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Do Carmelo and Stoudemire LIKE playing together?
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misterearl
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1/17/2012  9:09 AM    LAST EDITED: 1/17/2012  9:12 AM
Durzoblint: "Am I the only one to notice that in the fourth, once Melo and Chandler came back in, Amare never touched the rock again until less than 2minutes to go! Well, he touched it once, going for an offensive rebound. DumdumDouglas seemed allergic to passing to Amare and only gave it up to Melo. That is when he wasn't running in circles (passing to no one) until late in the clock when he'd force feed it to "Jarad!"

The supporting cast is out of balance.

If Carmelo and Amar'e do not set the example and share the ball with each other - with the goal of getting closer to the rim - no one will. Unless the Knicks learn to share shot attempts, the declining numbers of the supporting cast will struggle to duplicate last years production. From Fields to Toney Douglas, everyone's productivity (shooting pct) is down, significantly.

Fewer attempts in the flow + less rhythm = less confidence.

For example, Toney Douglas has attempted more three point shots (55) than the total shot attempts for Tyson Chandler (52). You want layups or three point attempts?

If Baron Davis can sort this out and bring balance then HE deserves to be a max salary player.

once a knick always a knick
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nyk4ever
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1/17/2012  9:24 AM
colombian0725 wrote:I'll post it again


Wait a max contract player that cannot create for him self? what? why? he is such a prolific scorer huh. So we have a Max contract player that needs a point guard to score points. So your saying a max player that can't create for himself, rebound or defend. Holy crap man. We sure know how to pick em.

we had to give amear the max to come here. this isn't about amear. he is who he is and he's always been that way. the fact is, PG is the most important position in basketball. you need a guy who can set the offense up, manage ego's on the floor and just be a floor-general. we don't have that guy right now and what happens when you don't have that guy? basically our "offense" right now is what happens. as earl would say "it ain't that deep." even jordan and pippen needed a ron harper to be on the floor with them to keep everyone happy. shumpert is doing an admirable job filling in at the point and i wanna bold that FILLING IN but make no mistake about it, he's not a PG. that is our problem and that will remain our problem until either baron comes back or we go out and get one.

"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
franco12
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1/17/2012  9:44 AM
nyk4ever wrote:
colombian0725 wrote:I'll post it again


Wait a max contract player that cannot create for him self? what? why? he is such a prolific scorer huh. So we have a Max contract player that needs a point guard to score points. So your saying a max player that can't create for himself, rebound or defend. Holy crap man. We sure know how to pick em.

we had to give amear the max to come here. this isn't about amear. he is who he is and he's always been that way. the fact is, PG is the most important position in basketball. you need a guy who can set the offense up, manage ego's on the floor and just be a floor-general. we don't have that guy right now and what happens when you don't have that guy? basically our "offense" right now is what happens. as earl would say "it ain't that deep." even jordan and pippen needed a ron harper to be on the floor with them to keep everyone happy. shumpert is doing an admirable job filling in at the point and i wanna bold that FILLING IN but make no mistake about it, he's not a PG. that is our problem and that will remain our problem until either baron comes back or we go out and get one.

I disagree with this PG is the most important position thing.

Look at the teams that win championships, and typically, you have the single best player carrying everything home.

Phil Jackson has won with PGs that probably wouldn't be able to start on any other team they played against- because he had MJ, Kobe and Shaq.

Who was the starting PG on the Heat last year, and the year they won it all back in 2006?

I tend to think this team, however things may fit together, or not, has the talent to win.

Maybe not a championship, but certainly more than they lose.

Question is - can the coach get them there.

colombian0725
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1/17/2012  9:59 AM    LAST EDITED: 1/17/2012  10:00 AM
franco12 wrote:
nyk4ever wrote:
colombian0725 wrote:I'll post it again


Wait a max contract player that cannot create for him self? what? why? he is such a prolific scorer huh. So we have a Max contract player that needs a point guard to score points. So your saying a max player that can't create for himself, rebound or defend. Holy crap man. We sure know how to pick em.

we had to give amear the max to come here. this isn't about amear. he is who he is and he's always been that way. the fact is, PG is the most important position in basketball. you need a guy who can set the offense up, manage ego's on the floor and just be a floor-general. we don't have that guy right now and what happens when you don't have that guy? basically our "offense" right now is what happens. as earl would say "it ain't that deep." even jordan and pippen needed a ron harper to be on the floor with them to keep everyone happy. shumpert is doing an admirable job filling in at the point and i wanna bold that FILLING IN but make no mistake about it, he's not a PG. that is our problem and that will remain our problem until either baron comes back or we go out and get one.

I disagree with this PG is the most important position thing.

Look at the teams that win championships, and typically, you have the single best player carrying everything home.

Phil Jackson has won with PGs that probably wouldn't be able to start on any other team they played against- because he had MJ, Kobe and Shaq.

Who was the starting PG on the Heat last year, and the year they won it all back in 2006?

I tend to think this team, however things may fit together, or not, has the talent to win.

Maybe not a championship, but certainly more than they lose.

Question is - can the coach get them there.


Yup. I'll say it again. Amare is a Max player that does not create his own shot. He does not Defend or rebound. He gives up layups and dunks that he should contest.

nyk4ever
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1/17/2012  10:23 AM
franco12 wrote:
nyk4ever wrote:
colombian0725 wrote:I'll post it again


Wait a max contract player that cannot create for him self? what? why? he is such a prolific scorer huh. So we have a Max contract player that needs a point guard to score points. So your saying a max player that can't create for himself, rebound or defend. Holy crap man. We sure know how to pick em.

we had to give amear the max to come here. this isn't about amear. he is who he is and he's always been that way. the fact is, PG is the most important position in basketball. you need a guy who can set the offense up, manage ego's on the floor and just be a floor-general. we don't have that guy right now and what happens when you don't have that guy? basically our "offense" right now is what happens. as earl would say "it ain't that deep." even jordan and pippen needed a ron harper to be on the floor with them to keep everyone happy. shumpert is doing an admirable job filling in at the point and i wanna bold that FILLING IN but make no mistake about it, he's not a PG. that is our problem and that will remain our problem until either baron comes back or we go out and get one.

I disagree with this PG is the most important position thing.

Look at the teams that win championships, and typically, you have the single best player carrying everything home.

Phil Jackson has won with PGs that probably wouldn't be able to start on any other team they played against- because he had MJ, Kobe and Shaq.

Who was the starting PG on the Heat last year, and the year they won it all back in 2006?

I tend to think this team, however things may fit together, or not, has the talent to win.

Maybe not a championship, but certainly more than they lose.

Question is - can the coach get them there.

you are totally missing the point about pg's. did you read anything i said after that? all of the pg's that phil jackson had were exactly what I described. heady, floor-generals who knew how to set the pace of a game and distributed the ball well. there is no question that having that big alpha dog scorer is extremely important, but the guy can't orchestrate without the pg. i'm a firm believer in this.

"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
Nalod
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1/17/2012  10:23 AM

The real problem as I might see it is the pick and role is going more to Tyson (I have read this somewhere) and amare is getting like 3 less per game.

With Tyson making picks also it reduces some where and tear on Amare.

But,

The flow of the offense is not moving for him.

It seems once we lose the advantage on a break Melo goes into Isolation mode and spacing becomes an issue for Amare.

If he is shooting more jumpers then his % is bound to drop. Once he puts the ball on the floor in traffic its a turn over machine.

I have not looked at the stats but he seems to be rebounding well, but if his time on the floor is limited because of foul trouble his stats will suffer.

Trading players is not the simple answer. Who is the proper PF in his place? Jorts?

colombian0725
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1/17/2012  10:32 AM
Non shot creating, non rebounding, zero defense super star? Everyone want's to make an excuse for Amare. Why is it that our max player cannot create his own shot, rebound and play defense no one see's him as our biggest problem on this team.
Bonn1997
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1/17/2012  11:00 AM    LAST EDITED: 1/17/2012  11:01 AM
nyk4ever wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:To my brain, it's not a question of whether they like playing with each other or not, it's whether they are willing to try; whether they understand that both will be affected and that there will be some pain in the process of learning to coexist. And this, they are willing. So this is a strong sign.

They are willing? It looks to me like Carmelo is the offense and Amare's job is to just get out of the way or at times force a shot up.

well then you're not paying enough attention. if you know anything about amears career, he's always been a player who worked well in the 7seconds or less. amear is at his best when the team is out on the break. sure he can hit that 15footer but that's not really his game. his game is fast-paced and right now there is absolutely no pg-play, which means no 7seconds or less and no set offense period.


You started with "you're not paying enough attention" but nothing you said contradicts what I said. (And I actually agree with what you said.)
misterearl
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1/17/2012  11:00 AM
Sitting In The Directors Chair, The Answer Man Calls For A Stunt Man

Q. Nalod - Who is the proper PF in his place?

A. You need a forward with outside range who can handle the ball effectively in traffic. That player must have a durable frame to take hits and the hops of a gazelle to defend the new breed of flexible flyers at the four. He needs to be fearless enough to dunk on anyone. He needs to be unselfish, unassuming and have a tiny ego. Preferred age? Under 28. He also needs to be ACQUIRABLE, and not some wet fantasy imaginary friend.

Wilson Chandler

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Nalod
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1/17/2012  11:07 AM
misterearl wrote:Sitting In The Directors Chair, The Answer Man Calls For A Stunt Man

Q. Nalod - Who is the proper PF in his place?

A. You need a forward with outside range who can handle the ball effectively in traffic. That player must have a durable frame to take hits and the hops of a gazelle to defend the new breed of flexible flyers at the four. He needs to be fearless enough to dunk on anyone. He needs to be unselfish, unassuming and have a tiny ego. Preferred age? Under 28. He also needs to be ACQUIRABLE, and not some wet fantasy imaginary friend.

Wilson Chandler

Im responding to the "trade amare" cries of instant gradification.

Shy Wil would/was nice in the system.

DLee not bad either. He played Center here.

Was a double-Double machine who played light defense as an undersized 5 to stay in the game. Put him next to Tyson and he don't have to.

Anyway, its done. They gone. We are who we are.

I know we supposed to move forward as fans.

Seems like the Knicks need also.

colombian0725
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1/17/2012  11:16 AM
misterearl wrote:Sitting In The Directors Chair, The Answer Man Calls For A Stunt Man

Q. Nalod - Who is the proper PF in his place?

A. You need a forward with outside range who can handle the ball effectively in traffic. That player must have a durable frame to take hits and the hops of a gazelle to defend the new breed of flexible flyers at the four. He needs to be fearless enough to dunk on anyone. He needs to be unselfish, unassuming and have a tiny ego. Preferred age? Under 28. He also needs to be ACQUIRABLE, and not some wet fantasy imaginary friend.

Wilson Chandler

We need a PF who can rebound and play better defense than Amare. A decent post up game(More than Amare). We know he isn't going to be better than Amare scoring wise but the trade would likely include a pg or shooting guard in return.

misterearl
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1/17/2012  11:21 AM    LAST EDITED: 1/17/2012  11:21 AM
whachootalkinboutWilis?

columbian0725 - criteria is one thing.

Naming a desirable and acquirable candidate for the job is another.

once a knick always a knick
RonRon
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1/17/2012  12:31 PM
colombian0725 wrote:
misterearl wrote:Sitting In The Directors Chair, The Answer Man Calls For A Stunt Man

Q. Nalod - Who is the proper PF in his place?

A. You need a forward with outside range who can handle the ball effectively in traffic. That player must have a durable frame to take hits and the hops of a gazelle to defend the new breed of flexible flyers at the four. He needs to be fearless enough to dunk on anyone. He needs to be unselfish, unassuming and have a tiny ego. Preferred age? Under 28. He also needs to be ACQUIRABLE, and not some wet fantasy imaginary friend.

Wilson Chandler

We need a PF who can rebound and play better defense than Amare. A decent post up game(More than Amare). We know he isn't going to be better than Amare scoring wise but the trade would likely include a pg or shooting guard in return.

I think we need a combination of players. The truth is we have no identity or system, but we are missing a lot of talent on our roster.
What I am trying to say is our players do not mesh, they are not very skilled, and 1 player will not change that.
Do we have no system because we have bad coaching or because we don't have enough skilled players needed that would work better than the "iso system"?
Did we see TD, Iman, and Melo passing the ball back n forth in the 4th quarter?
They did NOTHING vs the zone, that is when Jorts should have came in, to break the zone.
In general teams prefer to have 2 players that can penetrate, 2 post players, and at least 3 shooters.

Look at our lineup.... btw TD only penetrated because Jammer Nelson and Redick aren't good defenders, and TD hit a couple of shots early, playing with confidence.


Iman he handles the ball a lot better than TD, he gives is slightly later then TD but he has generate the offense more and better, instead of giving the ball to Melo
he single handly steals the ball, giving us momentum and earning easy baskets, has been playing under better control but he seems to have lost some
confidence/swagger in the process. His shot is suppose to be suspect, but he is our 2nd best shooter in the starting lineup, he should 3/4th option.

Fields he does a little of everything, rebounding, assist, steals, pts, but he hasn't been able to find his shot. With Tyson Chandler not being a threat for a shot
and now Amare taking a big step back from last year and previous years with his shot, that only leaves possibly 3 shooters on the floor. At SG position
we need a good 3point shooter, ability to penetrate, and a good defender

Melo is our ball handler, post player, 3 point shooter, rebounder, and its surprising he actually improved, willing, and still capable to play defense on top of
everything else he does. We never know how he is going to score and he is our only POST option on the whole roster. He takes a lot of bad shots but is capable of
hitting them, he takes so many shots its hard for his team mates to get in rhythm. Also if he is the post player, ideally, we should have 3 other shooters on the floor
with him to spread the floor. As many points he puts up, he is a ball stopper. While when he does give up the ball, the team is not capable of getting a good look/shot
lot of the times because of our inability to have 2 players aside from Melo to penetrate. He is taking too many 3pointers and like Lebron, should try to try not to
take the bad 3point shots and post up a lot more. Problem is he has the handle the ball a lot and he can not get good position because of it.

Amare is looking more lost everything I watch him. I think we have to bench Amare and start Jorts when we can. He just doesn't box out, fight for position, and gives up
position *all of the above on both ends*. He also does not give effort for defense. He not only doesn't mesh well with Melo but is horrible combo for Tyson Chandler.
Defensively, JJ looks 10x better than him, even though Ryan Anderson hit like 4 shots while JJ tried to contest them. He is suppose to be our 4th best shooter and be
able to be a threat a step away from the free throw line. With Amare not playing defense the way he doe, unable to hit a free throw distance shot consistently, and
unable to create his own shot or for other. He is completely useless right now, he needs to develop a post up game, at least for position.

Chandler He played great defense vs Dwight Howard yesterday, when Dwight Howard sets the pick which is almost impossible ,most of the time, for the defender to get through.
However, if he comes out, Dwight Howard is going to go in and NO ONE is going to be able to be able to stop him when he rolls after the pick.

RonRon
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1/17/2012  1:03 PM
Notes as team
==============

We can not afford to switch whenever a pick is set. Sometimes we are forced to do so, however, as a team, we can not let the offense to easily create a mismatch
whenever they want. We have to stop taking many 3pointers, because we are not hitting them at a good %.


Baron Davis - even if Baron Davis comes back healthy, we do not have the shooters we had last year to spread the floor. It would greatly help to have Iman and Baron Davis capable of penetrating. Baron Davis is capable of running the pick and roll and can create good shots, especially for cutters and alley hoops for Tyson Chandler and whoever.
He has the the respect and ability to say NO to Melo and Amare, whenever they want an ISO. He has the tools to generate our offense, while he also can
post up, shoot the 3point shot, pull up for mid range, and is easily our best passer. He is deceptive of the dribble and capable of penetrating and finishing it strongly.

TD - he looked a lot more comfortable yesterday. He penetrated many times and didn't pick up his dribble. However, I am not sure if he was only able to this because of the bad
defense that Nelson or Duhon, especially when he has barely done it all year. I am pretty sure, the scouting report against us, will say that our guards aren't capable of penetrating.
He took a couple of bad shots and missed a couple of good looks. It is nice to see him get some confidence back but he should not take any bad shots unless the shot clock is running
out. Although he no longer is or should be considered to be the starting PG, he is very important to our team. He needs to find back his role and comfort zone he had last year.

Jorts - he is the PF/C version of Shawne Williams, this year. I think he needs to play a little bit more, as we have a lack of shooters to spread the floor. He does not have the speed, quickness, or handle to take his man of the dribble like Ryan Anderson/Dirk if his man comes flying out not giving him the shot. I look for him to get better next year, while I don't know if he wants to lose too much weight. While it would help his mobility, to play center, the extra strength and weight could be used to help him.

JJ - in general he looks great defensively. He also doesn't look as small when he doesn't have to play Center now, he actually looks pretty big/quick for his size.
Whether he is paired with Jorts or Tyson Chandler, he seems to be a good fit with his speed and defense. I don't think he would fit with Amare though, he would clog up the lane
if paired with Amare and both would be poor rebounders, shot blockers, and defense because both players are not ideal to play center. I hate to say this but he plays right,
boxes out, and is a better pairing for the team and Tyson Chandler to start over Amare.

Balkman - I think he should play more, as he is probably our best SF, defensively. His 3point threat is keeping him from playing, as he is not a shooting threat, and he has to take those shots, when he is open regardless to make our defenders play him honest.

Novak/Walker - while Novak is a shooting threat, he does not have another ability. If he isn't open, he moves the ball, as the defender will not GIVE HIM a wide open shot. However, he can not penetrate or put the ball on the floor when his defender doesn't give him the shot. Novak might get more minutes when Baron Davis is back to spread the floor.

Walker can light it up at times and has decent size, and athletic ability. He looks really clumsy and needs work on coordination, while he gives effort on defense, he gives a lot of bone headed fouls. Neither is capable of playing the SG, ideally, and I think we need to decide between 1 of the 2, to free up a roster spot. Both are more comfortable at the SF and there just wont be much minutes with Melo playing.
Devin Green should get a call back, to play the SG/SF that Walker gets the minutes at, especially at the SG position.

Bibby - right now we don't have the luxury of playing him on most nights, as we need the PG to be able to use speed/quickness to penetrate. At his age, he just can no longer to that or stay in front of his man on defense. Unless we have a player like Odom, that can play point/forward and have a player like Iman at the SG to penetrate, I don't think he should be playing. Jeremy Lin should get a good look and chance to play his minutes.

RonRon
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1/17/2012  2:08 PM
I think Amare has a tough time adjusting to Melo and Tyson Chandler.
His weakness, flaws, and holes in his game is exposed, with his defense and choosing not to put a body on his man. However, it isn't fair to just blame Amare,
everyone has fault and seems to be in a funk. It is infectious, on a 10 point scale, we are playing at about 1-2 our of 10, prior to yesterdays game. While there are individual faults, there are team faults as well. The coaching staff and players must acknowledge this, point it out, and fix it. Each assistant coach should be keeping an eye on 2 players or so, ready to use film to illustrate it out while fi but our whole team has been exposed, the lack of skills, speed, penetration, and shooters to spread the floor consistently.
This is clearly a work in progress and when we play at our best, we are capable of competing with our best 5-7. However, we are not close to where we want to be
offensively and defensively. We have to keep our heads up, continue to work, continue to learn, and continue to play. Although defense is probably our stronger area
vs our recent offense, since our 4 game winning streak, they are clearly things that we do wrong, bad, and some could be changed.
We haven't adjusted to our weakness and answered the scouts/coaches. We are willing to shoot 30 3pointers and capable of only hitting 10 of them.
Our opponents are ready to counter this and score many points of the fast break, before the rest of our our defense and Tyson Chandler are set.

Lets start with our the play on both ends with our guards, or lack of. Our defense problems starts with our guards. In all fairness, the only guard
that stay in front of his man Iman. TD and Bibby are our 1st line of defense that breaks down too easily. I was very surprised Bibby got the start vs OKC but at his age.
He probably has a shot to guard a handful of players in the league. However, TD has no reason to play the defense he does, fail, and continue it on daily basis.
He should have learned by the summer at least, exactly the difference between the way he plays defense vs Anthony Carter. He is suppose to be a gym rat and all he
does is train in the gym. He has the heart, is missing that confidence, with the rest of our team right now. He has to figure out his role, fix the way he plays defense, and
continue to get back confidence in his game, especially with his shot. We are very much missing the the floor spacing and 3 point shooting, to go with that penetration.
It wasn't shown last year how missed Gallo, Wilson Chandler, and Felton's 3 point shooting because TD, Shawne Williams, to go with Melo, shot the ball extremely well.

When they got that sudden surge of confidence last year, TD was one of leagues best 3point shooters. TD, Shawne Williams, and Melo all stepped up big time,
for the loss of Gallo, Wilson Chandler, and Felton. TD was a big unexpected hero, he should continue that role and confidence he found in himself last year.
He lacks confidence in general, as he puts a lot of pressure on himself. Dantoni gave him the job at starting PG because he was the veteran in SSOL
and it was a clear mistake. Majority of us here knew from the start, it wasn't the strengths of his game. Now he has plays very limited minutes, mainly
because of his bad play of DEF, mixed with inability to penetrate or facilitate. Adjusting back to another role, while regaining that confidence, would be a
big difference maker for us but he has to tell the difference between a good shot and a bad one. He is a player that needs to get in rhythm before
he starts hoisting up those 3's. Getting a layup, or driving and getting an assist, or pulling up for a free throw shot. When he brings is A+ game,
he can be a great player of the bench. He has to continue to work on his strengths and weaknesses but he can be a vital player and has the skills to do it.
Playing the starting PG, was the completely opposite mindset, I hope the coaches and TD himself, realizes and adds to his arsenal.
With a consistent mid range pull up game, a floater, and after he starts hitting a couple of shots, defenders will come out and guard him.
It would help his game with penetration when his defenders are on their toes, catching them jumping, and forcing help defenders to help.

Fields still can not adapt to the ISO plays ,like Amare, is suffering from the lack of penetration, uptempo basketball, shooters to spread the floor, lack of ball movement and he has lost that confidence. He did well pre Melo because of the above reasons and he was the 5th option or 4th at best. The scouts, clearly know he doesn't have the ability to penetrate, like almost all of our players. If our opponents aren't guarding any of our team as if they can not penetrate, it really limits our moves.
Every time he gets the ball, he usually stands by the 3 point line, where he will pump fake. But NO ONE is falling for it, he just allows his defender to
come back to recover while standing close enough to jump out at him but not usually close enough so Fields can blow by his man. He is playing the same style that he once played
with the PRE Melo Knicks, without the cuts, and crashing the boards because he would limit Melo's moves, drawing an extra defender. He is unable to find his 3point shot, which
is very much needed to space the floor.

Of course he is missing the play of true PG to get him the ball where he wants, get him started, and rolling.
Amare does not use his body to box out, he always wants to JUMP for the rebound, but what happens when penetration comes to him or Tyson Chandler?
Amare does nothing if he has to leave his position where he feels he can jump for the rebound or majority of the time, Tyson Chandler helps.
When Tyson Chandler leaves his man, now 2 guys have position near the rim with no one with a body on them.
That is basketball 101, if scouts/coaches/players all know this, they will continue to use it against us.
Especially when TD and Bibby are in, our players and coach have to realize what our opponents are doing and teach them how to stop it.

Baron Davis could help us out a lot but in a lineup of

Baron Davis
Iman
Melo
Amare
Tyson Chandler

we do not have the shooters needed to spread the floor. Amare is not a post player and has been able to find his shot. I think we seriously have to consider making him our 6th man.
I think staring JJ would help our defense with Chandler, especially Amare plays defense. Or starting Jorts would give us a better identity, spacing, and system, as we would have 4 players capable of hitting the 3point shot.

Amare brought us back last year, however, Felton, Gallo, and Wilson Chandler, complimented Amare very well and deserves a lot more credit. We have no identity this year or partly because our players don't compliment each other well. If Melo is going to play that "Iso System", we should build the team more like the Sixers when Allen Iverson went to the finals.
With STRONG REBOUNDERS, great DEFENDERS/hustle players, and some tweaks. At the 4/5 we would probably do better with a combination of ELITE defenders, a slightly younger KG would
be perfect with Chandler.

Baron Davis
Delfino
Melo
KG
Chandler

Iman
Dooling/Pargo
Pietrus
Jorts
Ak47 / Camby
JJ
Balkman

misterearl
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1/17/2012  2:20 PM
(the Cliff Notes version)

First, let us cease painting our roster as individual. How do they compliment one another? They are obvious skill set flaws that must be considered beyond the "like" factor.

Rotation Quality Players

Baron Davis - has not been cleared to practice ("we talkin' 'bout practice... not the game...") he still needs a few weeks to get his sea legs. "Hello, my name is..."

Harrellson - is a decent component. One-dimensional on offense until he learns one post up move. Even with his shortcomings, he can get his offense without a play being run for him as a last-option shooter or offensive rebounder.

Douglas - should NEVER have attempted more three point shots (59) than the total of shots Tyson Chandler has attempted the ENTIRE season. You could look it up. Lacks basketball intuition and lacks the creativity to rely on when pressed. Could slide to the next bunch listed below.


Pine Brothers (talent that must be upgraded, not sidegraded)

Balkman - His outside shot is suspect but he does go to the rack strong so he gets an incomplete. Guard or forward?

Novak - is timid. What is the point of being that tall and having a decent shot if you do not have the courage to take it?

Walker - is playing on legs that lost their bounce.

Bibby - defends like an 87 year old. Can probably go hard once a week. "In case of emergency, break glass."

once a knick always a knick
misterearl
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1/17/2012  2:35 PM    LAST EDITED: 1/17/2012  2:49 PM
A Must Read

"Perhaps more than any other N.B.A. team, the Knicks have fostered a reputation for laying franchise fortune at the feet of superstars either in the midst of – or well past – their primes: Bob McAdoo, Spencer Haywood, Stephon Marbury, Steve Francis, Amar’e Stoudemire, Carmelo Anthony and, most recently, Tyson Chandler."

http://offthedribble.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/01/17/knicks-idling-waiting-for-baron/


"... a combination of Douglas’s struggles, Shumpert’s growing pains, and Anthony’s “point forward” alchemy have contributed to a kind of offensive identity crisis; rather than an attack predicated on quick breaks, precise cuts, and effective floor spacing, the Knicks have instead resorted far too often to letting Stoudemire or Anthony – usually the latter – conduct the offense from the elbow. The results have been at best mixed, at worst messy, and in either case evidence that Davis’ now imminent return has morphed from a matter of welcome convenience into one of sheer necessity."

Which begs the question, can you REALLY teach an old dog new tricks?

The core issue for the Knicks, and their veterans ingrained habits - is the ability to adapt to each other on the fly.

once a knick always a knick
KncksbigKATS
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1/17/2012  6:48 PM
What is the contingency plan if Baron Davis fails?
No one here seems ready to talk about that,
but it is a very real possibility.

Answer: It ain't pretty.

"Talent wins games, but teamwork and intelligence wins championships." -Michael Jordan
colombian0725
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1/17/2012  6:53 PM
KNICKSBIGCATS wrote:What is the contingency plan if Baron Davis fails?
No one here seems ready to talk about that,
but it is a very real possibility.

Answer: It ain't pretty.

Trade Amare and build the team around Melo,Shump and Tyson. Trade Amare for the best point guard we can find and hope to sign a shooter that plays(good enough D).

loweyecue
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1/17/2012  7:30 PM
RonRon wrote:
colombian0725 wrote:
misterearl wrote:Sitting In The Directors Chair, The Answer Man Calls For A Stunt Man

Q. Nalod - Who is the proper PF in his place?

A. You need a forward with outside range who can handle the ball effectively in traffic. That player must have a durable frame to take hits and the hops of a gazelle to defend the new breed of flexible flyers at the four. He needs to be fearless enough to dunk on anyone. He needs to be unselfish, unassuming and have a tiny ego. Preferred age? Under 28. He also needs to be ACQUIRABLE, and not some wet fantasy imaginary friend.

Wilson Chandler

We need a PF who can rebound and play better defense than Amare. A decent post up game(More than Amare). We know he isn't going to be better than Amare scoring wise but the trade would likely include a pg or shooting guard in return.

I think we need a combination of players. The truth is we have no identity or system, but we are missing a lot of talent on our roster.
What I am trying to say is our players do not mesh, they are not very skilled, and 1 player will not change that.
Do we have no system because we have bad coaching or because we don't have enough skilled players needed that would work better than the "iso system"?
Did we see TD, Iman, and Melo passing the ball back n forth in the 4th quarter?
They did NOTHING vs the zone, that is when Jorts should have came in, to break the zone.
In general teams prefer to have 2 players that can penetrate, 2 post players, and at least 3 shooters.

Look at our lineup.... btw TD only penetrated because Jammer Nelson and Redick aren't good defenders, and TD hit a couple of shots early, playing with confidence.


Iman he handles the ball a lot better than TD, he gives is slightly later then TD but he has generate the offense more and better, instead of giving the ball to Melo
he single handly steals the ball, giving us momentum and earning easy baskets, has been playing under better control but he seems to have lost some
confidence/swagger in the process. His shot is suppose to be suspect, but he is our 2nd best shooter in the starting lineup, he should 3/4th option.

Fields he does a little of everything, rebounding, assist, steals, pts, but he hasn't been able to find his shot. With Tyson Chandler not being a threat for a shot
and now Amare taking a big step back from last year and previous years with his shot, that only leaves possibly 3 shooters on the floor. At SG position
we need a good 3point shooter, ability to penetrate, and a good defender

Melo is our ball handler, post player, 3 point shooter, rebounder, and its surprising he actually improved, willing, and still capable to play defense on top of
everything else he does. We never know how he is going to score and he is our only POST option on the whole roster. He takes a lot of bad shots but is capable of
hitting them, he takes so many shots its hard for his team mates to get in rhythm. Also if he is the post player, ideally, we should have 3 other shooters on the floor
with him to spread the floor. As many points he puts up, he is a ball stopper. While when he does give up the ball, the team is not capable of getting a good look/shot
lot of the times because of our inability to have 2 players aside from Melo to penetrate. He is taking too many 3pointers and like Lebron, should try to try not to
take the bad 3point shots and post up a lot more. Problem is he has the handle the ball a lot and he can not get good position because of it.

Amare is looking more lost everything I watch him. I think we have to bench Amare and start Jorts when we can. He just doesn't box out, fight for position, and gives up
position *all of the above on both ends*. He also does not give effort for defense. He not only doesn't mesh well with Melo but is horrible combo for Tyson Chandler.
Defensively, JJ looks 10x better than him, even though Ryan Anderson hit like 4 shots while JJ tried to contest them. He is suppose to be our 4th best shooter and be
able to be a threat a step away from the free throw line. With Amare not playing defense the way he doe, unable to hit a free throw distance shot consistently, and
unable to create his own shot or for other. He is completely useless right now, he needs to develop a post up game, at least for position.

Chandler He played great defense vs Dwight Howard yesterday, when Dwight Howard sets the pick which is almost impossible ,most of the time, for the defender to get through.
However, if he comes out, Dwight Howard is going to go in and NO ONE is going to be able to be able to stop him when he rolls after the pick.

Great post, first time I understood one of your long posts the message is on target. Like you laid out Melo is doing everything and somehow improving his play but we need legit shooters out there otherwise the defense just clogs up the paint and we have a team moving the ball along the arc till 3seconds left on the click before hoisting a bad shot.

TKF on Melo ::....he is a punk, a jerk, a self absorbed out of shape, self aggrandizing, unprofessional, volume chucking coach killing playoff loser!!
Do Carmelo and Stoudemire LIKE playing together?

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