fishmike wrote:small sample size.

it would only be small if it was 6-18

SupremeCommander wrote:

fishmike wrote:small sample size.

are you talking about Jeremy Lin's stats?

Actually I was being sarcastic.

Both times.

ShellTopAdidas wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

ShellTopAdidas wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

fishmike wrote:why do you think I give Amare a pass? He had a crap year last year. Why do I give Melo more crap then him? I do think quitting on a coach (and your team) is the most indefensible thing in sports, and Melo did that. Thats my biggest knock on him here as a Knick.

Also the Knicks were terrible. Amare (yes I know we paid him) was willing to come here as FA when EVERY OTHER FA just used NY to get a better contract. He was the first.

Lets talk about what Amare added that year. We were a lottery team. In comes Amare and we are a playoff team. We also had BIG wins against elite teams that year so the Knicks were really making progres. Amare led the NBA in 4th qtr scoring. Amare was LEADING the young guys to wins that were not there in recent years. Yes, he broke down late (more bad timeing than anything else) and that really hurt. So my initial impression of Amare is positive.

We had one of the youngest teams in the NBA, with max cap space next offseason and things were good. Then Melo comes, forces a $20mm per extension and we cash out all our chips for Melo, a guy who hadnt won anything and had issues. We didnt get any better. A year later he kills Linsanity. We didnt win anymore games so my initial impression of Melo WAS NOT positive. The knocks on Melo (selfish, baby, pouts when doesnt get his way, fights with coach, not a standup guy) all followed him here. Painfully. Im waiting to be won over.

Its that simple man.

Bang - thats exactly it. THE COACH! You loved MDA, Amare was in the alliance, Melo was not - hence the one sided hate.

Melo quit on his coach? How do you know cause he said that they are working much harder for Woody? Duh!

Amare quit on his coach every play on the defensive end, did you not watch all those cordial invitations to the rim for the opposing team? They are still all over youtube if you care to take an excursion.

Amare did not do the knicks a favor by coming here, they did him a favor. Who else wanted him? Nobody! Not for that kind of cash. And even without giving up "our whole team" or even anyone, nobody wanted him. So were now the smart franchise and all others are the dumb ones?

Who wanted Melo? Who doesn't.

I will not forget how SVG said "enough about Dwight, how the hell are we gonna stop Carmello Anthony?" not "how are we going to stop Amare"

If you like the Melo trade or not, he did not make that trade, unless like the Lin situation, you or other perceive him as Denvers and our de facto GM.

I think the displaced bias in a large part comes down to the beloved MDA. That is your right but I don't necessarily agree.

Amere was a canidate for league MVP before the trade. You build around that, not blow it up!

That team and Amare was in decline - but that does not mean I agreed with "blowing up" the team. I am not sold either way on that (yet)

What's the point of giving your all if you know you about to get kicked to the curb? I wonder where OKC would be today if Dumblin was there owner 3 years ago? Smh!

Seriously dude - that was the dumbest post I have seen in a while.

And you are the Dumblin guy? Badge of Honor

mrKnickShot wrote:

ShellTopAdidas wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

ShellTopAdidas wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

fishmike wrote:why do you think I give Amare a pass? He had a crap year last year. Why do I give Melo more crap then him? I do think quitting on a coach (and your team) is the most indefensible thing in sports, and Melo did that. Thats my biggest knock on him here as a Knick.

Also the Knicks were terrible. Amare (yes I know we paid him) was willing to come here as FA when EVERY OTHER FA just used NY to get a better contract. He was the first.

Lets talk about what Amare added that year. We were a lottery team. In comes Amare and we are a playoff team. We also had BIG wins against elite teams that year so the Knicks were really making progres. Amare led the NBA in 4th qtr scoring. Amare was LEADING the young guys to wins that were not there in recent years. Yes, he broke down late (more bad timeing than anything else) and that really hurt. So my initial impression of Amare is positive.

We had one of the youngest teams in the NBA, with max cap space next offseason and things were good. Then Melo comes, forces a $20mm per extension and we cash out all our chips for Melo, a guy who hadnt won anything and had issues. We didnt get any better. A year later he kills Linsanity. We didnt win anymore games so my initial impression of Melo WAS NOT positive. The knocks on Melo (selfish, baby, pouts when doesnt get his way, fights with coach, not a standup guy) all followed him here. Painfully. Im waiting to be won over.

Its that simple man.

Bang - thats exactly it. THE COACH! You loved MDA, Amare was in the alliance, Melo was not - hence the one sided hate.

Melo quit on his coach? How do you know cause he said that they are working much harder for Woody? Duh!

Amare quit on his coach every play on the defensive end, did you not watch all those cordial invitations to the rim for the opposing team? They are still all over youtube if you care to take an excursion.

Amare did not do the knicks a favor by coming here, they did him a favor. Who else wanted him? Nobody! Not for that kind of cash. And even without giving up "our whole team" or even anyone, nobody wanted him. So were now the smart franchise and all others are the dumb ones?

Who wanted Melo? Who doesn't.

I will not forget how SVG said "enough about Dwight, how the hell are we gonna stop Carmello Anthony?" not "how are we going to stop Amare"

If you like the Melo trade or not, he did not make that trade, unless like the Lin situation, you or other perceive him as Denvers and our de facto GM.

I think the displaced bias in a large part comes down to the beloved MDA. That is your right but I don't necessarily agree.

Amere was a canidate for league MVP before the trade. You build around that, not blow it up!

That team and Amare was in decline - but that does not mean I agreed with "blowing up" the team. I am not sold either way on that (yet)

What's the point of giving your all if you know you about to get kicked to the curb? I wonder where OKC would be today if Dumblin was there owner 3 years ago? Smh!

Seriously dude - that was the dumbest post I have seen in a while.

And you are the Dumblin guy? Badge of Honor

If your learn you might be laid off or your firm purchased by some other company in the next 3 weeks there's a good chance your work performance is going to be subpar until you know what the deal is. Like that.

fishmike wrote:

ShellTopAdidas wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

fishmike wrote:why do you think I give Amare a pass? He had a crap year last year. Why do I give Melo more crap then him? I do think quitting on a coach (and your team) is the most indefensible thing in sports, and Melo did that. Thats my biggest knock on him here as a Knick.

Also the Knicks were terrible. Amare (yes I know we paid him) was willing to come here as FA when EVERY OTHER FA just used NY to get a better contract. He was the first.

Lets talk about what Amare added that year. We were a lottery team. In comes Amare and we are a playoff team. We also had BIG wins against elite teams that year so the Knicks were really making progres. Amare led the NBA in 4th qtr scoring. Amare was LEADING the young guys to wins that were not there in recent years. Yes, he broke down late (more bad timeing than anything else) and that really hurt. So my initial impression of Amare is positive.

We had one of the youngest teams in the NBA, with max cap space next offseason and things were good. Then Melo comes, forces a $20mm per extension and we cash out all our chips for Melo, a guy who hadnt won anything and had issues. We didnt get any better. A year later he kills Linsanity. We didnt win anymore games so my initial impression of Melo WAS NOT positive. The knocks on Melo (selfish, baby, pouts when doesnt get his way, fights with coach, not a standup guy) all followed him here. Painfully. Im waiting to be won over.

Its that simple man.

Bang - thats exactly it. THE COACH! You loved MDA, Amare was in the alliance, Melo was not - hence the one sided hate.

Melo quit on his coach? How do you know cause he said that they are working much harder for Woody? Duh!

Amare quit on his coach every play on the defensive end, did you not watch all those cordial invitations to the rim for the opposing team? They are still all over youtube if you care to take an excursion.

Amare did not do the knicks a favor by coming here, they did him a favor. Who else wanted him? Nobody! Not for that kind of cash. And even without giving up "our whole team" or even anyone, nobody wanted him. So were now the smart franchise and all others are the dumb ones?

Who wanted Melo? Who doesn't.

I will not forget how SVG said "enough about Dwight, how the hell are we gonna stop Carmello Anthony?" not "how are we going to stop Amare"

If you like the Melo trade or not, he did not make that trade, unless like the Lin situation, you or other perceive him as Denvers and our de facto GM.

I think the displaced bias in a large part comes down to the beloved MDA. That is your right but I don't necessarily agree.

Amere was a canidate for league MVP before the trade. You build around that, not blow it up!

ancient history. Not sure if you reaized but Amare is done. Its true... lots of Melo fans here say so!

Amare might not be done but he shouldnt get a pass. The guy was even more out of shape then melo at the start of the season. I thought we had multiple stars but its OK for Amare to be invisible

mrKnickShot wrote:

fishmike wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

ShellTopAdidas wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

ShellTopAdidas wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

fishmike wrote:why do you think I give Amare a pass? He had a crap year last year. Why do I give Melo more crap then him? I do think quitting on a coach (and your team) is the most indefensible thing in sports, and Melo did that. Thats my biggest knock on him here as a Knick.

Also the Knicks were terrible. Amare (yes I know we paid him) was willing to come here as FA when EVERY OTHER FA just used NY to get a better contract. He was the first.

Lets talk about what Amare added that year. We were a lottery team. In comes Amare and we are a playoff team. We also had BIG wins against elite teams that year so the Knicks were really making progres. Amare led the NBA in 4th qtr scoring. Amare was LEADING the young guys to wins that were not there in recent years. Yes, he broke down late (more bad timeing than anything else) and that really hurt. So my initial impression of Amare is positive.

We had one of the youngest teams in the NBA, with max cap space next offseason and things were good. Then Melo comes, forces a $20mm per extension and we cash out all our chips for Melo, a guy who hadnt won anything and had issues. We didnt get any better. A year later he kills Linsanity. We didnt win anymore games so my initial impression of Melo WAS NOT positive. The knocks on Melo (selfish, baby, pouts when doesnt get his way, fights with coach, not a standup guy) all followed him here. Painfully. Im waiting to be won over.

Its that simple man.

Bang - thats exactly it. THE COACH! You loved MDA, Amare was in the alliance, Melo was not - hence the one sided hate.

Melo quit on his coach? How do you know cause he said that they are working much harder for Woody? Duh!

Amare quit on his coach every play on the defensive end, did you not watch all those cordial invitations to the rim for the opposing team? They are still all over youtube if you care to take an excursion.

Amare did not do the knicks a favor by coming here, they did him a favor. Who else wanted him? Nobody! Not for that kind of cash. And even without giving up "our whole team" or even anyone, nobody wanted him. So were now the smart franchise and all others are the dumb ones?

Who wanted Melo? Who doesn't.

I will not forget how SVG said "enough about Dwight, how the hell are we gonna stop Carmello Anthony?" not "how are we going to stop Amare"

If you like the Melo trade or not, he did not make that trade, unless like the Lin situation, you or other perceive him as Denvers and our de facto GM.

I think the displaced bias in a large part comes down to the beloved MDA. That is your right but I don't necessarily agree.

Amere was a canidate for league MVP before the trade. You build around that, not blow it up!

That team and Amare was in decline - but that does not mean I agreed with "blowing up" the team. I am not sold either way on that (yet)

What's the point of giving your all if you know you about to get kicked to the curb? I wonder where OKC would be today if Dumblin was there owner 3 years ago? Smh!

Seriously dude - that was the dumbest post I have seen in a while.

And you are the Dumblin guy? Badge of Honor

I think his point is simply the team started to decline when the Melo rumors started. In those couple of weeks leading up to it you saw a clear decline in play. More human nature than a conscious thought to not play as hard.

If your learn you might be laid off or your firm purchased by some other company in the next 3 weeks there's a good chance your work performance is going to be subpar until you know what the deal is. Like that.

So is that what you believe? Thats why Amare's play declined? C'mon - you don't really believe that do you?

mrKnickShot wrote:
Melo sucked under MDA (this year).

Everyone sucked under MDA this year.

Your point?

Tyson Chandler won Defensive Player of the Year for his 24 games under Woodson and not any of the 42 games under D'Antoni?

Novak? Jeffries? Lin? Shumpert?

Knicks had their best defensive stretch in 12 years... under D'Antoni. First time they'd held 9 straight opponents under 100pts. Under MDA, not Woodson.

Thing about that best defensive stretch in 12 years... Amar'e and Melo were out.

You can slam D'Antoni or even Lin as much as you want, but the fact remains - the Knicks were underwhelming this year under D'Antoni because of Amar'e playing weird or hurt and Melo admitting that he wasn't trying his hardest for D'Antoni.

The problems this team will face next year are still going to be all about Melo and Amar'e meshing on the floor - which Woodson did not figure out (nor did MDA, obv).

It's also going to be about Melo and Amar'e giving a consistently high level defensive effort.

You can blame MDA all you want, but the two biggest problems with the Knicks are coming back next year and for two more years after that at a combined salary of $130M. They are problems that can be fixed, but let's be honest about what the real problems with the Knicks are. Amar'e and Melo.

mrKnickShot wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:
Melo sucked under MDA (this year).

Everyone sucked under MDA this year.

Your point?

Tyson Chandler won Defensive Player of the Year for his 24 games under Woodson and not any of the 42 games under D'Antoni?

Novak? Jeffries? Lin? Shumpert?

Knicks had their best defensive stretch in 12 years... under D'Antoni. First time they'd held 9 straight opponents under 100pts. Under MDA, not Woodson.

Thing about that best defensive stretch in 12 years... Amar'e and Melo were out.

You can slam D'Antoni or even Lin as much as you want, but the fact remains - the Knicks were underwhelming this year under D'Antoni because of Amar'e playing weird or hurt and Melo admitting that he wasn't trying his hardest for D'Antoni.

The problems this team will face next year are still going to be all about Melo and Amar'e meshing on the floor - which Woodson did not figure out (nor did MDA, obv).

It's also going to be about Melo and Amar'e giving a consistently high level defensive effort.

You can blame MDA all you want, but the two biggest problems with the Knicks are coming back next year and for two more years after that at a combined salary of $130M. They are problems that can be fixed, but let's be honest about what the real problems with the Knicks are. Amar'e and Melo.

When did you switch sides? So fickle?

huh? I've been saying Melo and Amar'e's defense is the main hurdle since before you started posting here.

people who say "they were never going to get past Miami with Lin." or "they were never going to get past Miami with D'Antoni."... might be right.

but, they're never going to get past Miami unless Amar'e and Melo commit to defending game in and game out. and history shows they don't have the taste for that sort of thing. i hope they can change career long habits, but i'm not gonna hold my breath.