Panos wrote:

orangeblobman wrote:

Panos wrote:2-10 when Gallo gets 30+ mins.

But how many of those did nate get 19+?? It's not so simple.

That's exactly my point. Its not so simple. The bottom line is the team has lost a lot of games.

But it's undeniable that we're better without Nate.

Panos wrote:

orangeblobman wrote:

Panos wrote:

orangeblobman wrote:

Panos wrote:2-10 when Gallo gets 30+ mins.

But how many of those did nate get 19+?? It's not so simple.

That's exactly my point. Its not so simple. The bottom line is the team has lost a lot of games.

But it's undeniable that we're better without Nate.

How do you figure its undeniable? We've been better the last 5 games, which happen to coincide with Nate
being benched and a bunch of other factors as well. Not saying its not true, but I don't think its conclusive.

Take into account the 2 consecutive wins against Indy and the Nets, where he played 12 and 6 minutes respectively, that's 7 games. Plus let's take a little liberty and say that his antics don't help the team (maybe they fire up the other team more), add into this his perceived shutting-out of Gallo, and I think there is a strong case that we're better without him.

1. shot on own basket, infuriating coach and going against the professional culture MDA is cultivating
2. showboating while losing against the Magic, which is crazy
3. blocking a shot and staring at the crowd while the play is still going on
4. stupid foul on goran dragic

Let's be honest-- who the hell does these things?? This type of **** can only take away from the team.

At the very least, there is a huge question mark above Nate, a question mark that I don't think is hanging above anyone else in the locker room aside from Darko, but Darko is nowhere near as significant.

Panos wrote:

orangeblobman wrote:

McK1 wrote:

orangeblobman wrote:

McK1 wrote:

Bippity10 wrote:
You can't seem to get over this "it's all Nate's fault" mentality. It isn't his fault. It isn't his fault by a long shot. Very few are interpreting it that way. But the team is 0-9 with him getting major minutes so what that says is that he has not earned the right to be angry that he isn't getting minutes.

the team is 0-9 with Nate getting back up minutes = the team is 0-9 with duhon starting and playing 40 minutes yet we see his trash ass out there every night.

nate is being scapegoated

He's not being scapegoated. But I agree, it's not the most reliable of statistics to go by. Still, it's at least some type of indication and just watching the games I feel that the Knicks are a better team without Nate on the floor.

Knicks look like a better team beause they are actually running plays that suit the personnel and taking the ball out of duhon's hands

I don't know.

Look, maybe you can't really blame Nate that we're 0-9 when he plays 19+ minutes...there could be other factors involved.

But it's impossible to deny that we're 6-6 without him, this tells me that we can win without Nate. You know? So he's not really missed, that's for sure.

Not its not a reliable statistic. What is the significance of the 19 minute mark?
I'll tell you, its the number that most makes the point of the person compiling the statistic.
I can do the same thing.
We're 1-8 when Chandler plays 35 mins or more. Look it up.
We're 2-5 when Douglas plays 20 mins or more.
I'm sure we can do this all day on a team with a bad record.

That's the whole point of the stat. Nobody on this roster can look at their body of work and say "I deserve minutes!!!". NOt Wilson, not Toney, not Gallo, not Nate. Nobody. The coach will make decisions on who will play(right now it seems to be a shortened rotation focused on D) and if someone slips up and is not foucsed then they don't play. And judging by the stats mentioned above, not one player on this roster has any right to complain if they are the one sitting. Coach thinks Toney Douglas helps more then Nate does right now(If you watched his d and hustle last night the case may have been made). Unfortunately Nate is the one sitting, but he has no more right to complain about this then anyone on the roster.

My advice to Nate. Up your game on the defensive end. Stop shooting in other teams baskets. Once you up your game and concentrate on what is important you will be back in the line-up. The Marbury era is gone and the antics stop. We have lost with everyone on the roster, the competition is too close, so don't slip up.

TMS wrote:

McK1 wrote:

TMS wrote:

McK1 wrote:

TMS wrote:

if Hughes keeps playing the way he has this year it's a no brainer to

attempt trading him dec 15th before the larry hughes of old rears his head

if it's a trade for a piece that we can use going forward then i'm open to it, but i don't trade him for just any old expiring contract or even T-Mac at this point... he's playing great & he's got an expiring contract himself, why would u dump him just for the sake of dumping him?

fools gold. trusting hughes to play at this level beyond a contract year is just not sound.

that's ur opinion... tell me some better options we can pursue at midlevel type dollars in the offseason if u got any... i don't see much out there.

why is everything about the 2010 capspace?

jazz are starting undrafted rookie wesley matthews. warriors are starting undrafted rookie anthony morrow. 4 yr guys always slip through the cracks. the guy that fits the bill may be in some university' basketball team. brining hughes back based on his history of getting paid than becoming a total flake on the court should make viewing him as a longterm asset a very last resort.

djsunyc wrote:

kam77 wrote:This may be unpopular, but i like how Nate has taken his benching. He is still standing and cheering on his teammates from the bench.

that's nate. he is always having fun no matter what the situation. that's why i'm curious as to why they stopped trying to work with him and expect to be something he's not.

Who said they stopped trying to work with him? Sitting the bench doesn't mean coaches have stopped working with you. It means you haven't earned your minutes.

Bippity10 wrote:

djsunyc wrote:

kam77 wrote:This may be unpopular, but i like how Nate has taken his benching. He is still standing and cheering on his teammates from the bench.

that's nate. he is always having fun no matter what the situation. that's why i'm curious as to why they stopped trying to work with him and expect to be something he's not.

Who said they stopped trying to work with him? Sitting the bench doesn't mean coaches have stopped working with you. It means you haven't earned your minutes.

exactly bip

nyk4ever wrote:

Bippity10 wrote:

djsunyc wrote:

kam77 wrote:This may be unpopular, but i like how Nate has taken his benching. He is still standing and cheering on his teammates from the bench.

that's nate. he is always having fun no matter what the situation. that's why i'm curious as to why they stopped trying to work with him and expect to be something he's not.

Who said they stopped trying to work with him? Sitting the bench doesn't mean coaches have stopped working with you. It means you haven't earned your minutes.

exactly bip

If anything, it means that they are working on him more than ever. It is the harshest disciplinary action that they have tried on him. So far so good.

arkrud wrote:Nate is a cool boy and physically gifted athlet.
He has some brain deficiency and looks like is hyper.
I all for giving every persone a chance regardless, but Knicks are not in position for charity.
We have very difficult time to come back from complete distruction. Somebody else should help him.

He can dunk, but he's very short.

He is full of complexes because of his height.

He has had TONS of chances.

No one can help this guy.

DurzoBlint wrote:I have been to some recent games (atl to name the most recent) and I call the reasoning listed for n8's benching as BS. Every game you see guys hugging and yucking it up with players of the opposing team. Hell, you can see Mike D doing the same thing.

Who hasn't seen him yuk it up with Nash, and his former players, Excuse me but, aren't they also on the opposing team. Being friends with them makes it OK

Not saying N8 should be playing but, the reason put out there is BS. Watch the pregame shoot around and you will see players from both teams approaching each other for a lil convo

Well let's be careful. I think Berman gave this reason (not sure), it wasn't the Knicks. Either way, it was a 'journalist'. I don't agree with that reason nor do I think that it IS the reason.

More likely it's a culmination of little incidents, probably dating back even to last year, that put him in this situation. I really doubt it was, or could have been, any individual thing.