SupremeCommander wrote:If Melo can pull down ~10 rpg for the rest of his prime, maybe he wouldn't be as good as LBJ or Durant, but he would certainly be remembered as an all-time great.

Bonn1997 wrote:

SupremeCommander wrote:If Melo can pull down ~10 rpg for the rest of his prime, maybe he wouldn't be as good as LBJ or Durant, but he would certainly be remembered as an all-time great.

10 is a stretch. I'd happily take 8.5

Keep your double double and give me one or two chips during the Melo regime.

dk7th wrote:

meloanyk wrote:

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

H1AND1 wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:I thought he was pretty awsome last year also. He and MDA didnt work. Once that situation dissolved Melo has been a top 10 player for the Knicks, hands down. Only donkeys and tfk cant see that

Seriously...Dude was top 5 in MVP voting and helped us win the division with 54 wins.

MVP voting is basically by ill-informed casual observers.
Any statistically informed analysis at this point would indicate that Melo is still not a superstar but he is playing at a reasonably high level.

Stats are good for the ill-informed who don't understand the game and grope to quantify. Those who do understand can use their eyes and see what's happening.

Bonn's not a donkey or ill-informed. He's just a FG% lover/sort of closet Melo hater. I don't think Melo killed his dog, ala tkf, but it must be something personal. I'm guessing it's probably the headband, some deep-seated sort of Slick Watts Halloween nightmare thing.

FG% loving is okay, Barkley shot .600 and averaged at or over .500 for his career and never won sheet. FG% is great for Shaq's and Gilmore's who spend huge amounts of time in the paint. Melo loves the perimeter and will shoot first, always. It's the NBA, you only get to shoot high % at the free throw line. Or if you're Lebron or Durant getting superstar calls day in and day out. Which gets you to the line.

well to be accurate Bonn is not in love with fg%. He is more of an advance stat guy. He is the Lt. Chris Sabian of advance stats, imo.

I think what jrod meant was that Bonn was a hater of the FG% lover...

No, what jrod meant is that Bonn is a hater of the Melo lover... If Melo suddenly became authentically 'efficient' (say 51% shooting) things would get very interesting around here for Mr. Advanced Stat. Of course, it's not like that's going to happen, but hey, Bonn already begrudgingly loves the Melo improved rebounding.

You seem to mis-perceive a lot of what I write. I'm definitely happy with the improvement in Melo's turnovers and if it lasts, in his rebounding. There wouldn't be anything interesting or dramatic if Melo had a long-term improvement in his scoring efficiency. I would just declare that I was happy with it - like I've done for the improvement in turnover rate.
Likewise, if there's a long-term deterioration, I won't ignore it or blame his teammates like a few here do.

let me ask you this: if he remains inefficient, and by inefficient i mean he takes 4-6 too many shots a game that are just bad shots-- then isn't he taking away better shot opportunities from teammates?

i just don't think you get anywhere substantive in the playoffs with a guy taking over 17-18 shots a game.

yes! You nailed it!!!!

Just which teammate is Melo stealing these shots from now????
Bargs? 44%
JR? 35%
Ray 39%
Shump? 39%
Beno? 43%
RonRon? 39%

Now if you can produce vaginametrics that prove everytime Melo takes a shot he's taking it from one of the two guys who shoot well on the team then yea... he's hurting us. Otherwise I would generally say that Melo taking the volume of the shots is a positive.

Lets also ignore that Melo's averaging almost 9 boards a game and for a guy who puts it on the floor so much he doesnt turn it over. Quite a bit less then Lebron and KD.

Exactly. Melo surrounded by offensive mediocrity and complainers complain. Melo certainly guilty of occasionally taking some very questionable shots like many scorers but he's a star who has busted his sss and not acted like a diva. Scores in and out, boards and competes defensively and is a likewable teammate. Could he be more efficient ? Put some opffensive talent around him and find out.NYK is fortunate to have him, be a terrible team without

stop complaining about his "help" and "supporting cast." it's a lame-assed excuse you are making for a guy who overvalued himself so much that he ruined the team he wanted to come to. he could have had a better team if he weren't a greedy selfish douche!

Until you are in position to turn down a 100 million dollar extention on the team of your choice prior to a pending lockout, you can't say anything about him being greedy and selfish. He is human, therefore financial security is extremely important. What happened if he turned it down then experienced a career ending injury? This theory of him being selfish and greedy is beyond laughable.

Knixkik wrote:

dk7th wrote:

meloanyk wrote:

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

H1AND1 wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:I thought he was pretty awsome last year also. He and MDA didnt work. Once that situation dissolved Melo has been a top 10 player for the Knicks, hands down. Only donkeys and tfk cant see that

Seriously...Dude was top 5 in MVP voting and helped us win the division with 54 wins.

MVP voting is basically by ill-informed casual observers.
Any statistically informed analysis at this point would indicate that Melo is still not a superstar but he is playing at a reasonably high level.

Stats are good for the ill-informed who don't understand the game and grope to quantify. Those who do understand can use their eyes and see what's happening.

Bonn's not a donkey or ill-informed. He's just a FG% lover/sort of closet Melo hater. I don't think Melo killed his dog, ala tkf, but it must be something personal. I'm guessing it's probably the headband, some deep-seated sort of Slick Watts Halloween nightmare thing.

FG% loving is okay, Barkley shot .600 and averaged at or over .500 for his career and never won sheet. FG% is great for Shaq's and Gilmore's who spend huge amounts of time in the paint. Melo loves the perimeter and will shoot first, always. It's the NBA, you only get to shoot high % at the free throw line. Or if you're Lebron or Durant getting superstar calls day in and day out. Which gets you to the line.

well to be accurate Bonn is not in love with fg%. He is more of an advance stat guy. He is the Lt. Chris Sabian of advance stats, imo.

I think what jrod meant was that Bonn was a hater of the FG% lover...

No, what jrod meant is that Bonn is a hater of the Melo lover... If Melo suddenly became authentically 'efficient' (say 51% shooting) things would get very interesting around here for Mr. Advanced Stat. Of course, it's not like that's going to happen, but hey, Bonn already begrudgingly loves the Melo improved rebounding.

You seem to mis-perceive a lot of what I write. I'm definitely happy with the improvement in Melo's turnovers and if it lasts, in his rebounding. There wouldn't be anything interesting or dramatic if Melo had a long-term improvement in his scoring efficiency. I would just declare that I was happy with it - like I've done for the improvement in turnover rate.
Likewise, if there's a long-term deterioration, I won't ignore it or blame his teammates like a few here do.

let me ask you this: if he remains inefficient, and by inefficient i mean he takes 4-6 too many shots a game that are just bad shots-- then isn't he taking away better shot opportunities from teammates?

i just don't think you get anywhere substantive in the playoffs with a guy taking over 17-18 shots a game.

yes! You nailed it!!!!

Just which teammate is Melo stealing these shots from now????
Bargs? 44%
JR? 35%
Ray 39%
Shump? 39%
Beno? 43%
RonRon? 39%

Now if you can produce vaginametrics that prove everytime Melo takes a shot he's taking it from one of the two guys who shoot well on the team then yea... he's hurting us. Otherwise I would generally say that Melo taking the volume of the shots is a positive.

Lets also ignore that Melo's averaging almost 9 boards a game and for a guy who puts it on the floor so much he doesnt turn it over. Quite a bit less then Lebron and KD.

Exactly. Melo surrounded by offensive mediocrity and complainers complain. Melo certainly guilty of occasionally taking some very questionable shots like many scorers but he's a star who has busted his sss and not acted like a diva. Scores in and out, boards and competes defensively and is a likewable teammate. Could he be more efficient ? Put some opffensive talent around him and find out.NYK is fortunate to have him, be a terrible team without

stop complaining about his "help" and "supporting cast." it's a lame-assed excuse you are making for a guy who overvalued himself so much that he ruined the team he wanted to come to. he could have had a better team if he weren't a greedy selfish douche!

Until you are in position to turn down a 100 million dollar extention on the team of your choice prior to a pending lockout, you can't say anything about him being greedy and selfish. He is human, therefore financial security is extremely important. What happened if he turned it down then experienced a career ending injury? This theory of him being selfish and greedy is beyond laughable.

That is all

playa2 wrote:Lets just says he has the physical tools of a winner & leader, but not the MENTALITY of a winner or leader.

He has won at every level he has played except the NBA..

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

playa2 wrote:Lets just says he has the physical tools of a winner & leader, but not the MENTALITY of a winner or leader.

He has won at every level he has played except the NBA..

Well unfortunately for us the Knicks are an NBA team...

Surround him with the right pieces, the best players don't win without the right pieces..Bron and KD are in the same boat..Melo is a winner tho..

playa2 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

playa2 wrote:Lets just says he has the physical tools of a winner & leader, but not the MENTALITY of a winner or leader.

He has won at every level he has played except the NBA..

Well unfortunately for us the Knicks are an NBA team...

Surround him with the right pieces, the best players don't win without the right pieces..Bron and KD are in the same boat..Melo is a winner tho..

The NBA is the hardest level to win at, Lebron had to sacrifice money and he did it when he was younger just to win a CHAMPIONSHIP. KD haven't won squat but scoring titles, George Gervin did that.

Put the money where your mouth is if you really want to win Big in the ASSOCIATION.

Your organization has to have a plan of putting the pieces together..It's just isn't as easy a the picture u are trying to paint...Melo is a winner tho..