newyorknewyork wrote:

Amare was not going to be moved or turned into anything. Once he was signed he was a knick until his contract ran out so automatically there is a flaw in that plan. Gallo and Wilson were also going to be re-upped, Fields would look to be reupped the following yr. The team needed a superstar to put along side of Gallo, Wilson, Fields, Amare, Felton at eiher Center or SG as well as adding in more depth in order for it to be a championship calibre team. The odds of that superstar falling to the Knicks lap was slim to none. I'm guessing the Knicks org felt they can go for the superstar like Melo now and then look to find the Gallo, Wilson and Felton type pieces later on.

I'm guessing they felt it is a lot harder to land a guy like Melo then it is to land guys like Gallo and Chandler etc..

Denver basically has Gallo, Chandler, Mozgov, Lawson, our draft picks, added Iggy and Mcgee. Should I be expecting them to be chasing a championship?

This is spot on.

VCoug wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

VCoug wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

VCoug wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:This team has a 2 yr window to win it all. But the rebuilding process after is being a bit exaggerated. Felton, Shump, Melo, Amare, Tyson, Jr Smith, Novak are all under 30. Melo, Amare, Tyson, Kidd, Camby all come off the books. Melo will be resigned. Tyson and Amare will most likley be resigned with pay cuts. Or The knicks will go after other free agents if Amare is done. The team will have a good amount of cap flexibility to refill depth lost. They will have 2 first rd draft picks out of the next 3 yrs added to the roster at this time. And will have the rest of there draft picks for the remaining yrs if no trades are made.

I don't see the rebuilding purgatory after the window closes. I see retooling and competitive basketball though most likely not championship asperations unless everything breaks our way with Amare.

We won't have cap space if we so what you're saying. Right now we have $12M on the cap that year; JR is probably going to be resigned for about $5M after this season bringing our total to $17M; if Melo takes no paycut he'll be resigned for $24M bringing out total top $ 41M; even if Amare and Tyson take 50% paycuts they'll still earn $12M and $7M each for a total salary figure of at least $60M. That doesn't include any draft picks or MLE free agents. Basically, if we want to retool in three years Dolan would have to agree to blow this team up and let each of our big 3 leave.

Cap space isn't really what im looking at more so flexibility. Melo isn't going to get 24mil the first yr of his renewed contract. More like 16-20mil depending on the length. Flexibility will come from Tyson and Amare though. With there contracts expiring the GM would be in position to either resign or check the market. If Amare is brought back at 12mil that means he has been at the very least pretty solid for us. If there are more attractive pieces we can go after them if not we can resign Tyson and/or Amare. If they are brought back that still leaves us with Felton, Shump, Melo, Amare, Tyson, Smith if resigned, Novak, 2 first rd draft picks, which is still a competitive team. The guys we would be looking to replace are Kidd, Camby, KT, Wallace, Pablo, Brewer if he doesn't stick.

How do we have flexibility without cap space? And why are any of those guys taking a paycut at 31/32 when it's likely the last big payday of their careers?

We would have cap space as under your senario even with Melo making 24mil his first yr which he wouldn't be making. We would have 41mil salary cap which is well under the cap before resigning Tyson and Amare. But again what im looking at is the flexibility to decide if we want to keep Tyson and Amare or if we want to go another direction depending on whats in the free agency market. If they aren't taking pay cuts that means they have been productive and have been winning. There would be no need to rebuild at that point anyway.

So while a championship window is probably only 2yrs depending on how we replace Kidd & Camby. Competitive basketball can be maintained for the next 6-7yrs.

Tyson and Amare will have full Bird rights when they become free agents which means that there will be a cap hold unless we waive there bird rights. If we want to resign either one or both of them we won't have any space unless they both agree to greatly reduce contracts.

I'm not saying we are going to resign them and then have cap space left over if they sign for less. I am saying we have the options of resigning them or letting them walk and signing someone else depending on how they have performed and who else is available in free agency during this time.

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:Competitive basketball can be maintained for the next 6-7yrs.

We had that with the previous team except more flexibility

Not guranteed, but it could have been. Ironic you would be banking on the same PG and PF that you don't think will get it done today. The organization went in another direction so be it. You can cry over it or you can move on.

Im all for moving on from the past but you have to admit that we might have only 2-3 years to have very good seasons then its back to the drawing boards. also we havent exactly had a great history in the draft

Wasn't banking on Felton or Amar'e per say but was banking on maybe turning Felton/Amar'e and or picks/AR//Fields/Douglas/ into the missing/better pieces. We had a winning record despite all the injuries/trade rumors/unfamiliarity/new style of play. I also wanted the coach swapped out a long time ago not last year.

Don't even try and flip this either. It's the other way around. Most fans said the team was going nowhere which had Felton/Amar'e, therefore the team needed a facelift. It needed to STARFUDGE at all costs no matter what. I always begged to differ.

I was fine with the team going forward since they only played about 40gms together factoring injuries. I wanted more games played for an official data analysis and what the team looked like in the playoffs. Surely they could have accomplished getting swept by Boston 4-0. What do you think?

When Felton was traded he was being talked about something fierce. Matter of fact most fans were disgusted with Felton's point play because they felt he iced the kids out too much, playing patty cake with Amar'e in the PNR.

Amare was not going to be moved or turned into anything. Once he was signed he was a knick until his contract ran out so automatically there is a flaw in that plan. Gallo and Wilson were also going to be re-upped, Fields would look to be reupped the following yr. The team needed a superstar to put along side of Gallo, Wilson, Fields, Amare, Felton at eiher Center or SG as well as adding in more depth in order for it to be a championship calibre team. The odds of that superstar falling to the Knicks lap was slim to none. I'm guessing the Knicks org felt they can go for the superstar like Melo now and then look to find the Gallo, Wilson and Felton type pieces later on.

I'm guessing they felt it is a lot harder to land a guy like Melo then it is to land guys like Gallo and Chandler etc..

Denver basically has Gallo, Chandler, Mozgov, Lawson, our draft picks, added Iggy and Mcgee. Should I be expecting them to be chasing a championship?

true, superstars don't fall into anyone's lap at all.... so you have to be smart and patient on how you build your team... I keep hearing melo referred to as a superstar, well how is he any more of a star than amare? this is what I don't get.. we didn't get a superstar in amare, but a guy who at one time was playing near elite level ball, but not a superstar( and amare is one of my favorite players in the league)... we didn't get a superstar in melo either, but a guy who is a great streak scorer.... either way, the knicks gave up a lot and still didn't accomplish what dolan intended to do... I also keep hearing it is easy to replace gallo and chandler, but we have yet to find the young talent to replace these guys.... brewer, Jr smith, prigioni, and a host of 40 year old guys are not equal replacements.... we did get a mulligan with lin, but botched that one up....

ChuckBuck wrote:

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:Competitive basketball can be maintained for the next 6-7yrs.

We had that with the previous team except more flexibility

Not guranteed, but it could have been. Ironic you would be banking on the same PG and PF that you don't think will get it done today. The organization went in another direction so be it. You can cry over it or you can move on.

Im all for moving on from the past but you have to admit that we might have only 2-3 years to have very good seasons then its back to the drawing boards. also we havent exactly had a great history in the draft

Wasn't banking on Felton or Amar'e per say but was banking on maybe turning Felton/Amar'e and or picks/AR//Fields/Douglas/ into the missing/better pieces. We had a winning record despite all the injuries/trade rumors/unfamiliarity/new style of play. I also wanted the coach swapped out a long time ago not last year.

Don't even try and flip this either. It's the other way around. Most fans said the team was going nowhere which had Felton/Amar'e, therefore the team needed a facelift. It needed to STARFUDGE at all costs no matter what. I always begged to differ.

I was fine with the team going forward since they only played about 40gms together factoring injuries. I wanted more games played for an official data analysis and what the team looked like in the playoffs. Surely they could have accomplished getting swept by Boston 4-0. What do you think?

When Felton was traded he was being talked about something fierce. Matter of fact most fans were disgusted with Felton's point play because they felt he iced the kids out too much, playing patty cake with Amar'e in the PNR.

Amare was not going to be moved or turned into anything. Once he was signed he was a knick until his contract ran out so automatically there is a flaw in that plan. Gallo and Wilson were also going to be re-upped, Fields would look to be reupped the following yr. The team needed a superstar to put along side of Gallo, Wilson, Fields, Amare, Felton at eiher Center or SG as well as adding in more depth in order for it to be a championship calibre team. The odds of that superstar falling to the Knicks lap was slim to none. I'm guessing the Knicks org felt they can go for the superstar like Melo now and then look to find the Gallo, Wilson and Felton type pieces later on.

I'm guessing they felt it is a lot harder to land a guy like Melo then it is to land guys like Gallo and Chandler etc..

Denver basically has Gallo, Chandler, Mozgov, Lawson, our draft picks, added Iggy and Mcgee. Should I be expecting them to be chasing a championship?

true, superstars don't fall into anyone's lap at all.... so you have to be smart and patient on how you build your team... I keep hearing melo referred to as a superstar, well how is he any more of a star than amare? this is what I don't get.. we didn't get a superstar in amare, but a guy who at one time was playing near elite level ball, but not a superstar( and amare is one of my favorite players in the league)... we didn't get a superstar in melo either, but a guy who is a great streak scorer.... either way, the knicks gave up a lot and still didn't accomplish what dolan intended to do... I also keep hearing it is easy to replace gallo and chandler, but we have yet to find the young talent to replace these guys.... brewer, Jr smith, prigioni, and a host of 40 year old guys are not equal replacements.... we did get a mulligan with lin, but botched that one up....

Novak isn't a better shooter than Gallo and Shumpert isn't a potentially better all around player than Wilson Chandler?

Chuck I like Novak but you have to be fair Gallo is a much better player than Novak. Novak can shoot but once you defend his shot he cant do anything.

ChuckBuck wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:Competitive basketball can be maintained for the next 6-7yrs.

We had that with the previous team except more flexibility

Not guranteed, but it could have been. Ironic you would be banking on the same PG and PF that you don't think will get it done today. The organization went in another direction so be it. You can cry over it or you can move on.

Im all for moving on from the past but you have to admit that we might have only 2-3 years to have very good seasons then its back to the drawing boards. also we havent exactly had a great history in the draft

Wasn't banking on Felton or Amar'e per say but was banking on maybe turning Felton/Amar'e and or picks/AR//Fields/Douglas/ into the missing/better pieces. We had a winning record despite all the injuries/trade rumors/unfamiliarity/new style of play. I also wanted the coach swapped out a long time ago not last year.

Don't even try and flip this either. It's the other way around. Most fans said the team was going nowhere which had Felton/Amar'e, therefore the team needed a facelift. It needed to STARFUDGE at all costs no matter what. I always begged to differ.

I was fine with the team going forward since they only played about 40gms together factoring injuries. I wanted more games played for an official data analysis and what the team looked like in the playoffs. Surely they could have accomplished getting swept by Boston 4-0. What do you think?

When Felton was traded he was being talked about something fierce. Matter of fact most fans were disgusted with Felton's point play because they felt he iced the kids out too much, playing patty cake with Amar'e in the PNR.

Amare was not going to be moved or turned into anything. Once he was signed he was a knick until his contract ran out so automatically there is a flaw in that plan. Gallo and Wilson were also going to be re-upped, Fields would look to be reupped the following yr. The team needed a superstar to put along side of Gallo, Wilson, Fields, Amare, Felton at eiher Center or SG as well as adding in more depth in order for it to be a championship calibre team. The odds of that superstar falling to the Knicks lap was slim to none. I'm guessing the Knicks org felt they can go for the superstar like Melo now and then look to find the Gallo, Wilson and Felton type pieces later on.

I'm guessing they felt it is a lot harder to land a guy like Melo then it is to land guys like Gallo and Chandler etc..

Denver basically has Gallo, Chandler, Mozgov, Lawson, our draft picks, added Iggy and Mcgee. Should I be expecting them to be chasing a championship?

true, superstars don't fall into anyone's lap at all.... so you have to be smart and patient on how you build your team... I keep hearing melo referred to as a superstar, well how is he any more of a star than amare? this is what I don't get.. we didn't get a superstar in amare, but a guy who at one time was playing near elite level ball, but not a superstar( and amare is one of my favorite players in the league)... we didn't get a superstar in melo either, but a guy who is a great streak scorer.... either way, the knicks gave up a lot and still didn't accomplish what dolan intended to do... I also keep hearing it is easy to replace gallo and chandler, but we have yet to find the young talent to replace these guys.... brewer, Jr smith, prigioni, and a host of 40 year old guys are not equal replacements.... we did get a mulligan with lin, but botched that one up....

Novak isn't a better shooter than Gallo and Shumpert isn't a potentially better all around player than Wilson Chandler?

Chuck I like Novak but you have to be fair Gallo is a much better player than Novak. Novak can shoot but once you defend his shot he cant do anything.

We don't need Novak to ISO, we just need him to space the floor and go around the occasional curl. Plus he doesn't flop!

Better all around player Gallo, but for our team, we don't need that.

Shooting wise it's no contest, Novak.

IrishKnickFan wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:Competitive basketball can be maintained for the next 6-7yrs.

We had that with the previous team except more flexibility

Not guranteed, but it could have been. Ironic you would be banking on the same PG and PF that you don't think will get it done today. The organization went in another direction so be it. You can cry over it or you can move on.

Im all for moving on from the past but you have to admit that we might have only 2-3 years to have very good seasons then its back to the drawing boards. also we havent exactly had a great history in the draft

Wasn't banking on Felton or Amar'e per say but was banking on maybe turning Felton/Amar'e and or picks/AR//Fields/Douglas/ into the missing/better pieces. We had a winning record despite all the injuries/trade rumors/unfamiliarity/new style of play. I also wanted the coach swapped out a long time ago not last year.

Don't even try and flip this either. It's the other way around. Most fans said the team was going nowhere which had Felton/Amar'e, therefore the team needed a facelift. It needed to STARFUDGE at all costs no matter what. I always begged to differ.

I was fine with the team going forward since they only played about 40gms together factoring injuries. I wanted more games played for an official data analysis and what the team looked like in the playoffs. Surely they could have accomplished getting swept by Boston 4-0. What do you think?

When Felton was traded he was being talked about something fierce. Matter of fact most fans were disgusted with Felton's point play because they felt he iced the kids out too much, playing patty cake with Amar'e in the PNR.

Amare was not going to be moved or turned into anything. Once he was signed he was a knick until his contract ran out so automatically there is a flaw in that plan. Gallo and Wilson were also going to be re-upped, Fields would look to be reupped the following yr. The team needed a superstar to put along side of Gallo, Wilson, Fields, Amare, Felton at eiher Center or SG as well as adding in more depth in order for it to be a championship calibre team. The odds of that superstar falling to the Knicks lap was slim to none. I'm guessing the Knicks org felt they can go for the superstar like Melo now and then look to find the Gallo, Wilson and Felton type pieces later on.

I'm guessing they felt it is a lot harder to land a guy like Melo then it is to land guys like Gallo and Chandler etc..

Denver basically has Gallo, Chandler, Mozgov, Lawson, our draft picks, added Iggy and Mcgee. Should I be expecting them to be chasing a championship?

true, superstars don't fall into anyone's lap at all.... so you have to be smart and patient on how you build your team... I keep hearing melo referred to as a superstar, well how is he any more of a star than amare? this is what I don't get.. we didn't get a superstar in amare, but a guy who at one time was playing near elite level ball, but not a superstar( and amare is one of my favorite players in the league)... we didn't get a superstar in melo either, but a guy who is a great streak scorer.... either way, the knicks gave up a lot and still didn't accomplish what dolan intended to do... I also keep hearing it is easy to replace gallo and chandler, but we have yet to find the young talent to replace these guys.... brewer, Jr smith, prigioni, and a host of 40 year old guys are not equal replacements.... we did get a mulligan with lin, but botched that one up....

Novak isn't a better shooter than Gallo and Shumpert isn't a potentially better all around player than Wilson Chandler?

Chuck I like Novak but you have to be fair Gallo is a much better player than Novak. Novak can shoot but once you defend his shot he cant do anything.

yea, chuck tried to pull one over on us.. he took the one trait novak has and tried to use it to prove his point.. for that matter, novak should be our starting SF, right, I mean he shoots better than carmelo hands down...

Felton - Is he really in shape now? Was his season with MDA a product of the system? He has a career .391 FG% and .350 3Pt FG%. Is that enough to give Iso ball a chance?
Kidd - He has lost a step or 2 last year. How much has he lost for this year? He is a crafty PG but he will get killed by the faster PGs similar to what Fisher was exposed to last year. I see Kidd playing a lot of SG and SF in a 3 guard set.
Pablo - He is the dark horse. Will his European game translate into the NBA? I have a feeling it will but he is also very old NBA wise.

If Woodson is smart, then he should really ration the minutes with these 3. If they falter, then it will be a very long year.

tkf wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:Competitive basketball can be maintained for the next 6-7yrs.

We had that with the previous team except more flexibility

Not guranteed, but it could have been. Ironic you would be banking on the same PG and PF that you don't think will get it done today. The organization went in another direction so be it. You can cry over it or you can move on.

Im all for moving on from the past but you have to admit that we might have only 2-3 years to have very good seasons then its back to the drawing boards. also we havent exactly had a great history in the draft

Wasn't banking on Felton or Amar'e per say but was banking on maybe turning Felton/Amar'e and or picks/AR//Fields/Douglas/ into the missing/better pieces. We had a winning record despite all the injuries/trade rumors/unfamiliarity/new style of play. I also wanted the coach swapped out a long time ago not last year.

Don't even try and flip this either. It's the other way around. Most fans said the team was going nowhere which had Felton/Amar'e, therefore the team needed a facelift. It needed to STARFUDGE at all costs no matter what. I always begged to differ.

I was fine with the team going forward since they only played about 40gms together factoring injuries. I wanted more games played for an official data analysis and what the team looked like in the playoffs. Surely they could have accomplished getting swept by Boston 4-0. What do you think?

When Felton was traded he was being talked about something fierce. Matter of fact most fans were disgusted with Felton's point play because they felt he iced the kids out too much, playing patty cake with Amar'e in the PNR.

Amare was not going to be moved or turned into anything. Once he was signed he was a knick until his contract ran out so automatically there is a flaw in that plan. Gallo and Wilson were also going to be re-upped, Fields would look to be reupped the following yr. The team needed a superstar to put along side of Gallo, Wilson, Fields, Amare, Felton at eiher Center or SG as well as adding in more depth in order for it to be a championship calibre team. The odds of that superstar falling to the Knicks lap was slim to none. I'm guessing the Knicks org felt they can go for the superstar like Melo now and then look to find the Gallo, Wilson and Felton type pieces later on.

I'm guessing they felt it is a lot harder to land a guy like Melo then it is to land guys like Gallo and Chandler etc..

Denver basically has Gallo, Chandler, Mozgov, Lawson, our draft picks, added Iggy and Mcgee. Should I be expecting them to be chasing a championship?

true, superstars don't fall into anyone's lap at all.... so you have to be smart and patient on how you build your team... I keep hearing melo referred to as a superstar, well how is he any more of a star than amare? this is what I don't get.. we didn't get a superstar in amare, but a guy who at one time was playing near elite level ball, but not a superstar( and amare is one of my favorite players in the league)... we didn't get a superstar in melo either, but a guy who is a great streak scorer.... either way, the knicks gave up a lot and still didn't accomplish what dolan intended to do... I also keep hearing it is easy to replace gallo and chandler, but we have yet to find the young talent to replace these guys.... brewer, Jr smith, prigioni, and a host of 40 year old guys are not equal replacements.... we did get a mulligan with lin, but botched that one up....

Novak isn't a better shooter than Gallo and Shumpert isn't a potentially better all around player than Wilson Chandler?

Chuck I like Novak but you have to be fair Gallo is a much better player than Novak. Novak can shoot but once you defend his shot he cant do anything.

We don't need Novak to ISO, we just need him to space the floor and go around the occasional curl. Plus he doesn't flop!

Better all around player Gallo, but for our team, we don't need that.

Shooting wise it's no contest, Novak.

ok, say that, but gallo isn't an iso player so I don't see your point.. and novak doesn't flop because he doesn't and can't defend at all...

I do see for team needs having novak, but honestly novak fits better with amare and guys like gallo and lin... but funny you talk about team needs and this brings us back to this point. we would never really need a novak had we not traded for carmelo, and we didn't need a carmelo moreso than a top flight PG... so you can understand why some of us are upset at the trade.. right.

our team didn't need melo.. the same way you feel we need novak over a guy like gallo....

back to my point again.. we still haven't replace chandler, and gallo with equal youth and talent... instead we are going after retreads like brewer and clowns like JR smith and his baby brother....who probably has no business being on this team.. again, such a circus environment, almost unprecedented....

Again, for this team Novak and Shumpert are better fits and by a landslide. Gallo is not a stretch 4 and doesn't shoot efficient enough from the 3 pt line to be a floor spacer which this team needs. Chandler is your prototypical tweener, too big and slow to play 2 guard, and not big enough some nights to play small forward. Shumpert isn't quite the scorer Wilson is yet, but defensively has bypassed him in his short time in the league. He checks everyone from Rose, Dwill, and Rondo all the way to Nowitzki.

So yes, looking at the team objectively, we have filled the talent appropriately. If Gallo and Chandler were still here instead of Novak and Shumpert, they would not thrive with the current team constructed.

Unless you bring up Mozgov, then yea we didn't replace shyt...

ChuckBuck wrote:

tkf wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:Competitive basketball can be maintained for the next 6-7yrs.

We had that with the previous team except more flexibility

Not guranteed, but it could have been. Ironic you would be banking on the same PG and PF that you don't think will get it done today. The organization went in another direction so be it. You can cry over it or you can move on.

Im all for moving on from the past but you have to admit that we might have only 2-3 years to have very good seasons then its back to the drawing boards. also we havent exactly had a great history in the draft

Wasn't banking on Felton or Amar'e per say but was banking on maybe turning Felton/Amar'e and or picks/AR//Fields/Douglas/ into the missing/better pieces. We had a winning record despite all the injuries/trade rumors/unfamiliarity/new style of play. I also wanted the coach swapped out a long time ago not last year.

Don't even try and flip this either. It's the other way around. Most fans said the team was going nowhere which had Felton/Amar'e, therefore the team needed a facelift. It needed to STARFUDGE at all costs no matter what. I always begged to differ.

I was fine with the team going forward since they only played about 40gms together factoring injuries. I wanted more games played for an official data analysis and what the team looked like in the playoffs. Surely they could have accomplished getting swept by Boston 4-0. What do you think?

When Felton was traded he was being talked about something fierce. Matter of fact most fans were disgusted with Felton's point play because they felt he iced the kids out too much, playing patty cake with Amar'e in the PNR.

Amare was not going to be moved or turned into anything. Once he was signed he was a knick until his contract ran out so automatically there is a flaw in that plan. Gallo and Wilson were also going to be re-upped, Fields would look to be reupped the following yr. The team needed a superstar to put along side of Gallo, Wilson, Fields, Amare, Felton at eiher Center or SG as well as adding in more depth in order for it to be a championship calibre team. The odds of that superstar falling to the Knicks lap was slim to none. I'm guessing the Knicks org felt they can go for the superstar like Melo now and then look to find the Gallo, Wilson and Felton type pieces later on.

I'm guessing they felt it is a lot harder to land a guy like Melo then it is to land guys like Gallo and Chandler etc..

Denver basically has Gallo, Chandler, Mozgov, Lawson, our draft picks, added Iggy and Mcgee. Should I be expecting them to be chasing a championship?

true, superstars don't fall into anyone's lap at all.... so you have to be smart and patient on how you build your team... I keep hearing melo referred to as a superstar, well how is he any more of a star than amare? this is what I don't get.. we didn't get a superstar in amare, but a guy who at one time was playing near elite level ball, but not a superstar( and amare is one of my favorite players in the league)... we didn't get a superstar in melo either, but a guy who is a great streak scorer.... either way, the knicks gave up a lot and still didn't accomplish what dolan intended to do... I also keep hearing it is easy to replace gallo and chandler, but we have yet to find the young talent to replace these guys.... brewer, Jr smith, prigioni, and a host of 40 year old guys are not equal replacements.... we did get a mulligan with lin, but botched that one up....

Novak isn't a better shooter than Gallo and Shumpert isn't a potentially better all around player than Wilson Chandler?

Chuck I like Novak but you have to be fair Gallo is a much better player than Novak. Novak can shoot but once you defend his shot he cant do anything.

We don't need Novak to ISO, we just need him to space the floor and go around the occasional curl. Plus he doesn't flop!

Better all around player Gallo, but for our team, we don't need that.

Shooting wise it's no contest, Novak.

ok, say that, but gallo isn't an iso player so I don't see your point.. and novak doesn't flop because he doesn't and can't defend at all...

I do see for team needs having novak, but honestly novak fits better with amare and guys like gallo and lin... but funny you talk about team needs and this brings us back to this point. we would never really need a novak had we not traded for carmelo, and we didn't need a carmelo moreso than a top flight PG... so you can understand why some of us are upset at the trade.. right.

our team didn't need melo.. the same way you feel we need novak over a guy like gallo....

back to my point again.. we still haven't replace chandler, and gallo with equal youth and talent... instead we are going after retreads like brewer and clowns like JR smith and his baby brother....who probably has no business being on this team.. again, such a circus environment, almost unprecedented....

Again, for this team Novak and Shumpert are better fits and by a landslide. Gallo is not a stretch 4 and doesn't shoot efficient enough from the 3 pt line to be a floor spacer which this team needs. Chandler is your prototypical tweener, too big and slow to play 2 guard, and not big enough some nights to play small forward. Shumpert isn't quite the scorer Wilson is yet, but defensively has bypassed him in his short time in the league. He checks everyone from Rose, Dwill, and Rondo all the way to Nowitzki.

So yes, looking at the team objectively, we have filled the talent appropriately. If Gallo and Chandler were still here instead of Novak and Shumpert, they would not thrive with the current team constructed.

Unless you bring up Mozgov, then yea we didn't replace shyt...

novak and shumpert are not replacing the positions that gallo and chandler played.. the truth is the knicks still don't have two players like gallo or chandler.. both can play multiple positions effectively, both can score and defend.... and gallo was an effective playmaker... we have not replaced that type of talent.. this is a convenient way to sidestep the point here.... this team lacks talented youth... NOVAK isn't that... shumpert is on the way, but again although a very good defender still hasn't given the production we got from the other two... but I like shump... and knicks have not really replaced what we lost...

That said, I think this team is specifically built to beat the Heat. Problem is, I am not sure how that translates to an 82 game season. I think there are critical flaws in our projected Starting Lineup because I am one of the people who thinks that the Melo/Stat combo does not complement each other. And there is no other shooter in the starting lineup that can make other teams pay. That's the problem with the Celtics comparisons -- we don't have Ray Allen. Best we can muster at the SG is JR Smith (who I like, but isn't quite the shooter that Allen is).

Best case scenario for the Knicks is that they emulate the 2004 Pistons. Find some team cohesion and play tough defense. I don't really care who "starts" but maybe 6 mins into the 1st quarter, put Felton and Amare on the bench for Kidd and Smith (Melo at PF) and let Melo-Ball do its thing... then a few mins into the 2nd quarter, Let Felton, Smith, Novak, Amare and Camby do some pick and roll offense for a bit.

I think this team can win, I just don't think its top 5 players belong on the court at the same time.