Nalod wrote:

Took forever to play him, had one good game.

"Forever" is a relative term..

The guy started as a rookie. He was not ready, then he got hurt, then he started playing well.

Rookies and young players are inconsistant before they are constistant. Its progress.

20 games is forever in knickland.

We are calling for the coach's head and already ready to re-trade the team.

Gallo, was fine under MDA, yes inconsistent but fine, you really don’t pay attention to the NBA as a whole. Not everyone is Lebrom or Shaq or Duncan, and considering that Gallinari missed most of his rookie season due to back problems he was on his way up with the Knicks for sure. Aside from statistics, is very important for rookies and young players to develop a strong work ethic and discipline in order to succeed in the NBA. This is why Donnie Walsh brought MDA and I believe he did a good job with most of them, not every one of them, but then again who does?

KnicksFE wrote:

Nalod wrote:

Took forever to play him, had one good game.

"Forever" is a relative term..

The guy started as a rookie. He was not ready, then he got hurt, then he started playing well.

Rookies and young players are inconsistant before they are constistant. Its progress.

20 games is forever in knickland.

We are calling for the coach's head and already ready to re-trade the team.

Gallo, was fine under MDA, yes inconsistent but fine, you really don’t pay attention to the NBA as a whole. Not everyone is Lebrom or Shaq or Duncan, and considering that Gallinari missed most of his rookie season due to back problems he was on his way up with the Knicks for sure. Aside from statistics, is very important for rookies and young players to develop a strong work ethic and discipline in order to succeed in the NBA. This is why Donnie Walsh brought MDA and I believe he did a good job with most of them, not every one of them, but then again who does?

Sorry for not paying attention to the NBA as a whole. Please teach me ...

What young guys did MDA do a suprisingly good job with? Gallo? Did he play above his potential to that point? below? as expected? Moz?

MDA actually has some good qualities as a coach for the right team but this is not one of them.

MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:D'Antoni had Felton dropping 17/9 and in All-Star discussion.

He was already an established player - was talking about the yoots.

Funny how people forget how Felton was not doing that great before he was traded. I still miss the dude.

mrKnickShot wrote:

KnicksFE wrote:

Nalod wrote:

Took forever to play him, had one good game.

"Forever" is a relative term..

The guy started as a rookie. He was not ready, then he got hurt, then he started playing well.

Rookies and young players are inconsistant before they are constistant. Its progress.

20 games is forever in knickland.

We are calling for the coach's head and already ready to re-trade the team.

Gallo, was fine under MDA, yes inconsistent but fine, you really don’t pay attention to the NBA as a whole. Not everyone is Lebrom or Shaq or Duncan, and considering that Gallinari missed most of his rookie season due to back problems he was on his way up with the Knicks for sure. Aside from statistics, is very important for rookies and young players to develop a strong work ethic and discipline in order to succeed in the NBA. This is why Donnie Walsh brought MDA and I believe he did a good job with most of them, not every one of them, but then again who does?

Sorry for not paying attention to the NBA as a whole. Please teach me ...

What young guys did MDA do a suprisingly good job with? Gallo? Did he play above his potential to that point? below? as expected? Moz?

MDA actually has some good qualities as a coach for the right team but this is not one of them.

Moz. Gallo. Wilson. Lando. Shump. Dlee (mr. Double Double here)

AR not here long enough.

Miss: Golden Nate, Jordo Hill

Bippity10 wrote:

JrZyHuStLa wrote:Funny how the legendary coaches of this game never demanded players of their "type", but only asked for toughness, unselfishness, and an aspiration to win.

But then you have guys complaining about Dantoni not having his type of players.

Ridiculous.

D'Antoni is not a legendary coach so why put him in that class. There are very few "legendary" coaches so you have to win with something else. Unless Phil Jackson comes here, no one we hire is going to be a "legendary" coach. So since that is the case we need to support our coach and provide him with players that suit his style. My guess is that this is a quicker way to win then putting random players on the floor and then hoping htat our coach becomes "legendary"

My point exactly.

If the great coaches never had a type, why does D'antoni?

mrKnickShot wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

KnicksFE wrote:

Nalod wrote:

Took forever to play him, had one good game.

"Forever" is a relative term..

The guy started as a rookie. He was not ready, then he got hurt, then he started playing well.

Rookies and young players are inconsistant before they are constistant. Its progress.

20 games is forever in knickland.

We are calling for the coach's head and already ready to re-trade the team.

Gallo, was fine under MDA, yes inconsistent but fine, you really don’t pay attention to the NBA as a whole. Not everyone is Lebrom or Shaq or Duncan, and considering that Gallinari missed most of his rookie season due to back problems he was on his way up with the Knicks for sure. Aside from statistics, is very important for rookies and young players to develop a strong work ethic and discipline in order to succeed in the NBA. This is why Donnie Walsh brought MDA and I believe he did a good job with most of them, not every one of them, but then again who does?

Sorry for not paying attention to the NBA as a whole. Please teach me ...

What young guys did MDA do a suprisingly good job with? Gallo? Did he play above his potential to that point? below? as expected? Moz?

MDA actually has some good qualities as a coach for the right team but this is not one of them.

So what your saying is that, The knicks higher a coach (under a 4 yr contract) take 3 years to rebuild, then aquire players that don't fit his style, and call him incompetent of running the team..

I want you to name me one coach in this league( as far back as i could remember) that doesn't mold he's team into his style..

Uh - Pat Riley with Knicks?

mrKnickShot wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

KnicksFE wrote:

Nalod wrote:

Took forever to play him, had one good game.

"Forever" is a relative term..

The guy started as a rookie. He was not ready, then he got hurt, then he started playing well.

Rookies and young players are inconsistant before they are constistant. Its progress.

20 games is forever in knickland.

We are calling for the coach's head and already ready to re-trade the team.

Gallo, was fine under MDA, yes inconsistent but fine, you really don’t pay attention to the NBA as a whole. Not everyone is Lebrom or Shaq or Duncan, and considering that Gallinari missed most of his rookie season due to back problems he was on his way up with the Knicks for sure. Aside from statistics, is very important for rookies and young players to develop a strong work ethic and discipline in order to succeed in the NBA. This is why Donnie Walsh brought MDA and I believe he did a good job with most of them, not every one of them, but then again who does?

Sorry for not paying attention to the NBA as a whole. Please teach me ...

What young guys did MDA do a suprisingly good job with? Gallo? Did he play above his potential to that point? below? as expected? Moz?

MDA actually has some good qualities as a coach for the right team but this is not one of them.

So what your saying is that, The knicks higher a coach (under a 4 yr contract) take 3 years to rebuild, then aquire players that don't fit his style, and call him incompetent of running the team..

I want you to name me one coach in this league( as far back as i could remember) that doesn't mold he's team into his style..

Uh - Pat Riley with Knicks?

I agree about Riley. The other guy that comes to mind is Mike Fratello. He had a pretty potent offense in Atlanta but when he went to Cleveland he slowed things down so much it was painful but it worked and gave that franchise the best chance to win. I think everyone that knows basketball agrees that D'Antoni is handicapped by how Knick management chose to build the team without regard to his style. That being said, Nix just posted an article on two very successful coaches that adjusted their offensive style to fit their roster. In contrast, the most common criticism of D'Antoni is that he is a roster specific coach and won't change to emphasize the strenght of his roster. D'Antoni's rigidity in regards to his style is at least part of the reason he left Phoenix where he was being asked to change and chose NY over Chicago, a team with a much better roster, when he came here. Walsh accepted him as is and offered more money. For all the talk some here have about D'Antoni sacrificing to coach this team he went where the money was the best and where he was going to be allowed to do what he wanted no questions asked about defense. D'Antoni chose a roster much less suited to his style then the one he left or the one he could have had if he went to Chicago because he was being asked to compromise his style.

+1000

Could not disagree with anything you said. Very valid points.

While I agree that MDA would prefer players that fit his style (what coach wouldn’t?)So he could be more successful, I also believe that he had tried to adjust to the roster as well, he may not be great at it, but we are nothing like the Phoenix Sun for sure. And for those who say that MDA needs Nash in order to be successful, last year we got to the playoff with Raymond Felton and Billups at the point, to me that was success. I may sound like a MDA supporter but I’m really not, I just want the Knicks to win games and be a top team, but I have to call it the way I see it on the games regardless of the labels and perception.

loweyecue wrote:

raven wrote:

MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:First winning season since Van Gundy's 48 wins in 2000-2001.

40 different players over 3 years; still makes playoffs last season.

Felton dropping 17/9 on a winning team. Felton 11/6 since leaving.

Season sabotaged by robbing him of the one thing he asks for: a halfway-decent point guard.

You don't understand, it'S the D'Antony's fault if:

- marbury was a headcase
- crawful was shooting us out of games
- spoon was getting rejected all the freaking time
- Qyntel Woods botched that stupid 360 while we were loosing the game by at least 20 points
- KT couldn't jumpo over a pancake
- Mardy Collins was not Allen Iverson
- Anfernee Hardaway had bionic knees but didn't have any oil left to make them work
- Nazr Mohammed was the key to the deal
- Mike Sweetney was overweight
- Vin Baker was a drunk
- Frank Williams was overweight
- shandon anderson could score
- Eisley couldn't pass
- Melo doesn't want to pass
- Curry couldn't keep his weight down
- Dice couldn't just walk
- Othella harrington played like Othella harrington, which was way worse than playing like let's say, Bruno Sundov
- Larry Hughes was disgruntled
- Tim Thomas only played when he wanted to
- Zach Randolph invented new ways to dribble on his feet
- Trevor Ariza was not kept although he was a promising young player
- Stat doesn't understand what boxing out means
- Moochie Norris had a weird haircut
- Chris Duhon couldn't last a full season at full speed while partying every night
- J.R. Giddens had that weird alien look
- Jared Jeffries was the glue and as such never bled when hit on his mouth
- Darko Milicic was out of shape and didn't care cause he was a badass russian hitman wannabe
- Nate Robinson was a human circus
- Jerome James had one good playoff series in his career and got a full MLE for that
- Quentin Richardson was overweight
- Malik Rose was LOL Malik ****ing Rose that couldn't jump, shoot, pass or dribble
- Tracy Mc Grady was not Tracy Mc Grady
- Chris Wilcox was finished
- Renaldo Balkman smoked too much pot
- David Lee was not 7ft tall
- Steve Francis was added to the Knicks
- Channing Frye had only one ball and a small one on top of that
- Jackie Butler never paned out
- DerMarr Johnson had a broken neck when we got him

It is D'Antony'S fault for all of this, and for that, he have to be fired.

This time, it's gonna be different, trust me.

Pretty much accurate. I would add its MDA's fault that:

Dolan overpaid for Melo
Gallo learned what MDA taught him and became a player everyone wants
Balkman can't jump
Jeffries can't figure out that the ball is supposed to go in from the top of the basket downward
Amare couldn't defend his grandmother from dunking on him
Lebron rejected us
Dolan and Walsh overpaid for Amare
Team is chock full of third string scrubs
Anthony Randolph makes George Bush look like a genius
Eddy Curry gaineore weight during the season than he lost in the off season each year

Yep all of these things are absolutely his fault. He will be fired soon.

Shump is a rookie with a history of causing lots of turnovers in college.
Landry Fields doesn't get to play Havlicek to Bill's Russell.
Toney D is dumber than a Harvard grad.
New York has D-Fence signs, and Threenix didn't.
His owner is a contrarian putz, and enjoys being that way.
Walsh was old when he got here, and the wheelchair didn't help.
The Celts won a chip with the original Starphuque, turning Doc Rivers from Avery Johnson into Red Auerbach overnight.
The IT debacle era made the prior 3 years go by way too fast for UK posters.

Fire the bastid, burn down all that is dear to him, and pee on the ashes.
I want so much to go back to the days of waiting for all that potential to turn into stars.

raven wrote:

MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:First winning season since Van Gundy's 48 wins in 2000-2001.

40 different players over 3 years; still makes playoffs last season.

Felton dropping 17/9 on a winning team. Felton 11/6 since leaving.

Season sabotaged by robbing him of the one thing he asks for: a halfway-decent point guard.

You don't understand, it'S the D'Antony's fault if:

- marbury was a headcase
- crawful was shooting us out of games
- spoon was getting rejected all the freaking time
- Qyntel Woods botched that stupid 360 while we were loosing the game by at least 20 points
- KT couldn't jumpo over a pancake
- Mardy Collins was not Allen Iverson
- Anfernee Hardaway had bionic knees but didn't have any oil left to make them work
- Nazr Mohammed was the key to the deal
- Mike Sweetney was overweight
- Vin Baker was a drunk
- Frank Williams was overweight
- shandon anderson could score
- Eisley couldn't pass
- Melo doesn't want to pass
- Curry couldn't keep his weight down
- Dice couldn't just walk
- Othella harrington played like Othella harrington, which was way worse than playing like let's say, Bruno Sundov
- Larry Hughes was disgruntled
- Tim Thomas only played when he wanted to
- Zach Randolph invented new ways to dribble on his feet
- Trevor Ariza was not kept although he was a promising young player
- Stat doesn't understand what boxing out means
- Moochie Norris had a weird haircut
- Chris Duhon couldn't last a full season at full speed while partying every night
- J.R. Giddens had that weird alien look
- Jared Jeffries was the glue and as such never bled when hit on his mouth
- Darko Milicic was out of shape and didn't care cause he was a badass russian hitman wannabe
- Nate Robinson was a human circus
- Jerome James had one good playoff series in his career and got a full MLE for that
- Quentin Richardson was overweight
- Malik Rose was LOL Malik ****ing Rose that couldn't jump, shoot, pass or dribble
- Tracy Mc Grady was not Tracy Mc Grady
- Chris Wilcox was finished
- Renaldo Balkman smoked too much pot
- David Lee was not 7ft tall
- Steve Francis was added to the Knicks
- Channing Frye had only one ball and a small one on top of that
- Jackie Butler never paned out
- DerMarr Johnson had a broken neck when we got him

It is D'Antony'S fault for all of this, and for that, he have to be fired.

This time, it's gonna be different, trust me.

CrushAlot wrote:

Bippity10 wrote:So if D'Antoni is supposedly known for not changing his style(even though our offense looks nothing like 7 seconds or less), then why would you hire him if you are going in a differetn direction. And if you are not going in a different direction then why wouldn't you get him the types of players that he was successful with in Phoenix? the reality is taht Walsh thought he could win with his style. Walsh went out and got players that fit his style. We had a young squad that started to gel and was on the way up. The owner and new managemetn decided that wasn't a good plan and decided to gut the team and get players that now don't match the coach. Thus continuing the neverending NY Knicks, never going to win a championship, plan of pitting front office against coach. Why do so many Knick fans love this perpetual losing approach?

Stop comparing D'Antoni to Riley etc. Riley was a hall of fame coach. We don't have a hall of fame coach. If we fire that coach we most likely are not going to hire a hall of fame coach. So our job is to hire a good/great coach(like Lenny Wilkens was, like LB was, like D'Antoni is) and provide them with as much support as we can. To get them the players they want to build their teams. Why would we not do that? Hirign a coach, and then signing players that don't match his style and then demanding that the coach change his approach is a ridiculously stupid approach. Why is no one up in arms at management for doing so. In my view, they are the ones that should be on the hot seat. It's a stupid approach and they better have Phil Jackson in their back pocket. IF not you will see this cycle continue. Next coach will be hired. When we start losing again and firings are expected the front office will again throw the next coach under the bus and end the next coaching career

As for Mike Fratello. Who cares if he adjusted. He hasn't won more than 50 games since 1989, was 2-18 in his last 20 playoff games and has a career playoff winning percentage of .323. My advice to Fratello would have been to stick with one style that works instead of trying to be like Pat Riley. You aren't Pat Riley so don't try to be like him. I don't want' D'Antoni to try to be like him either. I want my front office to support him and get him the players he needs or to be patient while he learns a new style or fire him, bring in a new coach that mathces the players we have and then for once, support him and get him the players he needs. Stop this ridiculous front office vs. coach nonsense

Lastly, Phil Jackson has not changed his style. He has however always had the leagues best player and great management that bends over backwards to get him what he needs. How would Phil do if we hired him, then gutted his roster 3 times in 3 year snad finally settled on a all 25 and under line-up of non passing athletes taht can't grasp the triangle?

I don't think anyone is comparing D'Antoni to Riley. I think the Riley's name comes up because he went from coaching Showtime to the Knicks and didn't try and have the Knicks play Showtime ball. It was in response to this from Knicks1248.

I want you to name me one coach in this league( as far back as i could remember) that doesn't mold he's team into his style..

That is also why Fratello was brought up. He coached a totally different style in Atlanta as opposed to Cleveland.

I think you missed my point. I know why they were brought up, I'm explaining why it's not relevant. Pat Riley adjusted because he is one of the greatest coaches of all-time and he had the ability to do so. Not everyone is Pat Riley and has the ability to switch on a dime. You can still win with those coaches if you support them and get them the players you need. We know D'Antoni is not Riley so why would we not get him the players he needs. Why would we fill his roster iwth guys that do not fit his style and then demand he change? What type of organization does that? Answer, a bad one.

As for fratello. Fratello switched his style. He was also not as successful as D'Antoni and had a horrendous playoff record(losing 18 of his 20 playoff games), so why does it matter if he changed his style?

CrushAlot wrote:

Bippity10 wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Bippity10 wrote:So if D'Antoni is supposedly known for not changing his style(even though our offense looks nothing like 7 seconds or less), then why would you hire him if you are going in a differetn direction. And if you are not going in a different direction then why wouldn't you get him the types of players that he was successful with in Phoenix? the reality is taht Walsh thought he could win with his style. Walsh went out and got players that fit his style. We had a young squad that started to gel and was on the way up. The owner and new managemetn decided that wasn't a good plan and decided to gut the team and get players that now don't match the coach. Thus continuing the neverending NY Knicks, never going to win a championship, plan of pitting front office against coach. Why do so many Knick fans love this perpetual losing approach?

Stop comparing D'Antoni to Riley etc. Riley was a hall of fame coach. We don't have a hall of fame coach. If we fire that coach we most likely are not going to hire a hall of fame coach. So our job is to hire a good/great coach(like Lenny Wilkens was, like LB was, like D'Antoni is) and provide them with as much support as we can. To get them the players they want to build their teams. Why would we not do that? Hirign a coach, and then signing players that don't match his style and then demanding that the coach change his approach is a ridiculously stupid approach. Why is no one up in arms at management for doing so. In my view, they are the ones that should be on the hot seat. It's a stupid approach and they better have Phil Jackson in their back pocket. IF not you will see this cycle continue. Next coach will be hired. When we start losing again and firings are expected the front office will again throw the next coach under the bus and end the next coaching career

As for Mike Fratello. Who cares if he adjusted. He hasn't won more than 50 games since 1989, was 2-18 in his last 20 playoff games and has a career playoff winning percentage of .323. My advice to Fratello would have been to stick with one style that works instead of trying to be like Pat Riley. You aren't Pat Riley so don't try to be like him. I don't want' D'Antoni to try to be like him either. I want my front office to support him and get him the players he needs or to be patient while he learns a new style or fire him, bring in a new coach that mathces the players we have and then for once, support him and get him the players he needs. Stop this ridiculous front office vs. coach nonsense

Lastly, Phil Jackson has not changed his style. He has however always had the leagues best player and great management that bends over backwards to get him what he needs. How would Phil do if we hired him, then gutted his roster 3 times in 3 year snad finally settled on a all 25 and under line-up of non passing athletes taht can't grasp the triangle?

I don't think anyone is comparing D'Antoni to Riley. I think the Riley's name comes up because he went from coaching Showtime to the Knicks and didn't try and have the Knicks play Showtime ball. It was in response to this from Knicks1248.

I want you to name me one coach in this league( as far back as i could remember) that doesn't mold he's team into his style..

That is also why Fratello was brought up. He coached a totally different style in Atlanta as opposed to Cleveland.

I think you missed my point. I know why they were brought up, I'm explaining why it's not relevant. Pat Riley adjusted because he is one of the greatest coaches of all-time and he had the ability to do so. Not everyone is Pat Riley and has the ability to switch on a dime. You can still win with those coaches if you support them and get them the players you need. We know D'Antoni is not Riley so why would we not get him the players he needs. Why would we fill his roster iwth guys that do not fit his style and then demand he change? What type of organization does that? Answer, a bad one.

As for fratello. Fratello switched his style. He was also not as successful as D'Antoni and had a horrendous playoff record(losing 18 of his 20 playoff games), so why does it matter if he changed his style?

I guess it matters if someone says no one does it. My initial response also noted that D'Antoni chose the job where he wasn't being asked to change but where he also would have the roster that was least suited to his style.

I'm confused. D'Antoni chose a job where he knew they would have to gut the team and then would be given a roster that would fit his style (We can't prove this but judging by the roster Walsh gave him and the amount of input he had in to decisions this was the case). That team with Chandler and Gallo and Stoudemire was exactly suited for D'Antoni. D'Antoni had direct repsonsibility for some of those moves. Then Dolan stepped in, cleared the trade for Melo and gutted the team again. Then Walsh quit. Now we are back to doing the exact same things we did before Walsh got here, and as long as D'Antoni is fired all the fans will be satisfied until it's time to fire and ruin the reputation of the next jerkoff coach. Rinse, cycle, repeat.

Let me ask it this way. Do you think that Phil Jackson is going to ever sign here, if he is not guaranteed to get the type of team he wants?????? Do you think if we turn to PJ and say "We are going to fill the roster with who we want. YOu shut up and accept it. If we give you a bunch of idiots taht can't run the triangle offense then you need to scrap it and come up with a new style like Pat Riley and Mike Fratello would do". Do you think he would ever come here under those circumsstances??? Isn't that exactly what we just did to Mike?