The biggest issue with Jules was that teams could sag off him and clog the lane. Randle never was a catch and shoot guy. KAT is comfortable shooting 10 3's a game. This trade is a huge win for both teams. Hopefully we will be able to judge the winner when they meet in the Finals.

tomlin8 wrote:

technomaster wrote:I like this trade. Sure, it hurts to lose Randle and DiVincenzo, but I think it reshapes our roster in mostly positive ways.

Towns: On offense, he does everything Hartenstein did - and better almost across the board. He does a great job as a high post distributor and allows us to continue that fluid style of play. He's also a legit 3pt shooter (39.8% for his career!) and give us a 3pt shooting center for the first time in Knicks history.

On defense, while he's not an elite shot blocking threat, he's a 7 footer and gives us a LOT more length than Randle would as a fill-in center. And his team tends to play better with him on the floor. His +/- was a whopping +321 last season, with a PER of 23.8. Wow.

So now some rationalizations:
* We badly needed a proven starting center. Mitch won't be in true game shape until after the all star break, and recent whispers said that Randle wasn't going to be ready for the start of the season, so we were getting into risky territory. Coupled with the fact that both of those players were unavailable for much of the 2nd of the season and playoffs with their annual late season injuries, it's quite frankly good business to plug in this hole on an otherwise championship-quality roster
* We needed to balance the logjam at swingman. The Bridges trade, while quite excellent, set us up with a messy log jam of swingman-sized talent, with Hart and DiVincenzo likely playing reserve minutes in spite of their starter-quality talent. They certain proved their capabilities during the playoffs, showing off what they could do when given 40mpg! Then there's the emerging McBride and highly touted rookie Kolek, both of whom looked slated for borderline garbage time/change of pace roles. DiVincenzo opens up 20-25 mins of playing time. Let's just say that we had too much of a luxury of talent off the bench, and we've traded that for a starter.
* When healthy, we'll be a match up nightmare - With KAT as our starter, I anticipate a healthy starting lineup including KAT/Hart/OG/Bridges/Brunson, and Mitch moving to the bench. This gives us a mix of shooters, defenders, fundamental ball movers, cutters, and passers in our best lineup. We also have the option to play 2 7 footers at the same time.

nice post :)

Agree. But I see a huge part of this trade in not being able to sign Randle to the contract he wants and if the rumur of DDV wanting out are true it is two birds with one stone. I am not a KAT fan but he does bring versatility, and outside shooting and we saw last year what the Knicks could do with a spread out offense through Brunson and no "bruiser" offensive player.

I love the cut of Randle's jib but I HATED the fact that they had to worry about his mental so much. Makes the Knicks much more versaile.

Now if we could just trade Mitch.......

If Randle and DDV wanted out, then a trade might have been a good idea. But KAT? Minny wasnt happy with KAT's performance in the conference Finals I guess.

Thibs likes leaning on his starters minuteswise, so trading DDV might have been done to prevent future drama. I was open to trading Randle, but he was a more complete player on offense, and gave more on D than KAT.

I understand the reasons for moving DDV and Randle, but Im surprised the FO thought this was the best we could do.

Thibs is said to have veto power over trades. Ive read that he has a big say in roster moves, so this one surprises me.

I would've never tried 'this' as un the whole offseason

Please forgot the each move or whatever

You really can't argue that our starting lineup is better than it was at any point last year

McBride also deserves to be in the rotation. I think Precious too

I like that there minutes are more readily able to be distributed between our rotation. I also like that we have a '**** you' matchup piece for KP and Turner, and a guy that should be able to hold his own against embiid.

EwingsGlass wrote:Brunson / Payne / Kolek
Hart / McBride / Shamet
Bridges / KBD / Dadiet
OG / Achiuwa / Morris
Towns / Sims / [Robinson]

Me personally I would start Achiuwa keeping OG & Bridges at the 2 & 3. With a rotation of OG sliding to the 4 with the 2nd unit of Mcbride & Hart.

1) Brunson. Team identity is sealed as Brunson’s team on contracts that are here for at least 2 more years.
2) Hart triple doubled in Randle’s absence regularly. His passing, defense and rebounding fits perfectly into this lineup. In my “Dray” scenario, Hart is the willing participant.
3) Bridges brings pretty much everything DDV did (maybe a little less scrappiness) with playmaking and a 7 foot wingspan.
4) OG was amazing. He will get injured with his style of play, but man, he still has upside.
5) KAT and Randle feel similar to people who don’t want to see the differences. You still will have a bit of the turnover prone action from KAT when trying to force a play, but you get a player at C that has positional size (7’4 wingspan), elite three point shooting that can take defenders out to 27’ like Zinger. His defense is actually net positive - go look. Another hometown kid. This is constructed almost perfectly to slot him in at the 5.

The Knicks literally bought the best available +/-, eFG, positional size and wingspan this summer at the cost of not waiting and seeing if the team could replicate January.

Payne/Kolek. Payne is like Elf if Elf could shoot. Understated pickup. Really solid playmaker. Kolek will have to earn his minutes by outplaying this guy.

Deuce/Shamet. His minutes become more secure. McBride ends up being our 6MOY entry.

KBD/Dadiet. KBD is well overlooked. Guy is fundamentally sound. Good positional size. Plug and play in a Taj manner. Dadiet is the future. Rumors are he is still growing.

Achiuwa/Morris. I mean, we know these guys. Let’s work on having enforcers around to protect our lil guys.

Robinson/Sims. I always thought KAT would cost MitchBeast. To still be able to bring Mitch in to face the Embiids of the world is amazing.

This team has so much symmetry. You have Huk and McCullar waiting in the wings with stark similarities to Robinson and Hart.

It’s just an amazingly constructed team.

Knicksfan wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:This guy is a reporter, but I'm not sure how credible his sources are. But, it might explain some things.

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://www.twitter.com/matissa15/status/1839868587135091093

Won’t lie: when I saw the other post hinting at a Knicks player wanting out, I didn’t think it was Randle, but actually DDV.

Makes sense, though: yeah, the Nova Knicks are a cool thing, but for DDV, he finally gets a chance to shine in prime time as a starting SG and you trade for one that will definitely take from your playing time and will move you back to the bench. This was probably a time bomb waiting to blow up during the season, so it makes sense to act.

Still, hurts though.

Guessing the player who wanted out. DDV makes more sense than Randle I agree.

ToddTT wrote:

nycericanguy wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

EwingsGlass wrote:Brunson / Payne / Kolek
Hart / McBride / Shamet
Bridges / KBD / Dadiet
OG / Achiuwa / Morris
Towns / Sims / [Robinson]

Me personally I would start Achiuwa keeping OG & Bridges at the 2 & 3. With a rotation of OG sliding to the 4 with the 2nd unit of Mcbride & Hart.

thats not a bad idea, Precious can move all over on D and also provide more rim protection. We have alot of options for sure.

Is Mitch in brackets because he might be outgoing as well?

Or because there's no telling if he'll ever be healthy enough to play significant minutes again?

we need MItch more than ever IMO, plenty of minutes for him because KAT can play the 4 as well. Mitch can backup C for 15mpg and you can play them together for another 10-15mpg

IHart opened up the offense at the high post with passing and a floater. Kat in this similar role, but a 20pt 40% three pt shooter 80% from FT!!

Defensively he isn't elite, but he holds positive defensive analytics. Last season 109 DTRTG, 3.6 DWS, 0.9 BPM.

Not to mention surrounded by quality defenders: Precious, OG, Bridges, Mcbride, Hart, Mitch.