fishmike wrote:

JrZyHuStLa wrote:

fishmike wrote:

JrZyHuStLa wrote:You're borderline flip flopping, Fish.

not at all man. Not at all. Ewing was ALWAYS a top 10 player. I never thought him as an MVP. And he was MY guy.

Top 10 means one could argue there are 9 other guys better than you, which in Melo's case is close to true. MVP means your not only a top 2-3 player, your also the key player on an elite team.

How is that flopping or the same?

Again... stop HEARING that Melo not MVP = Melo is trash. Only TFK says that

Melo is a good player, but isnt ironic his best start to his best season he's letting the ball go through someone else? You know the one season Melo played with a guy who took more shots than him was ALSO his best statistical season? Go look up the year Iverson took a trillion shots. Melo was pretty much 2nd option playing off him and has a MONSTER season and I believe his best FG% ever. Less is more.

Happy Melo is playing like a top 10 guy. Even happier if he still is this spring. I dont give a phuck about awards he's got no shot to win. I want to win some playoff games. Its been a long time.

What Ewing did to be in the race is NO different than what Anthony is doing to be in it. It's not because of points, rebounds, assists, defense.
It's about being on a winning team. It's instant recognition to be in the MVP race.

And Ewing never won it because there were always a few players who were better and also had better records. Same applies with Anthony. There's better guys out there with better records.

But it doesn't exclude him from the race.

and here is where your just dead wrong man, and to me is the heart of the MVP arguement. Knicks built a defensive team around Ewing that advanced in the playoffs for a decade AND the guy was their leading scorer. 7 times all NBA, 3 times all NBA defense. Those along WITH all the playoff wins = quantifying proof that Ewing was 'more valuable' that Melo. Does Melo anchor this team's defense? Is he a stopper like Kobe has been in his career? NO NO NO NO NO NO

Your off on this one amigo. Surely you can see this?

THERE is one thing great players seem to have in common.. they usually excel on both sides of the ball, wade, kobe, lebron all made all defensive teams, heck even larry bird did.. either that or they are just so dominant in one area...

gunsnewing wrote:Knicks are a lottery team without Melo. Miami was more of an aberration. The ugliness of the Chicago game would be more of the norm if we ever lost melo for an extended period of time. Can't rely on Amare being healthy. The team is built around Melo. Melo will certainly be considered for MVP. Lebron still deserves it and who cares about individual awards and accolades

NUPE wrote:

fishmike wrote:Durant... more FTs, more assists, more rebounds, more steals, shooting 50% vs. Melo's 45%, more PPG, more wins...

Really? You want to go there? WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY

Just enjoy Melo if you love him! There is no crime in that. Poor taste is a god given right in the USA! Sarcasm on that last part but really... if you think Melo is just as good you havent watched KD. He's better at everything. Cmon man

I said Durant is more efficient and indicated I give Durant the edge over Melo. I did not say Melo is as good or better than Durant. You should grab a copy of Hooked on Phonics and/or the closest Webster's Dictionary, pal.

I have never believed KD is much better than Melo. They are very similar players overall. I give KD the edge

fishmike wrote:NUPE.. I agree. KD gets the edge in rebounding, passing, scoring, steals, shot blocking, FG%, number of FTs taken, and pretty much every other quantifiable stat there is in the NBA including game results. Aside from that, your right... its neck and neck with KD getting the edge.

Better?

For their careers and most of the recent seasons KD and Melo are very close in regards to rebounds and assists. I gave KD the nod in regards to efficiency which pertains to %'s. I clearly said KD is more efficient. So yea, I would say they are similar with KD having the edge overall. Their playstyles are very similar in that they are primarily scorers that rebound. Neither player could run point-forward effectively if they had to like Lebron could. KD is far closer to Melo than LeBron. That is just reality. If this gets your panties in a bunch I don't care.

I believe I posted rankings, on this board, of the top 15 or so players and I had Durant around #7 and Melo around #10. I view them as similar players with Durant being more efficient and being slightly better. For their careers their rebounding and assist numbers are essentially identical. However, Durant is consistently more efficient year in and year out therefore I rank him higher than Melo. Neither can run point-forward. Neither is some great playmaker. They are primarily scorers above all else that rebound well. Thus, they are similar in regards to playstyle, imo.

Both are MVP candidate and either could conceivably win it for various reason. The same goes for LeBron.

fishmike wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Knicks are a lottery team without Melo. Miami was more of an aberration. The ugliness of the Chicago game would be more of the norm if we ever lost melo for an extended period of time. Can't rely on Amare being healthy. The team is built around Melo. Melo will certainly be considered for MVP. Lebron still deserves it and who cares about individual awards and accolades

no way man... take Melo and Stat off this team its still a .500 team at least. Probably not much more but Felton/JR/Novak/Kidd/Brewer/Shump/CAmby/Sheed/Prigo/Chandler etc etc is NOT a lottery team. Cmon now.

This team would not even make the playoffs if Melo and Stat are off the team.

A starting five of:

Felton
Kidd
Brewer
Kurt Thomas
Tyson Chandler

That team would struggle to score more often than not. Kidd will not get all these open threes. They'd be chucking up low % contested jump shots night after night. It would be atrocious. Felton and JR would take the majority of the shot attempts which is not a recipe for success night in and night out. This team would get maybe 35ish wins at best.

NUPE wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:By the way Lebron and KD over Melo.

Yea...

I have it like

LeBron
.
.
Wade
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
Durant
.
.
Melo

I have it Lebron then Durant then Tyson.

gunsnewing wrote:I don't see how you can put Wade in the conversation. 1) He is breaking down 2) Heat were a lottery team before adding Lebron and Bosh

Lottery team? LoL.

Wade is not in the running for MVP. However, I consider Wade to be a better player than Durant despite Wade's slow start this year. As I said earlier in this thread, MVP is not a best player in the NBA award. It is a best player on one of the 4 best teams award.

NUPE wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:I don't see how you can put Wade in the conversation. 1) He is breaking down 2) Heat were a lottery team before adding Lebron and Bosh

Lottery team? LoL.

Wade is not in the running for MVP. However, I consider Wade to be a better player than Durant despite Wade's slow start this year. As I said earlier in this thread, MVP is not a best player in the NBA award. It is a best player on one of the 4 best teams award.

LOL how did they get Micheal Beasley again? Like most players he needs the right core around him. The great thing for him is that he played with some great players. IS that his fault no but did he benefit yes.