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Ira
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7/19/2009  7:59 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:



I guess the main theme with our guys is patience. Neither are busts but neither are ready for big time action. When you win 30 games you hope that 8 pick can be a starter but I don't see that as the case right now.

I agree with this. Both are going to be good players, but will need time to refine their games.
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buddapaw
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7/19/2009  8:11 PM
My take: McGee is supposed to be further along than Hill and you all fail to realize that McGee has better shot opportunities provided by his teammates. Hill on the other hand had to deal with a wide array of cluster****s. These shot happy morons whom the Knicks coaching staff are auditioning for the SG spot on the roster. They were all bad in my opinion, terrible shots, quick shot and stupid turnovers were the order of the day. It's a miracle Hill managed to score at all. Hill showed a lot of promise, I'm still waiting for that mean spirited score on yer ass dunk in ya face player, you know someone who wants to win by any means necessary.
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BRIGGS
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7/19/2009  9:39 PM
Posted by buddapaw:

My take: McGee is supposed to be further along than Hill and you all fail to realize that McGee has better shot opportunities provided by his teammates. Hill on the other hand had to deal with a wide array of cluster****s. These shot happy morons whom the Knicks coaching staff are auditioning for the SG spot on the roster. They were all bad in my opinion, terrible shots, quick shot and stupid turnovers were the order of the day. It's a miracle Hill managed to score at all. Hill showed a lot of promise, I'm still waiting for that mean spirited score on yer ass dunk in ya face player, you know someone who wants to win by any means necessary.

I think Mcgee is a superior talent and that he outplayed both Griffin and Hill pick 1 and 8B-B hes the same age as those guys. However I don't think mcgee is in the best situation to grow and that might hinder what he can be. Mcgee would EASILY start C for the Knicks--there is no question he would start--in fact it's more likely Mcgee would start at C than Gallinari at F--that being said Mcgee is a role player on wash and he might be kept in that role for some time. Hill and Griffin are in much better personal situations and that might be a factor down the line. If I was Mcgee I would NOT want to be playing for the Wizards.
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Cosmic
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7/19/2009  10:15 PM
I just don't know, TKF, I just don't know. We're getting squeezed into being a team that has to land a max FA, and a supplementary FA that takes 10M a year... and even if we do that, somehow we pull that off, we ABSOLUTELY NEED these kids to be something special.

And from Hill? I just don't see even 1/4th of the guy that was advertised. I'm not writing him off in entirety but we got to look at what we see - and I see a journeyman backup PF.

This is the best we can do? Ugh... And even if it is, if he was the best we could do, that doesn't make it any better.

This guy is raw as hell and as we know raw is another word for "SUCKS". He's another one of these guys who grew tall and was forced to pick up basketball because of it. Not because he loved it but because he was tall enough to play it. And it shows.

He's already pulled an Eddy Curry if you will, not in actual words but what he said a few days ago about him being out of shape. He might as well have said "I sucked because I was out of shape." And? You mean if you were in shape you'd be spectacular? Well, why weren't you in shape? Got drafted, got the guaranteed multi-million dollar contract, and decided to eat at McDonalds morning, noon, and night?

Come'on! This guy should be AVERAGING the "numbers" he put up tonight. Unfortunately, tonight's numbers were Zach Randolph numbers. Nice box score, but, got SHAT on by the opponent, and lost the game.

Sorry, I'm not seeing it with this cat.

Again, I'm not writing him off, but if he wants to prove he's any better than a backup PF on a crappy team, he HAS A LOT OF WORK TO DO.

I'm tired of drafting BUMS with high picks - only to see the guys we draft with LOWER picks better than them!

Douglas > Hill

Lee > Frye

That's what I see right now.

Don't we have enough backup PFs on the team? Hill? REALLY? Might as well extend Harrington or give Lee his money after this showing.

http://popcornmachine.net/ A must-use tool for NBA stat junkies!
tkf
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7/19/2009  10:53 PM
Posted by McK1:
Posted by tkf:




sorry cosmic, but you are off here buddy.. watch the game. He showed more post moves than any big in SL

ummm...Javale McGee by himself says you're wrong. and the replay has already been uploaded by cosmic if you really want to debate this further.

[Edited by - McK1 on 07-19-2009 7:34 PM]

I love Mcgee, but he showed no post moves... He did show he can shoot over guys shorter than him...
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
tkf
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7/19/2009  10:57 PM
Posted by Cosmic:

I just don't know, TKF, I just don't know. We're getting squeezed into being a team that has to land a max FA, and a supplementary FA that takes 10M a year... and even if we do that, somehow we pull that off, we ABSOLUTELY NEED these kids to be something special.

And from Hill? I just don't see even 1/4th of the guy that was advertised. I'm not writing him off in entirety but we got to look at what we see - and I see a journeyman backup PF.

This is the best we can do? Ugh... And even if it is, if he was the best we could do, that doesn't make it any better.

This guy is raw as hell and as we know raw is another word for "SUCKS". He's another one of these guys who grew tall and was forced to pick up basketball because of it. Not because he loved it but because he was tall enough to play it. And it shows.

He's already pulled an Eddy Curry if you will, not in actual words but what he said a few days ago about him being out of shape. He might as well have said "I sucked because I was out of shape." And? You mean if you were in shape you'd be spectacular? Well, why weren't you in shape? Got drafted, got the guaranteed multi-million dollar contract, and decided to eat at McDonalds morning, noon, and night?

Come'on! This guy should be AVERAGING the "numbers" he put up tonight. Unfortunately, tonight's numbers were Zach Randolph numbers. Nice box score, but, got SHAT on by the opponent, and lost the game.

Sorry, I'm not seeing it with this cat.

Again, I'm not writing him off, but if he wants to prove he's any better than a backup PF on a crappy team, he HAS A LOT OF WORK TO DO.

I'm tired of drafting BUMS with high picks - only to see the guys we draft with LOWER picks better than them!

Douglas > Hill

Lee > Frye

That's what I see right now.

Don't we have enough backup PFs on the team? Hill? REALLY? Might as well extend Harrington or give Lee his money after this showing.


cosmic, I know Hills family and met the kid myself at a funeral. I can tell you. He is not playing basketball because he is tall. Heck his whole family is tall. His cousin who is a friend of mine is 6'5 300, Hill's cousin is tall and also played college ball at clemson. this kid loves playing ball, and the scary thing is he is just learning.. Now the fact that the knicks don't have a superstar is not Hills fault, and had we not drafted hill, we would still be in the same situation waiting for lebron or wade in 2010? so why judge him unfairly. If you don't see 1/4 of the kid you thought we were getting, then you must have thought we were getting Shaq with pick #8...
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
BRIGGS
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7/19/2009  10:58 PM
. He did show he can shoot over guys shorter than him...

Well that is 99% of the NBA if you consider his length and athletic ability.

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McK1
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7/19/2009  11:26 PM
at halftime MDA said they want Hill back with the coaching staff in August. Can NY force him to report? God I hope so. Perhaps we'll see a much better player in October
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
BRIGGS
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7/19/2009  11:54 PM
I think Skita is going to make the Knicks. I thought all week he showed a mature game all week. Im sure the Knicks like him. Also i think Almond saved himself today with a reasonably solid showing. Someone must have told him to move the ball and go harder for rebounds. he still didnt hit the three--but he can do that. The way that Almond can succeed is by concentrating on playing team ball moving the ball when he is not open rebounding fo his size and then he has to hit that three pointer at .4

I see the Knicks bringing Almond and Skita into camp--no one else from the SL group.
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crzymdups
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7/20/2009  10:18 AM
Posted by McK1:

at halftime MDA said they want Hill back with the coaching staff in August. Can NY force him to report? God I hope so. Perhaps we'll see a much better player in October

"force him to report"??? this isn't eddy curry - the kid actually wants to get better.

i agree hill had some major ups and downs, but i think judging someone's defense at this juncture of the season is a little ridiculous. hill is going to get easier shots and have a better sense of defensive schemes by the time we're done with training camp. he's raw, but he's showed lots of promise in several areas. and the fact that he is at least aware and active defensively means a lot. this is going to be a learning process, sure. but by all accounts he's a good kid who will work hard. i don't think this is a channing frye scenario where he doesn't have the high level athleticism to compete - this kid can do that, he just needs a comfort level. and playing with better players might help as well. i can't believe the lack of patience here.
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McK1
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7/20/2009  10:50 AM
Posted by crzymdups:

\

"force him to report"??? this isn't eddy curry - the kid actually wants to get better.

I really got that sense too when he showed up out of shape

and ur right, i should excuse him not even putting a hand up or boxing out for rebounds, guys usually learn the basics of their position after they get in the NBA.
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
kam77
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7/20/2009  10:53 AM
During the post-game interview Tina C asked Hill what his plans are. He said he'd be going to NY for training in mid august. I think the Knicks want him there sooner.
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
BasketballJones
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7/20/2009  11:00 AM
C'mon man, let the kid enjoy his summer. He can work out later.
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tkf
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7/20/2009  11:04 AM
Posted by BRIGGS:

. He did show he can shoot over guys shorter than him...

Well that is 99% of the NBA if you consider his length and athletic ability.

hence why he may have looked like he was doing something special in the post when he was just using his height to shoot over the knicks.... again, Mcgee played well, didn't show me any Moves, he just showed me that he can now hit some of the easy shots he made look difficult last year...
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
McK1
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7/20/2009  11:11 AM
it may not have looked too special but it did look way too easy.

Zero Resistance hands never left from his side.

This year work on him raising his hands, next year jumping. By the time he's eligible for an extension he'll be able to put his hands up and jump at the same time. After that first 8 mil a year raise comes the hard stuff.

the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
crzymdups
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7/20/2009  11:16 AM
i hope jordan hill never comes to ultimateknicks.com. do you guys ever wonder if the relentlessly unrealistic expectations for draft picks have something to do with why we rarely have young guys succeed here? people called ariza delusional just because larry brown said so. people trashed frye and nate and dlee left and right. people are quick to trash chandler and gallinari. let's give these kids a chance and stop laying all the frustrations of the last ten years at their feet. it's not jordan hill's fault layden traded camby and nene for dyess. it's not jordan hill's fault we don't have a draft pick next year. let the kid learn and grow before completely writing him off.
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SupremeCommander
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7/20/2009  11:24 AM
Posted by crzymdups:

i hope jordan hill never comes to ultimateknicks.com. do you guys ever wonder if the relentlessly unrealistic expectations for draft picks have something to do with why we rarely have young guys succeed here? people called ariza delusional just because larry brown said so. people trashed frye and nate and dlee left and right. people are quick to trash chandler and gallinari. let's give these kids a chance and stop laying all the frustrations of the last ten years at their feet. it's not jordan hill's fault layden traded camby and nene for dyess. it's not jordan hill's fault we don't have a draft pick next year. let the kid learn and grow before completely writing him off.

well played good sir... we've yet to see how Jordan Hill even fits with the Knicks. As has already been mentioned, the Knicks SL "team" was really a SG audition. Who knows how he'll do with some balance and who knows how he'll do as he learns the nuances of the game.
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nyk4ever
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7/20/2009  11:26 AM
Posted by SupremeCommander:
Posted by crzymdups:

i hope jordan hill never comes to ultimateknicks.com. do you guys ever wonder if the relentlessly unrealistic expectations for draft picks have something to do with why we rarely have young guys succeed here? people called ariza delusional just because larry brown said so. people trashed frye and nate and dlee left and right. people are quick to trash chandler and gallinari. let's give these kids a chance and stop laying all the frustrations of the last ten years at their feet. it's not jordan hill's fault layden traded camby and nene for dyess. it's not jordan hill's fault we don't have a draft pick next year. let the kid learn and grow before completely writing him off.

well played good sir... we've yet to see how Jordan Hill even fits with the Knicks. As has already been mentioned, the Knicks SL "team" was really a SG audition. Who knows how he'll do with some balance and who knows how he'll do as he learns the nuances of the game.

Yeah guys, but Zero Objectivity will not get bullied into "buying into popular opinion" so don't waste your time.
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crzymdups
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7/20/2009  11:29 AM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by SupremeCommander:
Posted by crzymdups:

i hope jordan hill never comes to ultimateknicks.com. do you guys ever wonder if the relentlessly unrealistic expectations for draft picks have something to do with why we rarely have young guys succeed here? people called ariza delusional just because larry brown said so. people trashed frye and nate and dlee left and right. people are quick to trash chandler and gallinari. let's give these kids a chance and stop laying all the frustrations of the last ten years at their feet. it's not jordan hill's fault layden traded camby and nene for dyess. it's not jordan hill's fault we don't have a draft pick next year. let the kid learn and grow before completely writing him off.

well played good sir... we've yet to see how Jordan Hill even fits with the Knicks. As has already been mentioned, the Knicks SL "team" was really a SG audition. Who knows how he'll do with some balance and who knows how he'll do as he learns the nuances of the game.

Yeah guys, but Zero Objectivity will not get bullied into "buying into popular opinion" so don't waste your time.

these are the same guys, who, if gallo were to play in this summer league and average oh say 20ppg, 6rpg and 5apg would say "it's only summer league, let's wait to see him do it in the real season before calling him a superstar!" it just gets tired.

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McK1
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7/20/2009  11:29 AM
noone has written him off

Its not unreasonable to ask Hill to:

put a hand up
box out
put a hand up
stop letting your man beat you down the floor for dunks
put a hand up

the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
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