Thought a young combo guard like Austin Rivers would've been ideal.

Nonetheless Lee will help the Knicks but think Holiday will provide the same with maybe more skill offensively.

yellowboy90 wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:I still might have tried to go big and sign Crabbe to an offer sheet by trading O'quinn for cap space. That could have created $19m or so in funds.

We will need that cap space to find a backup PG and a backup SG

They only have 4.3m left to find both unless they trade O'Quinn. They may find someone but I'd rather they invested in a young guy with upside instead of a 4yr contract to a guy over 30. He's an okay player so it is what it is

Our bench is going to be putrid, not good considering how injury prone this roster is.

ESOMKnicks wrote:Sorry, but how is Courtney Lee better than Afflalo, to justify giving him more money for a longer term? Afflalo scores and rebounds more, maybe Lee is a better defender, i dont know, but even then it is still a wash. Why are people getting so excited about this signing?
And isnt Courtney a girl's name?

Cartman718 wrote:

ESOMKnicks wrote:Sorry, but how is Courtney Lee better than Afflalo, to justify giving him more money for a longer term? Afflalo scores and rebounds more, maybe Lee is a better defender, i dont know, but even then it is still a wash. Why are people getting so excited about this signing?
And isnt Courtney a girl's name?

Assflac are you kidding me? That guy thought he was Melo and never found a shot he didn't like. He was horrible.

His 3pt shooting % was even slightly better than Courtney's. His overall shooting % only slightly lower. And his scoring average was higher. So if he was horrible, what is it that makes Lee so much better?

           
                                                          AST                    TO
Overall	        GP MIN  OffRtg  DefRtg NetRtg AST% AST/TO Ratio OREB% DREB% REB% Ratio eFG% TS%   USG% PACE  PIE
Courtney Lee	79 29.6	106.2	103.3   2.9   8.8  1.89   15.1  1.4   8.7   5.0  8.0   51.8 55.1  15.0 95.81 7.1
Arron Afflalo	71 33.4	103.1	106.3  -3.2   9.7  1.76   13.3  1.1   10.9  6.1  7.6   50.0 53.1  18.1 94.97 7.6

So Defense and Offense is actually better for Lee. The other is that Lee is a quicker and more capable player for a team looking to play a bit more uptempo. You simply can't have Afflalo AND a Jose or Rose out there. It makes the team D simply too weak. Afflalo slows down the ball movement as well. It's not just the passing for assists aspect. Afflalo pounds the ball too much at times.

yellowboy90 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

ESOMKnicks wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

ESOMKnicks wrote:Sorry, but how is Courtney Lee better than Afflalo, to justify giving him more money for a longer term? Afflalo scores and rebounds more, maybe Lee is a better defender, i dont know, but even then it is still a wash. Why are people getting so excited about this signing?
And isnt Courtney a girl's name?

Assflac are you kidding me? That guy thought he was Melo and never found a shot he didn't like. He was horrible.

His 3pt shooting % was even slightly better than Courtney's. His overall shooting % only slightly lower. And his scoring average was higher. So if he was horrible, what is it that makes Lee so much better?

In the simple box scores stats, no differences really stand out. There are just a lot of small differences that favor Lee. When you add them all together, it makes more of an impact. Here are all the stats I can find:

Lee vs. Afflalo
WS48: .080 vs. .055
Points per 100 possessions: 109 vs. 105
Points given up per 100: 109 vs. 112
Box plus minus: -.6 vs. -2.4
PER: 11.5 vs. 10.9
Net production (own - opp): -.4 (in Memphis for Lee) and -2.0 (in Cho - smaller sample) vs. -1.4

So the numbers do favor Lee but he's a bit below average in terms of statistical production. But Afflalo was way further below average. The real question is whether that difference is actually worth 25 mil (or 36 mil since only 14 mil is guaranteed for Afflalo).

I think the real difference come in Lee's defense but career wise they are pretty much the same like you said except it seems like AA is having a steeper decline.

Bonn1997 wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

ESOMKnicks wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

ESOMKnicks wrote:Sorry, but how is Courtney Lee better than Afflalo, to justify giving him more money for a longer term? Afflalo scores and rebounds more, maybe Lee is a better defender, i dont know, but even then it is still a wash. Why are people getting so excited about this signing?
And isnt Courtney a girl's name?

Assflac are you kidding me? That guy thought he was Melo and never found a shot he didn't like. He was horrible.

His 3pt shooting % was even slightly better than Courtney's. His overall shooting % only slightly lower. And his scoring average was higher. So if he was horrible, what is it that makes Lee so much better?

In the simple box scores stats, no differences really stand out. There are just a lot of small differences that favor Lee. When you add them all together, it makes more of an impact. Here are all the stats I can find:

Lee vs. Afflalo
WS48: .080 vs. .055
Points per 100 possessions: 109 vs. 105
Points given up per 100: 109 vs. 112
Box plus minus: -.6 vs. -2.4
PER: 11.5 vs. 10.9
Net production (own - opp): -.4 (in Memphis for Lee) and -2.0 (in Cho - smaller sample) vs. -1.4

So the numbers do favor Lee but he's a bit below average in terms of statistical production. But Afflalo was way further below average. The real question is whether that difference is actually worth 25 mil (or 36 mil since only 14 mil is guaranteed for Afflalo).

I think the real difference come in Lee's defense but career wise they are pretty much the same like you said except it seems like AA is having a steeper decline.

That's a good point. I see Afflalo's opponents shot 45.2% against him and Lee's shot 41.8% last year. That's a huge difference.

Cartman718 wrote:I was going to reply to esomknicks but the above posts summed it up best. More importantly, Courtney Lee plays in the flow of the offense whereas Assflac tries to control it.

fishmike wrote:ok signing. I think we could have done better honestly but he's a good fit with the players we have.

yellowboy90 wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:I still might have tried to go big and sign Crabbe to an offer sheet by trading O'quinn for cap space. That could have created $19m or so in funds.

We will need that cap space to find a backup PG and a backup SG

They only have 4.3m left to find both unless they trade O'Quinn. They may find someone but I'd rather they invested in a young guy with upside instead of a 4yr contract to a guy over 30. He's an okay player so it is what it is

I think they want to win now and saw Lee as the right guy. Fournier resigned with the Magic. I think Portland matches an offer to Crabbe. I don't think Rivers was leaving the clips/dad. Waiters may have been attainable but I think Lee is a better choice. Batum resigned. I think Lee was the guy. Maybe Holiday continues to develop. Not much out there. Marks may make an offer to Crabbe and if the Blazers don't match we can certainly second guess the Lee signing.

Unless they get some breaks health wise they are not winning much now. So if you do not have an elite team you need to hedge especially if the players you are choosing from are of equal talent but one is younger. Crabbe will most likely not be the one breaking down in a year or two.. ALso, I like the fact that crabbe can play the 2/3.

I know they are looking for a back up point but hopefully they can snag a young back up 2.