Posted by sebstar:

Posted by TMS:

Posted by sebstar:
How about this: Keep all the race shyt and black people in general out of your mouth, duke.

any discussions on race, religion, morality, sexuality & politics on any forum is bound to result in heated discussion & in most cases frustration & bitterness towards other posters... everyone's got a different viewpoint on these topics & no matter what you say to the contrary you are not likely to change anyone else's viewpoint.

seb, i am feeling your frustration on most of these race discussions but i think we both have to realize getting frustrated over other people's viewpoints on race is just a waste of our time... let people believe what they want to believe... nothing you or i say to them is gonna change their point of view on anything so let's just use this forum to voice our own opinions on this topic & let the rest believe what they will.

[Edited by - TMS on 08-20-2009 12:16 PM]

I feel you bro, but I'm getting tired of cats around here making these racially inflammatory statements on the daily and then trying to turn it around like we're picking on them and being angry minorities when we call them out on their bullshyt.

They think its some funny little game and they're being cute with all this.

Posted by Allanfan20:

Racial profiling was brought up when Briggs brought it up. He simply said "Nate might have been a victim of racial profiling."

Can't believe it escelated into this blood battle.

Posted by Allanfan20:

Please don't place me in with the other guys b/c I wasn't even part of this discussion, nor in Nalods thread. I was just pointing out the comments.

However, if you'd like me to speak in behalf of Briggs, then sure. I think he might have meant that Nate could have been pulled over simply b/c he was black and that arose suspicion from the cops.

As for Nalod, I don't know what he's talking about because I have hardly been reading his comments in this thread or the other one. Sorry.

As for me, I think you know by now that I don't just pull the race card out for any reason. It has to be clear that there's racial profiling in my mind because it's f'ed up to accuse someone of doing so if it's really not true. It's REALLY f'ed up. It's also F'ed up to brush it off like it's nothing, if it really IS true.

Sorry if I can't provide you with a better answer though, TMS. Like I said, I hardly read this thread and Nalods thread much. I hope you know me though and have a decent grasp of my views, and if not, maybe I can clarify them better in another thread where I'm actually participating.

Posted by Nalod:

Posted by sebstar:

Posted by martin:

Posted by sebstar:

Posted by Andrew:

sebstar, if you read the post directly prior to Nolads, Briggs mentions racial profiling.

I'll apologize for that oversight. The rest stands tho.

actually, this is kinda funny/ironic to me.

Did you initially just have a Gates-like over reaction kind of moment?

I guess you could have asked Nalod what he meant by his comment, but you went full hog, right?

Damn, you cats cant get over Gates can you, huh?

The rest stands because he is justifying racism by saying that cops will stop when it "yields less results"...thoughtless ridiculous comment.

So basically we are going to enforce second class citizenship on a group of Americans by violating their constitutional rights and justifying it because one finds a little weed on them or they have a suspended license or whatnot.

If cops just ran up in peoples houses at random and searched the entire home, they are more than likely going to find something illegal. Again its unconstitutional and it flies in the face of everything we have been taught about America.

But I guess that's expecting too much of you to understand that.

You go right to the black white thing as reflex.

Nobody said a dam thing about race.

you look real dumb trying to push all this, people can read around here doggy.

Posted by TMS:

Posted by martin:

Posted by TMS:

Posted by Allanfan20:

Racial profiling was brought up when Briggs brought it up. He simply said "Nate might have been a victim of racial profiling."

Can't believe it escelated into this blood battle.

maybe u can answer my question for me since Nalod doesn't seem to have an answer... what are u guys referring to when you bring up the word "profiling" if it doesn't have any race intonations at all?

I am pretty sure police use Offender Profiling all the time. I would guess that race plays a part in that, don't know how much or how little. Obviously when offender profiling is debased to pure racial profiling, it's a bad thing.

I think the pure meanings of Racism, Racial Profiling and Offender Profiling (or profiling in general) are 3 different animals. Could be the points of confusion.

what do u think profiling is when the race factor is subtracted? can u just give me an example to illustrate the definition? isn't profiling by it's very definition rooted in stereotypes & assumptions about a person's character or intentions at a very cursory glance at the person's appearance? that's how i define the word... maybe u see things different... feel free to let me know ur definitions cuz i don't wanna misinterpret anyone's words here.

Posted by Bippity10:

Posted by TMS:

Posted by Allanfan20:

Racial profiling was brought up when Briggs brought it up. He simply said "Nate might have been a victim of racial profiling."

Can't believe it escelated into this blood battle.

maybe u can answer my question for me since Nalod doesn't seem to have an answer... what are u guys referring to when you bring up the word "profiling" if it doesn't have any race intonations at all?

I just e-mailed a cop buddy of mine out of curiosity. He's a Hartford cop(white). Here is a summary of our conversation(this is just a summary I cut out most of the conversation, but I thought it was interesting and he doesn't pull punches. Been friends with him since birth by the way. He was one of maybe 20 white kids in high school)

Bip: What is profiling to you

Cop friend: Anything that reminds me of the last 30 dudes that committed some ridiculous crime

Bip: Does that include race

Cop friend: Yup

Bip: What do you mean?

Cop Friend: My area is 90% black and 10% hispanic. White dude shows up, his asse is getting pulled over. Hah, didn't think I'd say white dude, but that's true. I know everyone in my area so I don't pull over too many brothers for Minimal cause. If I do, trust me I got a reason and history on my side. I already know who the a-holes are. When I was new, I pulled over dudes that were driving expensive cars in the projects. I know they are either dealing or buying. You come to my hood and tell me if there is any other reason to be there. Mother f'n black dude in Frog Hollow, driving an expensive car either took a wrong turn or he's dealing. Either way, don't matter, cops are watching you. The laws just got more stringent, keep your hands at 10 and 2, put away your cell phone, check your tailights. Don't slip up! Sorry if you don't like this. I know things are different in your house on the hill :). By the way if they were dealing I want to get to know them. What better way than to get to know them at the end of my boot

Bip: end of your boot? you get physical or are you trying to act like a tough guy?

Cop Friend: Streets ain't no joke, that's all I'm saying

Bip: You get rough with people just to get to know them? I don't get it.

Cop Friend: don't believe all that you see on tv. Not a lot of "innocent guys" getting roughed up. We do make some mistakes, don't want to do it, but allow me to say again, "streets ain't no joke". Nobody out there for the joy of roughing up black folk. Maybe there are some I don't know about, but all the cats I work with would kill to be able to clean up the streets for the rest of good people that are working hard trying to make ends meet. Why else would we be out there? All the nonsense you hear is because every precint has a horrible PR team :). How many cops you see get shot and wounded and killed before you realize we are there to help the majority not harrass innocent people because we power hungry. F Yall! Where I work, you are guilty until you can tell me why you got 6 guys in smoke filled BMW at 3 in the morning in Frog Hollow. I know the good people ain't doing that, they are at home asleep, I'm watching you, and if you slip up, whoop, whoop. Los Solidos is around the corner, if it's a group of hispanics you don't have to slip up. You most likely are getting pulled. If something don't look right and I got to come up with a reason to pull you over to keep the peace, trust me I got history on my side.

Cop Friend: Back to the question, profiling ain't just about race, like I said it's anything that reminds me of the last 30 dudes I met that are making life miserable for the rest. But let's not lie, race is the majority of it.

Bip: Be honest you profile blacks

Cop friend: Straight up? yeah.

Bip: Do you think that's fair? I'm driving down the street out in Glastonbury and I get pulled over for no reason should I be upset

Cop friend: I work in the hood so that shiot is different. Those cops in the suburbs are looking for something to do. They are bored, see a black guy and it reminds them of what they saw on the news, not what actually goes on in their neighborhoods. White boys are committing the crimes in their neighborhoods. They should be profiling whites, but they are not real cops anyway.

Bip: You admit that you profile but you are calling them fake cops because they profile?

Cop friend: Yeah. If you worked where I work, your black asse would be doing it too.

Posted by Nalod:

TMS,

I clarified on another thread.

You see the word profile and jump into your own reference to Asian sterotype and felt left out.

I keep reference over an over its the economics, not the hate.

I stick to it. Don't lop my view with others. IM trying to bring a perspective not of hate or bias, but that its just freaking business of how things work in this country. I never said thats a good thing, just that its not always hate, but money that drive things.

For example,passions run high on healthcare. I am for Obamas plan, because its the right thing. BUt I am trying to present it in other circles that its not personal, just business. Private capital returns in healthcare is what driving this. When profit does not exist private capital dries up. Thats when the Gov't comes in.

Im no racist, just a numbers geek.

Profiling is wrong. But its effective in the real world. It happens all around us good and bad. Its funny when "white men can't jump", but its profiling.

Im pretty consistant, its just statistics and history. Is it racist to say the weakness of the family unit in black americans is reason for many urban problems with black youths? Did I ever say it was about a races charactor, morals or abilities? No, just that emacipated slaves did not have the economic power to sustain nor multigenerational units. Slaves were bought and sold, families broken up quite often. Freakin tragic and no doubt a terrible crime. My relatives were not here so im not taking that guilt on. We wuz getting our asses kicked in Tsarist Russia. So my people had big problems also. They burned crosses here, there they burned your house. Im not the guy that talked about "excuses".

So lets cut the crap and if we can't engage in some real perspective then its not worth getting into bashing when we basically all get along and have a good time. I'll stay the hell away and you can have all the one way convo's you want.

Just so much we can all type anyway.

Going home, its after 5. Nite fellas!

Posted by martin:

Here's how I took it: It's a boring story. It's about a dude getting pulled over. It's about a dude being nice and the cop being nice back. Nalod suggested that cooler heads prevailed, and if he or the cop had burst out in anger for whatever reason, things may have turned out differently. No more no less.

That's all.