Bonn1997 wrote:

DurzoBlint wrote:he needs help...he may have his weaknesses but, that doesn't alter reality

I won't say the teams need to built around him because he should be the beta dog, not the alpha but, this team needs to cut or buy out kidd if he refuses to retire, find a team to move Camby to and sign a legit 2guard.

Beta? It sounds like you're saying on the one hand, the Knicks should keep Melo. And on the other hand, it's virtually impossible for keeping him to work out (because we don't have the resources to get another alpha). Saying the Knicks should trade him is not the same as saying he's an awful player.

If stats were the all in all then I ask one question. Why do we send out scouts on the road to study players? Hell all we have to do is pull up his stats and go after the player with the best Stats.
Let me get real New York is the most difficult place to play basketball. New York is the Meca of basketball. You must have tough skin to play here and stay here. We have a revolving door. Did you forget what LeBron did to us?? He played us like a 2 bit chump. I read all the post of everyone thinking we had a chance and we never was in the running. And do you know why. Besides his deal with Wade he was afraid of New York. I will ask again Why did Lebron Leave Cleveland?? He is such a superstar so Why did he leave Cleveland. How come he didn't come to New York, Why did Bosh leave his team?? At least Melo came to New York hoping to play with Amear. Melo had balls.

in a nutshell were "stuck" with our team..for better or for worse. Its not that bad folks, just need minor changes for next yr!! Most likely we win 45-50 games and make it to the 2nd rd and with a few breaks we advance to the ECF. (look at our previous six yr trajectory; there has been steady improvement each yr). The following yr in 2014-15, we trade amare (an expiring contract) and maybe add some more depth and see how that goes (yet another 2nd rd appearance). To me, were building for 2015-16..the truth is, the way this team is constructed you can expect to be elite. (No team under this CBA can afford to let $30 million be wasted in amare, kidd and camby). In 2015-16, Melo (age 31 still in his prime) wouldve resigned but most of all we'd be under the salary cap to make major moves. The priority should be to get a Kyrie-like (i say "like" because i dont know if he'll be available) who can distribute and create for others since its clear that's not Melo's strength. Add solid role players around Melo and Elite PG. If woody does a good job, he stays...if not get a better coach.

SIMPLE!!!... lol

Jmpasq wrote:

RonRon wrote:

knickscity wrote:What choice would be other? Either you build or trade, there is no "other".

1- My first preference is to trade Tyson Chandler, remove his salary with a trade exemption with Portland, with multiple 2nd round picks (picks 39,40,45, and draft rights to Pap back)

2- My second one is to have Carmelo Anthony remove his ability to opt out in 2014 summer and play out his contract till 2015, where we can add multiple FA's with possibly the best FA class in NBA history

If Melo is unwilling to do so, I don't want to lose leverage while his value is still high and we can still get multiple asset's for him, and retool with 2015 FA class
I simply don't think he is worth signing a 5 year extension making 20-25m per year, leaving us with little room to improve and add quality FA's to build a contender

3- My 3rd preference is to add a well respected assistant coach to the staff that will do all the dirty work and hold players accountable like Woodson once said he would do
He would also be responsible for running an offense instead of 1v1's in which with more player/ball movement, picks on and off the ball, and a SYSTEM/PHILOSOPHY that allow's all players to be threats instead of doing nothing as 1 player dances ineffectively

This is the biggest thing with Melo if he wants a max extension no way I would keep him. Im willing to do a normal max deal but paying him 25 -30 million like Kobe there is no way I would be willing to do that not at 31.

If this is what Melo wants 25 - 30 million then he dosen't want a championship and I would be one of the first ones on the forum to go against him. Then I would say get rid of him because him being the leader he should take a hit if he want's a ring. Now I don't mean him settling for 10 million no. He should be the highest paid but 15 - 18 million I'm ok with 15 million I would be better with and that would mean no one on the team should be making more than that.

Bonn1997 wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

RonRon wrote:

knickscity wrote:What choice would be other? Either you build or trade, there is no "other".

1- My first preference is to trade Tyson Chandler, remove his salary with a trade exemption with Portland, with multiple 2nd round picks (picks 39,40,45, and draft rights to Pap back)

2- My second one is to have Carmelo Anthony remove his ability to opt out in 2014 summer and play out his contract till 2015, where we can add multiple FA's with possibly the best FA class in NBA history

If Melo is unwilling to do so, I don't want to lose leverage while his value is still high and we can still get multiple asset's for him, and retool with 2015 FA class
I simply don't think he is worth signing a 5 year extension making 20-25m per year, leaving us with little room to improve and add quality FA's to build a contender

3- My 3rd preference is to add a well respected assistant coach to the staff that will do all the dirty work and hold players accountable like Woodson once said he would do
He would also be responsible for running an offense instead of 1v1's in which with more player/ball movement, picks on and off the ball, and a SYSTEM/PHILOSOPHY that allow's all players to be threats instead of doing nothing as 1 player dances ineffectively

This is the biggest thing with Melo if he wants a max extension no way I would keep him. Im willing to do a normal max deal but paying him 25 -30 million like Kobe there is no way I would be willing to do that not at 31.

The max contract under the new CBA is closer to $20 mil. Yeah, that's too much though.

2013--------- 2014--------- 2015--------- 2016--------- 2017
18,668,430--- 20,068,563--- 21,468,695--- 22,868,827--- 24,268,960

If its the same structure that means Melo can get a deal starting at 25,934,799 and increasing by roughly 1.065 each year for 5 seasons. I dont know though if thats right there is no way Im ok with that and im PRO MELO. Isnt that how Kobes deal got so high

Bonn1997 wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

RonRon wrote:

knickscity wrote:What choice would be other? Either you build or trade, there is no "other".

1- My first preference is to trade Tyson Chandler, remove his salary with a trade exemption with Portland, with multiple 2nd round picks (picks 39,40,45, and draft rights to Pap back)

2- My second one is to have Carmelo Anthony remove his ability to opt out in 2014 summer and play out his contract till 2015, where we can add multiple FA's with possibly the best FA class in NBA history

If Melo is unwilling to do so, I don't want to lose leverage while his value is still high and we can still get multiple asset's for him, and retool with 2015 FA class
I simply don't think he is worth signing a 5 year extension making 20-25m per year, leaving us with little room to improve and add quality FA's to build a contender

3- My 3rd preference is to add a well respected assistant coach to the staff that will do all the dirty work and hold players accountable like Woodson once said he would do
He would also be responsible for running an offense instead of 1v1's in which with more player/ball movement, picks on and off the ball, and a SYSTEM/PHILOSOPHY that allow's all players to be threats instead of doing nothing as 1 player dances ineffectively

This is the biggest thing with Melo if he wants a max extension no way I would keep him. Im willing to do a normal max deal but paying him 25 -30 million like Kobe there is no way I would be willing to do that not at 31.

The max contract under the new CBA is closer to $20 mil. Yeah, that's too much though.

His contract isnt grandfathered with an extension? He cant get the same raises off the last yearly amount? Either way if Melo really wants to win and wants help he needs to sign a deal around 15 million a year.Im not sure but here is Chrs Pauls for example. This season he made
17,800,000 and according to Clippers blog he can get raises off that.

2013--------- 2014--------- 2015--------- 2016--------- 2017
18,668,430--- 20,068,563--- 21,468,695--- 22,868,827--- 24,268,960

If its the same structure that means Melo can get a deal starting at 25,934,799 and increasing by roughly 1.065 each year for 5 seasons. I dont know though if thats right there is no way Im ok with that and im PRO MELO. Isnt that how Kobes deal got so high

Maybe you're right about grandfathering. I'm not sure how it works.

Either am I but if this is the case the Knicks need to see what his intentions are because we have zero chance of winning under the new CBA paying him like that. He cant get that money without us though so we could do a sign and trade if a team wanted him and were willing to pay

dk7th wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

Papabear wrote:Papabear Says

I don't know what hell is the meaning of What should we do with Melo. I should say what should we do to help Melo. Every damn thread is bash Melo time. Damn can't we talk about something else. This is getting sick. Just like the two sicko brothers. which one I have on ignore. The best year we had in 13 years and you still complain. Now about winning it all aka a championship. You have 12 other good teams thinking the same thing but there can only be one winner. So does the rest of the league suck? I believe that half of the people on this forum only care about is how you play the game and not winning the game. I bet no one on this forum would be willing to give up a raise in pay just to bring in someone else on your work team. Hell No! give me mine. Now you say regular season don't count and what Melo did then dosent mean a thing. Let me tell you something every game is an important game.

Perhaps with his 29th birthday celebration this week, Carmelo Anthony should treat himself to Phil Jackson's book, "Sacred Hoops."

That's what Jackson hopes Melo, whom he called a "terrific player," purchases to learn what it takes to become an NBA champion.

"He's one step away from getting there and having that opportunity," Jackson said on Thursday during an interview on Bloomberg Radio's "Taking Stock" with Pimm Fox and Carol Massar. "Having had [a championship] as an NCAA player, it's something he must crave."

In "Sacred Hoops," Jackson describes coaching the greatest player ever, who also needed some motivation from the "Zen Master" himself.

"It's a book in which I address the fact that Michael Jordan's a leading scorer, he's got the capability of being a terrific scorer," Jackson said, "but that he's got to get his other teammates involved and he's got to make it a team game."

"Sacred Hoops" was published in 1995, two years after the Bulls won three straight titles. Jackson has written several other books, including "Maverick: More Than a Game," "The Last Season: A Team in Search of Its Soul" and "Eleven Rings: The Soul of Success," which was released earlier this month. During his legendary coaching career, Jackson was known to give his players books to read for teaching and inspiration.

Recently, in an interview with The New York Times, Jackson also took a jab at the Knicks, saying they're still missing championship pieces.

"The Knicks still have to find some accommodating group of guys that know how to play ball together, move the ball and play the game the right way," he said.

it's not just people on this board that are sick and tired of melo playing like he's in the streets..

the main issue is playing ball the right way. i have been saying this all along. melo doesn't know how to. trade this chump.

I think he can be MADE TO PLAY THE RIGHT WAY. -
That's what coach K did in the Olympics. But you need someone like tgat with enough credibility to steamroll his whining and self centered ego issues. If we don't have a coach like that then yes trade him by all means. We will never win anything with Melo.

Papabear wrote:

Red1976 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Red1976 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Papabear wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Papabear wrote:Papabear Says

I don't know what hell is the meaning of What should we do with Melo. I should say what should we do to help Melo. Every damn thread is bash Melo time. Damn can't we talk about something else. This is getting sick. Just like the two sicko brothers. which one I have on ignore. The best year we had in 13 years and you still complain. Now about winning it all aka a championship. You have 12 other good teams thinking the same thing but there can only be one winner. So does the rest of the league suck? I believe that half of the people on this forum only care about is how you play the game and not winning the game. I bet no one on this forum would be willing to give up a raise in pay just to bring in someone else on your work team. Hell No! give me mine. Now you say regular season don't count and what Melo did then dosent mean a thing. Let me tell you something every game is an important game.

Some threads are critical of Melo but almost all of your comments bash many if not the majority of the forum members here. Have you thought about finding a forum where you respect the views of the members more? I know I could just put you on ignore but I don't have anyone on ignore and I don't like doing that. It's irritating to see someone bash our forum so often though.

Papabear Says

Bonn 1997 I can't help it if you have a problem about Melo or this team. You are of the minority with your views. The majority of the form members are in favor of Melo the same way I am.Go to a Knicks game and you will see how much love the fans (who spend thier money have for Melo) Does he have to change some things? of course so but Melo ain't the problem. 13years 13 years of loosing and now it's over. That's something to celebrate. As far as I'm concern you can say or do what you want to say and I'll just say to you 13 years of hell is over. And we will get better. 13 years

You're saying I'm in the minority but a second ago you criticized half the people on this board (bold above)? You know half is not a minority, right? And actually about 60% of the people in this thread don't think we can build a contender around Melo. Nevertheless, I have no problem with you feeling that the losing is over and feeling that we accomplished something meaningful. It's when you constantly bash the majority of our forum that it's ridiculous.

with increasing sample size your 60% tendency is going the reverse way it seems ...

Not really. Right now 42% of posters who voted do and 58% don't think building a contender around Melo is a feasible option

to be fair it is almost tied between "TRADE and BUILD", other are another category and this should be interpreted this way... otherwise your poll is biased if you have 3 choices and one of them is counting like one of the other two and if this is not clearly stated (mostly because voting "other" is not specifying if you are voting towards "no melo can't be build around at all" or "there are maybe other better ways, but building around melo is still an option but not the best one") ... here you are subjectively deciding that other should be lumped in the category that shows what you think ... the argument can be drawn the other way around

so NO i disagree with you there ... or clarify your questions so there are 2 or 3 clear categories that can't be subjectively lumped together by one or another voter to make a point

Papabear Says

You better go back and take another look today. Melo wins

which isn't surprising ... the 60% were based on a very small number of voters ... i guess the trend will grow even bigger in favor of Melo and this is just fine for me as we had the best year in a decade ...

tkf wrote:

loweyecue wrote:

dk7th wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

Papabear wrote:Papabear Says

I don't know what hell is the meaning of What should we do with Melo. I should say what should we do to help Melo. Every damn thread is bash Melo time. Damn can't we talk about something else. This is getting sick. Just like the two sicko brothers. which one I have on ignore. The best year we had in 13 years and you still complain. Now about winning it all aka a championship. You have 12 other good teams thinking the same thing but there can only be one winner. So does the rest of the league suck? I believe that half of the people on this forum only care about is how you play the game and not winning the game. I bet no one on this forum would be willing to give up a raise in pay just to bring in someone else on your work team. Hell No! give me mine. Now you say regular season don't count and what Melo did then dosent mean a thing. Let me tell you something every game is an important game.

Perhaps with his 29th birthday celebration this week, Carmelo Anthony should treat himself to Phil Jackson's book, "Sacred Hoops."

That's what Jackson hopes Melo, whom he called a "terrific player," purchases to learn what it takes to become an NBA champion.

"He's one step away from getting there and having that opportunity," Jackson said on Thursday during an interview on Bloomberg Radio's "Taking Stock" with Pimm Fox and Carol Massar. "Having had [a championship] as an NCAA player, it's something he must crave."

In "Sacred Hoops," Jackson describes coaching the greatest player ever, who also needed some motivation from the "Zen Master" himself.

"It's a book in which I address the fact that Michael Jordan's a leading scorer, he's got the capability of being a terrific scorer," Jackson said, "but that he's got to get his other teammates involved and he's got to make it a team game."

"Sacred Hoops" was published in 1995, two years after the Bulls won three straight titles. Jackson has written several other books, including "Maverick: More Than a Game," "The Last Season: A Team in Search of Its Soul" and "Eleven Rings: The Soul of Success," which was released earlier this month. During his legendary coaching career, Jackson was known to give his players books to read for teaching and inspiration.

Recently, in an interview with The New York Times, Jackson also took a jab at the Knicks, saying they're still missing championship pieces.

"The Knicks still have to find some accommodating group of guys that know how to play ball together, move the ball and play the game the right way," he said.

it's not just people on this board that are sick and tired of melo playing like he's in the streets..

the main issue is playing ball the right way. i have been saying this all along. melo doesn't know how to. trade this chump.

I think he can be MADE TO PLAY THE RIGHT WAY. -
That's what coach K did in the Olympics. But you need someone like tgat with enough credibility to steamroll his whining and self centered ego issues. If we don't have a coach like that then yes trade him by all means. We will never win anything with Melo.

Do you really believe that? I wish people stop using the olympics as an example of how carmelo can be a different player... everyone can behave in the short term, in a different environment when they know it is just temporary.. plus it wasn't coach K that kept him in check, it was the real star players that made sure of that.. carmelo had to fall in line.. and unless you can get that olympic team in NY, we are doomed..

First of all last I checked the Olympics and NCAA is not the NBA.

I'm sick and tired of fans referencing either when it comes to Melo. When I speak of Mihceal Jordan on a personal level as a player I never ever ever ever ever if ever mention The Dream Team or his shot at North Carolina to catapult them to a title....NEVER....I only speak on what he did once he got in the league and what he did by the time he left. That goes for all other greats.

Also what player changes their game after 10-11yrs in the league... not due to injury/age or change of position/role(e.g. Magic playing Center due to Kareem's injury for the Lakers...Amar'e microfracture/debridement/change of role...Micheal after prime became more skilled player). The answer is they don't. Basketball players are pretty much who they are once they've reached a certain skill level after 3-4yrs.

Back in 2008 when Melo was not relevant to Knick fans (he was actually Spawn of this franchise then) during the Olympics that year Kobe referred to him as the best player on the team(his level of play that is) at the time. This isn't new but of course since he meant nothing to us at the time, no one really paid him any mind and thought of him like a small few do now...a LOSER. Fast forward 4 more yrs now he's relevant to the Knicks and these same fans want to laud his Oylympic performances against the likes of Nigeria....it's like sheesh we've already been there done that in 2008.... SO THE FLYING FUDGE WHAT WHO CARES!!!!

You do not pad your personal Knicks resume by what you do in the Olympics... because he doesn't even represent our franchise when there, he represents THE NATIONAL BASKETBALL ASSOCIATION and it will be recognized as a personal basketball accomplishment for Melo only. Case in point. If we were to trade him tomorrow what he's done in the Olympics will not be recognized by this organization, the Nuggets are not going to recognize what he did in the 2008 Olympics but the Basketball HOF possibly will..AND?

For the record Carmelo was on the 2004 Olympic team one in which landed The Bronze medal as was Wade/James/Amar'e/Duncan does anyone think this taints them as players or the current teams they play for or still play for when they accomplished this result? NOPE! It taints the NBA representation though and that's about it.

Please stop it with the Olympic talk once and for all....it looks like and is absolute foolery discussion.