nyvector16 wrote:That is completely conceivable and almost too obvious not to be true...

It really is a no-brainer when you consider that Felton was only on rental for 1 more season before we let him walk so we can sign a max in 2012.
Also Chandler was prob not going to get another deal this offseason short of a 1 season rental before... again the summer of 2012.
Gallo would be a restricted free agent the summer of 2012 and perhaps we would have to dump somehow to accommodate... the free agent max signing of 2012.
Mozgov was signed past 2012... and perhaps we would have to give up another pick to dump his contract.... To free up cap space for 2012....

Not sure if anyone else notices the pattern but most of what we gave up was not going to be here long term anyway....

You could have traded those players for draft picks and still had cap room.

Bonn1997 wrote:

nyvector16 wrote:That is completely conceivable and almost too obvious not to be true...

It really is a no-brainer when you consider that Felton was only on rental for 1 more season before we let him walk so we can sign a max in 2012.
Also Chandler was prob not going to get another deal this offseason short of a 1 season rental before... again the summer of 2012.
Gallo would be a restricted free agent the summer of 2012 and perhaps we would have to dump somehow to accommodate... the free agent max signing of 2012.
Mozgov was signed past 2012... and perhaps we would have to give up another pick to dump his contract.... To free up cap space for 2012....

Not sure if anyone else notices the pattern but most of what we gave up was not going to be here long term anyway....

You could have traded those players for draft picks and still had cap room.

Cap room, schmap room. This is New York and fantasy trades are only in vogue in the faux digital world.

James Dolan is the shot caller and Cablevision has more money than God. You want cap room? Let's allow Dolan's total 2009 compensation package of $17,143,660.00 to expire.

That should be good enough for a max contract (preferably a center) and a player to be named later.

tkf wrote:

martin wrote:

tkf wrote:I was very upset at the trade. I always had hope we could get melo as a FA and add him to our core of young kids.. but melo is only 26, is playing as well as advertised, and is giving a real effort on defense. I can't hate on him.. the guy is a heck of a player.... But I do hate our owner... what a bafoon... he sabotaged most of Donnie's work on this deal. I am almost sure of that..

I have asked this question before and didn't get much response, so I'll ask it again.

There are some very good financial reason for Dolan to want Melo in NY ASAP and not at all in NJ. The stadium is going under construction, he wants to lock in marketing deals with every client he can in the greater NYC area, he also wants to deplete the Brooklyn project every which way he can.

IMHO those are some very solid reasons to get Melo to NY now without the risk of unknown after CBA comes out and not knowing exactly what Melo would do in off-season.

If as GM Dolan came to you and outlined this to you from an organizational standpoint and told you he wanted to supersede your basketball decision just this one time, would you understand the decision? I mean, he did give Isiah 6 years of free reign and I think he has given Donnie pretty much the same for the first 2, right?

Downside risk of Melo going to NJ/Brooklyn is that he is there for 8+ years as a thorn in the side and he pulls maybe a second star. That's some big ass downside.

good question martin.. I was talking to my son, and I told him the amount of money that can be made in just two home playoff games.. lets say average ticket prices are $100-150( I know msg is more, but just play along) with 18 thousand seats sold that is almost 2mil per game.. so your investment in amare is paying off, add melo and maybe you get another round, so maybe 2+ more home games and you have close to 8 mil in ticket sales, then count in concessions, and all the other stuff they sell and that is a nice chunk of change.....

so yea, from a business standpoint I can almost understand dolan here, but it seems as if he jumped the gun a bit, I would have rode this to the deadline and if walsh could not get it done with the pieces he was offering then I, as the owner would have stepped in...

I completely understand the downside of him going to NJ, and I believe he would have signed there now, because melo wanted that money...

good post martin..

as a business owner of MSG, can you image if Melo went to NJ and then was able to convince Dwight to come along? Not a very good chance of it happening, but this is how you squash your competition with some keen insight and long-term thinking. It kinda kills your bball decision-making process, and I hated how the trade went down, but I can understand it.

martin wrote:

tkf wrote:

martin wrote:

tkf wrote:I was very upset at the trade. I always had hope we could get melo as a FA and add him to our core of young kids.. but melo is only 26, is playing as well as advertised, and is giving a real effort on defense. I can't hate on him.. the guy is a heck of a player.... But I do hate our owner... what a bafoon... he sabotaged most of Donnie's work on this deal. I am almost sure of that..

I have asked this question before and didn't get much response, so I'll ask it again.

There are some very good financial reason for Dolan to want Melo in NY ASAP and not at all in NJ. The stadium is going under construction, he wants to lock in marketing deals with every client he can in the greater NYC area, he also wants to deplete the Brooklyn project every which way he can.

IMHO those are some very solid reasons to get Melo to NY now without the risk of unknown after CBA comes out and not knowing exactly what Melo would do in off-season.

If as GM Dolan came to you and outlined this to you from an organizational standpoint and told you he wanted to supersede your basketball decision just this one time, would you understand the decision? I mean, he did give Isiah 6 years of free reign and I think he has given Donnie pretty much the same for the first 2, right?

Downside risk of Melo going to NJ/Brooklyn is that he is there for 8+ years as a thorn in the side and he pulls maybe a second star. That's some big ass downside.

good question martin.. I was talking to my son, and I told him the amount of money that can be made in just two home playoff games.. lets say average ticket prices are $100-150( I know msg is more, but just play along) with 18 thousand seats sold that is almost 2mil per game.. so your investment in amare is paying off, add melo and maybe you get another round, so maybe 2+ more home games and you have close to 8 mil in ticket sales, then count in concessions, and all the other stuff they sell and that is a nice chunk of change.....

so yea, from a business standpoint I can almost understand dolan here, but it seems as if he jumped the gun a bit, I would have rode this to the deadline and if walsh could not get it done with the pieces he was offering then I, as the owner would have stepped in...

I completely understand the downside of him going to NJ, and I believe he would have signed there now, because melo wanted that money...

good post martin..

as a business owner of MSG, can you image if Melo went to NJ and then was able to convince Dwight to come along? Not a very good chance of it happening, but this is how you squash your competition with some keen insight and long-term thinking. It kinda kills your bball decision-making process, and I hated how the trade went down, but I can understand it.

I would have preferred to pay less than retail price for Melo too, but there is something to be said for creating your own destiny.

I think your analysis is pretty spot on. I'd like to add that NJ is basically going to be a new entrant tot he marketplace. I never consider NJ to be in the same market as the Knicks. That's about to change. You crush market entrants by having a superior product.

We can debate over who's better between Williams and Melo all day, but the fact is the Knicks got their guy and the Nets didn't. That's a power signal to the marketpalce and consumers.

The Nets might be coming to Brooklyn but from a business operations and brand management standpoint, I think it was very important to demonstrate to the marketplace the Nets are second rate.

If the Nets had procured Williams, there would have been a buzz with the Nets and the Knicks fans would've been calling the FAN to bitch about the "same old Knicks"

I recall ten years ago reading that the knicks made 2 million after expenses for each playoff game. Ten years ago!

The commentary was the fans were frustrated over not being true title contenders (to me 1999 was a freak) and that the business plan was to get to conferance finals which made the team very profitable.

Im sure all involved including Dolan would prefer we go all out and build a contender but it takes tanking and luck to secure that franchise player.

We have that with Amare but with Melo it cost us.

seems the best of all worlds clear the cap space and keep your yoots.

I had too much hope that Melo could come via free agency and if so the team was set with assets and space to compete for years. Years.

Hope is not lost but its more challangeing.

Froma business standpoint the trade is excellent. From a basketball standponint its inconclusive until the roster is balanced in the next two years.

The jury is out for a long time on this one. Until then, there are games to sort it out. Its not what we think that really matters does it?

In Denver, a celebrity sighting might be skiier Billy Kidd.

In New York, Billy Crystal, Bill Murray, Bill Maher, Bill Clinton, and Bill Bradley make court side appearances.

In Denver, when it snows nothing moves downtown, except the free shuttle buses on the mall... and you go stir crazy.

In New York, when it snows you call the car service and hit The Blue Note.

In Denver, Melo would have been forced to take LaLa shopping on an off day to keep her happy.

In New York, LaLa can hang with her girlfriends and Carmelo can hit the gym to refine his moves.

Melo had no motivation in Denver, so he chilled and posted up.

In New York, he learns that when a three point shot comes raining out of the sky, "it will wire you up!"

Nalod wrote:TKF, don't forget TV ad revenue and other sales from each game.

I recall ten years ago reading that the knicks made 2 million after expenses for each playoff game. Ten years ago!

The commentary was the fans were frustrated over not being true title contenders (to me 1999 was a freak) and that the business plan was to get to conferance finals which made the team very profitable.

Im sure all involved including Dolan would prefer we go all out and build a contender but it takes tanking and luck to secure that franchise player.

We have that with Amare but with Melo it cost us.

seems the best of all worlds clear the cap space and keep your yoots.

I had too much hope that Melo could come via free agency and if so the team was set with assets and space to compete for years. Years.

Hope is not lost but its more challangeing.

Froma business standpoint the trade is excellent. From a basketball standponint its inconclusive until the roster is balanced in the next two years.

The jury is out for a long time on this one. Until then, there are games to sort it out. Its not what we think that really matters does it?

oh yea, I am sure TV and ad revenue is HUGE for MSG...

I am still bitter at losing the yoots, I was skeptical at what kind of player melo would be.. but so far he is really showing me he wants to win and is willing to adjust to do so.. his defense so far has been impressive as well as his passing..

we definately need to balance out the roster, but when I see guys like walker and TD step up their games, it makes me feel better, and now all we need is for derrick brown to be that hidden gem...

tkf wrote:

Nalod wrote:TKF, don't forget TV ad revenue and other sales from each game.

I recall ten years ago reading that the knicks made 2 million after expenses for each playoff game. Ten years ago!

The commentary was the fans were frustrated over not being true title contenders (to me 1999 was a freak) and that the business plan was to get to conferance finals which made the team very profitable.

Im sure all involved including Dolan would prefer we go all out and build a contender but it takes tanking and luck to secure that franchise player.

We have that with Amare but with Melo it cost us.

seems the best of all worlds clear the cap space and keep your yoots.

I had too much hope that Melo could come via free agency and if so the team was set with assets and space to compete for years. Years.

Hope is not lost but its more challangeing.

Froma business standpoint the trade is excellent. From a basketball standponint its inconclusive until the roster is balanced in the next two years.

The jury is out for a long time on this one. Until then, there are games to sort it out. Its not what we think that really matters does it?

oh yea, I am sure TV and ad revenue is HUGE for MSG...

I am still bitter at losing the yoots, I was skeptical at what kind of player melo would be.. but so far he is really showing me he wants to win and is willing to adjust to do so.. his defense so far has been impressive as well as his passing..

we definately need to balance out the roster, but when I see guys like walker and TD step up their games, it makes me feel better, and now all we need is for derrick brown to be that hidden gem...

Exactly.

What can Jeffries do that Brown cannot do?

At 6'8.5 (in shoes), 227 with far superior hops, Derrick Brown has flashed the ability to drain a jump shot. His defense is respectable and, unlike Jeffries, his offensive moves are fluid. Brown has a 7'2.5 wingspan with almost 9 feet (8' 11.5") of standing reach.

Brown sold himself like this in an interview with NBAdraft.net: “My ceiling is high, but I’m not a project, so I can help a team right away next year. You know, I can shoot it, I’m athletic, but I also use my brain out there.”

Jeffries is shooting 32 per cent for the season. You do the math.

Knickoftime wrote:

tkf wrote:I am still bitter at losing the yoots,

Somewhat lost in the feel-good story of Denver's all-around play is the fact Wilson Chandler hasn't been very good since the trade.

He might be looking at another year playing for his QO.

yea, good point.... last night I saw him airball a couple of shots, I was like whoa... or at least one airball and the other was way, way off..

Uptown wrote:

misterearl wrote:46 and 20?

"I really focused in before the game, knowing we didn't have Stat (Stoudemire) and had to step up and go after it," said Anthony, who finished with 25 points and 14 rebounds in 30 minutes -- he had 23 and 10 in the first half. "Obviously, it worked."

(bootleg alert)

"Seems like Melo is holding the ball less and less now after being in the offense for a good amount of time. Seems like Melo has adjusted his offensive game to fit the system he is playing in and upped his efficiency and added the 3 pointer to an already dangerous offensive repertoire, while at the same time playing defense better than he has his whole career and becoming an emotional team leader. Sounds like a superstar player to me."

- Major on Apr 9, 2011 9:23 AM

Melo has been the best player in the league over the last 3 weeks....

Does the suit make the man... or vice versa?

When someone who has seen Carmelo up close like Chauncey Billups makes a bold statement, it is reason to consider whether it was fiction or fact. Carmelo has made an impressive adjustment to life in New York City with Madison Square Garden as his home office.

If Mr. Melo can be the best player in the league over the next 3 weeks, it won't be dull.