TeamBall wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:I don't like the way the media, music, movies etc portray black culture. I think it also plays a huge part in the "setback"

Maybe a sign that I'm headed towards 40, but I agree with this. Mass media — movies, TV and music in particular — is not doing our citizenry in general and Black folks in particular any favors. We've gone from the people who created jazz and fought for our freedom while "the world is watching" to having our culture publicly conflated with drug, prison, and sex work culture.

Questlove from the Roots is writing a 6-part article called "How Hip-Hop Failed Black America", he just put up part 2: http://www.vulture.com/2014/04/questlove-on-money-jay-z-how-hip-hop-failed-black-america-part-2.html

Exactly. The world nixluva described was undoubtably a disgrace on humanity. There should be more respect for the good moral and innocent people who suffered for no good reason. It seems media today is not interested in shinning the same positive light on folks today. Something has to change at the core so that people of every race can be seen in the same light.

Morality is all but gone in today's world and it extends far beyond race. The more technology is introduced the less moral we become. Example: people are more quick to record something on their phones then actually do something to help

Speaking as a black man, it was would be great if I didn't have to hear the N-word thrown around in music and movies leading it to be thrown around in everyday conversation. I don't give a damn what race you are either. I don't want to hear the word and no I don't use it myself.

Ah man, NYC and Northeastern cities are the worst about this. I was on the M train to BK yesterday after work carrying bags of groceries, between a middle aged black postal work and black lady. To our right were some young kids of indeterminate ethnicity — I reckon Latino — who started every sentence with "nigga"… it was uncomfortable. I've heard young men of all races do this — Chinese, Indian, whatever… and young Black women and Latinas too… It's like no one ever heard the word "dude" or "man" or "guy" before. It's like with hip-hop we open sourced the goddamn word or something. So weird.

gunsnewing wrote:What are some examples today?

The Voting Rights Act was recently gutted by the Supreme Court making it easier to discriminate against African Americans excercising their right to vote and to be heard. Some GOP pols have admitted that "voter fraud" was just a smokescreen for their effort to make it harder for blacks to vote. Makes it harder to elect African Americans as well. This article has some good info on the subject.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2014/04/republican-voting-rights-supreme-court-id

When the Supreme Court ruled 5-4 to overturn a key section of the Voting Rights Act last June, Justice Ruth Ginsburg warned that getting rid of the measure was like "throwing away your umbrella in a rainstorm because you are not getting wet." The 1965 law required that lawmakers in states with a history of discriminating against minority voters get federal permission before changing voting rules. Now that the Supreme Court has invalidated this requirement, GOP lawmakers across the United States are running buck wild with new voting restrictions.

Before the Shelby County v. Holder decision came down on June 25, Section 5 of the Voting Rights Act required federal review of new voting rules in 15 states, most of them in the South. (In a few of these states, only specific counties or townships were covered.) Chief Justice John Roberts voted to gut the Voting Rights Act on the basis that "our country has changed," and that blanket federal protection wasn't needed to stop discrimination. But the country hasn't changed as much as he may think.

blkexec wrote:

nixluva wrote:I've been living down in the deep South now for 10 years now and I can tell you that down here things are much different than you'd think. There is some good happening, but the damage from hundreds of years of oppression have left their mark on the African American community. For many there's a Slave Mentality, signaled by self hate and destroyed social structure. Many Blacks here have basically given up trying to achieve more after hundreds of years of being beaten down. The White community still has many of the very same racist people still alive and in power from the days when things were really bad. Do people think those racists just disappeared? In fact down here things didn't change nearly as fast as in the North. My local Church wasn't allowed to integrate until 1978!!! There's a town near by that JUST NOW has gotten an integrated Prom. There are areas that you can't really go down here and feel comfortable as a black man. Trust me things aren't all in the past as some think.

I know a little about the south....from nyc but went to college in Alabama. And yes, I understand completely. Compared to the north, that mentality has always been a major difference for as long as African American history began.

This was a deliberate action taken by the Whites in power to aid in subjugating the slaves. It was necessary to break their spirit at internment camps before they reached the plantations. This had to continue of course and since the power structure was always organized and Blacks have been kept from organizing it's been most effective.

See the problem is that Blacks have always been at a disadvantage and to this very day Whites in power work to ensure their advantage. They see it as a zero sum game. In their eyes if Blacks n minorities as a whole succeed they believe they fail. That's why there's so much resistance to Obama and his policies. They feel they must obstruct progress at any cost. Their passion for this is greater than Blacks desire to be equal in that they've always been willing to KILL to preserve the position they've always had.

After the Civil War in South Carlina there were more Blacks than Whites and after elections for the 1st time there were a majority of Black elected officials. These men were very capable and were getting things accomplished. There was a very violent White backlash and soon Jim Crow Laws made it impossible for Blacks to get elected and there hasn't been an elected Black Senator since. The Black Republican Senator for South Carolina Tim Scott is not elected but was placed there by the Republican Gov. There hasn't been an elected Black Senator since 1881, the period I mentioned after the Civil War and before Jim Crow. As I said not much has changed.

The thing that IMO really messed up things was the assassination of Pres Lincoln. His vice pres Andrew Johnson was a Southern Racist who did his best to undermine all the progress that was being made. It took another hundred years to get Civil Rights and the vote back.

Down here the city of Macon is 60% Black and yet they can't achieve power because the forces against them are secretive and organized and they keep pretending to be on the side of the Blacks but things NEVER get better. I've seen the Black politicians try to build coalitions with the Whites but every time they get took. The money in town always ends up on the White side of town for new construction etc. You have to see it to believe it.

Unlike the north the slave holder families and former slaves who have the same name still live in the same towns. They still have the same wealth gap. A small group of White families still own most of the property and businesses.

Knicks22 wrote:context?
So, because sterling is rich (or white?) his racist ugly comments are bad, but, anyone else isnt'?

Sterling's comments outrageous, and rightfully condemned. All right minded people - of all colors - are condemning them.

why double standard for LJ?

Do I think he's advocating for an all black league, a league based on race? No. If u think that then I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree. I dont think a race-based league is a good idea or even legal. But the double standard u seek to apply still isn't applicable. Sterling has quite an impressive history of racism that has affected people's lives, at worst, LJ may have hurt ur feelings. Its not a double standard, these things are not the same.

The same positive light that was casted on African Americans that nixluva described. Unfortunately they were unfairly dealt a raw deal but as Nix highlighted there were periods of prosperity. Cast black culture in a better light and I feel this time prosperity will be encouraged but it takes time.

It's possible the white suits who run the media secretly want black culture to be perceived in a vulgar manner because they fear blacks becoming more prominent in the corporate world. It's time people wake up and think about their actions and try to be more positive.

Need less labeling and stereotypes and more common interests especially with the youth. People should no longer be categorized by race

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:I'm less concerned about words as I am about systemic racism and unequal treatment of poor and minorities. Blacks always played by the rules and got played for suckers cuz there has always been an organized White power structure working to keep them down. I used to laugh at the idea of "The Man" but now I'm not laughing cuz I've seen it.

Down here the city of Macon is 60% Black and yet they can't achieve power because the forces against them are secretive and organized and they keep pretending to be on the side of the Blacks but things NEVER get better. I've seen the Black politicians try to build coalitions with the Whites but every time they get took. The money in town always ends up on the White side of town for new construction etc. You have to see it to believe it.

Unlike the north the slave holder families and former slaves who have the same name still live in the same towns. They still have the same wealth gap. A small group of White families still own most of the property and businesses.

How will this change? Soon the minorities will out number the whites. Will this change the balance of power?

How will the mexican american experience similar long term issues or is this specific to the remnants of slavery?

Do you not think it is better now than it was 10 years ago? Are we moving forward?

It's never been about numbers. In the South there was a time when Blacks outnumbered Whites but that didn't lead to a violent overthrow because any small revolt was met with overwhelming violence and even stricter laws. Even now the richest 1% are able to use there wealth to rig the system. Most of the politicians are wealthy businessmen with all the connections and control. This is how they're as to maintain the status quo. Black unemployment has always been double that of whites. The only time there's been full employment for Blacks was in slavery.

There is no simple answer to the problem because the cause of the problem is complex as it's been developed over the last few hundred years!!! It will take generations to overcome the extreme levels of interference and obstruction of progress for Blacks. Every time a leader emerges they've been either killed or severely thwarted in their efforts to Improve the lives of minorities. History proves this over and over.

I've taught both of my sons as much as I can. My youngest just graduated and is already employed in his new career. I try to mentor any young men I can but the system is so big it's gonna take a massive effort. I like what Obama and Eric Holder are doing about prison sentencing. The whole move to lower stop n frisk will help and decriminalizing pot will help. Still gonna be a long road.

Thanks for your response. Its really sad that there seems to be no end in sight.

I have another question for you, do many people in the south believe that there is a jewish conspiracy to keep blacks oppressed? I have heard that from many of my black co workers and I find it troubling that there seems to be a big disconnect on so many levels between black and jews. We our so similar in so many ways and its horrible that there seems to be so much friction.

Perhaps the fact that Sterling was a old jewish bigot maybe there can be more dialogue and awareness of racism and anti antisemitism between black and jews.

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:I'm less concerned about words as I am about systemic racism and unequal treatment of poor and minorities. Blacks always played by the rules and got played for suckers cuz there has always been an organized White power structure working to keep them down. I used to laugh at the idea of "The Man" but now I'm not laughing cuz I've seen it.

Down here the city of Macon is 60% Black and yet they can't achieve power because the forces against them are secretive and organized and they keep pretending to be on the side of the Blacks but things NEVER get better. I've seen the Black politicians try to build coalitions with the Whites but every time they get took. The money in town always ends up on the White side of town for new construction etc. You have to see it to believe it.

Unlike the north the slave holder families and former slaves who have the same name still live in the same towns. They still have the same wealth gap. A small group of White families still own most of the property and businesses.

How will this change? Soon the minorities will out number the whites. Will this change the balance of power?

How will the mexican american experience similar long term issues or is this specific to the remnants of slavery?

Do you not think it is better now than it was 10 years ago? Are we moving forward?

It's never been about numbers. In the South there was a time when Blacks outnumbered Whites but that didn't lead to a violent overthrow because any small revolt was met with overwhelming violence and even stricter laws. Even now the richest 1% are able to use there wealth to rig the system. Most of the politicians are wealthy businessmen with all the connections and control. This is how they're as to maintain the status quo. Black unemployment has always been double that of whites. The only time there's been full employment for Blacks was in slavery.

There is no simple answer to the problem because the cause of the problem is complex as it's been developed over the last few hundred years!!! It will take generations to overcome the extreme levels of interference and obstruction of progress for Blacks. Every time a leader emerges they've been either killed or severely thwarted in their efforts to Improve the lives of minorities. History proves this over and over.

I've taught both of my sons as much as I can. My youngest just graduated and is already employed in his new career. I try to mentor any young men I can but the system is so big it's gonna take a massive effort. I like what Obama and Eric Holder are doing about prison sentencing. The whole move to lower stop n frisk will help and decriminalizing pot will help. Still gonna be a long road.

Thanks for your response. Its really sad that there seems to be no end in sight.

I have another question for you, do many people in the south believe that there is a jewish conspiracy to keep blacks oppressed? I have heard that from many of my black co workers and I find it troubling that there seems to be a big disconnect on so many levels between black and jews. We our so similar in so many ways and its horrible that there seems to be so much friction.

Perhaps the fact that Sterling was a old jewish bigot maybe there can be more dialogue and awareness of racism and anti antisemitism between black and jews.

There is actually a very strange history when it comes to the Jewish Community and Blacks. There were in fact Jewish Slave Holders, but that doesn't define the relationship over the centuries. In terms of Black and Jewish relations during the post Civil War Period and later during the Civil Rights struggle Jewish leaders were very helpful in trying to helps Blacks gain education opportunities with the Freedmens Bureau.

The widely publicized lynching of Leo Frank, a Jew, in Georgia in 1915 by a mob of southerners caused many Jews to "become acutely conscious of the similarities and differences between themselves and blacks" and accelerated the sense of solidarity between Jews and blacks,[6] but the trial also pitted Jews against blacks because Frank's defense attorneys tried to ascribe guilt to a black janitor, Jim Conley, and called Conley a "dirty, filthy, black, drunken, lying, nigger."[7]
In the early 20th century, Jewish daily and weekly publications were preoccupied with violence against blacks, and often compared the anti-black violence in the South to pogroms—this preoccupation was motivated by principles of justice, and by a desire to change racist policies in United States. During the first few decades of the 20th century, the leaders of American Jewry expended time, influence and their economic resources for black endeavors—civil rights, philanthropy, social service, organizing—and historian Hasia Diner notes that "they made sure that their actions were well publicized" as part of an effort to demonstrate increasing Jewish political clout.[9] Julius Rosenwald was a Jewish philanthropist who donated a large part of his fortune to supporting education of blacks in the south.[10] Jews played a major role in the founding of the NAACP, which was founded in 1909. Jews involved in the NAACP included Joel Spingarn (the first chairman), Arthur Spingarn, Henry Moskowitz, and—more recently—Jack Greenberg.[11]

It seems to me that once the Civil Rights period was over that many of the Jewish Leaders walked away from the Black struggle since they could do so and blend into the larger society much easier than Blacks who by their very skin could not blend at all. Moreover, Jewish culture promotes more unity than is found in the Black community and there is strength in that unity. In the 70's Blacks started to harbor negative views of Jews who were more successful and separatist culturally. A sort of Jealousy set in and a bit of Contempt for Blacks on behalf of Jews set in.

IMO Blacks could learn a LOT from Jews in terms of not only survival but succeeding in life. As i've pointed out many times in this thread, because Blacks have only a history of subjugation and a lack of self worth in this country, it's hard to overcome the fact that we're starting from such a position of weakness. In the recession Blacks lost 40% of their net wealth. They didn't have much to begin with. Jews weren't prevented from owning businesses for much of their history in this country and so they came with skills and were able to grow from there, but that was not possible for Blacks and to this very day there are relatively few Black owned businesses in the Black Community. As I've said the system has worked as intended to keep Blacks lower class. It isn't an accident or bug in the system. This is a feature of the American system.