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Andrea "Il Mago" (The Magician) Bargnani Appreciation
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JamesKPolk
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7/1/2013  7:26 PM
Markji wrote:Here's a Ball Don't Lie take on the trade. And I think this is why a lot of us are unhappy with the trade and how much we had to give up. Even tho the picks are late round picks.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-ball-dont-lie/york-knicks-trading-andrea-bargnani-because-course-155517381.html

While former Raptors personnel boss Bryan Colangelo was inexorably tied to Bargnani after not only drafting him first overall in 2006 but also giving him a (head-scratching, even at the time) five-year, $50 million extension in the summer of 2009, a new Raps regime led by recently hired former Denver Nuggets general manager and reigning NBA Executive of the Year Masai Ujiri had no such sentimental attachment; after taking the Raptors' reins on June 1, Ujiri reportedly made moving Bargnani his "first order of business."

There was quite a bit of skepticism as to whether he'd actually be able to complete that business, though, for several reasons:

• Bargnani has two years and nearly $22.3 million remaining on his current contract;

Everyone knew the Raptors were desperate to move him, not only because Ujiri (and Colangelo before him) had openly said so, but also because it seemed untenable to bring Bargnani back to a city where he'd begun hearing more boos than cheers and where player, team and fan-base all appeared ready to move on months before he suffered a right elbow injury that ended his 2012-13 season;

• And, most importantly, Bargnani hasn't really been very, or any, good for the past couple of seasons.

He has always been a very poor defender, with insufficient strength to battle bruising power forwards and centers in the post and too little foot speed to stay with speedier threes and fours on the perimeter. He's also been something of a space cadet as a helper in Toronto's team defensive schemes; the Raptors have allowed more points per possession with Bargnani on the floor than off it in each of the last six seasons, according to NBA.com's stat tool. (On/off-court data isn't available for Bargnani's rookie season.)

He grabs an astoundingly low share of available rebounds for a 7-footer, a persistent problem that reached its nadir last season, when he posted a lower rebound rate (7.6 percent of possible caroms) than the average small forward/shooting guard and the lowest of any power forward to play at least 10 games and average at least 10 minutes per game. He's not an especially gifted facilitator, averaging 1.5 assists per 36 minutes over the course of his seven-year career; this is extra bad when you consider that he averages two turnovers per-36.

These faults — the defensive liability, the absent rebounding, the underwhelming playmaking — are generally accepted truths about Bargnani's game through a 444-game NBA sample, and unlikely to meaningfully improve at the age of 27. To whatever extent he has made up for those flaws throughout his career, it's been as a result of a deep shooting stroke that can draw opposing big men out of the paint; he shot 37.6 percent from 3-point range through his first four NBA seasons, exploding just often enough to keep alive the hope that he'd figure out how to become a consistent and reliable offensive focal point.
As he took on more responsibility and took more shots in the Raptors' offense over the last three seasons, though, his accuracy and efficiency dwindled. He shot a tick under 40 percent from the floor and 31 percent from deep last season, due in part to a pair of injuries to his shooting elbow and partly, perhaps, to a seeming disinterest in getting in shape.

With that long-range stroke and scoring acumen falling by the wayside, there really wasn't too much left to Bargnani — if he couldn't carry his share of the offensive load, he was just an overpaid, underperforming albatross with no place in a Toronto future that will be built on frontcourts featuring Rudy Gay, Amir Johnson and Jonas Valanciunas. He was an afterthought whom most observers figured would net zero actual value in trade, and who was considered among the league's most likely candidates to be jettisoned via the CBA's amnesty provision.

So, y'know, enter the Knicks.

You can certainly make the argument (as some have) that the Knicks didn't lose a ton of on-court value in the deal, considering age and injury limited the 39-year-old Camby to just 253 minutes in his return season to New York and that Novak — while a more accurate and less expensive 3-point shooter than Bargnani — completely fell out of coach Mike Woodson's rotation in the postseason. You can make the argument (as some have) that a fresh start in a new city with a new role could be just what the doctor ordered for Bargnani, that working with shooting coach Dave Hopla could help Bargnani rediscover his rhythm and that a long spring, summer and fall to get healthy could do wonders for the former top overall pick.

These are possibilities; Bargnani does still have talent, after all. Still, it's difficult to see how adding Bargnani to the mix meaningfully moves the needle in a positive direction for the Knicks.

While the Knicks were repeatedly victimized by the size and interior strength of the Indiana Pacers in their six-game second-round playoff loss, Bargnani doesn't offer much in the way of rim protection, low-post muscle or in-the-paint grit; he also doesn't figure to improve what was a middling defense in terms of points allowed per possession last season. Given how successful the Knicks were last season with Carmelo Anthony at the power forward spot, it seems like the prudent move would be to bring Bargnani off the bench to provide an offensive boost; then again, the Knicks still employ Amar'e Stoudemire, and while you can kind of get on board with the idea of Amar'e operating out of the post while Andrea spaces the floor, the idea of defensive units pairing Stoudemire and Bargnani is likely already giving Knicks fans nightmares.

Plus, while Bargnani profiles as a stretch four in today's NBA, meaning his addition would seem to jive (to some degree) with the small-ball identity the Knicks fashioned last year, if the addition of another power forward winds up pushing Anthony down to small forward more often, that would seem to run counter to the Melo-at-the-four plus one big and three shooters/playmakers strategy. So while the Knicks might not have given up much on-court value in the swap, they might not have added much, either.

And then, of course, you think about the future.

The 2016 first-round pick the Knicks will give up for Bargnani had already been included in a prior trade with Ujiri, as Denver received the right to swap '16 first-rounders with New York in the deal that brought Anthony to Manhattan. The Knicks gave up their 2014 first-rounder in that deal, too, and sent off next year's second-round pick, as part of the 2012 deal that sent Toney Douglas, Josh Harrellson and Jerome Jordan to the Houston Rockets for Marcus Camby.

The two second-rounders the Knicks will reportedly send Toronto include a '14 selection they received from the Oklahoma City Thunder for Ronnie Brewer at this past February's trade deadline; the Knicks own the rights to one more '14 second-rounder, which once belonged to the Sacramento Kings but went to the Boston Celtics in 2009, then was conveyed to New York as part of the Nate Robinson deal in 2010, but New York only gets that pick if it falls between picks No. 56 and 60, which means they're not likely to see it. That means the Knicks will most likely be without a draft choice in what some have projected to be the deepest draft in years. The Knicks have also given up their second-rounders in '15 (in the Houston deal) and '16 (in the trade that brought Raymond Felton back from the Portland Trail Blazers). New York's 2017 second-rounder will go to the Raptors, for Bargnani, too.

It's true that draft picks don't always fulfill their promise; you absolutely don't have to remind Knicks fans of that. But teams that are over the salary cap and luxury tax — the Knicks are on the books for more than $77 million this year and next before this deal goes through — have precious few instruments under the new collective bargaining agreement for adding talent, let alone young, inexpensive, cost-controlled talent. The draft affords that opportunity, whether by making your own selections or by using a cache of available selections to pluck a young asset like Thomas Robinson, whom the Blazers just snagged from the Rockets for a pair of second-rounders and European prospects.

Having draft picks gives you options; not having them eliminates options. The Knicks, now, have very few options at inexpensively improving their existing core in the years ahead or developing foundational talent to have on-board beyond the 2014-15 season, when just about everybody comes off New York's books and a grand reset seems likely, and in the three years afterward, too. They have traded away said options in the hope that a high-priced player with a recognizable name who'd become persona non grata in his previous stop will be able to turn his declining fortunes around under the bright lights of Madison Square Garden.

Knicks fans have heard this tune before. It's got a bad beat, and you can't dance to it. But that doesn't mean James Dolan and company plan to stop playing that same old song over and over and over again.

This article perfectly sums up my feelings on the trade.

"Peace, plenty, and contentment reign throughout our borders, and our beloved country presents a sublime moral spectacle to the world." - James K Polk
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Bonn1997
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7/1/2013  7:31 PM
nixluva wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
nixluva wrote:Man please! Anyone can bash Bargs based on the last 2 years, but at least we know why he was playing poorly. There's a great chance that we can get him back to his best BB and even better if we can get him to buy into the winning attitude we have here. The Raps stunk and who knows how that effected him. I'm sure the losing doesn't exactly inspire a player. He'll be coming here with a fresh start and a positive attitude. I think that's gonna make a huge difference.

So we got another veteran with the goal of changing him into something he's never been? Didn't we learn from the past ten years?

Do you have another solution short of blowing the team up, which they're not gonna do this year? See it's easy to just sit back and take pot shots, but to put yourself in the thinking process of the Knicks, they have to try and get a guy at his low value point and try to build him up. The work they did on JR was mostly successful. The work they did on Amar'e was also successful from the standpoint of his post game being improved. So the premise of taking players and helping them add to their game has actually been working. All we're asking Bargs to do is learn how to defend and give more effort, things which aren't impossible to do.

Yeah, stop ignoring all of the best available stats.

Markji
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7/1/2013  7:31 PM    LAST EDITED: 7/2/2013  6:19 AM
nixluva wrote:Man please! Anyone can bash Bargs based on the last 2 years, but at least we know why he was playing poorly. There's a great chance that we can get him back to his best BB and even better if we can get him to buy into the winning attitude we have here. The Raps stunk and who knows how that effected him. I'm sure the losing doesn't exactly inspire a player. He'll be coming here with a fresh start and a positive attitude. I think that's gonna make a huge difference.

Nixluvqa, I always read your posts and like your positive attitude. It is refreshing compared to many other posters who bash everything.

When you say "anyone can bash Bargs based on the past 2 years" well, he deserves to be bashed. He played very poorly. People on this board bashed JR for having a terrible shooting series; even though he won many games for us and won 6th man of the year award. Same with Tyson; same with Kidd; same with Novak; etc. But 2 years of being bad for Bargs is a long time to doubt the player and wonder if he can bounce back. And that is his offense. He was NEVER a good defensive player nor a good rebounder in his entire career, even when he posted big offensive stats. So I think it is valid to question his abilities. I like most people hope he reverts to his former self and plays well for the Knicks. But he is a big question mark.

The other part of the deal is once again, we get fleeced in the bargaining. Say what you will about the picks, they are still assets and we gave them up when we probably didn't have to. And now we are left with no more assets to trade. We even had to throw in Q, one of our only sign and trade players.Another asset lost. I don't think Grunny is this bad of a bargainer and business person. It does ring of interference from Dolan and posibly his long term friend and advisor.

The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
Bonn1997
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7/1/2013  7:34 PM
Markji wrote:
nixluva wrote:Man please! Anyone can bash Bargs based on the last 2 years, but at least we know why he was playing poorly. There's a great chance that we can get him back to his best BB and even better if we can get him to buy into the winning attitude we have here. The Raps stunk and who knows how that effected him. I'm sure the losing doesn't exactly inspire a player. He'll be coming here with a fresh start and a positive attitude. I think that's gonna make a huge difference.

Nixlover, I always read your posts and like your positive attitude. It is refreshing compared to many other posters who bash everything.

When you say "anyone can bash Bargs based on the past 2 years" well, he deserves to be bashed. He played very poorly. People on this board bashed JR for having a terrible shooting series; even though he won many games for us and won 6th man of the year award. Same with Tyson; same with Kidd; same with Novak; etc. But 2 years of being bad for Bargs is a long time to doubt the player and wonder if he can bounce back. And that is his offense. He was NEVER a good defensive player nor a good rebounder in his entire career, even when he posted big offensive stats. So I think it is valid to question his abilities. I like most people hope he reverts to his former self and plays well for the Knicks. But he is a big question mark.

But the other part of the deal is once again, we get fleeced in the bargaining. Say what you will about the picks, they are still assets and we gave them up when we probably didn't have to. And now we are left with no more assets to trade. We even had to throw in Q, one of our only sign and trade players.Another asset lost. I don't think Grunny is this bad of a bargainer and business person. It does ring of interference from Dolan and posibly his long term friend and advisor.


I can't help wondering that too. It seems like Isiah/Dolan found out that someone with similar PPG and RPG stats to Eddy Curry was available and got extremely excited.
nixluva
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7/1/2013  7:49 PM
Bonn1997 wrote:
Markji wrote:
nixluva wrote:Man please! Anyone can bash Bargs based on the last 2 years, but at least we know why he was playing poorly. There's a great chance that we can get him back to his best BB and even better if we can get him to buy into the winning attitude we have here. The Raps stunk and who knows how that effected him. I'm sure the losing doesn't exactly inspire a player. He'll be coming here with a fresh start and a positive attitude. I think that's gonna make a huge difference.

Nixlover, I always read your posts and like your positive attitude. It is refreshing compared to many other posters who bash everything.

When you say "anyone can bash Bargs based on the past 2 years" well, he deserves to be bashed. He played very poorly. People on this board bashed JR for having a terrible shooting series; even though he won many games for us and won 6th man of the year award. Same with Tyson; same with Kidd; same with Novak; etc. But 2 years of being bad for Bargs is a long time to doubt the player and wonder if he can bounce back. And that is his offense. He was NEVER a good defensive player nor a good rebounder in his entire career, even when he posted big offensive stats. So I think it is valid to question his abilities. I like most people hope he reverts to his former self and plays well for the Knicks. But he is a big question mark.

But the other part of the deal is once again, we get fleeced in the bargaining. Say what you will about the picks, they are still assets and we gave them up when we probably didn't have to. And now we are left with no more assets to trade. We even had to throw in Q, one of our only sign and trade players.Another asset lost. I don't think Grunny is this bad of a bargainer and business person. It does ring of interference from Dolan and posibly his long term friend and advisor.


I can't help wondering that too. It seems like Isiah/Dolan found out that someone with similar PPG and RPG stats to Eddy Curry was available and got extremely excited.

You know BB better than to reduce this to an Eddy Curry comparison. This is a move that makes sense based on how Melo plays. Melo is the centerpiece and as such we have to find players that can mesh with his game. The entire point of adding Bargs is that his game matches the way Melo wants to play. Bargs is there to draw his man out of the paint and free up Melo. If the big doesn't come out that means we have a mismatch out against Bargs or closer to the basket against Melo. That is how you have to look at this. For all the crap people keep posting about this, that is exactly how they use Bosh. You're gonna sacrifice some rebounding, but you hope to have a greater impact on the offense, which is the biggest reason we lost. The best rebounding team in the league didn't win the title.
The Heat were the worst rebounding team in the league and the Spurs were about a rebound better than the Knicks. Don't make the mistake of overrating that stat!!!

Cartman718
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7/1/2013  8:16 PM    LAST EDITED: 7/1/2013  8:20 PM
first of all, bargnani is greater than michael jordan.

and by that i mean, bargnani would beat michael jordan in a one-on-one any day.

and by that i mean, a 28 year old bargnani would beat a 50 year old michael jordan any day

i dont like giving the picks either, but lets face it, if bargnani was hurt last 2 years and you didn't know what hurt meant, if you looked it up in the dictionary there would be a picture of marcus camby next to it.

secondly, i dont think anyone of the forum liked giving quentin richardson away. we should have received 3 unprotected first round picks for him from 2048, 2049, 2050.

thirdly, novak showed his real value in the playoffs the last 2 years draining shot after shot from behind the arc when the games really mattered.... oh wait....

he did turn into a better player under woodson even defending at times. if woodson can do that in 1-2 years with novak, is it even remotely possible that bargnani will listen to woodson? at worst, we are in the same position as we were yesterday. no true center to back up chandler. we all know flu-son chandler's healthy reputation. at best, bargnani plays up to his potential which far exceeds qrich, novak and camby combined in their current states. grunnie didn't rape the raptors on this one, but if this gamble means that woodson can get bargnani's best out of him, next year should be a shoo-in around this time with a nice trading piece.

what were we going to get next year for camby, novak and qrich.... something better?

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7/1/2013  8:19 PM
Here's a copy of Bargnani's profile from Basketball Prospectus heading into last season:

Most similar to: LaPhonso Ellis (97.2), Terry Mills, Wayman Tisdale, Keith Van Horn
Andrea Bargnani was playing the best basketball of his career when he turned up with a nagging calf injury that dogged him all season and beyond, limiting the hard-luck Italian to 31 games. When he played, Bargnani was less effective from three-point range but made up for the lost value by getting to the line more often and repeating his high usage rate from 2010-11. The foul shots kept his True Shooting Percentage right at the league average (actually better, adjusting for the post-lockout downturn) and once he resumes his normal three-point accuracy, Bargnani is going to offer that valued blend of high usage and high efficiency. His career-high scoring average is 21.4 points; he could easily average 25 points one of these seasons.
As we noted in the team essay, Bargnani may get a chance to play the four full-time for the first time in his career if Jonas Valančiūnas proves ready for prime time. If the transition takes place as hoped, the Dirk Nowit- zki comparisons for Bargnani could begin anew. No, he’s not on Nowitzki’s level, but as a premier perimeter- scoring big man whose coach has to hide him on the defensive end, the similarities will be tough to deny if Bargnani further raises his level of play. With a stable roster around him, more friendly defensive responsibili- ties and improved health, this could be the breakout season we’ve been waiting for from Bargnani. Raptors fans have thought this before, but this might be the year that Bargnani booms or busts. If he’s somewhere in between, that in itself will in some ways be a disappointment.

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7/1/2013  8:36 PM
nixluva wrote:
JamesKPolk wrote:This is the Bargnani you will see a lot of:

That's what Woody is here for. It's his job to work with Bargs to get him to understand what he needs to do on D. Don't get locked into what he did with a losing franchise like the Raps. I really could care less. He's on the Knicks now and we'll have to coach him up to understand how we do things here. You know better than that.

I don't know Nix, that looks like some Amar'e D. Woodie is gonna have his hands full! He needs to have a training camp solely on defense. He needs to live up to that defensive guru title and get everybody on the same page.

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7/1/2013  8:56 PM
Sangfroid wrote:I don't know Nix, that looks like some Amar'e D. Woodie is gonna have his hands full! He needs to have a training camp solely on defense. He needs to live up to that defensive guru title and get everybody on the same page.

You mean Woodies job is easier. He can use the same scheme to cover for Bargs as he does for Amare.

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7/1/2013  9:31 PM
this is a great move,

you have to understand: we are not in a vacuum.

brilliant trade for knicks, you get a totally new dimension in your attack, you are now a new team,

situation is ripe for bargs to thrive, comeback season when he really can't do any worse than last year, which was rock bottom,

he's not asked to be the #1 guy, the #1 overall pick, now he can settle into a supporting role where he will be asked to do less and he will focus on his strengths,

then it expires with amar'e? that's brilliant, a lot of cash comes off the books that summer which means HONEY POT,

so you bang with bargs and amar'e one more year, maybe they make more moves, and if it fails you don't lose anything and if it works you will be a scarier team in the playoffs,

bargs can ball, he's a serious baller, there were some issues last year outside of the game that threw the fork in the wheels,

and if you're worried about draft picks? why should you be worried? they replenish every year, you will never run out of draft picks, and for our team, draft picks don't have any value if we hold them, because we don't develop players, so why not trade them?

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7/1/2013  10:23 PM
The ball don't lie article is overwhelmingly negative and perhaps factually incorrect, especially if Golden State was willing to offer David Lee (an all-star player) in a trade for him.
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7/1/2013  11:08 PM
I think the major thing that Bargnani trade adds from a basketball standpoint is you can start Bargnani at the 4 and Melo at the 3, not sacrifice any size, and still give Melo the opportunity to operate on the low block since Bargnani will stop operate from the perimeter a lot of the time. From a defensive standpoint, that puts less pressure on Melo and keeps him from constantly being at a size disadvantage. Now, you probably will still have some teams switching and putting their 3 on Bargs and a bigger guy on Melo. That said teams that go 3 guards (often the case in today's NBA) are gonna be at a big disadvantage against us, since they will have to keep their 4 on Bargs for size purposes and will put a guard on Melo, who will then have a good size advantage to post up. Or Bargs will have a major size advantage. I think it could do wonders for our lineup.
knicks1248
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7/1/2013  11:23 PM
Andrew wrote:
Sangfroid wrote:I don't know Nix, that looks like some Amar'e D. Woodie is gonna have his hands full! He needs to have a training camp solely on defense. He needs to live up to that defensive guru title and get everybody on the same page.

You mean Woodies job is easier. He can use the same scheme to cover for Bargs as he does for Amare.

he didn't cover up for Amares "D", he look just like Barg on D 85% of the time, always has his back to the ball and turns around to late, always out of position and gets occasional blocks for being athletic.

the only way to cover for a weak defender... surround him with a lot of defensive players..

THINK ALLAN HOUSTON

ES
CashMoney
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7/1/2013  11:25 PM
IronWillGiroud wrote:this is a great move,

you have to understand: we are not in a vacuum.

brilliant trade for knicks, you get a totally new dimension in your attack, you are now a new team,

situation is ripe for bargs to thrive, comeback season when he really can't do any worse than last year, which was rock bottom,

he's not asked to be the #1 guy, the #1 overall pick, now he can settle into a supporting role where he will be asked to do less and he will focus on his strengths,

then it expires with amar'e? that's brilliant, a lot of cash comes off the books that summer which means HONEY POT,

so you bang with bargs and amar'e one more year, maybe they make more moves, and if it fails you don't lose anything and if it works you will be a scarier team in the playoffs,

bargs can ball, he's a serious baller, there were some issues last year outside of the game that threw the fork in the wheels,

and if you're worried about draft picks? why should you be worried? they replenish every year, you will never run out of draft picks, and for our team, draft picks don't have any value if we hold them, because we don't develop players, so why not trade them?

+1,000,0000!

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CrushAlot
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7/2/2013  1:12 AM
knicks1248 wrote:
Andrew wrote:
Sangfroid wrote:I don't know Nix, that looks like some Amar'e D. Woodie is gonna have his hands full! He needs to have a training camp solely on defense. He needs to live up to that defensive guru title and get everybody on the same page.

You mean Woodies job is easier. He can use the same scheme to cover for Bargs as he does for Amare.

he didn't cover up for Amares "D", he look just like Barg on D 85% of the time, always has his back to the ball and turns around to late, always out of position and gets occasional blocks for being athletic.

the only way to cover for a weak defender... surround him with a lot of defensive players..

THINK ALLAN HOUSTON

Didn't the Knicks play an effective zone towards the end of the year when Amare was in?
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
nixluva
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7/2/2013  2:30 AM
CrushAlot wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Andrew wrote:
Sangfroid wrote:I don't know Nix, that looks like some Amar'e D. Woodie is gonna have his hands full! He needs to have a training camp solely on defense. He needs to live up to that defensive guru title and get everybody on the same page.

You mean Woodies job is easier. He can use the same scheme to cover for Bargs as he does for Amare.

he didn't cover up for Amares "D", he look just like Barg on D 85% of the time, always has his back to the ball and turns around to late, always out of position and gets occasional blocks for being athletic.

the only way to cover for a weak defender... surround him with a lot of defensive players..

THINK ALLAN HOUSTON

Didn't the Knicks play an effective zone towards the end of the year when Amare was in?

One thing Woody has done is get a bit more out of guys who have been awful defensively. STAT, Melo, Cope and even Novak did get better. They still aren't consistently good defenders, but you can see some improvement over time. STAT is literally one of the worst cases i've ever seen. I did see some improvement tho and that gives hope for Bargs. Bargs seems like another player who can be improved. Get better positioning and awareness of what he should be doing. Knowing the rotations and giving more effort. I just don't think Bargs simply can't get better. Woody has a decent track record of getting more out of his players. Thibs has also been very effective at getting guys to defend. Belinelli was horrid, but he actually got better under Thibs, so it's possible to get a player to improve defensively.

Markji
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7/2/2013  6:36 AM
VDesai wrote:The ball don't lie article is overwhelmingly negative and perhaps factually incorrect, especially if Golden State was willing to offer David Lee (an all-star player) in a trade for him.

The article was overwelmingly truthful. But you are right, it didn't give any positives, only the negatives, and Bargnani does have some positives. He plays the high post and sets picks; good at the PnR; good hands; moves well for a 7 footer; can easily shoot over his defender; etc. He injured his right elbow (shooting arm) last year. Don't know what injury the previous year. If Bargs is healthy and regains his shooting form, he can help us. If not healthy and/or shoots like he did the past 2 years, then he and the trade are a total waste.

It still doesn't negate the fact that we negotiated terribly for him.
Also I hope we still sign KMart who, to me is the most important re-signing we can do.

Since Bargnani is a Knick, I will wait, give him the benefit of the doubt, and root for him.

The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
mattshaw78
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7/2/2013  6:44 AM
We didn't give up much for Bargnani to tell you the truth. Camby is invisible, basically Bargnani is Novak but a bit better and the draft picks let me tell you about that. The first round that Denver has the right to swap, nothing comes out good in the 20s that will help this team and furthermore we suck in drafting. The only thing that came out good besides Ewing was David Lee. Granted Bargnani can't rebound better than some guards/forwards and can't block shots but with this trade you will have cap room in 2015 with his contract, melo, stat and Tyson coming off the books.

Bargnani will open the floor a bit for you considering his outside shot which also means that Melo can play the 3 again.

BlueSeats "I like anyone who can make Lebron cry. Melo seems to do it a lot."
misterearl
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7/2/2013  7:23 AM
A Contradiction

mattshaw78 wrote:
Bargnani will open the floor a bit for you considering his outside shot which also means that Melo can play the 3 again.

Bargnani is a skill forward. He will roam outside the paint and hoist jumpers. Anything he contributes inside is a bonus.

Carmelo will drive to the rack without fear, as he did last season, and score inside of 15 feet. Anything he contributes from three point range is a bonus.

Tyson Chandler will rebound the misses or tap loose balls back to the perimeter.

once a knick always a knick
DurzoBlint
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7/2/2013  8:10 AM
Vmart wrote:I know why they call him the Magician, he is a giant disappearing act.

Has anyone heard if he is recovered from the elbow injury?

the fact that you can't even have an unrelated thread without some tool here bringing him up make me think that rational minds are few and far between. Bunch of emotionally weak, angst riddled people. I mean, how many times can you argue the same shyt
Andrea "Il Mago" (The Magician) Bargnani Appreciation

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