dk7th wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

dk7th wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

OGkush121 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

JrZyHuStLa wrote:

fishmike wrote:

JrZyHuStLa wrote:

fishmike wrote:

JrZyHuStLa wrote:

fishmike wrote:you boys still at this?

Melo playing MVP caliber ball right now. He's doing what your all star player is supposed to. Carry the load and lead the team when guys are banged up.

If the season ended today I would rank it something like:
1) CP3. Playing like Nash during his MVPs only + all NBA defense
1a) Durant. The record is MJ Bull's like and he's becoming a high caliber defensive player also. Shooting 52%, 1.5 blocks, 8.5 rebs and 28ppg. WOW.

Durant and CP3 easily the best players in the NBA right now

2) Lebron
2a) Melo

Even though I have MElo 4th I put 1 and 1a and 2 and 2a because thats how I percieve the race if there is one. Because of their success, #s, team records, impact on teammates... the whole package CP3 and KD heads above the class right now. Melo and Lebron are the next group. MVP caliber but outclassed by CP3 and KD playing out of their minds.

Now once Amare/Shump comes back Melo's shots will go down, he will beome (hopefully) more team type role and Knicks will be better for it. It will also eliminate any MVP talk which is fine and good. When Melo thinks hes MVP you see the circus shots and hero basketball and he can have his stretches but he cant sustain and it doesnt work. When Melo plays team ball (even if he's taking the most shots) Knicks play like the best team in the league. A more mature and better Melo doesnt not equal an MVP Melo.

First he was not even close to being a candidate.

Then it was "ok fine, he's in the fake race."

Now you have him in the same discussion with Durant, CP3, and Lebron.

Glad to see you're getting warmer.

just calling it like I see it. Nice he's in shape this year and willing to play for the coach right?

Im just giving him his due as hes playing great. Bottom line? He's not a realistic candidate. That hasnt changed one bit. He's in the discussion like Ron Paul is in the presidential discussion. Melo is like 3-4 player having torn ACLs away from a real chance. But if you want to be happy about about a great first 6 weeks here and call him MVP feel free. Knicks are playing great ball to start. Since realism with such things causes hurt feelings I have bowed out of the discussion. But thanks ;)

Yes, getting in shape and playing for Woodson is the best decision Carmelo has ever made, because it has yielded a 19-6 record along with being in the MVP discussion. Haven't heard you complain at all about that have we now? Nor have we heard you say you wish Mike D'antoni was still coaching this team.

So yea, he's willing to play for this coach, he has every reason to.

I have never said I wish MDA was still coaching this team. Also your right... Im not complaining our star player in year 3 decided to show up in shape and play for the head coach and that a serious effort and commitment to conditioning has made him a better player. Who knew?

What makes you think he's stepping up in year 3? He's been putting up these same numbers his whole career. The only thing that's new to him is being a legit MVP candidate because he now has real players around him. Something he never had before. Having Woodson coaching you obviously isn't hurting either.

But again, good to see you coming around.

maybe the same numbers as before but much more efficiently due to his astronomical 3-pt%. he still takes too many shots (and a few bad ones)-- so as the season wears on and he doesn't have as much lift, that 3-pt% will go down and our team will struggle. the key is that, as he loses his 3-pt shooting, he find other ways to generate points, ie by drawing more fouls. notice that last game he put a great head and ball fake on a guy from the left side about 8 feet out. very pierce-like and i approve. this is the kind of adaptation that he will be needing to make to remain efficient.

I know it's not to be expected that he'll keep shooting near 50% from downtown the entire season, but for all we know he may end up doing it.

And last night wasn't really a good night to "scout" him on his ability to get to the free-throw line.
Due to his ankle he barely ever drove to basket, mostly stuck to outside shots.
Which in a way makes his 31 points on over 50% shooting even "better".

if he does it, it will be a statistical anomaly for the ages.

as to the next point, he doesn't need to drive if he is hitting from the perimeter at the clip he has been hitting. it's when that 3-point shot starts to go south of 35%-- he is a career 33% from 3-- that he'll need to find a way to get to the line more times a game. the reason for that is that if you compare his 3FG% to harden and durant-- both of whom are ahead of him in FTA/GM-- he shoots at a lower rate, hence driving up the need to get to the line. good news is we finally saw him do what i was hoping he would do-- start incorporating some guile and cleverness to his game by using the head and ball fake. the more he does that the more staying power he will have.

You keep saying that his 3 pt % will go down but its not really about his career avg which is hurt by his first few years. Its about his attempts. Also, the fact that he is not taking pull up threes. Most f his 3s have been assisted. If you look at his numbers career wise in taking catch and shoot 3s or assisted 3s you would see his % is very high. Plus add on the fact that was a goal he worked on this summer and you get what you see. Like last year he worked on his PnR skills and he was one of the best PnR finishers in the league and still is.

no he's taking a lot of heat-check adrenaline pull-up threes on semi breaks. now, a career 40% 3 guy like nash can do that and get away with it but it is going to catch up with melo eventually.

guys on this site keep telling me to watch the games as though i don't watch the games. i watch the games and there are more than enough examples of those sorts of threes to keep an eye on.

i have the same issue with felton and his ability to orchestrate and get everyone involved. dudes claiming he hits brewer or whomever in the corner and whatnot. give me the time of the game when felton does this and i will be persuaded i don't know what i am talking about.

instead i get <crickets>

so if i have the time and wherewithal i will record the game and make note of when felton hits brewer or anyone in the corner in traffic and i will also make note how many times melo takes a pull up 3. against the bulls i don't think you will see melo doing that as much-- they get back on d-- but lets see how many times felton hits a guy in the corner in traffic.

So explain to me why its ok for nash to try a 3 pt heat ck and not Melo?

Again I have asked dk7th questions and havent got an answer in HOURS.Whats up with that?

i am not a fan of our previous chit chat so i have been reluctant to try again because so far it has not been civil or fruitful. i will try again though.

career 40% from 3 is >>>>> 34% from 3. 43% from 3 gives u the green light, 33% doesn't.

And right now whats the NBA average from 3pt land? Or better yet whats the % that the bball media says is a good 3pt shooter?

Answer this question dk.

the nba average is around 35%. melo's average for his career is 33%. nash's is 43%.

if you shoot below average it's dumb to take adrenaline heat check 3s. in fact any decision based on adrenaline is just plain dumb. if you shoot well above the average you should be given the green light to do so.

the reason it is dumb is because it squanders an opportunity for a higher percentage shot. when it misses it leads to a long rebound for the opposition 50% of the time or more and easy points. it demoralizes teammates and it either ruins momentum for your team or gives momentum to the opponent.

this season anthony is shooting close to 45% from 3 which is an highly improbable rate for him to maintain if not impossible. so he should not be indulging in this sort of shot if he wants to truly help his team over the course of the season.

this is a mathematical and objective argument against the heat check adrenaline 3.

now here is my very subjective opinion about this guy-- i study his demeanor closely: he is infatuated with himself and is surrounded by enablers. he doesn't understand what it means to play for others. he "expects" to make these shots into perpetuity and be forgiven by his teammates when they cease to fall-- and this is going to happen.

Why is his 45% highly improbable? And dk you gotta stop acting like a psychologist,hes infatuated with himself? What do you base that on,JUST LOOKING? As I have said before dk, YOUR NOT A PSYCHOLOGIST, you dont have the degrees,you dont have the necessary paperwork to say things like this. And if you have played any kind of basketball in your life, when you put up a shot you"EXPECT" to make it. Thats what a player does. You seem to be the kind of player that sat because you were never picked in the schoolyard or park. And the stats you mention about "shooting on adrenaline" you must NEVER have played any kind of ball. Adrenaline is what powers the injured player, the so-so player when he gets the time etc... Your arguement doesnt hold water because your not speaking from as player weather it be in a playground,jv, or varsity player. My bet is you never played any kind of organized or even unorganized league. My bet is you NEVER played ball.

off the top of my head the following are some of the greatest pure shooters the league has known:

steve kerr 45.4%
ray allen 40.1%
reggie miller 39.5%
jeff hornacek 40.3%
steve nash 42.8%
mark price 40.2%

carmelo has beautiful form on his shot which definitely works in his favor. but it is highly improbable nonetheless. it is improbable because statistically he would have to have a spike that defies the statistical range he has set throughout the years. nobody will complain if melo hits 40% from 3 for the season-- including the playoffs. but chances are that he won't as the season grinds on. notice as well that his defense is already beginning to lapse.

it's myopic to claim that unless you have a degree you can't consider yourself a psychologist. we are born studying faces and learn to study body language eventually as well. you and i and everybody else are constantly studying other people-- it's as natural as breathing. social situations require it. successful businessmen and salespeople excel at it. and mind games are constantly being played on the court. it's why poise and unflappability are so prized. melo does not play with quite enough poise, as we have seen from this season with his griping and technicals. in short, you don't need a framed diploma to be a psychologist. psyche students who think otherwise need to have their heads examined.

i have played organized basketball and received excellent coaching. i played until my back and my knees could no longer take the pounding.

You may be right that Melo's 3% will decline. But Jason Kidd had such a 3pt% spike from New Jersey to Dallas. Melo is a talented player that having a 40% 3pt % yr shouldn't really shock people. Carmelo has also been able to get in a good shooting rhythem for majority of the season. Making people have to fear Melo's 3pt ability is critical for when Amare comes back which is why he worked on it during the offseason and olympics.

good post and i agree. two things though: 1) we will see how much playing time he and stat actually spend together. my prediction is not a whole lot. 2) the 3-point shooting at issue is the semi-break stop and pop. nash is great at it and it has been an integral part of his game. kidd never takes that sort of shot. all his shots are in half-court play. and i don't think it is advisable for melo to take that sort of shot.

If Melo plays 34mins a game and Amare plays 30mins a game. They will play 26mins out of 48 or 50% of the game together on the court. Most likely including late in the 4th quarter with 4mins left in the game.

I brought up Melo's shooting rhythem because his stop and pop connect % depends on what type of shooting rhythem he has during the game. When he was on his tear vs Denver, Brooklyn and LA he was in such a good shooting rhythem that those aren't bad shots when the defender is sagging off him scared of penitration.

IronWillGiroud wrote:cooch you're a woman??

No.

tkf wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:Tkf I knew you were gonna be around to defend dk but wheres dk to defend himself? A high volume shooters % are skewed to any other kind of shooter. A high volume shooter takes more shots therefore his % will be different that a low volume shooter. Melo has been a high volume shooter all his NBA career,esp when he was in Denver. So this isnt even worth discussion esp with you tkf because you and dk hate Melo anyway.

would you consider kevin durant a high volume shooter? what about wade? Lebron? all of those guys shoot quite a bit and they have or currently shoot over 50% or around that area..

lets go back in time a bit.. reggie miller? bernard king? alex english? all of those guys shot a lot, and they shot a high percentage..

maybe carmelo needs to shoot less........ever thought of that...if carmelo's high volume is hurting his shooting %, therefore in some ways hurting his team... why shoot so much? what is your point here?

how about Kobe?

Your guy ("best since jordan")

41 shots last night. Never stops shooting and is at 45 pct for his career. Heat checks?

Durant, Wade and Lebron are all efficient. Yes.

Your arguments are at times really inconsistent.

mrKnickShot wrote:

tkf wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:Tkf I knew you were gonna be around to defend dk but wheres dk to defend himself? A high volume shooters % are skewed to any other kind of shooter. A high volume shooter takes more shots therefore his % will be different that a low volume shooter. Melo has been a high volume shooter all his NBA career,esp when he was in Denver. So this isnt even worth discussion esp with you tkf because you and dk hate Melo anyway.

would you consider kevin durant a high volume shooter? what about wade? Lebron? all of those guys shoot quite a bit and they have or currently shoot over 50% or around that area..

lets go back in time a bit.. reggie miller? bernard king? alex english? all of those guys shot a lot, and they shot a high percentage..

maybe carmelo needs to shoot less........ever thought of that...if carmelo's high volume is hurting his shooting %, therefore in some ways hurting his team... why shoot so much? what is your point here?

how about Kobe?

Your guy ("best since jordan")

41 shots last night. Never stops shooting and is at 45 pct for his career. Heat checks?

Durant, Wade and Lebron are all efficient. Yes.

Your arguments are at times really inconsistent.

I forgot about your other "star" guy.

Allen Iverson

cooch2584 wrote:And tkf, Melos high volume shooting has his team ONLY 19-7.So he must really be hurting his team(green font) You lose tkf.

yea, you win cooch.. I have to go now, gotta fly to NY to attend the 19-7 championship parade...

peace...

tkf wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:And tkf, Melos high volume shooting has his team ONLY 19-7.So he must really be hurting his team(green font) You lose tkf.

yea, you win cooch.. I have to go now, gotta fly to NY to attend the 19-7 championship parade...

peace...

And as usual tkf/dk7th chickens out when hes hit with FACTS. OH by the way whats the Fakers record?? Your a joke tkf/dk7th.