Knicks1969 wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

nixluva wrote:[dence and poise so essential to they will be much more consistent, much better defenders, much more smarter, triangle ready....9 months from now.

Spurs won last yr, and every other team wants to play like that, in fact, the hawks mirror the spurs right now, as well as the GSW. You know why they don't run it, they don't have MJ, kobe or shaq, or even a top notch defender like pipen, who was capable of guarding 4 positions.

But here is my biggest issue with fish, he refuse to let a 10 man rotation build and mesh, every signal player on earth knows you can get comfortable playing sporadic minutes.

so whats going to happen next yr when phil brings in 13 new players, there going to spend 4 months figuring out a rotation. How can you kill woodson for having that dopey rotation, then give fisher a major v.i.p pass

Exactly what scares me with Fisher as our coach. The game has changed from an inside out style to strictly outside the three point line style. Other than Memphis and Detroit, there aren't any other teams out there with a strong inside presence. For our coach to continue to preach "pack the paint" is .

Exactly what scares me with Fisher as our coach. The game has changed from an inside out style to strictly outside the three point line style. Other than Memphis and Detroit, there aren't any other teams out there with a strong inside presence. For our coach to continue to preach "pack the paint" is .

Knicks1969 wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

nixluva wrote:[dence and poise so essential to they will be much more consistent, much better defenders, much more smarter, triangle ready....9 months from now.

Spurs won last yr, and every other team wants to play like that, in fact, the hawks mirror the spurs right now, as well as the GSW. You know why they don't run it, they don't have MJ, kobe or shaq, or even a top notch defender like pipen, who was capable of guarding 4 positions.

But here is my biggest issue with fish, he refuse to let a 10 man rotation build and mesh, every signal player on earth knows you can get comfortable playing sporadic minutes.

so whats going to happen next yr when phil brings in 13 new players, there going to spend 4 months figuring out a rotation. How can you kill woodson for having that dopey rotation, then give fisher a major v.i.p pass

Exactly what scares me with Fisher as our coach. The game has changed from an inside out style to strictly outside the three point line style. Other than Memphis and Detroit, there aren't any other teams out there with a strong inside presence. For our coach to continue to preach "pack the paint" is .

His theory is simple, every player onthe roster should be ready to take on any roll at any time as soon as his number is called. That's what he said from jump st.

That's why he's constantly playing guys, anykind of minutes, and putting players in roles they have no business being in, like gallow playing 34 minutes as a rookie, and wondering why he's inconsistent, or larkin playing in the clutch and constantly turning the ball over after the 2 minute mark.

knicks1248 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Who's blue print are you studying...tell me why the same 10 teams are always in the lottery,yr aftr yr despite all these top draft picks that they draft..then tell me why it will be different in ny with a rookie coach. I'll bet you $500 that next season will be no different form this season if fisher is still the coach, thats when you'll come arnd and come to the realization thats he sucks.

Phil has a system and he knows what kind of players he needs for it to work. Not all teams go in with a specific blueprint. Most of those losing teams just wing it. The Sixers are just gathering talent, but there's no clear direction to any of it. Here we have a system that has specific needs and we'll be addressing those needs in the draft. It's not a big mystery what Phil is looking to do here. Phil isn't actually winging it as some think.

An effective offense, to my way of thinking, features the following dimensions:

1. Penetration. Players must penetrate the defense, and the best way to do this is the fast break, because basketball is a full-court game, from baseline to baseline.

2. Spacing. I am a fanatic about how players distribute themselves on the offensive end of the court. They must space themselves in a way that makes it most difficult to defend, trap, and help. Players must align a certain number of feet apart. In high school, I’d recommend 12 to 15 feet spacing, in college, 15 to18 feet, and in the NBA, 15 to 20 feet. Proper spacing not only exposes individual defensive players’ vulnerabilities, but also ensures that every time the defense tries to trap, an offensive player will be open.

3. Ball and player movements. Players must move, and must move the ball, with a purpose. Effective off-the-ball activity is much more important than most fans and players think because they’re so used to watching only the movement of the ball and the player in possession of it. But there is only one ball and there are five players, meaning most players will have the ball in their hands 20 percent or less of the time the team is in possession of the ball.

4. Options for the ball handler. The more options a smart player has to attack a defender, the more successful that offensive player will be. When teammates are all moving to positions to free themselves (or another teammate with a pick), the ball handler’s choices are vastly increased.

5. Offensive rebounding and defensive balance. On all shots we take, players must go strong for the rebound while retaining court balance and awareness to prevent the opponent’s fast break.

6. Versatile positioning. The offense must offer to any player the chance to fill any spot on the court, independent of the player’s role. All positions should be interchangeable.

7. Use individual talents. It only makes sense for an offense to allow a team to take advantage of the skill sets of its best players. This doesn’t preclude the focus on team play that is emphasized in the six other principles, but it does acknowledge that some individuals have certain types and degrees of talent, and an offense should accentuate those assets. Michael Jordan taught me this.

Finally, I want the offense to flow from rebound to fast break, to quick offense, to a system of offense. The defenses in the NBA are so good because the players are so big, quick, and well coached. Add the pressure that the 24-second clock rule applies to the offense to find a good shot, and the defense gets even better.
The triangle offense has proven most effective, even against such obstacles, when players commit to and execute the system. The offense hinges on players attending to minute details in executing not just plays but also the fundamentals underlying the plays. Once players have mastered the individual techniques required of their roles, we then integrate those individuals into a team. Once this is done, the foundation for a good offense is solidly in place. The team can then go on the court with the confidence and poise so essential to success.

This method of play is as old as basketball. The triangle set is adjustable to the personnel, but such adaptations can be made without altering the essence of the offense. The only necessary adjustment from one season to the next involves tailoring the series of options based on each individual’s talents.

phil isn't coaching, If he was we wouldn't be having this conversation. he's not even traveling with the team, or at practice's on a daily. From a mental stand point, Fisher is way over his head. The minute he stated how baffle he was that he had to get players motivated, That was confirmation for me.

He thinks millionaires that came from nothing are motivated. The only thing that can save avg coaches, are floor leaders and veterans. You can have all the talent in the world,and it's nothing without veteran leadership and a floor general.

I would love guy a like fish on my coaching staff, but there are some people that you can see off the break, that their not set out to be a head coach.

The difference between Kerr, Fish, and KIdd

Kidd has the Bucks playing the exact same style he had the knicks and NETS playing.

Kerr is playing a style that fits his players, he's playing a style that his players will have the most success

Fisher is playing a style his president is some what forcing him to play, and his players are looking worse by the game on both ends. he has a few guys on this team that play hard because they have no contract next yr.

You feel good about yourself when you help your team win, it builds confidence and trust, then you get a better idea of what type of play you have.

But if I'm seeing this kid turning over the ball in the clutch, missing FT, poor defense, wild shots, am i suppose to think he's doing that on purpose to help the team get a high draft pick, am I suppose to say he'll be great addition to the roster next yr.

So what are going to do, throw away 13 guys on the roster because they help you tank, or keep them because you know for sure they will be much more consistent, much better defenders, much more smarter, triangle ready....9 months from now.

If you can't see my point, then your completely blinded by optimism..

It's like you didn't read a damn thing I posted!!! The list above is a guiding set of principles that Phil was taught by Tex Winters and he's passing on to Fish. It's not about Phil coaching the team or not. Everything that is going on has Phil's imprint and Fish and his staff are adding their own ideas to the mix much as Phil did with what he learned from Tex. It's a part of the structure of the new culture here. Phil and his entire staff are working together to rebuild this franchise. There's a crystal clear philosophy and system in place and Phil is going to give Fish what he needs to succeed running this team. Phil has stated that he gets together with Fish and Rambis after games to go over everything and work on making improvements. That would include adding tweaks to the Triangle or anything else that they feel would help. Still getting results is not always as simple as 2+2=4.

There is so much criticism of Fish based off of this season which is fine, but not necessarily predictive of what Fish is going to be like as he moves along in his career. Kidd was not immediately successful as a rookie coach. I think Fish has shown enough growth this year and i'm sure he's learning a lot that will help him in his 2nd season. I think Perhaps there is a lack of understanding about what a coach can realistically be expected to do. Players that we have are not high draft pick, ready made products. A few months into this season it's just not reasonable to think the young players will have it all figured out and play virtually mistake free. Just watching other teams with young players you can see that they're still making dumb mistakes as well. It's not a simple process and it's gonna take some time.

You judge growth by success, if your having the same results as you had from day 1, how is that growing. Were still dead last at guarding the 3 ball, because his philosophy hasn't change, and it continues to be the death of us every game. Where 50 games in, this isn't November or early December, this is more than halfway through.

You and I both Know that any other coach would have been fired, rookie or not. The only reason fish is still here is because of Phil. In any sport, there's a coaching change before a player change. What has fisher and his staff added to the triangle, to help is players succeed, or put them in a position to have success.

Give me something that i should look forward to besides hope and pray. Why don't you just say I'm giving phil and fisher a 2nd chance, don't sugar coated and say they are building something special. Phil was at least honest and said he fcked up, fisher is still yet to take accountability on anything or any loss.

I think i've tried to make this point repeatedly but it's being lost somehow. You have to realize that there's only so much that can be done with this roster as it is, which is why we can expect some new additions. The Knicks were losing games at an alarming clip and recently the team has played much better and actually won some games. This team just isn't good enough to win games. They're executing the offense and giving effort on D, but we also have some players who are just not that good. It's that simple. We need more Offensive and Defensive talent.

You don't change the coach when you know that the team doesn't have enough talent. That would just be stupid. Only way that would make sense is if the players weren't responding to Fish or clearly having issues with him as head coach. The team plays hard for him but they make mistakes and miss shots because they aren't good enough. You're saying that you know more about coaching than Phil who is watching the games and reviews tapes and knows what to look for. I think you are mistaken.

I've given this example and you seem to have just ignored it. If you improved the SL with Dragic in place of Jose and Matthews instead of Galloway and let's just say Okafor instead of Amundson do you think that SL might have a chance to be a bit more successful? My guess is that they'd have a chance to be more successful in executing this very same offense and it would make the bench deeper. In fact there are a lot of FA's who would be a vast improvement starting for this team. That's what Phil is looking at.

Ok here's where we are definitely not on the same page. If you are my coach, and you tell me to protect the paint and not worry about perimeter shooters, it doesnt matter how good of a defender i am, my coach told me to not worry about guarding players who take 3's.

Calderon, larkin, Amare, jason, these are PnR players who made their living doing it, so instead of him putting them in that position to succeed, he's hell bent on sticking to the triangle like it or not,and if you don't like it, then bye bye ( see jr and shump).

Every single player in the league is capable of playing in the triangle to some degree, but at some point you have to ask yourself, Phil has like 9 championships running that system, and not one single team ran it since.

The Spurs won last yr, and every other team wants to play like that, in fact, the hawks mirror the spurs right now, as well as the GSW. You know why they don't run it, they don't have MJ, kobe or shaq, or even a top notch defender like pipen, who was capable of guarding 4 positions.

But here is my biggest issue with fish, he refuse to let a 10 man rotation build and mesh, every signal player on earth knows you can get comfortable playing sporadic minutes.

so whats going to happen next yr when phil brings in 13 new players, there going to spend 4 months figuring out a rotation. How can you kill woodson for having that dopey rotation, then give fisher a major v.i.p pass

If you stay focused on what's going on this year with an obviously talent deprived team then you will be disappointed. As for the Spurs winning last year playing their Flow Offense, that's great when you have their kind of talent and years of player development in that system. You are going off about our team when we don't have that kind of talent you see in GS, ATL or SA and we are just now installing a new system with few really talented or skilled players.

As I posted above. This team now has a guiding set of principles, clear leadership and they are about to add talent that can excel playing in this system, which is sorely needed.
The better the talent Phil adds to the team the easier it will be to settle on a rotation. We don't at this time have a good SL, but hopefully Phil will change that this year. It will make things much easier and clearer when we have a clear 7 men who can be relied on and a bench that can fill in where needed.

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Who's blue print are you studying...tell me why the same 10 teams are always in the lottery,yr aftr yr despite all these top draft picks that they draft..then tell me why it will be different in ny with a rookie coach. I'll bet you $500 that next season will be no different form this season if fisher is still the coach, thats when you'll come arnd and come to the realization thats he sucks.

Phil has a system and he knows what kind of players he needs for it to work. Not all teams go in with a specific blueprint. Most of those losing teams just wing it. The Sixers are just gathering talent, but there's no clear direction to any of it. Here we have a system that has specific needs and we'll be addressing those needs in the draft. It's not a big mystery what Phil is looking to do here. Phil isn't actually winging it as some think.

An effective offense, to my way of thinking, features the following dimensions:

1. Penetration. Players must penetrate the defense, and the best way to do this is the fast break, because basketball is a full-court game, from baseline to baseline.

2. Spacing. I am a fanatic about how players distribute themselves on the offensive end of the court. They must space themselves in a way that makes it most difficult to defend, trap, and help. Players must align a certain number of feet apart. In high school, I’d recommend 12 to 15 feet spacing, in college, 15 to18 feet, and in the NBA, 15 to 20 feet. Proper spacing not only exposes individual defensive players’ vulnerabilities, but also ensures that every time the defense tries to trap, an offensive player will be open.

3. Ball and player movements. Players must move, and must move the ball, with a purpose. Effective off-the-ball activity is much more important than most fans and players think because they’re so used to watching only the movement of the ball and the player in possession of it. But there is only one ball and there are five players, meaning most players will have the ball in their hands 20 percent or less of the time the team is in possession of the ball.

4. Options for the ball handler. The more options a smart player has to attack a defender, the more successful that offensive player will be. When teammates are all moving to positions to free themselves (or another teammate with a pick), the ball handler’s choices are vastly increased.

5. Offensive rebounding and defensive balance. On all shots we take, players must go strong for the rebound while retaining court balance and awareness to prevent the opponent’s fast break.

6. Versatile positioning. The offense must offer to any player the chance to fill any spot on the court, independent of the player’s role. All positions should be interchangeable.

7. Use individual talents. It only makes sense for an offense to allow a team to take advantage of the skill sets of its best players. This doesn’t preclude the focus on team play that is emphasized in the six other principles, but it does acknowledge that some individuals have certain types and degrees of talent, and an offense should accentuate those assets. Michael Jordan taught me this.

Finally, I want the offense to flow from rebound to fast break, to quick offense, to a system of offense. The defenses in the NBA are so good because the players are so big, quick, and well coached. Add the pressure that the 24-second clock rule applies to the offense to find a good shot, and the defense gets even better.
The triangle offense has proven most effective, even against such obstacles, when players commit to and execute the system. The offense hinges on players attending to minute details in executing not just plays but also the fundamentals underlying the plays. Once players have mastered the individual techniques required of their roles, we then integrate those individuals into a team. Once this is done, the foundation for a good offense is solidly in place. The team can then go on the court with the confidence and poise so essential to success.

This method of play is as old as basketball. The triangle set is adjustable to the personnel, but such adaptations can be made without altering the essence of the offense. The only necessary adjustment from one season to the next involves tailoring the series of options based on each individual’s talents.

phil isn't coaching, If he was we wouldn't be having this conversation. he's not even traveling with the team, or at practice's on a daily. From a mental stand point, Fisher is way over his head. The minute he stated how baffle he was that he had to get players motivated, That was confirmation for me.

He thinks millionaires that came from nothing are motivated. The only thing that can save avg coaches, are floor leaders and veterans. You can have all the talent in the world,and it's nothing without veteran leadership and a floor general.

I would love guy a like fish on my coaching staff, but there are some people that you can see off the break, that their not set out to be a head coach.

The difference between Kerr, Fish, and KIdd

Kidd has the Bucks playing the exact same style he had the knicks and NETS playing.

Kerr is playing a style that fits his players, he's playing a style that his players will have the most success

Fisher is playing a style his president is some what forcing him to play, and his players are looking worse by the game on both ends. he has a few guys on this team that play hard because they have no contract next yr.

You feel good about yourself when you help your team win, it builds confidence and trust, then you get a better idea of what type of play you have.

But if I'm seeing this kid turning over the ball in the clutch, missing FT, poor defense, wild shots, am i suppose to think he's doing that on purpose to help the team get a high draft pick, am I suppose to say he'll be great addition to the roster next yr.

So what are going to do, throw away 13 guys on the roster because they help you tank, or keep them because you know for sure they will be much more consistent, much better defenders, much more smarter, triangle ready....9 months from now.

If you can't see my point, then your completely blinded by optimism..

It's like you didn't read a damn thing I posted!!! The list above is a guiding set of principles that Phil was taught by Tex Winters and he's passing on to Fish. It's not about Phil coaching the team or not. Everything that is going on has Phil's imprint and Fish and his staff are adding their own ideas to the mix much as Phil did with what he learned from Tex. It's a part of the structure of the new culture here. Phil and his entire staff are working together to rebuild this franchise. There's a crystal clear philosophy and system in place and Phil is going to give Fish what he needs to succeed running this team. Phil has stated that he gets together with Fish and Rambis after games to go over everything and work on making improvements. That would include adding tweaks to the Triangle or anything else that they feel would help. Still getting results is not always as simple as 2+2=4.

There is so much criticism of Fish based off of this season which is fine, but not necessarily predictive of what Fish is going to be like as he moves along in his career. Kidd was not immediately successful as a rookie coach. I think Fish has shown enough growth this year and i'm sure he's learning a lot that will help him in his 2nd season. I think Perhaps there is a lack of understanding about what a coach can realistically be expected to do. Players that we have are not high draft pick, ready made products. A few months into this season it's just not reasonable to think the young players will have it all figured out and play virtually mistake free. Just watching other teams with young players you can see that they're still making dumb mistakes as well. It's not a simple process and it's gonna take some time.

You judge growth by success, if your having the same results as you had from day 1, how is that growing. Were still dead last at guarding the 3 ball, because his philosophy hasn't change, and it continues to be the death of us every game. Where 50 games in, this isn't November or early December, this is more than halfway through.

You and I both Know that any other coach would have been fired, rookie or not. The only reason fish is still here is because of Phil. In any sport, there's a coaching change before a player change. What has fisher and his staff added to the triangle, to help is players succeed, or put them in a position to have success.

Give me something that i should look forward to besides hope and pray. Why don't you just say I'm giving phil and fisher a 2nd chance, don't sugar coated and say they are building something special. Phil was at least honest and said he fcked up, fisher is still yet to take accountability on anything or any loss.

I think i've tried to make this point repeatedly but it's being lost somehow. You have to realize that there's only so much that can be done with this roster as it is, which is why we can expect some new additions. The Knicks were losing games at an alarming clip and recently the team has played much better and actually won some games. This team just isn't good enough to win games. They're executing the offense and giving effort on D, but we also have some players who are just not that good. It's that simple. We need more Offensive and Defensive talent.

You don't change the coach when you know that the team doesn't have enough talent. That would just be stupid. Only way that would make sense is if the players weren't responding to Fish or clearly having issues with him as head coach. The team plays hard for him but they make mistakes and miss shots because they aren't good enough. You're saying that you know more about coaching than Phil who is watching the games and reviews tapes and knows what to look for. I think you are mistaken.

I've given this example and you seem to have just ignored it. If you improved the SL with Dragic in place of Jose and Matthews instead of Galloway and let's just say Okafor instead of Amundson do you think that SL might have a chance to be a bit more successful? My guess is that they'd have a chance to be more successful in executing this very same offense and it would make the bench deeper. In fact there are a lot of FA's who would be a vast improvement starting for this team. That's what Phil is looking at.

Ok here's where we are definitely not on the same page. If you are my coach, and you tell me to protect the paint and not worry about perimeter shooters, it doesnt matter how good of a defender i am, my coach told me to not worry about guarding players who take 3's.

Calderon, larkin, Amare, jason, these are PnR players who made their living doing it, so instead of him putting them in that position to succeed, he's hell bent on sticking to the triangle like it or not,and if you don't like it, then bye bye ( see jr and shump).

Every single player in the league is capable of playing in the triangle to some degree, but at some point you have to ask yourself, Phil has like 9 championships running that system, and not one single team ran it since.

The Spurs won last yr, and every other team wants to play like that, in fact, the hawks mirror the spurs right now, as well as the GSW. You know why they don't run it, they don't have MJ, kobe or shaq, or even a top notch defender like pipen, who was capable of guarding 4 positions.

But here is my biggest issue with fish, he refuse to let a 10 man rotation build and mesh, every signal player on earth knows you can get comfortable playing sporadic minutes.

so whats going to happen next yr when phil brings in 13 new players, there going to spend 4 months figuring out a rotation. How can you kill woodson for having that dopey rotation, then give fisher a major v.i.p pass

The statements made by Fish which suggest that they aren't concerned with the 3pt shot are being taken way too seriously. They don't want players to just take wide open shots, but they don't want teams just getting to the basket with ease either. The biggest issue is a lack of defensive talent and not so much the defensive scheme. We need more players who can defend their man, give help and recover effectively. The more 2 way players we add the better. Right now we start every game with very few good defensive players. When we actually start bringing in defensive talent that will improve the defense a ton. No different that if you bring in great 3pt shooters or guys that can breakdown a D and get to the basket and finish or draw a foul. It's mostly about the talent.

If you stay focused on what's going on this year with an obviously talent deprived team then you will be disappointed. As for the Spurs winning last year playing their Flow Offense, that's great when you have their kind of talent and years of player development in that system. You are going off about our team when we don't have that kind of talent you see in GS, ATL or SA and we are just now installing a new system with few really talented or skilled players.

As I posted above. This team now has a guiding set of principles, clear leadership and they are about to add talent that can excel playing in this system, which is sorely needed.
The better the talent Phil adds to the team the easier it will be to settle on a rotation. We don't at this time have a good SL, but hopefully Phil will change that this year. It will make things much easier and clearer when we have a clear 7 men who can be relied on and a bench that can fill in where needed.

KNICK1696

Were on the same page.

The triangle is a system that requires you to take a ton of mid range shots because their so open. No player in this league shoots mid range shots above 42%, and thats why there so seldomly taking.

Think about why the Lakers blew off a 11 time championship coach, to hire a no defense teaching coach, who's arguable the best offensive coach in the league. Simply because phil is living in the 80's/90's.

That style of basketball is over, the rules don't benefit it, the players are not smart enough, and the mid range game is the least effective shot in todays game. The league is all about the the 3 ball. Back in the 90's it was all about low scoring, half court,defensive teams, post ups and cuts to the basket.

Nix says we have leadership now, what player on this team is a leader. You talk about 2 way players who can recover, what FA are you talking about, you can count on your hands the amount of true defensive players we have in this league, and oakfer, he plays for a coach who uses MDA system to the T, and he's god awful defending the PnR.

nixluva wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:Matthew is not a slasher. He can shoot the ball with accuracy and play in the post. We need a 6'5+ guard who can handle the rock and shoot it as well

Matthews is just a suggestion. The point is that Matthews is a shooter and can defend. We need players like that. Personally i'd like a guy a bit younger but like I said he's an option. I'd be very interested in trying to get Tony Wroten if Philly is looking to move him. I think the Knicks would be interested in Reggie Jackson for his ability to attack the rim.

I hate Reggie Jackson. He has a huge ego that doesn't match his talent. I would much rather target a guard like Russell in the draft or go hard at Westbrook

nixluva wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:Matthew is not a slasher. He can shoot the ball with accuracy and play in the post. We need a 6'5+ guard who can handle the rock and shoot it as well

Matthews is just a suggestion. The point is that Matthews is a shooter and can defend. We need players like that. Personally i'd like a guy a bit younger but like I said he's an option. I'd be very interested in trying to get Tony Wroten if Philly is looking to move him. I think the Knicks would be interested in Reggie Jackson for his ability to attack the rim.

I hate Reggie Jackson. He has a huge ego that doesn't match his talent. I would much rather target a guard like Russell in the draft or go hard at Westbrook

The thing about Reggie is that he's one of the most efficient Guards scoring on drives to the basket. He's young and athletic. We likely aren't going to get the perfect guy but he'd be an option. Of course i'd prefer D'Angelo Russell, but i'm just talking about FA's at the moment.

Reggie is an efficient 2pt FG shooter at 49%, which is something that you must take into account when it comes to the Triangle. Any player who is efficient in that range is going to be a good fit in this system. We have to stop looking at players for how they may look in other systems and interpret their game as to how it would match this system. This is why Jason Smith looks so much better in NY than he's ever looked in any other team. He's getting a steady diet of shots where he's most efficient.

And that is very very sad. We are trying to find guys who can shoot the long 2 and efficient from 3? Reggie is horrible from 3 ... we need to spread the floor.

This is not 1970, or even 5-10 years ago.

knicks1248 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:Matthew is not a slasher. He can shoot the ball with accuracy and play in the post. We need a 6'5+ guard who can handle the rock and shoot it as well

Matthews is just a suggestion. The point is that Matthews is a shooter and can defend. We need players like that. Personally i'd like a guy a bit younger but like I said he's an option. I'd be very interested in trying to get Tony Wroten if Philly is looking to move him. I think the Knicks would be interested in Reggie Jackson for his ability to attack the rim.

I hate Reggie Jackson. He has a huge ego that doesn't match his talent. I would much rather target a guard like Russell in the draft or go hard at Westbrook

The thing about Reggie is that he's one of the most efficient Guards scoring on drives to the basket. He's young and athletic. We likely aren't going to get the perfect guy but he'd be an option. Of course i'd prefer D'Angelo Russell, but i'm just talking about FA's at the moment.

Reggie is an efficient 2pt FG shooter at 49%, which is something that you must take into account when it comes to the Triangle. Any player who is efficient in that range is going to be a good fit in this system. We have to stop looking at players for how they may look in other systems and interpret their game as to how it would match this system. This is why Jason Smith looks so much better in NY than he's ever looked in any other team. He's getting a steady diet of shots where he's most efficient.

And that is very very sad. We are trying to find guys who can shoot the long 2 and efficient from 3? Reggie is horrible from 3 ... we need to spread the floor.

This is not 1970, or even 5-10 years ago.

yup, I'm trying to tell this guy, the triangle will not win us a lot of games in this era of basketball, the way it's defended leaves the paint locked up, and mid range shots all day, so while we shot 2's and never get to the FT line, the other team shoots 3's and takes a ton of FT's from our shady defensive philosophy.

I don't care if we have an all star line up, as soon as we lock up the paint, by the 4th quarter, teams adjust, and start shooting a ton of 3's..i mean look at what Willie Green did to us last night..wille-fkng-green..I didn't even know he was still in the damn league.

agreed though I think and I am hoping that will change.

I had stated that if Jason Smith is taking all these mid range shots as a means to keep moving back until many of them are behind the arc, then I can see the strategy. He has been taking more and more 3's (and hitting them).

If we are going to lead the lead by a mile in long 2's and be the best at defending long 2's then we are screwed since the 3 will kill us on both sides of the ball.

I am concerned but I think it is too early to make a final judgement. Lets see how this plays out next year.

nixluva wrote:You guys are f'n funny. I'm the one who has been saying we could bring in Matthews or Danny Green. I know we need 3pt shooting but we also need guards that can break down a D and drive n kick or finish at the hole or draw fouls. It's not just one thing. Just cuz I mention one option doesn't mean he's all I'm looking at. Reggie would be an upgrade and give us something we don't have plus he's young. It would be great if we can draft Russell but I was talking about FA options. Like him or not Reggie is a top option.

Reggie is not a top option. Your f'n funny.

How much would you pay for him?

yellowboy90 wrote:Give me Cory Joseph over Reggie J.

I'd like Cory, he's on the list too. I'm just pointing out that Reggie is on the list of young PG's. It's not a long list. If we don't get a PG in the Draft then we will have to look for one in Free Agency. It's gonna be hard to pry some guys from their team since they're RFA's.

Shane Larkin	  PG	22	NYK	TBD	$1,606,080	UFA
Brandon Knight	  PG	23	MIL	TBD	$3,553,917	RFA
Cory Joseph	  PG	23	SAS	TBD	$2,023,261	RFA
Kendall Marshall  PG	23	MIL	TBD	$915,243	UFA
Reggie Jackson	  PG	24	OKC	TBD	$2,204,370	RFA
Matt Dellavedova  PG	24	CLE	TBD	$816,482	RFA
Darius Morris	  PG	24	BKN	TBD	$605,157	RFA
Jeremy Lin	  PG	26	LAL	TBD	$8,374,646	UFA
Alexey Shved	  PG	26	HOU	TBD	$3,282,056	RFA
Norris Cole	  PG	26	MIA	TBD	$2,038,206	RFA

I just think it's ridiculous to think that because a player isn't perfect that we won't consider them. You have to accept some flaws if the options are limited. I'd love Brandon Knight, but no way the Buck's let him go. I'm not sure how the spurs feel about Cory but my guess is that they put a lot of time into him and will look to retain him. What exactly would he be worth to the Knicks or Spurs? In the end it's gonna come down to who we can actually get.

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:You guys are f'n funny. I'm the one who has been saying we could bring in Matthews or Danny Green. I know we need 3pt shooting but we also need guards that can break down a D and drive n kick or finish at the hole or draw fouls. It's not just one thing. Just cuz I mention one option doesn't mean he's all I'm looking at. Reggie would be an upgrade and give us something we don't have plus he's young. It would be great if we can draft Russell but I was talking about FA options. Like him or not Reggie is a top option.

Reggie is not a top option. Your f'n funny.

How much would you pay for him?

can you give us a number? How much is he worth? You keep touting him.