Posted by TrueBlue:

Posted by TMS:

Posted by TrueBlue:

Posted by islesfan:

Isiah is using fatigue as an excuse.

How the hell do you use playing back to back games as an excuse when you use wins over 2 teams, playing their 4th game in 5 nights, as emphatic evidence that you've turned the corner?

Isiah is such a douchebag.

Hence why we bring this up on this board to prove a point. He picks and chooses just like our fans base. I'm just glad I see Black and White with this regime, there are absolutely no grey areas.

picking & choosing when to use the fatigue excuse... funny, i've heard you do the same when it comes to teams we beat.

You don't get it TMS. As Cosmic tried to explain 2weeks ago those of us who do it's done to prove a point.

ur right, i don't get how one can differentiate when it's OK to use the fatigue excuse when we beat other teams but it's not OK to use it when we lose... i've been pretty consistent from the start... there are no excuses... u either win or lose, there is no in betweens... u just said u see everything in black & white when it comes to this regime but so far all i've seen is you make excuses for other teams when we beat them & yet never seem willing to accept any when the shoe is on the other foot... if i'm wrong, let me know, but that's how i see it.

Posted by TMS:

Posted by TrueBlue:

Posted by TMS:

Posted by TrueBlue:

Posted by islesfan:

Isiah is using fatigue as an excuse.

How the hell do you use playing back to back games as an excuse when you use wins over 2 teams, playing their 4th game in 5 nights, as emphatic evidence that you've turned the corner?

Isiah is such a douchebag.

Hence why we bring this up on this board to prove a point. He picks and chooses just like our fans base. I'm just glad I see Black and White with this regime, there are absolutely no grey areas.

picking & choosing when to use the fatigue excuse... funny, i've heard you do the same when it comes to teams we beat.

You don't get it TMS. As Cosmic tried to explain 2weeks ago those of us who do it's done to prove a point.

ur right, i don't get how one can differentiate when it's OK to use the fatigue excuse when we beat other teams but it's not OK to use it when we lose... i've been pretty consistent from the start... there are no excuses... u either win or lose, there is no in betweens... u just said u see everything in black & white when it comes to this regime but so far all i've seen is you make excuses for other teams when we beat them & yet never seem willing to accept any when the shoe is on the other foot... if i'm wrong, let me know, but that's how i see it.

I wish I could find Cosmic's post but in a nutshell we do it to make fun of I SAY UGH and those who support him when he makes excuses. He invents the excuse and we pull it out when it applies to the other team, real simple actually. We're not necessarily trying to make the excuse stick.

[Edited by - TrueBlue on 01-31-2008 01:23 AM]

Posted by GKFv2:



I hope Isiah listens to that song and walks out the door and never comes back. Ever.

And hopefully the door he walks out of, leads to a cliff.....

[Edited by - Slimpack on 01-31-2008 05:43 AM]

Posted by tkf:

Posted by bitty41:

Sorry tkf but I felt that this was an appopriate time to remind of your comments regarding Deron Williams:

that argument has been settled, I mentioned this before, chris paul is a true PG. Deron williams is a SG in a PG's body, he plays the game of a SG if you ask me. He is a decent passer with decent vision, doesn't have great vision or passing skills, but deron can shoot and score..

Maybe Jamal can tell us if Deron is just a shooting guard with decent court vision and passing skills.

[Edited by - bitty41 on 01-30-2008 11:26 PM]

they are one in the same. jamal had 9 assist, is he a PG.. again, deron is not a creative passer and a very average passer, he has a team that has some good shooters on it. he benefits from that.... other than that, what was the point of bringing this back up...? he proved nothing different tonight..

I'm sorry but I have to take you to task for this. I hope you are not saying that Jamal and Deron Williams are remotely close in terms of how they play b/c even the biggest Jamal fan couldn't make that statement with a straight face. They are not even close Deron averages 19 points on 13 shot attempts so where do you get that he's true shooting guard masqurading as a point is beyond me. You mentioned Jamal had 9 assists umm you realize that Deron averages that on a nightly basis right? The supporting cast arguement is a total crap b/c his supporting cast is better with him and honestly Deron could probably play with a lot of teams and put up similar numbers IMO.

Creative passer? What does he not make enough behind the back passes for you or look away passes how is one a "creative passer"? I know your use to watching that Rucker Park all-star Jamal Crawford every night and maybe thats skewing your sense of good basketball but "creative passing" huh

Can you explain to me how a guy who is in the top 5 in assist's average is just a decent/average passer? B/c averaging 9.5 assists on a nightly basis isn't average.

You may know a ton about a million other things. But maybe its time to admit that your assesement of Deron Williams might have been a tad off and not that informed. There are no statistics that support your claims. His individual stats definetly do not show him to be an "average passer", his shot's average show him to be a very efficient scorer (I know how everyone around here loves that term), and his team is currently 4th in the Conference. So I don't understand how you came to your conclusions other then you were talking totally off the cuff.

Posted by TrueBlue:

Posted by TMS:

Posted by TrueBlue:

Posted by islesfan:

Isiah is using fatigue as an excuse.

How the hell do you use playing back to back games as an excuse when you use wins over 2 teams, playing their 4th game in 5 nights, as emphatic evidence that you've turned the corner?

Isiah is such a douchebag.

Hence why we bring this up on this board to prove a point. He picks and chooses just like our fans base. I'm just glad I see Black and White with this regime, there are absolutely no grey areas.

picking & choosing when to use the fatigue excuse... funny, i've heard you do the same when it comes to teams we beat.

You don't get it TMS. As Cosmic tried to explain 2weeks ago those of us who do it's done to prove a point.

As my man McNulty on the Wire once said, "You play in the dirt, you get dirty"

Posted by nixluva:

Posted by King1:

This team needs a point guard and a SF to be able to compete. Mardy Collins and Quentin are killing this team in every facet. If you put a great point and defensive 3 man around Jamal his can concentrate on scoring.

That and a Shotblocker/reboiunder. Really nothings changed much from what we all said was needed before the season started. Only now you can see how well some of the players could be with the right additions. WIth the recent improvement in play I can foresee a scenario where this team could be on the upper half of the league with just a couple of changes. When you see us play these other teams out west now we look more competitive and just a bit short of where we need to be in order to consistently beat these teams. The sad thing is it usually happens once Curry goes out of the game. That has to be a humbling thing for Isiah to see. You would think that he'd have already made the change in the SL by now. What is he waiting for? The only thing I can think of is trade value. If he completely takes Curry out of the SL that lowers his trade value even more.

So what you're saying is last season was a total waste since we were previously told how it was a success because they established Curry as the cornerstone franchise player.

Just like 2004-2005 was a success because Marbury was brought home to save the franchise.

Just like 2005-2006 was a success because they drafted 3 guys to build around in Frye, Nate and Lee.

Just like we're going to be told that 2007-2008 is a success because they established Crawford as their PG and leader of the future. And because they actually try now.

What a load of ****. How do people still believe this stuff?

Posted by bitty41:

Posted by tkf:

Posted by bitty41:

Sorry tkf but I felt that this was an appopriate time to remind of your comments regarding Deron Williams:

that argument has been settled, I mentioned this before, chris paul is a true PG. Deron williams is a SG in a PG's body, he plays the game of a SG if you ask me. He is a decent passer with decent vision, doesn't have great vision or passing skills, but deron can shoot and score..

Maybe Jamal can tell us if Deron is just a shooting guard with decent court vision and passing skills.

[Edited by - bitty41 on 01-30-2008 11:26 PM]

they are one in the same. jamal had 9 assist, is he a PG.. again, deron is not a creative passer and a very average passer, he has a team that has some good shooters on it. he benefits from that.... other than that, what was the point of bringing this back up...? he proved nothing different tonight..

I'm sorry but I have to take you to task for this. I hope you are not saying that Jamal and Deron Williams are remotely close in terms of how they play b/c even the biggest Jamal fan couldn't make that statement with a straight face. They are not even close Deron averages 19 points on 13 shot attempts so where do you get that he's true shooting guard masqurading as a point is beyond me. You mentioned Jamal had 9 assists umm you realize that Deron averages that on a nightly basis right? The supporting cast arguement is a total crap b/c his supporting cast is better with him and honestly Deron could probably play with a lot of teams and put up similar numbers IMO.

Creative passer? What does he not make enough behind the back passes for you or look away passes how is one a "creative passer"? I know your use to watching that Rucker Park all-star Jamal Crawford every night and maybe thats skewing your sense of good basketball but "creative passing" huh

Can you explain to me how a guy who is in the top 5 in assist's average is just a decent/average passer? B/c averaging 9.5 assists on a nightly basis isn't average.

You may know a ton about a million other things. But maybe its time to admit that your assesement of Deron Williams might have been a tad off and not that informed. There are no statistics that support your claims. His individual stats definetly do not show him to be an "average passer", his shot's average show him to be a very efficient scorer (I know how everyone around here loves that term), and his team is currently 4th in the Conference. So I don't understand how you came to your conclusions other then you were talking totally off the cuff.

Bitty: Deron runs the offense as good as any PG in the NBA right now. Why bother arguing it. Your wasting minutes of your life. It's almsot as bad as saying that Tim Duncan is garbage and then arguing about that for 4 days straight. I've done it. Don't get sucked in.

Posted by Bippity10:

Nix: You spent all offseason telling us how great this team would be. And now you are okay with the team "trying hard"? Shouldn't that be a given? We were supposedly the greatest 33 win team in the history of the NBa last year. We would have won 38-50 had we not suffered all the injuries. We added a 20-10 superstar to the team. And yet somehow now we are led to believe that the fact that they try should be enough to satisfy the fan base. I would find that amazing but since it's happened 3 years in a row I no longer do. Every year you are on the prowl during the summer about how good the team is. Then when we come up short you try to lower expectations of those that are disappointed.

I ask the question again. As a fan, when is it okay for me to start expecting REAL WINS INSTEAD OF MORALE VICTORIES?

When the Team President, General Manager and Head Coach do.

I do think the Knicks are getting better - not only effort wise but they are slowly starting to understand each other and most importantly their roles. That doesn't mean that they are 'ready' to go - because we have seen them revert back to 'their' game instead of a team game.

2004-2005 With Marbury was just a starting point - but at that point and that year - te real issue was clearing the roster of KVH, Weatherspoon, Harrington, Anderson, Wesley, etc.

2005-2006- Bringing in a coach who has a diametrically opposite view of how your team should play - and that coach trying to assert his authority (in this case -by publicly flogging your athletes) - as well as bringing in players to psychologically demoralize your players (Francis for Marbury and Rose for Crawford) - does have a pervading effect on the rest of the team.

2006-2007- re-assembling and re-directing a 24-58 team where other than Marbury - the rest of the team is essentially a group of 'potential' guys that need to play and develop -are not seasoned to ups and down in a season - means basically you choose one player to build around and make it easier for the team - that year that player was Curry- good or bad- he was probably the most likely rallying point.

2007-2008- the first 20-30 games of the season were lost -because to integrate Randolph into the team was difficult. Not only in terms of having two post guys who want the ball-but because Randolph like Crawford is overly in love with his shooting an so when push comes to shove - both Crawford and Zbo - just end up shooting- regardless of double teams etc.

In addition - you have a bunch of rookies - who continue to make rookie mistakes. David Lee- with the inbounds pass against the Lakers, the casual behind the back flip , etc. Robinson - with not recogizing when to penetrate and shooting from the perimeter like the mad bomber when he has had a few good FG% nights. But this shows up most on defense- even last night - there were too many assumptions of when Lee was supposed to take the post guy - and several times - it was his responsibility. Mardy Collins - not continuing to do to Derron Williams -what Williams did to Robinson- which is back down in the post and take a few 5 foot jumpers - forcing him to play defense and expend energy.

But overall - this trip out west has been a good one. We played three playoff bound teams who have been at rebuilding for a few years - and had a chance to win each game (with the least chance at Utah).

I personally don't think that Isiah meant 'fatigue' as an excuse - I think he meant that the you have to have energy and most importantly focus for all 4 quarters and particularly the fourth quarter. He has them playing about 3 1/2 quarters so far - and whether its conditioning, lack of experience in terms of maintaining focus or the fact that at crunch time - the key players try to take a team 'on their back' and forget - tht if they were those types of players - their originial teams would NEVER have let them go.

On the positive side Jeffries has definitely been what the Knicks signed him to do and if he stays healthy - he will be a great addition. Lee has gained the trust of Randolph particularly - and his scoring has gone up because of that- Nate and Craw-always look to get him the ball - because other than Jeffries/Balkman - he is the only other option not usually covered by the opposing team. But at best he is a role player - as you could and will continue to see - how many times he gets blocked- when there are other players playing in the post. Robinson is definitely improving every year in every area- for a 5'9" to come out with 3-5 rebounds in the NBA -only speaks to his perseverance.

Anyway - I personally think if you throw out the first two years (let the past stay in the past)- and look at this team - they have improved significantly from early on. Most of the pieces are starting to play together - with the exception of Curry. Hasn't anyone noticed how many steals and assists Randolph is putting up? If the backcourt can shoot near 50 percent -the Knicks are in most games.

2005-2006- Bringing in a coach who has a diametrically opposite view of how your team should play

What are you talking about? As soon as Isiah got past his "Happy Happy Joy Joy See, I'm Not Like Larry" first year, he did exactly what Larry Brown was trying to do. Play unselfish offensively and concentrate on defense. But as we can all plainly see, the players that Isiah the GM has brought here is counter intuitive of that. Notice Isiah butting heads with "his" players. It's a good thing he has the GM backing him up unlike what Brown had.

Yeah, I stopped reading his post after that. I figured it was just filled with more spin and inaccuracies.

Posted by iyamwutiam:

Actually Larry's style has always been set plays -therefore givingthe team more time to set up defensively. Isiah is trying to get a more fluid style by putting pressure on the opposing teams defense by spreading out the focus by having talented players at every position.

Started laughing like 15 minutes ago. Still laughing.

GOOD ONE MAN!