

He must run him off screens, run pick and pop, run pick and roll, post him up against smaller opponents, ISO him on the perimeter against bigger ones, etc...

If Melo's going for the scoring title again, and JR has free rein to shoot 16 times a game, then we'll probably be 1 and done or 2 rounds and done.

Woodson has to "share the wealth" with the players. Can't be predictable like last year. Melo has to average like 24 or 25, Bargnani 15 or 16, JR 14 or 15, and then distributed with the rest.

If we can balance out the offense, while playing solid D, we have as good a chance as any to advance to the ECF.

If not, you know the drill.

Just one add to this. Bargs has the ability to create his own shot........Novak really has not shown that ability.

How valuable is shot creation from a PF/C shooting .437 (or .399 last year)? All he's creating are his own misses.

I thought you don't put a lot of stock in Shooting Pct? We will see how a change in scenery and difference in role and teammates as well as a come back from injury will effect his %. My theory is that his percentage will be significantly better than .399.

You seem to establish a theory first and then go and find stats to back up the theory. Citing wanton facts means little unless you dig deeper to understand why the stats are what they are.

Bargs shooting pct will be lower than many C/PF because he shoots more from the outside and three pt range. His stats will be lower due to elbow injury. His stats will be lower due to being the main guy and therefore focus of more defensive intensity. As I have said before, basketball statistics are not static in a vacuum, there are actually other players and teams on the floor. The Knicks are banking that a change in teammates, coaches, fans and role will create more offensive efficiency. You seem to be of the mindset that everything always stays the same based on the way you are evaluating Bargs here.

OK, 53% TS% (48% last year).. Like I said, sometimes I list FG% for simplicity although you're right that I should have at least included the TS% with it.

In his case--Id throw out the numbers. If Andrea plays the right way--and I do not mean playing like a SF--but a guy who is 7-0 250+ and uses his skills a majority of time in the low block --on the break and when a jumper is clean--he will shoot a very solid eFG and score 17-20 points. Remember the jump Pau Gasol had in efficiency when he went from the Grizzlies to the Lakers. He went from a 50% shooter to a 59% player in one year as a second cog and kept a higher% up until he started to suffer injury and aging.