holfresh wrote:

s3231 wrote:Also:

- Phil was clear that we will not be aggressive in trading this pick. Said we will sit back and let teams make offers and if there is anything out there that is interesting, we'll listen. As I said earlier though, the sense we all got tonight after listening to both Phil and Steve is that they realize the value in drafting this high and are looking to keep the pick as opposed to what we are accustomed to seeing with this franchise.

- This was reported already but Steve mentioned how there has been pressure in the past to make moves that would play well in the media or would be short-term wins. Says under Phil, it is different in that they are just trying to build a great basketball team and want to do what is right for the organization (personal note: I thought it was sad that this was even admitted...)

- Phil thinks fans should watch the Final Four (this was after a question about whether or not Knocks fans should be interested in the games left and knowing that Phil couldn't comment on specific players)

- Phil mentioned how remarkable it was that fans still not only come to the games, but still make the Garden loud and make their presence felt (he mentioned last night's game specifically). Said that he wanted to do this town hall personally because he knows how passionate the fans are and he wanted to give the season ticketholders a better sense of where he thought the team was going (said this was something he was used to doing in LA and Chicago). On a personal note, I will say this was the 1st time the Knocks have done this in my 6 years as a ticketholders....... was refreshing

- Lance Thomas, Galloway, and Amundson mentioned as players that seem to grasp the system pretty easily (in reference to a question about who the learners are and which players already get it). Was interesting because these names were mentioned a few times throughout the conversation and starting to think that they like these 3 enough to consider bringing them back next season. Steve in particular, mentioned that guys like Lance and Amundson are leaders in how professional they are and how they approach the team.

- On leadership: Phil mentioned how difficult it is to get a sense of which young players will develop into great leaders (in reference to our pick). Said that this is something that needs to be nurtured. Mentioned how Melo has made strides in this area this year and how he is at the training center even through his rehab. Steve spoke for a bit about how involved Melo is and mentioned that he oven goes into Steve's office to discuss the roster/players/options/etch

- In regards to the triangle and offense in general, Phil made it clear that he wants us to be aggressive and wants the team to get easy baskets whenever is possible. Feels like the media has made the triangle into a big deal and actually said at one point to "forget about the triangle." Emphasized that the triangle is only an option when we're not able to run down the court and get transition baskets. Says we will never be a team that scores 130 points a night but that he still wants the team to get great shots early in the shot clock if there are opportunities to do so.

I don't understand "forget the triangle" talk, it only an option..Phil hired a coach with no experience with assistants specifically to run the triangle..He is trading players for nothing in return that so called don't fit the triangle...Now it's only an option??..Well can we get a real coach in here then and tell him the triangle is an option??

+10000000000

knicks1248 wrote:This team is horrific in ever phase of the game, at every position. i mean he doesn't matter who he picks. We need a defensive big, a offensive big, a pg, a rebounder, a slasher, some shooters. you name it we need it

I would think with so little time left to this season that you would shift from Biotch Mode to looking at the options for the future. The point is whoever he picks in the draft could greatly impact who we go after in Free Agency. What if he does trade down for another pick? There's an awful lot of scenarios to discuss rather than to restate how bad the team is at this point.

holfresh wrote:

s3231 wrote:Also:

- Phil was clear that we will not be aggressive in trading this pick. Said we will sit back and let teams make offers and if there is anything out there that is interesting, we'll listen. As I said earlier though, the sense we all got tonight after listening to both Phil and Steve is that they realize the value in drafting this high and are looking to keep the pick as opposed to what we are accustomed to seeing with this franchise.

- This was reported already but Steve mentioned how there has been pressure in the past to make moves that would play well in the media or would be short-term wins. Says under Phil, it is different in that they are just trying to build a great basketball team and want to do what is right for the organization (personal note: I thought it was sad that this was even admitted...)

- Phil thinks fans should watch the Final Four (this was after a question about whether or not Knocks fans should be interested in the games left and knowing that Phil couldn't comment on specific players)

- Phil mentioned how remarkable it was that fans still not only come to the games, but still make the Garden loud and make their presence felt (he mentioned last night's game specifically). Said that he wanted to do this town hall personally because he knows how passionate the fans are and he wanted to give the season ticketholders a better sense of where he thought the team was going (said this was something he was used to doing in LA and Chicago). On a personal note, I will say this was the 1st time the Knocks have done this in my 6 years as a ticketholders....... was refreshing

- Lance Thomas, Galloway, and Amundson mentioned as players that seem to grasp the system pretty easily (in reference to a question about who the learners are and which players already get it). Was interesting because these names were mentioned a few times throughout the conversation and starting to think that they like these 3 enough to consider bringing them back next season. Steve in particular, mentioned that guys like Lance and Amundson are leaders in how professional they are and how they approach the team.

- On leadership: Phil mentioned how difficult it is to get a sense of which young players will develop into great leaders (in reference to our pick). Said that this is something that needs to be nurtured. Mentioned how Melo has made strides in this area this year and how he is at the training center even through his rehab. Steve spoke for a bit about how involved Melo is and mentioned that he oven goes into Steve's office to discuss the roster/players/options/etch

- In regards to the triangle and offense in general, Phil made it clear that he wants us to be aggressive and wants the team to get easy baskets whenever is possible. Feels like the media has made the triangle into a big deal and actually said at one point to "forget about the triangle." Emphasized that the triangle is only an option when we're not able to run down the court and get transition baskets. Says we will never be a team that scores 130 points a night but that he still wants the team to get great shots early in the shot clock if there are opportunities to do so.

I don't understand "forget the triangle" talk, it only an option..Phil hired a coach with no experience with assistants specifically to run the triangle..He is trading players for nothing in return that so called don't fit the triangle...Now it's only an option??..Well can we get a real coach in here then and tell him the triangle is an option??

Instead he straight says yes I know who I would pick and goes on to describe Willie Stein as close to the line that you can without being fined. The clincher to me was how confidant he was --how can you be confidant without the pick? We only have a 25% chance of landing this pick so why would an intelligent man say anything without the lottery process going on unless its ordain that we are taking willie stein and he knows for the most part that at position 1-4 hes going to get him.

I think at April 1 2015 60 days before the draft--there is NO way we should be done with the process. That guys like Mudiay Hozenga Winslow Russell Okafor need to be put through personal workouts and interviews et al. Does Phil J even know that for some reason last year Willie Stein choose to become a blonde for 6 weeks and then colored his hair purple? At the time he seemed to have some personal issues there that would absolutely have to be looked ta if he is to come here to play in NY? This is a process we need to take our time and really think about it.

GustavBahler wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Hmm I think that Phil should NOT have answered that question about the pick. He shouldve said we have our thoughts on players that have evolved over a long period of time and we feel great that we will improve the team in a major way at the draft.

Instead he straight says yes I know who I would pick and goes on to describe Willie Stein as close to the line that you can without being fined. The clincher to me was how confidant he was --how can you be confidant without the pick? We only have a 25% chance of landing this pick so why would an intelligent man say anything without the lottery process going on unless its ordain that we are taking willie stein and he knows for the most part that at position 1-4 hes going to get him.

I think at April 1 2015 60 days before the draft--there is NO way we should be done with the process. That guys like Mudiay Hozenga Winslow Russell Okafor need to be put through personal workouts and interviews et al. Does Phil J even know that for some reason last year Willie Stein choose to become a blonde for 6 weeks and then colored his hair purple? At the time he seemed to have some personal issues there that would absolutely have to be looked ta if he is to come here to play in NY? This is a process we need to take our time and really think about it.

Phil does have a habit of telegraphing his punches, started with his pursuit of Kerr. Agree that he should be playing it closer to his vest.

I forgot about Kerr. Good point..

GustavBahler wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Hmm I think that Phil should NOT have answered that question about the pick. He shouldve said we have our thoughts on players that have evolved over a long period of time and we feel great that we will improve the team in a major way at the draft.

Instead he straight says yes I know who I would pick and goes on to describe Willie Stein as close to the line that you can without being fined. The clincher to me was how confidant he was --how can you be confidant without the pick? We only have a 25% chance of landing this pick so why would an intelligent man say anything without the lottery process going on unless its ordain that we are taking willie stein and he knows for the most part that at position 1-4 hes going to get him.

I think at April 1 2015 60 days before the draft--there is NO way we should be done with the process. That guys like Mudiay Hozenga Winslow Russell Okafor need to be put through personal workouts and interviews et al. Does Phil J even know that for some reason last year Willie Stein choose to become a blonde for 6 weeks and then colored his hair purple? At the time he seemed to have some personal issues there that would absolutely have to be looked ta if he is to come here to play in NY? This is a process we need to take our time and really think about it.

Phil does have a habit of telegraphing his punches, started with his pursuit of Kerr. Agree that he should be playing it closer to his vest.

BRIGGS wrote:Hmm I think that Phil should NOT have answered that question about the pick. He shouldve said we have our thoughts on players that have evolved over a long period of time and we feel great that we will improve the team in a major way at the draft.

Instead he straight says yes I know who I would pick and goes on to describe Willie Stein as close to the line that you can without being fined. The clincher to me was how confidant he was --how can you be confidant without the pick? We only have a 25% chance of landing this pick so why would an intelligent man say anything without the lottery process going on unless its ordain that we are taking willie stein and he knows for the most part that at position 1-4 hes going to get him.

I think at April 1 2015 60 days before the draft--there is NO way we should be done with the process. That guys like Mudiay Hozenga Winslow Russell Okafor need to be put through personal workouts and interviews et al. Does Phil J even know that for some reason last year Willie Stein choose to become a blonde for 6 weeks and then colored his hair purple? At the time he seemed to have some personal issues there that would absolutely have to be looked ta if he is to come here to play in NY? This is a process we need to take our time and really think about it.

I actually said the same thing after the town hall to one of my friends. In Phil's defense too, he answered a question that was asked of him very directly and Phil has always been blunt (which is a little refreshing from a transparency perspective but at same time, a little frustrating if it screws up our execution).

Phil was asked what he prefers in a big man by Al and he was very direct and flat out said he thinks defense is more important at that position. I give him kudos for being truthful and honestly answering the question instead of skating around it (unless it's a smokescreen but I didn't get that sense). At the same time....we've been down this path so many times and have seen our targets go to other teams.....everybody knows how desperately we wanted Steph Curry in the draft and hell, we also wanted Westbrook in that Gallinari draft and were looking for ways to either move up or hope that he falls....it seems like we never seem to get what we want.

I will say, it was very refreshing as a fan and as ticket-holder to hear that confidence in Phil's voice that he at least knows what he wants to build up to. Admittedly, he said it might not happen right away and he would not commit to us getting there after only one off-season but the guy clearly knows what he wants from this team and knows what he is looking for in his players.

I definitely did not get the sense that he was describing Stein at #1 but who knows, I could be wrong and maybe that is the type of guy he would consider if we fall out of the top 2?

I will say, the Thanasis 2nd round pick from last year makes more sense after hearing his through process last night.

holfresh wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

s3231 wrote:Also:

- Phil was clear that we will not be aggressive in trading this pick. Said we will sit back and let teams make offers and if there is anything out there that is interesting, we'll listen. As I said earlier though, the sense we all got tonight after listening to both Phil and Steve is that they realize the value in drafting this high and are looking to keep the pick as opposed to what we are accustomed to seeing with this franchise.

- This was reported already but Steve mentioned how there has been pressure in the past to make moves that would play well in the media or would be short-term wins. Says under Phil, it is different in that they are just trying to build a great basketball team and want to do what is right for the organization (personal note: I thought it was sad that this was even admitted...)

- Phil thinks fans should watch the Final Four (this was after a question about whether or not Knocks fans should be interested in the games left and knowing that Phil couldn't comment on specific players)

- Phil mentioned how remarkable it was that fans still not only come to the games, but still make the Garden loud and make their presence felt (he mentioned last night's game specifically). Said that he wanted to do this town hall personally because he knows how passionate the fans are and he wanted to give the season ticketholders a better sense of where he thought the team was going (said this was something he was used to doing in LA and Chicago). On a personal note, I will say this was the 1st time the Knocks have done this in my 6 years as a ticketholders....... was refreshing

- Lance Thomas, Galloway, and Amundson mentioned as players that seem to grasp the system pretty easily (in reference to a question about who the learners are and which players already get it). Was interesting because these names were mentioned a few times throughout the conversation and starting to think that they like these 3 enough to consider bringing them back next season. Steve in particular, mentioned that guys like Lance and Amundson are leaders in how professional they are and how they approach the team.

- On leadership: Phil mentioned how difficult it is to get a sense of which young players will develop into great leaders (in reference to our pick). Said that this is something that needs to be nurtured. Mentioned how Melo has made strides in this area this year and how he is at the training center even through his rehab. Steve spoke for a bit about how involved Melo is and mentioned that he oven goes into Steve's office to discuss the roster/players/options/etch

- In regards to the triangle and offense in general, Phil made it clear that he wants us to be aggressive and wants the team to get easy baskets whenever is possible. Feels like the media has made the triangle into a big deal and actually said at one point to "forget about the triangle." Emphasized that the triangle is only an option when we're not able to run down the court and get transition baskets. Says we will never be a team that scores 130 points a night but that he still wants the team to get great shots early in the shot clock if there are opportunities to do so.

I don't understand "forget the triangle" talk, it only an option..Phil hired a coach with no experience with assistants specifically to run the triangle..He is trading players for nothing in return that so called don't fit the triangle...Now it's only an option??..Well can we get a real coach in here then and tell him the triangle is an option??

I think it was explained pretty well. Be opportunistic and get baskets in transition when possible. I think his saying that the media has made a big deal about the triangle is accurate. The coaching staff is made up of Phil guys but it is also made up of guys that have been involved in winning a lot of championships.

No the coaching staff is made of guys who will promote the triangle, implemented the triangle...Trades were made after Phil statements were made in December about players not picking up on the system...Phil only interviewed/wanted coaches(his guys) who would run the triangle..Phil is saying going forward, he isn't going after the big names but guys that fit the style of play he is looking for...So now it's not important, it's overblown-ed??...Phil is doing double speak...

I disagree. I think Phil has been very consistent in saying for 4-5 months now that the media has overhyped the triangle and even in Spike's documentary, I'm pretty confident he tried to level-set expectations and explained that this was a basic offense that allowed us to have a set system to employ if the fastbreak isn't there and if no attractive opportunities present themselves. That's why when he said "forget the triangle" last night, I wasn't really surprised at all and didn't think it was controversial in the way that he said it.

Another thing from the town hall last night that came up that kind of ties to this....Phil explained that when he came on board, he expected this team to compete at a similar level to last year's team. But even last year, he knew that this roster was a long way from being a contender and he knew that the roster had to essentially be turned over to get to that level. Obviously, he admitted that he didn't think we would have to turn the roster over this quickly but it had to happen regardless.

His point last night was you have to get the players first and "then you worry about the triangle." Everybody is making this huge deal about the triangle and how it might be outdated but does anyone expect this system to work with the current roster? Hell, we all knew going into this season that at our very best, this team could maybe get into the 1st or 2nd round of the playoffs if every single thing went right. Then the injuries happened and we obviously saw the very worst of this team instead...

s3231 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

s3231 wrote:Also:

- Phil was clear that we will not be aggressive in trading this pick. Said we will sit back and let teams make offers and if there is anything out there that is interesting, we'll listen. As I said earlier though, the sense we all got tonight after listening to both Phil and Steve is that they realize the value in drafting this high and are looking to keep the pick as opposed to what we are accustomed to seeing with this franchise.

- This was reported already but Steve mentioned how there has been pressure in the past to make moves that would play well in the media or would be short-term wins. Says under Phil, it is different in that they are just trying to build a great basketball team and want to do what is right for the organization (personal note: I thought it was sad that this was even admitted...)

- Phil thinks fans should watch the Final Four (this was after a question about whether or not Knocks fans should be interested in the games left and knowing that Phil couldn't comment on specific players)

- Phil mentioned how remarkable it was that fans still not only come to the games, but still make the Garden loud and make their presence felt (he mentioned last night's game specifically). Said that he wanted to do this town hall personally because he knows how passionate the fans are and he wanted to give the season ticketholders a better sense of where he thought the team was going (said this was something he was used to doing in LA and Chicago). On a personal note, I will say this was the 1st time the Knocks have done this in my 6 years as a ticketholders....... was refreshing

- Lance Thomas, Galloway, and Amundson mentioned as players that seem to grasp the system pretty easily (in reference to a question about who the learners are and which players already get it). Was interesting because these names were mentioned a few times throughout the conversation and starting to think that they like these 3 enough to consider bringing them back next season. Steve in particular, mentioned that guys like Lance and Amundson are leaders in how professional they are and how they approach the team.

- On leadership: Phil mentioned how difficult it is to get a sense of which young players will develop into great leaders (in reference to our pick). Said that this is something that needs to be nurtured. Mentioned how Melo has made strides in this area this year and how he is at the training center even through his rehab. Steve spoke for a bit about how involved Melo is and mentioned that he oven goes into Steve's office to discuss the roster/players/options/etch

- In regards to the triangle and offense in general, Phil made it clear that he wants us to be aggressive and wants the team to get easy baskets whenever is possible. Feels like the media has made the triangle into a big deal and actually said at one point to "forget about the triangle." Emphasized that the triangle is only an option when we're not able to run down the court and get transition baskets. Says we will never be a team that scores 130 points a night but that he still wants the team to get great shots early in the shot clock if there are opportunities to do so.

I don't understand "forget the triangle" talk, it only an option..Phil hired a coach with no experience with assistants specifically to run the triangle..He is trading players for nothing in return that so called don't fit the triangle...Now it's only an option??..Well can we get a real coach in here then and tell him the triangle is an option??

I think it was explained pretty well. Be opportunistic and get baskets in transition when possible. I think his saying that the media has made a big deal about the triangle is accurate. The coaching staff is made up of Phil guys but it is also made up of guys that have been involved in winning a lot of championships.

No the coaching staff is made of guys who will promote the triangle, implemented the triangle...Trades were made after Phil statements were made in December about players not picking up on the system...Phil only interviewed/wanted coaches(his guys) who would run the triangle..Phil is saying going forward, he isn't going after the big names but guys that fit the style of play he is looking for...So now it's not important, it's overblown-ed??...Phil is doing double speak...

I disagree. I think Phil has been very consistent in saying for 4-5 months now that the media has overhyped the triangle and even in Spike's documentary, I'm pretty confident he tried to level-set expectations and explained that this was a basic offense that allowed us to have a set system to employ if the fastbreak isn't there and if no attractive opportunities present themselves. That's why when he said "forget the triangle" last night, I wasn't really surprised at all and didn't think it was controversial in the way that he said it.

Another thing from the town hall last night that came up that kind of ties to this....Phil explained that when he came on board, he expected this team to compete at a similar level to last year's team. But even last year, he knew that this roster was a long way from being a contender and he knew that the roster had to essentially be turned over to get to that level. Obviously, he admitted that he didn't think we would have to turn the roster over this quickly but it had to happen regardless.

His point last night was you have to get the players first and "then you worry about the triangle." Everybody is making this huge deal about the triangle and how it might be outdated but does anyone expect this system to work with the current roster? Hell, we all knew going into this season that at our very best, this team could maybe get into the 1st or 2nd round of the playoffs if every single thing went right. Then the injuries happened and we obviously saw the very worst of this team instead...

Thanks for the update on the Town Hall by the way, I thought it was excellent, through and insightful..Appreciate the effort..

I get the offense doesn't have to be implemented at evey possible moment..The point Im making is that his hiring a rookie coach, only interviewing guys who would run the triangle and assistants who would tow the line is all about the system he wants to run..Whether the team run the system every time down court doesn't matter..I know Chicago abondoaned it in the 4th and gave the ball to Jordan..Point is every team decision he makes is with the triangle in mind..coaches and players..So how are people not going to emphasis it?

Finestrg wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Hmm I think that Phil should NOT have answered that question about the pick. He shouldve said we have our thoughts on players that have evolved over a long period of time and we feel great that we will improve the team in a major way at the draft.

Instead he straight says yes I know who I would pick and goes on to describe Willie Stein as close to the line that you can without being fined. The clincher to me was how confidant he was --how can you be confidant without the pick? We only have a 25% chance of landing this pick so why would an intelligent man say anything without the lottery process going on unless its ordain that we are taking willie stein and he knows for the most part that at position 1-4 hes going to get him.

I think at April 1 2015 60 days before the draft--there is NO way we should be done with the process. That guys like Mudiay Hozenga Winslow Russell Okafor need to be put through personal workouts and interviews et al. Does Phil J even know that for some reason last year Willie Stein choose to become a blonde for 6 weeks and then colored his hair purple? At the time he seemed to have some personal issues there that would absolutely have to be looked ta if he is to come here to play in NY? This is a process we need to take our time and really think about it.

More good points -- yeah seriously, how can you be that confident that you're basically done with the process already and have your guy in the bag? That's crazy talk...This is a process now that's only just beginning. Has Phil even sat down and talked to any of these players? No--he's not allowed to yet.

Don't remember that stuff about Stein. Purple hair? Wow--yeah, we would definitely need to screen that kid thoroughly if we consider him a possibility...Bottom line on Stein for me -- big, good defensive role player with limited offensive potential. But to be clear -- no way you take this guy 1-3 in the draft. That'd be insane in the membrane...I gotta believe Phil understands that. He'd get destroyed with a decision like that and rightly so. Plus, with all the persecution/ridicule Stein would endure, he'd never be able to handle that. He'd never work out here and it'd be a wasted pick...At 4 Stein's more of a possibility I guess but even there, I wouldn't take him. Turner would probably be my guy there if I was dead set on drafting a big. I'm tellin' ya, man -- if we wanted some role-playing defensive bigs, how 'bout guys like Jordan Bachynski/Khem Birch for peanuts, maybe a Jeff Withey if we can get him cheap in FA etc., and call it a day. At 1-4 in this draft, I want a bonafide impact player, not a role player.

They could simply value Stein that high. They could look at him as some kind of hybrid Dennis Rodman who can affect the game with his defense who has the ability to lock down the opposing players best guy from whatever position. They have been at Kentucky for 3 months? or something like that and perhaps they have seen where Stein can be a better offensive player than shown.

In my view--just from watching Stein overtime--this is what I compute

First off--and anyone who really watches the nuances of the game--Willie Stein is not a good defensive rebounder for his size. Tyson Chandler is. Stein has somewhat of a weak base--looks like he has skinny legs and should be able to be moved easily by NBA caliber posts. He has absolutely no go to move. For every once in a while you see the hook that he shoots down at the basket--he has another shot that is either blocked or misses wildly from close range--I mean like wildly off from 3 feet. You'd have little confidence about throwing the ball inside for Willie Stein to make a play in the NBA when he hasnt done it in 3 years in CBB. In fact I take into question his whole feel for the game after 3 years on the offensive end. So if the goal is to make Carmelo play 4 then you are saying we will have 0 low post game in the starting unit. Also a triangle C needs to be a passer especially if he cant score--Willie Stein is NOT a good passer--again going back to feel for the game. Also even thought these people have watched Stein from a far and even in practice--they must be able to concede that Willie Stein has tendencies to disappear in games. Where was his energy on the boards against Notre Dame--why did he have 4 rebounds in 32 minutes? Why did a man 7 inches smaller repeatedly get inside him for rebounds? I just dont think Willie Stein in a league that is RELIANT on skills moreso than anytime in its history--would be a potential number 1 pick????

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:This team is horrific in ever phase of the game, at every position. i mean he doesn't matter who he picks. We need a defensive big, a offensive big, a pg, a rebounder, a slasher, some shooters. you name it we need it

We all know what the current state of the team is. This is after all a rebuild. What's the point of restating the obvious except to just be needlessly negative while you still can?

I would think with so little time left to this season that you would shift from Biotch Mode to looking at the options for the future. The point is whoever he picks in the draft could greatly impact who we go after in Free Agency. What if he does trade down for another pick? There's an awful lot of scenarios to discuss rather than to restate how bad the team is at this point.

I wasn't being negative, I'm simply stating we need everything. Picking in the top 3 is extremely tricky because you can easily fck it up.

If i get a solid offer for the pick, im not oppose to trading. I will always go with a sure thing, rather then "I hope it turns out to be a good player".

I have a different prospective on the draft base on who's running the franchise.

Right now I have little to no faith in a president who assembled the worst roster in franchise history, and then holds a Q and A and gives the media the questions to ask. I wished he prepared for the season as well as he did this little, " Don't panic everythings under control" speech.

At least one things for certain, where going to have plenty to talk about this off season