dk7th wrote:

mreinman wrote:

dk7th wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:I've written about it elsewhere but a scoring specialist who's about average in all other areas of the game? Based on looking at his advanced stats and considering age, I'd say around 4 years, $52 mil. Because I can't imagine he'd accept that, I also said we should have traded him. That's if you're asking me as a fan, not a shareholder.

13 million per year is about all he is worth to the knicks as a basketball team certainly, i agree 100%. the fact is that i just don't see a scenario anywhere in the nba where he goes someplace else for more than that amount and expects to win. do you?

i keep asking the board here what teams would fulfill a scenario where he makes a bunch more than that and they win a title, and all these weeks later it is nothing but <crickets>

anywhere he goes he should be expecting second fiddle status at best. how much do second fiddles make in this day and age? 12-13 million

Chicago? You don't think that they can pay him more than that and win with him? I think that they can.

i think there will be gelling issues anywhere he goes and with chicago there will be friction over defensive effort. i think noah is a highly intelligent player with a huge heart, really a top 15 player, maybe top 12. but having two similar mindsets in rose and anthony on the floor for a lot of minutes i think you have real cohesion issues to overcome on both ends of the floor.

no particular order past the top three names here and i may be forgetting a couple of names:

lebron
durant
george
hibbert
nowitzki
curry
griffin
cp3
lilliard
aldridge
harden
marc gasol
parker
noah
love
dragic
<meh>lo
anthony davis
stephenson
wade
howard
parsons
milsap

Of course there may be cohesion issues. Heck Miami has serious cohesion issued out of the gate, and Im not saying that this WILL work but the pieces are in place that it CAN.

That is his best move by far. Can't see anything else close.

gunsnewing wrote:

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:I think you guys are selling him short. I've had my issues with Melo but he is worth $17-23 for a 5 year duration to us. He's not just another glen Robinson, Mitch Richmond vin baker career loser. My problem is with people who put him on the same pedestal as Jordan Lebron and Kobe and want to max him out. Give him everything and he he'll with the cap and draft picks and assets

He is good enough to single handey get you in the playoffs which we saw last year and most of his career in Denver. That is valuable.

Question is what is the New York knickerbockers brain trust plan going forward. Are we going to be patient and add the right pieces around Melo or are we going all out for Kevin Love to form he worse defensive front out in NBA history? Or are we going after more players with a few acl, micro fracture surgeries under their belts?

Melo resigning for $17-23 allows you to add the right pieces if you are patient

This to me is impartial and how I feel. I hate parts of his game (e.g. 0.4 assists in the 4th quarter) but I will not grossly underestimated him either because of personal distaste.

Yea definitely and subpar defense whether it's at SF or PF. This is where he really falls incredibly short of the true greats

I don't think we will ever win in the playoffs with Melo playing PF.

We need an athletic rugged monster of a man next to him like a David West

THen you need a pg leader to get the ball out of his ISO hands in the 4th

Yes. And that is part of the reason why he is not top 5 but top 15.

What would get him up there?

47% FG
4.5 assist per
20 pct better defense

I believe these adjustments to his game which he is definitely capable of doing if he bought into them, would make all the difference.

smackeddog wrote:Someone posted this Phil quote on realm, that makes me feel a bit better about the prospect:

when discussing Michael Jordan as an owner he goes on to say how 'when someone is staffing an organization, you cannot bring on friends or people who think like you on board to work under you (like Jordan has), you have to have people who are outside of your thought process and who will say no...'

You could put Jimmy Dolan instead of Michael Jordan and it still works.

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:I think you guys are selling him short. I've had my issues with Melo but he is worth $17-23 for a 5 year duration to us. He's not just another glen Robinson, Mitch Richmond vin baker career loser. My problem is with people who put him on the same pedestal as Jordan Lebron and Kobe and want to max him out. Give him everything and he he'll with the cap and draft picks and assets

He is good enough to single handey get you in the playoffs which we saw last year and most of his career in Denver. That is valuable.

Question is what is the New York knickerbockers brain trust plan going forward. Are we going to be patient and add the right pieces around Melo or are we going all out for Kevin Love to form he worse defensive front out in NBA history? Or are we going after more players with a few acl, micro fracture surgeries under their belts?

Melo resigning for $17-23 allows you to add the right pieces if you are patient

This to me is impartial and how I feel. I hate parts of his game (e.g. 0.4 assists in the 4th quarter) but I will not grossly underestimated him either because of personal distaste.

Yea definitely and subpar defense whether it's at SF or PF. This is where he really falls incredibly short of the true greats

I don't think we will ever win in the playoffs with Melo playing PF.

We need an athletic rugged monster of a man next to him like a David West

THen you need a pg leader to get the ball out of his ISO hands in the 4th

Yes. And that is part of the reason why he is not top 5 but top 15.

What would get him up there?

47% FG
4.5 assist per
20 pct better defense

I believe these adjustments to his game which he is definitely capable of doing if he bought into them, would make all the difference.

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:I think you guys are selling him short. I've had my issues with Melo but he is worth $17-23 for a 5 year duration to us. He's not just another glen Robinson, Mitch Richmond vin baker career loser. My problem is with people who put him on the same pedestal as Jordan Lebron and Kobe and want to max him out. Give him everything and he he'll with the cap and draft picks and assets

He is good enough to single handey get you in the playoffs which we saw last year and most of his career in Denver. That is valuable.

Question is what is the New York knickerbockers brain trust plan going forward. Are we going to be patient and add the right pieces around Melo or are we going all out for Kevin Love to form he worse defensive front out in NBA history? Or are we going after more players with a few acl, micro fracture surgeries under their belts?

Melo resigning for $17-23 allows you to add the right pieces if you are patient

This to me is impartial and how I feel. I hate parts of his game (e.g. 0.4 assists in the 4th quarter) but I will not grossly underestimated him either because of personal distaste.

Yea definitely and subpar defense whether it's at SF or PF. This is where he really falls incredibly short of the true greats

I don't think we will ever win in the playoffs with Melo playing PF.

We need an athletic rugged monster of a man next to him like a David West

THen you need a pg leader to get the ball out of his ISO hands in the 4th

Yes. And that is part of the reason why he is not top 5 but top 15.

What would get him up there?

47% FG
4.5 assist per
20 pct better defense

I believe these adjustments to his game which he is definitely capable of doing if he bought into them, would make all the difference.

You're signing him for his 12th to 16th seasons. It's much more likely that all his numbers will go down, not up.

I think for at least the first 2-3 years they can certainly go up if he looked less for contested shots and more for his teammates.

Pierce did it later in his career (became a better more efficient player), I think Melo can as well.

Who says you get less efficient with age?

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

VCoug wrote:

holfresh wrote:

VCoug wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Silverfuel wrote:

OasisBU wrote:So the Knicks didn't want to give the keys to Riley back in the day but now they are going after the Zen master who has zero front office experience. I think he will be a good addition and add some much needed credibility to the organization but what exactly would he be in charge of?

Giving Riley what he wanted would have been the right move

Riley wanted 25% of the team plus 10 mil per...That number might have been approaching 500 mil at this point..

And that would have been a bad thing because?

It's not your money right??

No, and it isn't yours either. But if it was my money I would have done it. And considering what a small piece of the pie the Knicks are compared to the rest of Cablevision, $6B in revenue last year, it would have been very affordable.

No one with a clue would do that..No one..

If you think he can increase your profits by significantly more than 25%, then you give him 25%. It's not black and white.
But like vcoug pointed out, he probably would have settled for less than 10%

Over what period of time??...That doesn't sound like good judgement or a wise business decision...U give someone 25% of the profits going forward(forever, knowing this individual will more than likely never deliver the same kind return to your business)..25% of your business is forever or as long as the franchise exists...

dk7th wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:I think you guys are selling him short. I've had my issues with Melo but he is worth $17-23 for a 5 year duration to us. He's not just another glen Robinson, Mitch Richmond vin baker career loser. My problem is with people who put him on the same pedestal as Jordan Lebron and Kobe and want to max him out. Give him everything and he he'll with the cap and draft picks and assets

He is good enough to single handey get you in the playoffs which we saw last year and most of his career in Denver. That is valuable.

Question is what is the New York knickerbockers brain trust plan going forward. Are we going to be patient and add the right pieces around Melo or are we going all out for Kevin Love to form he worse defensive front out in NBA history? Or are we going after more players with a few acl, micro fracture surgeries under their belts?

Melo resigning for $17-23 allows you to add the right pieces if you are patient

This to me is impartial and how I feel. I hate parts of his game (e.g. 0.4 assists in the 4th quarter) but I will not grossly underestimated him either because of personal distaste.

Yea definitely and subpar defense whether it's at SF or PF. This is where he really falls incredibly short of the true greats

I don't think we will ever win in the playoffs with Melo playing PF.

We need an athletic rugged monster of a man next to him like a David West

THen you need a pg leader to get the ball out of his ISO hands in the 4th

Yes. And that is part of the reason why he is not top 5 but top 15.

What would get him up there?

47% FG
4.5 assist per
20 pct better defense

I believe these adjustments to his game which he is definitely capable of doing if he bought into them, would make all the difference.

You're signing him for his 12th to 16th seasons. It's much more likely that all his numbers will go down, not up.

I think for at least the first 2-3 years they can certainly go up if he looked less for contested shots and more for his teammates.

Pierce did it later in his career (became a better more efficient player), I think Melo can as well.

Who says you get less efficient with age?

paul pierce has a much higher BBIQ than carmelo anthony, he's a much better decision-maker. he always had that aspect to his game-- just look to his ball sharing numbers (usage to assist ratio) to back up this assertion. he is a better teammate that is a fact.

compare what melo's numbers have been his entire career. i don't see that in melo's future or he would have been doing it in nyc.

PP did play smarter and is a bit more efficient (with his most efficient years between 2007 and 2010 (coincidence?). I don't think PP's IQ is hiher than Melo's, he is just more willing to do the right thing. Melo knows where all the open men are, the question is, will he make the pass and give up the shot which is not easy for him. He also needs to trust that his teammates will hit the shot regardless of how bad they are.

I think Melo has been more efficient this year with an AWFUL cast. I think he could be more efficient even with this cast and far more efficient with a team like Chicago. Of course, he has to be willing to do this. Will he? Time will tell.

Bonn1997 wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:I've written about it elsewhere but a scoring specialist who's about average in all other areas of the game? Based on looking at his advanced stats and considering age, I'd say around 4 years, $52 mil. Because I can't imagine he'd accept that, I also said we should have traded him. That's if you're asking me as a fan, not a shareholder.
From a shareholder's perspective (meaning I just wanted $$$), I'd probably offer him a few min total salary above whatever other teams are willing to offer. (I think that was something around $95 mil if I remember right.)

After state and nyc income tax that is down to almost 11 mil a year. If he is making that kind of money he goes to the Heat to get a championship.

So be it. That's why I said I'd trade him. As a fan, I'm not afraid to depart from the .500 Melo era and start over.

Bonn I say win now. I've been waiting for 40 years for a championship. I have more years behind me than in front of me. I don't want to wait 4 or 5 years. I want it now. or next season or the following season but not no 4 - 5 years from now.

mreinman wrote:

dk7th wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:I think you guys are selling him short. I've had my issues with Melo but he is worth $17-23 for a 5 year duration to us. He's not just another glen Robinson, Mitch Richmond vin baker career loser. My problem is with people who put him on the same pedestal as Jordan Lebron and Kobe and want to max him out. Give him everything and he he'll with the cap and draft picks and assets

He is good enough to single handey get you in the playoffs which we saw last year and most of his career in Denver. That is valuable.

Question is what is the New York knickerbockers brain trust plan going forward. Are we going to be patient and add the right pieces around Melo or are we going all out for Kevin Love to form he worse defensive front out in NBA history? Or are we going after more players with a few acl, micro fracture surgeries under their belts?

Melo resigning for $17-23 allows you to add the right pieces if you are patient

This to me is impartial and how I feel. I hate parts of his game (e.g. 0.4 assists in the 4th quarter) but I will not grossly underestimated him either because of personal distaste.

Yea definitely and subpar defense whether it's at SF or PF. This is where he really falls incredibly short of the true greats

I don't think we will ever win in the playoffs with Melo playing PF.

We need an athletic rugged monster of a man next to him like a David West

THen you need a pg leader to get the ball out of his ISO hands in the 4th

Yes. And that is part of the reason why he is not top 5 but top 15.

What would get him up there?

47% FG
4.5 assist per
20 pct better defense

I believe these adjustments to his game which he is definitely capable of doing if he bought into them, would make all the difference.

You're signing him for his 12th to 16th seasons. It's much more likely that all his numbers will go down, not up.

I think for at least the first 2-3 years they can certainly go up if he looked less for contested shots and more for his teammates.

Pierce did it later in his career (became a better more efficient player), I think Melo can as well.

Who says you get less efficient with age?

paul pierce has a much higher BBIQ than carmelo anthony, he's a much better decision-maker. he always had that aspect to his game-- just look to his ball sharing numbers (usage to assist ratio) to back up this assertion. he is a better teammate that is a fact.

compare what melo's numbers have been his entire career. i don't see that in melo's future or he would have been doing it in nyc.

PP did play smarter and is a bit more efficient (with his most efficient years between 2007 and 2010 (coincidence?). I don't think PP's IQ is hiher than Melo's, he is just more willing to do the right thing. Melo knows where all the open men are, the question is, will he make the pass and give up the shot which is not easy for him. He also needs to trust that his teammates will hit the shot regardless of how bad they are.

I think Melo has been more efficient this year with an AWFUL cast. I think he could be more efficient even with this cast and far more efficient with a team like Chicago. Of course, he has to be willing to do this. Will he? Time will tell.

To be honest Paul P won nothing until Garnett and Ray Allen came to Boston. I wonder what would have happened if Chandler , Ray Allen, Melo , Rondo, and Garnet played together? They would have won one.