Uptown wrote:

s3231 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

nixluva wrote:My problem with Woody started even when the team was winning. I will NEVER agree that a plan to just live off one guy getting ridiculously hot is a good plan for a team winning. Woody was supposed to make sure that his best players got more touches, but only Melo got more touches. Both STAT and Tyson are more efficient scorers than Melo, with the exception of Melo's hot April, which we had to know was unsustainable. When I some of us were complaining during the wins that this was not a winning formula for this team, guys like mrknickshot, Anji etc. kept blasting us as haters. HOW'D THAT TURN OUT???

We all know that we lost Lin, but that doesn't mean you can't run better sets and have motion and ball movement to create better shots for everyone. The entire reason for running the spread offense with off the ball motion is to keep the middle open for attacking the basket!!!
You don't want the opposing D to be able to setup and stay in position. You want them to have to move and shift so that you can attack them for high % shots. You can't do that with strict Melo Ball. He's not some quick guard that can breakdown a defense by himself. So he ended up taking a lot of perimeter shots and didn't get to the line enough. That's low % BB. You want to get STAT and Tyson involved because they shoot closer to the basket and draw fouls. So not only do STAT and Tyson shoot a higher % from the floor, but they get to the Free Throw line too, which is even higher %.

So my concern about Woody is will he be capable of figuring out how to use STAT, Melo and Tyson? He certainly failed at doing that this go round. People are putting too much into the 18-6. It's a historical fact that often coaches get a boost from the coaching change and teams will go on a run but eventually settle back down into the mean. Woody had the coaching change Bump and Melo got HOT during April. Those things combined were fools gold. It wasn't real. That's not a winning formula for a normal 82 game schedule!!! Woody still has a problem similar to what MDA faced. His team plays best in a different style from that of his best player. The rest of the team thrives in uptempo, spread offense with PnR and ball movement and Melo thrives in ISO. That's a structural problem IMO. MDA wanted Melo to adjust a bit and I don't believe he was wrong. PJax would also want Melo to adjust IMO. Not totally change, but realize that the team has to be involved for most of the game and then when it's crunchtime Melo can get more ISO plays to seal a win.

It worked for 18-6 and for every win - blah blah blah blah blah in the game thread and after - was just the usual annoyance that we are accustom to

SEE? I WAS RIGHT IT WAS A BAD RECIPEE - WE LOST!

uhhh - we lost to the MIAMI HEAT with half are team gone to injury

YUP - you were right

Just like the Linsanity schedule - you completely don't get it

You know you really do need to learn how to make a convincing argument. Why don't you explain to me how what i'm saying is wrong in terms of the basketball specific merits of what i've been saying? It's just a fact that it's better for this team if they play a more team oriented style rather than ISO Melo. Don't use the 18-6 close to the season under Woody as some evidence that ISO Melo is the right way to go. That was a mirage!!! We see what happens if Melo isn't completely on fire playing ISO Melo. You can't beat good teams that way. The idea is to actually win a title one day.

What is the point of having STAT and Tyson who both shoot over 50% if you aren't going to use them? STAT was 4-7 and Tyson 3-6 in the last game!!! Melo was on the floor for 42 freakin minutes and took 31 shots and had only 1 assist. Heck STAT had 1 assist and Tyson had 3!!! Woody needed to do a better job of making sure we used all of our weapons. I'm concerned that based on Woodson's entire career and his time as coach here that he has ABSOLUTELY NO ANSWERS for how this is going to work offensively. I love the guys moxie and style as a coach, but he seemed outmatched by Spoelstra, a guy I have no respect for as a coach.

Totally agree with Nix and will add that you know something is wrong when JR Smith is getting significantly more shots than Amare Stoudemire....who is only one of the best big men in NBA history in terms of running the pick and roll....but no, let's just stand and watch Melo/JR go iso for 90% of the game.

Stat is/was fantastic at running PNR and it begs the question, since Tyson Chandlers arrival, why did MDA run almost exclusive PNR with Chandler while Stat was a bystander usually on the other elbow or baseline? Once Woodson took over, Lin got hurt 6-7 games in and we no longer could run the PNR effectively without a legit pg. Did wish Woodson would have run PNR's between Melo and Stat more often once Lin went down.

Yes - I saw them do it once yesterday and have no clue why that was not done more, especially since all Tyson was doing when he rolled was getting called for charges.

Did you hear his time out speaches? They went something like this:

"Run, jump, shoot!"
"We have to want it more!" (Team is up by 10pts)
"Keep playing basketball!"

You don't have to run many plays when you have 2 of the best playmakers in the NBA.

mrKnickShot wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:He is not mobile enough to get run away from the screen and get open in time for a 3. His 3's came off Lins penetration drawing the defense and against poor defenses. Its not just miami check his games against chicago. One game where he scored a whooping 12pts. The other games he was shut down. He is an unathletunathletc 6'10 immobile spot up 3pt shooter hes not reggie miller, ray allen or even steve kerr

or Korver, JJ Red, Mike Dunleavy

Very similar to Matt Bonner

What, they all Circumsized?

gunsnewing wrote:He is not mobile enough to run away from the screen and get open in time for an open 3. His 3's came off Lins penetration drawing the defense and against poor defenses. Its not just miami check his games against chicago. One game where he scored a whooping 12pts. The other games he was shut down. He is an unathletetic 6'10 immobile spot up 3pt shooter hes not reggie miller, ray allen or even steve kerr

dude you don't have to be mobile to stand in a spot and have someone set a screen for you while someone is passing you the ball. this never happened ONCE.

it's not rocket science.

PresIke wrote:

franco12 wrote:

Jackson is either going to get some of these softies (Melo) mentally tough or prove they aren't championship caliber.

melo isn't mentally tough? based on what evidence does one come to this conclusion?

Mentally tough dudes don't smile, they growl

nyk4ever wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:He is not mobile enough to run away from the screen and get open in time for an open 3. His 3's came off Lins penetration drawing the defense and against poor defenses. Its not just miami check his games against chicago. One game where he scored a whooping 12pts. The other games he was shut down. He is an unathletetic 6'10 immobile spot up 3pt shooter hes not reggie miller, ray allen or even steve kerr

dude you don't have to be mobile to stand in a spot and have someone set a screen for you while someone is passing you the ball. this never happened ONCE.

it's not rocket science.

gunsnewing wrote:

MaTT4281 wrote:This series pushed my Woodson opinion down from "Sure thing" to "Meh."

We could do a whole lot worse than Woody, but his post season offensive sets were brutal to watch. My chief complaint is Novak...9 FGA the entire series. Now I know the Heat paid him close attention, but you can't just wait for Miami to leave him open...RUN A DAMN PLAY FOR HIM!

I'd definitely welcome him back, but if one of the Grumpy Old Men decide to come back to coach, make it happen.

Novak isn't fast enough to get open on Miami when a play is run for him. Unless Lin is penetrating and drawing the entire defense. Something neither Davis or Bibby are able to do

gunsnewing wrote:Its funny. Novak had plenty of open looks in the regular season under woodson who everyone wants gone. I wonder if the Heat fast defense and Novaks lack of speed to get open on them had anything to do with it? Please explain

[late response/rant] We sent Melo 3 screens in a single play (Game 4). Meanwhile, we seemed to tell Novak, "Go stand in the corner and wait for the ball. Pump fake if you absolutely need to." Not to compare Melo and Novakane, but just the complete lack of attempts to try and free him up. 47% from 3 this year, and we used him as a glorified decoy the entire series.

If you're convinced you can't get him a shot, then he should not be on the floor for 20+ minutes a game, and certainly not starting! It took Woody until game 4 to cut back his minutes. I'm sure Lin will help tremendously, but when you're on-court coach is missing, it's up to the one on the sidelines to get things going. [/late response/rant]

MaTT4281 wrote:Only problem is, we're down 3-0 in the series by the time we get him off the court. Once again, I put that on the coach.

Who was the other option fields? JR who missed a million shots?

MaTT4281 wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

MaTT4281 wrote:Only problem is, we're down 3-0 in the series by the time we get him off the court. Once again, I put that on the coach.

Who was the other option fields? JR who missed a million shots?

Apparently.

JR:
7-17
6-11
5-18
3-15
3-15

Should Novak have gotten some of JR's shots? Absolutely.
I'm not sure what we're arguing here.

Starting to run around in circles now, so I'll just end by restating, I don't mind bringing Woodson back. He's done a lot of good things in his opportunity here. He's just given himself a couple bad marks on what was a perfect record.

I welcome the offseason.