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Now I like Isiah more. He is not always a snake, sometimes he is honest...
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nixluva
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9/14/2007  8:37 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:

but like I said this is an isolated incident.

It's isolated as far as you know and are concerned. I would submit that if you were in some of our shoes you would KNOW that it's not isolated. How about Eleanor Bumpers, Amadou Diallo and all the many others that didn't get the publicity? You may not know what it's like to be found guilty driving while black, shopping while black or had some white woman clutch her bag tight at the mere site of you. It's not "isolated". It's systemic. You need to educate yourself about what's really going in in this country before you keep commenting in ignorance.
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nykshaknbake
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9/14/2007  8:52 PM
Replace white with black and make it Jim Dolan instead of Isiah...then is it a racist statement?

Not sure that Isiah was being racist but just pointing out the hypersensitivity to race we have in this day and age.
Posted by Nalod:


"bitch I dont give a **** about these white people" to me is not racist.

To me its an arrogant statement made by an arrogant person who is more style than substance and is usually over his head.

Isiah tries, but maybe being a top 50 hall of fame player with two rings is about as good as he can do. I always liked his ambition, but we see this all the time in the business world. Guys and gals want the big job but are not really able to handle it.
arkrud
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9/14/2007  9:10 PM
Posted by nykshaknbake:

Replace white with black and make it Jim Dolan instead of Isiah...then is it a racist statement?

Not sure that Isiah was being racist but just pointing out the hypersensitivity to race we have in this day and age.
Posted by Nalod:


"bitch I dont give a **** about these white people" to me is not racist.

To me its an arrogant statement made by an arrogant person who is more style than substance and is usually over his head.

Isiah tries, but maybe being a top 50 hall of fame player with two rings is about as good as he can do. I always liked his ambition, but we see this all the time in the business world. Guys and gals want the big job but are not really able to handle it.

So Isiah is fighting against racism...
WOW. Joining Mr. Sharpton and company.
Great course in right hands.




"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
misterearl
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9/14/2007  9:18 PM
"Do you understand the words that are coming out of my mouth?"

nykshakenbake /arkrud and fellow Americans - allow me to help you with an exact street level translation for the African American culture impaired

What Isiah said: (according to Anucha) "bitch I dont give a **** about these white people" to me is not racist.

What the subtitles at the bottom of the screen said:

"bitch" (adjective commonly used male to male) I have a basketball team I am trying to prepare for another game in front of the most demanding fans on the planet. Many of these same "people" would love to see me fail more than anything. I could care less about any artificial masquerade to appease their appetite for my disembodied head on a silver platter.

My sista, why must you create additional (marketing) distractions during the season that discharge the energy of the players that I have acquired, who I am also responsible for coaching? My main objective is winning. Everything else is secondary to that. I prefer to stay on the in-season schedule so our preparation is consistent, as opposed to another photo op if that is not a problem with you."

that my dear collegaues IS what Isiah said.... verbatum

[Edited by - misterearl on 09-14-2007 9:20 PM]
once a knick always a knick
misterearl
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9/14/2007  9:29 PM
Some historical perspective for the doubters of the subtitled explanation

African Americans bent the rules for English usage to maintain the ability to communicate with each other during slavery to mask their intentions in the company of their owners. It might not be wise to divulge the exact departure time from the same plantation where your wife was raped, your brother whipped or your children sold as cattle.

That practice continues to this day.
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Sportsfan00
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9/14/2007  9:45 PM
Posted by misterearl:

"Do you understand the words that are coming out of my mouth?"

nykshakenbake /arkrud and fellow Americans - allow me to help you with an exact street level translation for the African American culture impaired

What Isiah said: (according to Anucha) "bitch I dont give a **** about these white people" to me is not racist.

What the subtitles at the bottom of the screen said:

"bitch" (adjective commonly used male to male) I have a basketball team I am trying to prepare for another game in front of the most demanding fans on the planet. Many of these same "people" would love to see me fail more than anything. I could care less about any artificial masquerade to appease their appetite for my disembodied head on a silver platter.

My sista, why must you create additional (marketing) distractions during the season that discharge the energy of the players that I have acquired, who I am also responsible for coaching? My main objective is winning. Everything else is secondary to that. I prefer to stay on the in-season schedule so our preparation is consistent, as opposed to another photo op if that is not a problem with you."

that my dear collegaues IS what Isiah said.... verbatum

[Edited by - misterearl on 09-14-2007 9:20 PM]

Since you know "EXACTLY" what IT is thinking then answer this: If it was not meant racist then why did "HE" single out white season ticket holders? Why did he not just address it as Season ticket holders?

nykshaknbake
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9/15/2007  12:53 AM
So basically if a black person says something against white ppl it's just code for something else. But if a white person does it it's racism. Is that what you're saying?
Posted by misterearl:

"Do you understand the words that are coming out of my mouth?"

nykshakenbake /arkrud and fellow Americans - allow me to help you with an exact street level translation for the African American culture impaired

What Isiah said: (according to Anucha) "bitch I dont give a **** about these white people" to me is not racist.

What the subtitles at the bottom of the screen said:

"bitch" (adjective commonly used male to male) I have a basketball team I am trying to prepare for another game in front of the most demanding fans on the planet. Many of these same "people" would love to see me fail more than anything. I could care less about any artificial masquerade to appease their appetite for my disembodied head on a silver platter.

My sista, why must you create additional (marketing) distractions during the season that discharge the energy of the players that I have acquired, who I am also responsible for coaching? My main objective is winning. Everything else is secondary to that. I prefer to stay on the in-season schedule so our preparation is consistent, as opposed to another photo op if that is not a problem with you."

that my dear collegaues IS what Isiah said.... verbatum

[Edited by - misterearl on 09-14-2007 9:20 PM]
BRIGGS
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9/15/2007  7:53 AM
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070914/ap_on_re_us/philadelphia_violence
RIP Crushalot😞
NineMike2Whiskey
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9/15/2007  7:55 AM
Posted by misterearl:

Counterpointguard

MSs Questionable Character/Work Ethic Players

1. Penny - gone, heck YOU try running and jumping on tender knees
2. Marbury - you can question his quotes but where is it validated that Marbury does not work hard?
3. Tim Thomas - gone
4. Jalen Rose - long gone
5. Jerome James - comic relief
6. Eddy Curry - heck YOU try running and jumping 82 nights against the biggest of big men with a suspect heart
7. Zach Randolph - everyone deserves a second chance, especially when you're good for 23 and 12
8. Steve Francis - gone
9. Nate Robinson - nothing wrong whatsover about Nate's work ethic, he's a playful kid just dancing to his own beat - nothing wrong widat
10. Q Woods - doggone, hey I liked Qyntel because I love a good story, besides Qyntel came from nothing with no support or mentoring, you should try it
11. Mo Taylor - who?

sheesh, where is it written the path to success is a perfectly straight line?

MS - I would submit that kvetching over every single one of Zeke's transactions is just plain redundant. The more contemporary and relevant question is whether the current, resulting skill-sets of those moves is aiming the roster in the right direction?

here's a clue - make an intelligent comparison of Knicks frontcourt in Janauary 2004 and September 2007 then get back to me

you gotta crack a bunch of eggs to make an omelette





[Edited by - misterearl on 09-14-2007 7:32 PM]


Whoa man, you've got to be kidding when it comes to JJ and N8 rite ?
Jerome James gets a pass because he cracks some joke despite showing up for practice drunk (thats character for you) and coming to camp out of shape?
As for N8, well he lost me the day he couldnt tell how much time was left on the shot clock.

Anyway my 2cents on the 2004 and 2007 frontcourt is this

2004 - Less flash, less stats, but utlimately with smaller holes that needed to be patch up
2007 - Undoubtedly more flash but with much bigger and glaring holes



[Edited by - NineMike2Whiskey on 09-15-2007 08:05 AM]

[Edited by - NineMike2Whiskey on 09-15-2007 08:06 AM]
misterearl
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9/15/2007  9:32 AM
The Answer Man Cometh

Q. nykshaknbake - So basically if a black person says something against white ppl it's just code for something else. But if a white person does it it's racism. Is that what you're saying?

A. Gee nykshaknbake, you catch on fast.

But allow me to add... what Isiah said was not "against" White people as much as it was FOR his job ... even though it hurts your ears. He was enforcing his space as President of the Knicks in the same way the President of the United States cares more about preserving his position of power more than he does the lives of Iraqui, or New Orleans citizens. Zeke's proclamation is not so far removed from, "damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!"

When a Black person speaks the code is much more complicated, and much more intense, than mere words can express. Forget categorizing re-actions into the convenient box of racism. We are ALL acutely aware of race, no matter what degree of "colorblindness" we may claim.

that is the plain truth of the matter - might as well deal with it just as we deal with the plain truth that Charlie Weis will have more years than Ty Willingham to coach football at Notre Dame, no matter what his won-loss record is.

This is a history lesson which is still being played out daily. The first episodes pre-date the Knicks first season in 1949.
once a knick always a knick
misterearl
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9/15/2007  9:35 AM
NineMike2 - the 2007 frontcourt hasn't set foot on the floor yet

c'mon dude, let's see where the "glaring holes" are first before you start missing Kurt Thomas, Clarence Weatherspoon and Shandon Anderson

[Edited by - misterearl on 09-15-2007 09:36 AM]
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NineMike2Whiskey
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9/15/2007  11:14 AM
Posted by misterearl:

NineMike2 - the 2007 frontcourt hasn't set foot on the floor yet

c'mon dude, let's see where the "glaring holes" are first before you start missing Kurt Thomas, Clarence Weatherspoon and Shandon Anderson

[Edited by - misterearl on 09-15-2007 09:36 AM]


Just my 2 cents anyways, we'll see when the seasons starts. I'll hope for the best but i've got a nagging feeling either Zach or Curry will have to move. The paint just aint big enuf for both of them
nixluva
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9/15/2007  11:32 AM
Posted by NineMike2Whiskey:
Posted by misterearl:

NineMike2 - the 2007 frontcourt hasn't set foot on the floor yet

c'mon dude, let's see where the "glaring holes" are first before you start missing Kurt Thomas, Clarence Weatherspoon and Shandon Anderson

[Edited by - misterearl on 09-15-2007 09:36 AM]


Just my 2 cents anyways, we'll see when the seasons starts. I'll hope for the best but i've got a nagging feeling either Zach or Curry will have to move. The paint just aint big enuf for both of them
Weren't many of us calling for more postups from Frye? If that's the case then why is it wrong to replace Frye with a guy that can more effectively post up?

Besides Zach actually doesn't play in the low post as much as Curry. He does more mid post stuff. Basically he's effective from more areas on the court than Curry and so he doesn't limit himself to the low post. Since Curry is working on his jumper, I would assume that he will make himself more useful when he's not in the post and Zach is. I hope his jumper is coming along nicely.
NineMike2Whiskey
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9/15/2007  11:52 AM
Posted by nixluva:
Posted by NineMike2Whiskey:
Posted by misterearl:

NineMike2 - the 2007 frontcourt hasn't set foot on the floor yet

c'mon dude, let's see where the "glaring holes" are first before you start missing Kurt Thomas, Clarence Weatherspoon and Shandon Anderson

[Edited by - misterearl on 09-15-2007 09:36 AM]


Just my 2 cents anyways, we'll see when the seasons starts. I'll hope for the best but i've got a nagging feeling either Zach or Curry will have to move. The paint just aint big enuf for both of them
Weren't many of us calling for more postups from Frye? If that's the case then why is it wrong to replace Frye with a guy that can more effectively post up?

Besides Zach actually doesn't play in the low post as much as Curry. He does more mid post stuff. Basically he's effective from more areas on the court than Curry and so he doesn't limit himself to the low post. Since Curry is working on his jumper, I would assume that he will make himself more useful when he's not in the post and Zach is. I hope his jumper is coming along nicely.

You're right Zach is versatile and can spread the floor for us but i'm worried his presence in the lineup will take away touches from Curry, limiting his effectiveness. Unless his rebounding and defence has improved leaps and bounds and his passing out of the post gets much better i can't see how much of a force he is on the team without his scoring. If Zach starts on a tear and Curry sees less of the ball than he used too, i'm afraid he'll end up in Fyre-esque slump and we'll back where we started last season when our centre on a roll (well sort of) and a mentally gimp forward.

It's just a nagging feeling i have thats all, I cant' wait for the preseason to see how it all pans out.
nykshaknbake
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9/15/2007  4:29 PM
Don't patronize me, misterearl. How you spin what Isiah said into the convuluted mess you wrote is puzzling. Saying it's not racist because a black man is saying it and it has a meaning beyond wrods is pure crap and pure double standard on your behalf.

Is the main thrust of Isiah's message racist? maybe not, but it certainly would suggest racism. Hell, he may not have even said it. But you can't just explain it away as just lingo. Especially in this day and age when someone says 'you ppl' it's blantantly racist.
Posted by misterearl:

The Answer Man Cometh

Q. nykshaknbake - So basically if a black person says something against white ppl it's just code for something else. But if a white person does it it's racism. Is that what you're saying?

A. Gee nykshaknbake, you catch on fast.

But allow me to add... what Isiah said was not "against" White people as much as it was FOR his job ... even though it hurts your ears. He was enforcing his space as President of the Knicks in the same way the President of the United States cares more about preserving his position of power more than he does the lives of Iraqui, or New Orleans citizens. Zeke's proclamation is not so far removed from, "damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!"

When a Black person speaks the code is much more complicated, and much more intense, than mere words can express. Forget categorizing re-actions into the convenient box of racism. We are ALL acutely aware of race, no matter what degree of "colorblindness" we may claim.

that is the plain truth of the matter - might as well deal with it just as we deal with the plain truth that Charlie Weis will have more years than Ty Willingham to coach football at Notre Dame, no matter what his won-loss record is.

This is a history lesson which is still being played out daily. The first episodes pre-date the Knicks first season in 1949.
playa2
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9/15/2007  6:58 PM
I can truly appreciate how you guys have the ability to go from talking about Isiah, to racism in america and Jena 6 back to Isiah and the knicks without anyone getting ignorant on the matter.

For that I give all of you who participated a ^5
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
arkrud
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9/16/2007  12:06 AM
What about black season ticket holders?
Are they happy that Isiah likes them more?
Seriously:
If Isiah sad this (which is easy to believe) he has no respect to white people and black people.
Simple just because he separates them in groups by color.
I think this should be equally offensive to whites and blacks.
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
misterearl
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9/16/2007  8:36 PM
don't shoot me, I'm just the piano player

nyshakenbake - it's about time the so-called "double standard" was flipped



arkrud - Isiah has no less respect for people than that arrogant, smarmy and cheatin' Bill Bellichek.

please pay close attention to how the press paints words with Isiah as evil and Belichick with continued not-so-faint praise...

ESPN - Belichick and Patriots ownership recently agreed to a long-term contract extension. The pact will keep Belichick on New England's sideline through at least the 2013 season, according to league sources and sources close to the coach. The deal was agreed to before the recent "spying" scandal in which the Patriots were punished by the NFL.

just win baby

[Edited by - misterearl on 09-16-2007 8:42 PM]
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arkrud
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9/16/2007  10:17 PM
Posted by misterearl:

don't shoot me, I'm just the piano player

nyshakenbake - it's about time the so-called "double standard" was flipped



arkrud - Isiah has no less respect for people than that arrogant, smarmy and cheatin' Bill Bellichek.

please pay close attention to how the press paints words with Isiah as evil and Belichick with continued not-so-faint praise...

ESPN - Belichick and Patriots ownership recently agreed to a long-term contract extension. The pact will keep Belichick on New England's sideline through at least the 2013 season, according to league sources and sources close to the coach. The deal was agreed to before the recent "spying" scandal in which the Patriots were punished by the NFL.

just win baby

[Edited by - misterearl on 09-16-2007 8:42 PM]

Exactly... Just win Isiah... You need it now more that even... Knicks fans.

[Edited by - arkrud on 09-16-2007 10:18 PM]
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
misterearl
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9/17/2007  8:30 AM
arkrud - performance is what matters most this season.

With Madison Square Garden is firmly in the crosshairs of the media and training camp is right around the corner the pressure cooker is just getting heated up

But don't you think Mike Vaccaro's description of "world's most heinous arena" is a bit over the top

whatever happened to "innocent until proven guilty"?
once a knick always a knick
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Now I like Isiah more. He is not always a snake, sometimes he is honest...
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