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Who should've been drafted: Lopez, Randolph, or Gallo?


Author Poll
SupremeCommander
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Did Walsh blow the Gallo pick? Should he be fired? Make your reactions as knee-jerk as possible!
Gallo
Anthony Randolph
Brook Lopez
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Author Thread
Panos
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3/26/2010  12:42 AM    LAST EDITED: 3/26/2010  1:40 AM
AnubisADL wrote:
Marv wrote:you do realize that efg% is a stat that specifically accounts for how effective you are OVERALL in your shooting percentage, including accounting for the number of 3's you take, right? so to say that you have a personal dislike for the number of m3's that gallo takes is one thing - i happen to agree with you. but regardless of where his shots come from he's still more effective overall than mayo. that's what the stat is saying. regardless of whether you or i like where he puts the majority of his shots up form. that's the whole point of the stat - to be able to compare the relative efficiency of guys that may shoot from very different spots at different rates.

I understand what eFG% is and it is skewed when you jack an insane amount of 3's. I also understand most coaches arent going to let you jack 400+ 3PA's without you joining them on the bench.


Dude, no matter how many you shoot, if you're hitting 40% of your threes that's not "jacking" them.
Jacking them is shooting lots of 3's and only hitting on <30%.

For the record, lifetime 3pp:
Michael Jordan: 32.7%
Larry Bird: 37.6%
Reggie Miller: 39.0%
Kobe Bryant: 34.0%
Ray Allen: 39.6%

At 39.7% lifetime so far, I'd say Gallo's shooting is pretty ok.

AUTOADVERT
Paladin55
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3/26/2010  12:45 AM
Why no love for Eric Gordon, by the way?

A nice player- much better all-around player than I thought he was. Good outside shooter. Good defender. Plays under control. Undersized in terms of height, but compensated for in terms of strength and width. Injury prone?

Might have been included in this poll.

No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
umynot
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3/26/2010  12:53 AM
Panos wrote:
AnubisADL wrote:
Marv wrote:you do realize that efg% is a stat that specifically accounts for how effective you are OVERALL in your shooting percentage, including accounting for the number of 3's you take, right? so to say that you have a personal dislike for the number of m3's that gallo takes is one thing - i happen to agree with you. but regardless of where his shots come from he's still more effective overall than mayo. that's what the stat is saying. regardless of whether you or i like where he puts the majority of his shots up form. that's the whole point of the stat - to be able to compare the relative efficiency of guys that may shoot from very different spots at different rates.

I understand what eFG% is and it is skewed when you jack an insane amount of 3's. I also understand most coaches arent going to let you jack 400+ 3PA's without you joining them on the bench.


Dude, no matter how many you shoot, if you're hitting 40% of your threes that's not "jacking" them.
Jacking them is shooting lots of 3's and only hitting on <30%.

For the record, lifetime 3pp:
Michael Jordan: 32.7%
Larry Bird: 37.6%
Reggie Miller: 39.0%
Kobe Bryant: 34.0%

At 39.7% lifetime so far, I'd say Gallo's shooting is pretty ok.

Bravo megale......

Gallo is like rain from 3...... 2nd in league and yet he is basically a rookie!!

KNICKS on the way UP!!!
Panos
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3/26/2010  12:55 AM
umynot wrote: Bravo megale......

umynot
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3/26/2010  12:58 AM
Panos wrote:
umynot wrote: Bravo megale......

Like the greek skills......

Don't get why people on here are still hating on Gallo.....

Best prospect we have had since maybe Ewing!!

KNICKS on the way UP!!!
TMS
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3/26/2010  1:45 AM
Paladin55 wrote:
TMS wrote:Pally, just seems to coincide how Walsh started to travel with the team & suddenly TD gets regular starts when he hasn't been afforded that opportunity all season... it could be pure coincidence but u have to wonder why TD wasn't seeing playing time before now when we were out of the playoff hunt weeks before.

I would love to know for sure- I would probably have a bit more respect for Walsh, I guess.

I'm not an anti-MDA guy, but I have wondered about some of his decisions in terms of playing guys.

i started out the year pro-MDA but his handling of the team has really made me wonder about him.

it was suggested in news stories that Donnie went on that road trip w/the team to evaluate all the players & the coaching staff before the summer so he could decide if there needed to be any changes made... after that embarassing loss to the Nets & he came out with those comments accepting responsibility for this season & bit the bullet on behalf of his head coach he passed up the chance to stay at MSG & scout the Big East tournament & went on that 5 game road trip.

After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
AnubisADL
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3/26/2010  2:25 AM
Panos wrote:
AnubisADL wrote:
Marv wrote:you do realize that efg% is a stat that specifically accounts for how effective you are OVERALL in your shooting percentage, including accounting for the number of 3's you take, right? so to say that you have a personal dislike for the number of m3's that gallo takes is one thing - i happen to agree with you. but regardless of where his shots come from he's still more effective overall than mayo. that's what the stat is saying. regardless of whether you or i like where he puts the majority of his shots up form. that's the whole point of the stat - to be able to compare the relative efficiency of guys that may shoot from very different spots at different rates.

I understand what eFG% is and it is skewed when you jack an insane amount of 3's. I also understand most coaches arent going to let you jack 400+ 3PA's without you joining them on the bench.


Dude, no matter how many you shoot, if you're hitting 40% of your threes that's not "jacking" them.
Jacking them is shooting lots of 3's and only hitting on <30%.

For the record, lifetime 3pp:
Michael Jordan: 32.7%
Larry Bird: 37.6%
Reggie Miller: 39.0%
Kobe Bryant: 34.0%
Ray Allen: 39.6%

At 39.7% lifetime so far, I'd say Gallo's shooting is pretty ok.

Are you seriously going to compare guys who played with defenders draped over them to Gallo camping on the 3 point line?

Michael Redd: .384
Rashard Lewis: .391
Steve Kerr: .454
Jeff Hornaceck: 403
Jason Kapono: .443
Kyle Korver: .410
Allan Houston: .402

NY Knicks - Retirement home for players and GMs
SupremeCommander
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3/26/2010  3:26 AM    LAST EDITED: 3/26/2010  3:34 AM
AnubisADL wrote:
Panos wrote:
AnubisADL wrote:
Marv wrote:you do realize that efg% is a stat that specifically accounts for how effective you are OVERALL in your shooting percentage, including accounting for the number of 3's you take, right? so to say that you have a personal dislike for the number of m3's that gallo takes is one thing - i happen to agree with you. but regardless of where his shots come from he's still more effective overall than mayo. that's what the stat is saying. regardless of whether you or i like where he puts the majority of his shots up form. that's the whole point of the stat - to be able to compare the relative efficiency of guys that may shoot from very different spots at different rates.

I understand what eFG% is and it is skewed when you jack an insane amount of 3's. I also understand most coaches arent going to let you jack 400+ 3PA's without you joining them on the bench.


Dude, no matter how many you shoot, if you're hitting 40% of your threes that's not "jacking" them.
Jacking them is shooting lots of 3's and only hitting on <30%.

For the record, lifetime 3pp:
Michael Jordan: 32.7%
Larry Bird: 37.6%
Reggie Miller: 39.0%
Kobe Bryant: 34.0%
Ray Allen: 39.6%

At 39.7% lifetime so far, I'd say Gallo's shooting is pretty ok.

Are you seriously going to compare guys who played with defenders draped over them to Gallo camping on the 3 point line?

Michael Redd: .384
Rashard Lewis: .391
Steve Kerr: .454
Jeff Hornaceck: 403
Jason Kapono: .443
Kyle Korver: .410
Allan Houston: .402

I'd say it's unfair to gauge Gallo to the all time greats; I'd say it's unfair to compare Gallo to situational players with half his attempts.

Take Kerr and Kapono off that list and I'd say Gallo is in some pretty good company. If the worst case scenario is the Knicks get Kyle Korver +4 inches, that's not so bad but we all know his mid range game is already significantly more advanced than Korver's.

So, Redd, Lewis, Hornacek, Houston... I'll take that, +4 inches

DLeethal wrote: Lol Rick needs a safe space
Panos
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3/26/2010  8:58 AM    LAST EDITED: 3/26/2010  9:07 AM
AnubisADL wrote:
Panos wrote:
AnubisADL wrote:
Marv wrote:you do realize that efg% is a stat that specifically accounts for how effective you are OVERALL in your shooting percentage, including accounting for the number of 3's you take, right? so to say that you have a personal dislike for the number of m3's that gallo takes is one thing - i happen to agree with you. but regardless of where his shots come from he's still more effective overall than mayo. that's what the stat is saying. regardless of whether you or i like where he puts the majority of his shots up form. that's the whole point of the stat - to be able to compare the relative efficiency of guys that may shoot from very different spots at different rates.

I understand what eFG% is and it is skewed when you jack an insane amount of 3's. I also understand most coaches arent going to let you jack 400+ 3PA's without you joining them on the bench.


Dude, no matter how many you shoot, if you're hitting 40% of your threes that's not "jacking" them.
Jacking them is shooting lots of 3's and only hitting on <30%.

For the record, lifetime 3pp:
Michael Jordan: 32.7%
Larry Bird: 37.6%
Reggie Miller: 39.0%
Kobe Bryant: 34.0%
Ray Allen: 39.6%

At 39.7% lifetime so far, I'd say Gallo's shooting is pretty ok.

Are you seriously going to compare guys who played with defenders draped over them to Gallo camping on the 3 point line?

Michael Redd: .384
Rashard Lewis: .391
Steve Kerr: .454
Jeff Hornaceck: 403
Jason Kapono: .443
Kyle Korver: .410
Allan Houston: .402


Not that's not AT ALL what I'm doing. Where did you hear me compare him to those guys?
All I am saying is that his 3p% which is what YOU have chose to focus on is efficient, contrary to what you are saying. I listed those players' 3pt%s as benchmarks. Do you think they were "jacking" threes?

And very good of you to bolden Steve Kerr. He just happens to be the highest percentaged 3-pt shooter EVER in the history of the NBA. (Who by the way, had NObody guarding him because they were too busy guarding MJ, Pippen and Grant) What's your point?

itchetrigr
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3/26/2010  11:09 AM
how does anybody in their right mind argue over a player shooting 39% of his 3 point shots?
markvmc
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3/26/2010  11:49 AM
Paladin55 wrote:
TMS wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
TMS wrote:
And yet the Knicks – left for dead long ago, dismissed as selfish, callow, poorly coached, indifferent or simply uninspired – are suddenly on a roll, with four victories in their last six games.

The modest surge could be waved off as an aberration, except that it includes stunning victories over the Dallas Mavericks and the Denver Nuggets, two of the best teams in the N.B.A. They also beat the Atlanta Hawks two weeks ago, making the Knicks 3-3 against teams with .600-or-better winning percentages in the month of March.

interesting that winning streak coincided with Tony Douglas being inserted as the starting PG.

Its also interesting that it coincided with the GM traveling with the team.

i agree... Walsh had to basically force MDA's hand by travelling w/the team to get him to finally give the rookie some burn... i am willing to bet he was frustrated as hell that he had to give up Jordan Hill in that trade to dump Fishlips' contract & wanted to see for himself why his draft picks couldn't get any burn on this team.


I know this has been talked about on UK at times. Do we have any solid info supporting this belief? I am not saying that it isn't possible, I'm just looking for corroborating evidence.

Not sure about this, but I think asking for corroborating evidence is a banning offense on this site.

Panos
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3/26/2010  12:18 PM
itchetrigr wrote:how does anybody in their right mind argue over a player shooting 39% of his 3 point shots?

I think you've hit the crux of the matter.

AnubisADL
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3/26/2010  12:55 PM    LAST EDITED: 3/26/2010  12:57 PM
This is almost as bad as when Toronto was hyping Bargnani up.


Gallinari is talented but so are other guys and a streak of good games does not make him suddenly a star in the making.

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tkf
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3/26/2010  1:00 PM
AnubisADL wrote:
playa2 wrote:ALL YOUNG PLAYERS FROM ALL LOSING TEAMS ARE PLAYING WITH A CHIP ON THEIR SHOULDER.

They are playing with no pressure IN GAMES DOWN THE STRETCH and when they go up against teams in the playoff picture they have the ability to look at it as a playoff game with nothing to lose.

If these young players act like this in the beginning of the regular season then I will say WOW !

Great post.

Guys putting up stats now when the games dont matter but did alot of NOTHING all year don't impress me.

I still go with Gallo because of his height and shooting touch for our system. I wouldn't sleep on Randolph though because the guy is very talented. Lopez is also solid and can be just as good or better than Bogut.

when do games not matter? for a lot of teams that can be 20 games into the season...when did games not matter for the nets?

that statment is so overused... Playing well is playing well.... circumstances change. some guys get their turn to shine as the season goes on.. can't blame them for it.. what i find funny is that if they flop at the end of the season, would they not be held accountable? since the games "don't count"? such a double standard... And honestly most of these young players who played early in the season showed what they can do and had good games.. from gallo, to brook lopez, right down to eric gordon, and they are still putting in work... come on man...

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
tkf
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3/26/2010  1:03 PM
eViL wrote:can we revisit some of the major criticisms that many had for gallo before we got to see him play a significant amount of time? is he still a soft euro? does he still play no d? is he still a one trick pony? does he still have no mobility? is he still only a garbage time scorer? looks like some people may have rushed to judgment.

as usual, but it really isn't a rush for some people.. they were quotes made out of hate.. that is why you still get this type of comical comments..


They are playing with no pressure IN GAMES DOWN THE STRETCH and when they go up against teams in the playoff picture they have the ability to look at it as a playoff game with nothing to lose.

If these young players act like this in the beginning of the regular season then I will say WOW !

go figure..

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
tkf
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3/26/2010  1:06 PM
eViL wrote:thanks marv.

to the other points:

i disagree with the idea that his lack of explosion equates lack of mobility. does he get to the rim? yes. does he draw fouls? yes. does it matter how fast or slow he does this? no. it's not always about explosive speed or leaping. sure, that's the most impressive way to get to the rim, but using change of pace moves and proper angles can get you to the hole just as well (only it won't put you on any posters).

and judging his man to man defense by the fact that he couldn't stop melo who was on a hot streak is unfair. while the ultimate goal of defense is to stop the opponent from scoring, the first step is to make them take difficult shots. i think gallo has proven that he can at least force opponents to work harder if they want to score. the notion before this season was that gallo was going to leave a gaping hole in our D. by now i think we have all seen that this is not the case. lock down defender? no. solid defender? yes.

that is just another overblown myth... the guy gets to the hoop and he draws fouls.I don't care if he crawls there.... the most athletic player on our team(chandler) gets to the line a lot less.. why is that? where is the correlation here?

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
tkf
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3/26/2010  1:08 PM
Andrew wrote:Effective shooting %:

Gallo: 53.2
Jennings: 43.1

man it seems like you are skeet shooting here andrew.. annibus Pulls... Andrew shoots... hahaha...

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
tkf
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3/26/2010  1:24 PM
SupremeCommander wrote:Who gives a **** if Gallo has "maximized" his stopwatch speed? That's such an asinine point to argue, especially after just watching Chauncy Billups. Gallo is clearly fast enough and already savvy enough to take guys off the dribble and create space for his shots. As he improves his technical play and gains more polish he's going to be able to make the guys with the fast stopwatch speed look slow.

It is really a dumb argument.. clearly the guy has height and length so he doesn't really have to worry about creating that much space over smaller guys.. vs the Hawks Dominique was amazed how gallo was just turning around over guys like evans(who is 6'6 and athletic) and shooting jumpers in his face flat footed..

And gallo is quick enough to get by bigs with his dribble.. really, the fact that he isn't rudy gay is not prohibiting his game.. Just as it doesn't prohibit dirk, who is not that agile at all, as it doesn't prohibit hedo who is not a high flyer, as it doesn't prohibit andre miller at guard as he is no derrick rose, as it never prohibited Tim duncan who was probably one of the lesser athletic PF in the league at one time... this is a skill game....

That is why high flyers such as Gerald green, and James white are playing ball in russia!

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
tkf
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3/26/2010  1:27 PM
TMS wrote:bottomline is can Gallo make shots & can he play defense... so far he's proven he can do both & is improving as the season goes along w/his shot selection... most people would look at this as a good thing... he doesn't need to be the fastest guy or the most athletic guy, he can make up for his lack in those areas by playing intelligent basketball & by being a student of the game... from everything i've seen & heard from him & from his coaches' comments about him this season, it seems like he wants to be just that... i don't have any concerns about him developing into a very good basketball player for this franchise... so what that he doesn't have Anthony Randolph's athletic ability, or Brooke Lopez' size & strength? neither of those guys have Gallo's shooting ability either, & i think it's fair to say he's probably the most mature out of all 3 having played with grown men in Europe for years & there will never be any questions about his character or willingness to learn & be coached... we should consider ourselves lucky that we were able to draft a kid like Gallo last year.

good point TMS.. but what people are not looking at is his size is his advantage.. he is a legit 6'10 and probably closer to 6'11.. plus he can shoot. the size will mitigate some of his weaknesses. He may not have brook lopez size, but he is not much shorter, that is for sure.. he may not have randolphs athleicism, but he is able to put his game together better at this point... play with a savy randolph can only dream about... so again, I don't see why people are not excited here, and much rather nit pick... LOL.. go figure..

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
tkf
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3/26/2010  1:34 PM
AnubisADL wrote:This is almost as bad as when Toronto was hyping Bargnani up.


Gallinari is talented but so are other guys and a streak of good games does not make him suddenly a star in the making.

those are all nice moves.. and toronto is probably still high on bargs... whoever said he was a star in the making.. if he continues to improve this guy will be an allstar for years to come... you act as if that is some small accomplishment...

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
Who should've been drafted: Lopez, Randolph, or Gallo?

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