dk7th wrote:newyorknewyork wrote:dk7th wrote:newyorknewyork wrote:dk7th wrote:newyorknewyork wrote:dk7th wrote:newyorknewyork wrote:tkf wrote:StarksEwing1 wrote:tkf wrote:dk7th wrote:Papabear wrote:Papabear SaysNow the 7th is a music man and he failed to answer my question. Why is The Maveriks, Heat, Chicago, the Lakers,Houston and others trying to get Melo since to you he is such a bad player? They are willing to pay him the max. Why is that? why does lebron want him. Answer the damn question! or shut up.
think about it: melo can't go far with him as the team's best player-- he needs to go to a team with at least one player who is better at playing the game than he is. he is a loser otherwise. he needs to hitch his wagon to a better situation or he will end up ringless.
this is the 800-pound gorilla in the room-- everyone realizes he is not that good, including melo. they can SAY whatever they want but it does not change the fact that when a player realizes his limitations he must go elsewhere if there isn't someone better than himself to play with.
put another way, you should think carefully about how you rank melo. if he were truly a top 5 player would he not be more of a winner?
please respond with some insight and coherence instead of the usual lumbering blather. here, have a smiley on me 
ps i know PLENTY about music 
. maybe this is a subject you and i can become friends over. here, have another smiley on me 
here is an even bigger problem.. the solution for most in here is to keep carmelo, pay him max and get him help.. now check out who the help is..
Lebron, Durant.. LOL.. I mean why do I need carmelo if I can get those guys? It is safe to say you can build a winner with most players by adding lebron and durant....
I do defend Melo BUT i agree lebron and durant are on another level especially lebron
and it really isn't about them just being better.. but people are saying, get carmelo pay him the max and then pair him with lebron? really?
how about get two guys who can defend, play team ball, pass, score efficiently for under the max combined and then still get lebron... wouldn't that be better..
in other words, why not Get a guy like Parsons and rondo and pair them with lebron, I am sure you can win with that..
why not add lebron to the Hawks squad, I am sure he could win with that..
why not add lebron with noah I am sure he can win with that..
I mean there are a lot of scenarios in which you can add lebron and Durant and have a pretty good friggin team... why must ours include paying a flawed player near max money to do that?
People name Durant and Lebron because of the cap space available and they are the best players. Clearly you shoot for the best players and after they pass you adjust. Most fans don't want Melo at max and some would rather give it to him then lose him for nothing and some would rather lose him for nothing. Free agents like Rondo or Parsons etc aren't going to come to the Knicks unless we offer them ridiculous contracts ala Amare Stoudemire if we are in a rebuilding situation. Some fans are mindful of that and would rather have Melo under contract. There is value in both sides of the equation.
IMO you exaggerate Melo being a loser but I understand your beef with his game especially with the price tag. But the truth is none of the players you want are going to come to the Knicks.
maybe one of them will have the courage to challenge the paradigm. the present one sucks but it can be gamed.
There is no player that is going to come save us. Knicks need to create this environment.
What needs to happen is the Knicks need to make the playoffs consistently and change the perception of the Knicks as a place to cash out to a place you go to compete. 2nd: Knicks need to keep there draft picks to keep a consistent pipeline and coaching staff should exercise the use of depth giving young players consistent playing time while resting starters consistently. 3rd: unless the player is a key core piece contracts shouldn't be more then 2-3yrs to maintain flexibility to upgrade. Solid players who aren't core members looking for longer deals can be moved for picks which will replace them. 4th: core player contracts should all match when they expire if possible.
If Melo returns max or no max I would make 2016 when Durant is a free agent the target. Buy low on overpaid yet productive players which teams are trying to dump there contracts who end in 2016. Push for playoffs, try and flip the overpaid yet productive players who are now expiring for either future assets or resign them to cheaper deals if worth it. Present Durant with the ability to sign with a playoff team who can move Carmelo to another team for another player that may fit Durant better or team up with him. If Durant doesn't come continue the trend of buying low on overpaid yet productive players turning them into assets, continue to draft upgrading the roster step by step yr after year.
your first paragraph is brilliant.
then it seems you took a hallucinogen and sat down to write the second.
Its a scenario which Melo returns to the Knicks. Example I would target a guy like David Lee who may be available in a salary dump and ends in 2016. Immediately you will say he don't play defense, can't be apart of a championship team, overpaid etc. But we wouldn't be bringing him in to be apart of a championship team unless he resigns for a cheap deal to be a role player after his contract runs out. Lee's value would be to be productive player for a yr or 2 and help us make playoffs. When he has one yr left or at the deadline when he has like 5mil owed to him a contender or a team looking to add a player to push them to the playoffs may be willing to give up a future draft pick for him. Like Bulls and Deng to Cleveland or Houston and Asik to Pelicans.
yes that's why it's a hallucination. also-- not that jackson would ever do this-- how is bringing in a hometown favorite back in david lee as an interim rental anything close to building? you want to bring a culture change, a foundation built to last, you don't treat players like that. only way you see lee here it's if melo ain't. lee is better in the triangle guaranteed.
Core players are your foundation built to last everyone else is possibly a moving part. Right now we need to upgrade the production level with contracts that match 2016 and then decide to keep them as core pieces or role players, flip them for either core pieces if possible, or future assets. He doesn't need to be a rental he could resign for less and be a role player upgrading the quality of role players we have and would fit under the 2-3yr guideline. We would trade him if he wants to earn more then role player status. If you want to entice a Durant then you need to make the playoffs. Durant or any star players like him aren't going to come to the Knicks to be in rebuilding situations.
speaking in declarative statements doesn't make it exclusively so. there are alternatives. for instance the "build it and he will come" approach. at the very least you are creating a decent team that creates an opportunity for a great player to come to. durant for instance. you don't think he hasn't looked at new york and an opportunity to run or run in the triangle?
this "moving parts" of lesser players-- again how does treating players like that encourage loyalty and professionalism, operational cohesion, corporate health?
we should be pursuing cheaper and younger small forwards who can defend, defend, defend-- or as jackson has put it: play with alacrity. can't have your second or third option not be able to defend and bring a hustling style.
i think "cultural change of the franchise" will involve the approach that is the opposite of what you are presenting.
lastly consider that the league is a bloated mess and with an extremely diluted talent pool. based on this fact it is better to look for solid "secondary value players" and "tertiary value players." had we not had the approach of clear it out for lebron we may have been better off-- but the perceived urgency of landing a name after two throwaway seasons was too strong. i would have passed on bringing in stoudemire at all without a truly solid point guard in place. but once we made the commitment it was absolutely VITAL that you make a move to complement the existing max contract. the acquisition of anthony was a stupendous error based on this. it was not worth finding out as it turns out. i knew it would fail and i am generally hated for it. no that i gaf!
perhaps installing "system basketball" will give the knicks a shot at building the right way? it's worth waiting to find out.
I don't know if Durant is interested in the Knicks or not odds are stacked against us that he will come to save the Knicks without the Knicks proving they are a competitive team in the least. That culture change has to win first and foremost. I don't see Durant coming to a team with cheap young players just because the play hard. And again the scenario displayed was based off of Melo returning.
Same as how the Spurs drafted George Hill at #26 to be the backup to Toney Parker and then traded him at the draft 3yrs later for there starting Small forward. Or Dallas who landed Jamison and Walker buying low when there value was poor and then flipping both of them for Jason Terry who became a core piece and the #5 pick Devin Harris who was then later flipped for Jason Kidd who became another core piece. Or Houston who got Asik with a poison pill contract to fill there center position when needed then got the ability to upgrade by adding Howard so by the 3rd yr they then flip Asik for a future first round pick.
It doesn't automatically mean we are going to trade everyone every yr. If they fit very well we could just keep them, but at better contracts. We would only be moving them if better options for the teams flexibility or balance or upgrade in talent present themselves or they want more money or yrs then what we deem there value to be. All I am looking for is the flexibility to upgrade consistently.
https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
6/29/2014 9:50 AM