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So when is Kemba starting again?
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BigDaddyG
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12/27/2021  4:51 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:

So should we slap the sht out THIBS..lol


Kemba always plays good when he's got that chip on his shoulder. Maybe Thibs was trying to press the right buttons?
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knicks1248
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12/27/2021  5:24 PM
BigDaddyG wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:

So should we slap the sht out THIBS..lol


Kemba always plays good when he's got that chip on his shoulder. Maybe Thibs was trying to press the right buttons?

Judging from Thibs initial comments it seemed more personal. Maybe if he benched him for Grimes or Mcbride i would think different, but cmon man, Alec Burk...... thats insult to injury, not to mention forcing Taj, Mitch and Randle to play on the court at the same time..that was brutal to watch

You can't sacrifice team wins to prove a point to one player...IDK dude, he loss some cool points with me on this one

ES
martin
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12/27/2021  5:45 PM
knicks1248 wrote:Judging from Thibs initial comments it seemed more personal. Maybe if he benched him for Grimes or Mcbride i would think different, but cmon man, Alec Burk...... thats insult to injury, not to mention forcing Taj, Mitch and Randle to play on the court at the same time..that was brutal to watch

You can't sacrifice team wins to prove a point to one player...IDK dude, he loss some cool points with me on this one

What were those comments? I don't recall any

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Knixkik
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12/27/2021  6:04 PM
martin wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:Judging from Thibs initial comments it seemed more personal. Maybe if he benched him for Grimes or Mcbride i would think different, but cmon man, Alec Burk...... thats insult to injury, not to mention forcing Taj, Mitch and Randle to play on the court at the same time..that was brutal to watch

You can't sacrifice team wins to prove a point to one player...IDK dude, he loss some cool points with me on this one

What were those comments? I don't recall any

Thibs went out of his way to make sure it wasn’t personal. Other than the fact that Kemba is a small guard which he made a point of.

That being said, Kemba has called it a blessing in disguise and understands more after watching, so seems like neither Kemba nor thibs are putting any of this on each other.
Clean
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12/27/2021  6:14 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:

So should we slap the sht out THIBS..lol


Kemba always plays good when he's got that chip on his shoulder. Maybe Thibs was trying to press the right buttons?

Judging from Thibs initial comments it seemed more personal. Maybe if he benched him for Grimes or Mcbride i would think different, but cmon man, Alec Burk...... thats insult to injury, not to mention forcing Taj, Mitch and Randle to play on the court at the same time..that was brutal to watch

You can't sacrifice team wins to prove a point to one player...IDK dude, he loss some cool points with me on this one

What are you talking about? Kemba was playing like trash. No one cared that Kemba was getting demoted at the time because he looked washed. Thibs was wrong for totally keeping him out of the rotation. However, he was not wrong for demoting Kemba. You have to let go of the recency bias. What we are seeing now is not the Kemba that was benched. He is no longer deferring to low efficiency ISO Randle.
martin
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12/27/2021  6:39 PM
Clean wrote:What are you talking about? Kemba was playing like trash. No one cared that Kemba was getting demoted at the time because he looked washed. Thibs was wrong for totally keeping him out of the rotation. However, he was not wrong for demoting Kemba. You have to let go of the recency bias. What we are seeing now is not the Kemba that was benched. He is no longer deferring to low efficiency ISO Randle.

I think you are pretty spot on with your entire take.

Regarding the bolded... I have not been able to closely watch all of the recent Kemba games but it does feel like the entire team - including Randle - is trying to get the ball out of Randle's hands, especially when taking the ball up the court, etc.

I've seen a few times where it seemed odd that Randle was looking for a guard to take ball up court, but also in a good way. I do think the team is at least trying to evolve.

They see it and know it.

My take is that Thibs WANTED Kemba to take more control of the team whereas both Kemba and Fournier were trying to just fit in at first. And this was perhaps the frustration Thibs had with Kemba.

Kemba is back and playing more like himself. Team is playing better albeit against GLeague level, COVID decimated teams.

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NYKMentality
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12/27/2021  7:39 PM
Thibs was 100% right for removing Kemba Walker.

Kemba was playing like pure TRASH and was not playing how coach Thibs envisioned him playing from day 1 (when he IMMEDIATELY made him his starting PG).

Thibs knew what he was doing with Kemba the entire time.

And it worked out.

Because Kemba has been on a RAMPAGE since his return 4 games ago.

And why?

Because it was coach Thibs who lit a fire under his ass.

Coach Thibs is one of only 5 NBA coaches of All-Time with multiple Coach Of The Year Award Honors

He knew EXACTLY what he was doing with Kemba Walker and it's now paying off.

Thibs is wrong about one thing. It needs to be Evan Fournier who gets BENCHED forever (in favor of QuentinGrimes).

Knixkik
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12/27/2021  8:04 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/27/2021  8:05 PM
Early season was supposed to be a carry over of last year. Don’t fix what isn’t broken. In this case, it was Randle being the primary playmaker. Walker and Fournier were trying to blend with that. Now it’s clear that Randle doesn’t currently have last year’s magic as that all around superstar. Kemba needs to be treated as more of the playmaker and Randle can be a finisher more often. I think sometimes going back to the basics is the simplest answer. For as washed as Kemba looked, if he can be the Kemba of old 75% of the time than this needs to be partially his offense.
EwingsGlass
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12/27/2021  8:12 PM
martin wrote:
Clean wrote:What are you talking about? Kemba was playing like trash. No one cared that Kemba was getting demoted at the time because he looked washed. Thibs was wrong for totally keeping him out of the rotation. However, he was not wrong for demoting Kemba. You have to let go of the recency bias. What we are seeing now is not the Kemba that was benched. He is no longer deferring to low efficiency ISO Randle.

I think you are pretty spot on with your entire take.

Regarding the bolded... I have not been able to closely watch all of the recent Kemba games but it does feel like the entire team - including Randle - is trying to get the ball out of Randle's hands, especially when taking the ball up the court, etc.

I've seen a few times where it seemed odd that Randle was looking for a guard to take ball up court, but also in a good way. I do think the team is at least trying to evolve.

They see it and know it.

My take is that Thibs WANTED Kemba to take more control of the team whereas both Kemba and Fournier were trying to just fit in at first. And this was perhaps the frustration Thibs had with Kemba.

Kemba is back and playing more like himself. Team is playing better albeit against GLeague level, COVID decimated teams.

My issue with Kemba was more associated with athletic PGs running right past him. FVV and Devonte Graham made his defense non existent. I didn't see him fighting over screens. Or picking up his man at the half court mark. He seemed to be getting caught flat-footed by more agile players.

The best arguments for Kemba are that he wasn't being used properly. I love the analysis of letting him control the game more. It begs the question whether Randle and him can establish the chemistry they need to build this team further.

Re: Fournier, I have been a clear critic. He also needs to unlock his game a bit more. I wonder if he would be better suited to being the 6th man with a bit more freedom to run that second unit while Rose is out. Grimes might be a better fit based on his spot shooting and on ball defense. He doesn't seem to need the ball in his hands to be effective and seems better suited to filling Bullock's former role in the offense.

You know I gonna spin wit it
NYKMentality
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12/27/2021  8:58 PM
Knixkik wrote:Early season was supposed to be a carry over of last year. Dont fix what isnt broken. In this case, it was Randle being the primary playmaker. Walker and Fournier were trying to blend with that. Now its clear that Randle doesn;t currently have last year;s magic as that all around superstar. Kemba needs to be treated as more of the playmaker and Randle can be a finisher more often. I think sometimes going back to the basics is the simplest answer. For as washed as Kemba looked, if he can be the Kemba of old 75% of the time than this needs to be partially his offense.

Hey man. Believe it or not. But Julius Randle's numbers outside of 3PT% are damn near identical to last year. Including both of his assist/turnover numbers.

In other words he's an increased 3PT% away from becoming last year's All-Star.

You're as good as your last game and Julius Randle was down right awesome on Christmas Day.

He also led us to the playoffs last year and I'm not one to TRASH him only 33 games into a long season.

Philc1
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12/27/2021  9:46 PM
NYKMentality wrote:Thibs was 100% right for removing Kemba Walker.

Kemba was playing like pure TRASH and was not playing how coach Thibs envisioned him playing from day 1 (when he IMMEDIATELY made him his starting PG).

Thibs knew what he was doing with Kemba the entire time.

And it worked out.

Because Kemba has been on a RAMPAGE since his return 4 games ago.

And why?

Because it was coach Thibs who lit a fire under his ass.

Coach Thibs is one of only 5 NBA coaches of All-Time with multiple Coach Of The Year Award Honors

He knew EXACTLY what he was doing with Kemba Walker and it's now paying off.

Thibs is wrong about one thing. It needs to be Evan Fournier who gets BENCHED forever (in favor of QuentinGrimes).

Moves that are 100% right usually don’t result in a subsequent 2-8 run
Philc1
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12/27/2021  9:47 PM
NYKMentality wrote:
Knixkik wrote:Early season was supposed to be a carry over of last year. Dont fix what isnt broken. In this case, it was Randle being the primary playmaker. Walker and Fournier were trying to blend with that. Now its clear that Randle doesn;t currently have last year;s magic as that all around superstar. Kemba needs to be treated as more of the playmaker and Randle can be a finisher more often. I think sometimes going back to the basics is the simplest answer. For as washed as Kemba looked, if he can be the Kemba of old 75% of the time than this needs to be partially his offense.

Hey man. Believe it or not. But Julius Randle's numbers outside of 3PT% are damn near identical to last year. Including both of his assist/turnover numbers.

In other words he's an increased 3PT% away from becoming last year's All-Star.

You're as good as your last game and Julius Randle was down right awesome on Christmas Day.

He also led us to the playoffs last year and I'm not one to TRASH him only 33 games into a long season.

The 3pt % decline is critical because it wrecks our spacing on offense. Having a PG who can hit from 3 helps mitigate that.
Knixkik
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12/27/2021  10:14 PM
NYKMentality wrote:
Knixkik wrote:Early season was supposed to be a carry over of last year. Dont fix what isnt broken. In this case, it was Randle being the primary playmaker. Walker and Fournier were trying to blend with that. Now its clear that Randle doesn;t currently have last year;s magic as that all around superstar. Kemba needs to be treated as more of the playmaker and Randle can be a finisher more often. I think sometimes going back to the basics is the simplest answer. For as washed as Kemba looked, if he can be the Kemba of old 75% of the time than this needs to be partially his offense.

Hey man. Believe it or not. But Julius Randle's numbers outside of 3PT% are damn near identical to last year. Including both of his assist/turnover numbers.

In other words he's an increased 3PT% away from becoming last year's All-Star.

You're as good as your last game and Julius Randle was down right awesome on Christmas Day.

He also led us to the playoffs last year and I'm not one to TRASH him only 33 games into a long season.

Yes hopefully there’s some regression back to last years 3pt shooting with Randle.
NYKMentality
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12/28/2021  1:32 AM
Philc1 wrote:
NYKMentality wrote:Thibs was 100% right for removing Kemba Walker.

Kemba was playing like pure TRASH and was not playing how coach Thibs envisioned him playing from day 1 (when he IMMEDIATELY made him his starting PG).

Thibs knew what he was doing with Kemba the entire time.

And it worked out.

Because Kemba has been on a RAMPAGE since his return 4 games ago.

And why?

Because it was coach Thibs who lit a fire under his ass.

Coach Thibs is one of only 5 NBA coaches of All-Time with multiple Coach Of The Year Award Honors

He knew EXACTLY what he was doing with Kemba Walker and it's now paying off.

Thibs is wrong about one thing. It needs to be Evan Fournier who gets BENCHED forever (in favor of QuentinGrimes).

Moves that are 100% right usually don;t result in a subsequent 2-8 run

Get your numbers right.

The Knicks went 3-7 during the 10 days of Kemba benching, not "2-8".

And before the Kemba benching? Kemba was playing like TRASH and only averaging...

11.7 points.
3.1 assists.
2.6 rebounds.
And a +/- differential of only -122.4.

During his first 18 games he had 14 games of - point differentials.

-1.
-2.
-14.
-16.
-11.
-10.
-2.
-22.
-23.
-15.
-3.
-4.
-3.
-13 (BENCHED)!

Tom Thibs had every right to bench his ass.

BECAUSE COACH THIBS EXPECTED MORE FROM HIS STARTING PG AND KEMBA WAS PLAYING ATROCIOUS BASKETBALL.

And after the Kemba benching? Kemba is now averaging...

26.0 points.
7.0 assists.
8.3 rebounds.
And a +/- differential of +37.2.

During his previous 4 games he's had (ALL) 4 games of + point differentials.

+5.
+9.
+4.
+19.

Coach Thibs lit a New York fire under Kemba Walker and it's now paying off big time.

And if you can not comprehend why coach Thibs benched him for 10 games? Well then that's something I can not help you with.

Nalod
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12/28/2021  8:39 AM
Slap Thibs? When a player rises you praise the coach! Kemba was playing like ****. Burkes was not the answer but Kemba needed time to get it together. Thibs holds true that all guys get opportunities.
The question was does Kemba respond. He did.

crying about Grimes and Mcbride. They got in. Thibs did not hold them back, he got them ready. Deuce lit up the Gleague. Why? Cuz his coach got him ready. The buck stops with Thibs and his coaches.

At the same level Thibs shares “blame” with Randle in my eyes. I don’t believe last year was a fluke. But I believe the chemistry is not easily recreated for the aggregate of many small things. Team construction mattered. Even if we “upgraded” the roster we did not maintain the chemistry. If your making beef stew you want good ingredients Funny, you don’t use top cuts of beef, you use a fattier cut and let it simmer over time. small change might not make it better. With basketball you don’t things until you can get hindsight. Is 30game enough? maybe. As our resident optimist NYmentality reminds us the team is not much worse than last year and a strong finish perhaps puts us back in the 45 win area most professional protagonists had us.

Tank? Too soon. Put it all on the Rooks? Too soon. Im not against elevating Grimes and McBride but we do as fans get a bit carried away with their potential?
Philc1
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12/28/2021  10:26 AM
NYKMentality wrote:
Philc1 wrote:
NYKMentality wrote:Thibs was 100% right for removing Kemba Walker.

Kemba was playing like pure TRASH and was not playing how coach Thibs envisioned him playing from day 1 (when he IMMEDIATELY made him his starting PG).

Thibs knew what he was doing with Kemba the entire time.

And it worked out.

Because Kemba has been on a RAMPAGE since his return 4 games ago.

And why?

Because it was coach Thibs who lit a fire under his ass.

Coach Thibs is one of only 5 NBA coaches of All-Time with multiple Coach Of The Year Award Honors

He knew EXACTLY what he was doing with Kemba Walker and it's now paying off.

Thibs is wrong about one thing. It needs to be Evan Fournier who gets BENCHED forever (in favor of QuentinGrimes).

Moves that are 100% right usually don;t result in a subsequent 2-8 run

Get your numbers right.

The Knicks went 3-7 during the 10 days of Kemba benching, not "2-8".

And before the Kemba benching? Kemba was playing like TRASH and only averaging...

11.7 points.
3.1 assists.
2.6 rebounds.
And a +/- differential of only -122.4.

During his first 18 games he had 14 games of - point differentials.

-1.
-2.
-14.
-16.
-11.
-10.
-2.
-22.
-23.
-15.
-3.
-4.
-3.
-13 (BENCHED)!

Tom Thibs had every right to bench his ass.

BECAUSE COACH THIBS EXPECTED MORE FROM HIS STARTING PG AND KEMBA WAS PLAYING ATROCIOUS BASKETBALL.

And after the Kemba benching? Kemba is now averaging...

26.0 points.
7.0 assists.
8.3 rebounds.
And a +/- differential of +37.2.

During his previous 4 games he's had (ALL) 4 games of + point differentials.

+5.
+9.
+4.
+19.

Coach Thibs lit a New York fire under Kemba Walker and it's now paying off big time.

And if you can not comprehend why coach Thibs benched him for 10 games? Well then that's something I can not help you with.

We were a game over .500 and the 6th seed prior to the Kemba benching. Has he mostly been off the charts good since getting out of the Thibs doghouse? Yes but stop acting like Kemba was a worse Dennis Smith Jr
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So when is Kemba starting again?
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